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Sponsoring husband from Morocco

Lois Lane

Hero Member
May 14, 2008
414
13
(close to Toronto) Ontario
Category........
Visa Office......
Rabat, Morocco
Job Offer........
Pre-Assessed..
App. Filed.......
10 2007
"Habibti, the only thing that I'm concerned about as far as your husband's intentions go, is why he did not pay for any part of that $15,000 sum for wedding and trips. Aren't you?"

seemed/seems like a very insensitive thing to say!
"concerned" about"your husbands INTENTIONS"
questioning "Aren't you?" is way over the top...in my opinion

ESPECIALLY given the news

but we all have opinions
 

Habibti

Hero Member
Apr 4, 2011
804
44
Vancouver, Canada
Category........
Visa Office......
Rabat, Morocco
Job Offer........
Pre-Assessed..
App. Filed.......
08-02-2011
File Transfer...
31-03-2011
Med's Done....
10-01-2011 / 06-09-2012
Interview........
12-09-2011 / Denied 4-11-2011
VISA ISSUED...
January 9, 2013
LANDED..........
January 18, 2013 in Montreal
I don't think it was insensitive to ask. I think it is a legitimate question. Even myself for months I could not understand and accept I had to pay for all these trips without any substantial help from my husband. After all, I am the one with child. He is a free man! No responsibilities no obligations as his mother take care of the house and his meals are provided. I have to fight every day to feed myself and my son. Having said that, I am sure, I am convinced that if it was the other way around, that is my husband in my position, I am sure he would have done the same thing for me. He would have paid for all the trips and expenses related to Immigration.

It is when I traveled over there, I understood their precarious life. I understood how employment is rough. So many people on the streets with a blanket trying to sell things like tissues or sunglasses or shoes!

You know.... I was helped in the past. People made sacrifices to help me. A fiance from a long time ago (when I was 20) sold his motor boat so I can study in a private business college in Ontario.

Life goes around. I am sure one day my husband will be the one to help me when I am going to be in need.
 

INEEDU

Newbie
Aug 26, 2009
8
0
My own situation was the same as Habibti's but I can tell you that does NOT mean he is using her.
My husband had very limited funds in Morocco. He gave ALL he had while I was there to visit.

I honestly feel and 100% believe they are genuine because I can relate and see the similarities.

I still have over $23 000 debt for all the sponsorship efforts.
We were denied the first time and we re-applied and won - all took 33 months, 8 trips to Morocco and
like in Habibti's case much extra cost surrounding this project - to make all this possible.

My husband is here now for 2 years and he works 7 days a week to make up for the cost
and to help me to recover.

Our age difference is the same as well as Habibti's. He chose me over having kids,
or a younger Moroccan virgin girl; he was genuine and he still his genuine.

We are happy and our life is moving in a good strong direction.
I encourage Habibti to not give up on her husband and to go to the next step.

There is no greater gift in life than to love and be loved in return.
And she has that with her husband.

Best wishes.
 

locolynn

Hero Member
May 19, 2008
412
16
Category........
Visa Office......
Rabat
Job Offer........
Pre-Assessed..
App. Filed.......
24-04-07
AOR Received.
08-06-07
Interview........
06-12-07/09-24-08/09-27-11
I just want to add a very quick and general note to this conversation:

Yes, it is the cultural norm for men to marry young women and start a family. But come on, every culture and country has cultural norms. And in every culture and country we have people CHOOSING to live outside of those expectations.

Just because you grow up with the expectation that you'll marry some nice, pretty young thing (oh MJ moment), have hordes of babies, and leave your wife at home all day while you drink coffee in the cafe all day doesn't mean that's what you actually WANT FOR YOUR LIFE.

Change happens when those who want something more are brave enough to go get it.

Locolynn

Locolynn
 

ddobro2

Champion Member
May 4, 2011
2,589
38
124
Montreal, QC Canada
Category........
Visa Office......
Buffalo, NY
Job Offer........
Pre-Assessed..
Habibti, the more you talk about your husband, the more I like him. That was so sweet of him of making those repairs to your house. And that is awesome that he has a job - I think if he has one in Morocco, chances are he will find one in Canada. I'm sorry to hear you're not feeling well. Hang in there, both of you.
Habibti said:
To all of you who left comments in the past hours, thank you! Your support means so much to me. I don't have any hard feelings towards anyone.

Our wedding cost almost nothing. It is just what was around it that was expensive. I think I explained once that my ex "stole" my passport a few months before I went to Morocco to get married (I got married in December 2010). To order a new passport and go to the notary cost money. My ex-y-z! promised me to take care of my house, my son and my dog when I would be away for the month of December. He changed his mind at the last minute. I had to pay airfare for my mother to come. These were unexpected expenses. There was also the trip to pay to go to Ottawa to get my divorce certificate stamped at the ministry of Foreign Affairs. Since my husband lives in a small place with his mother and 3 brothers, we had to rent an apartment so we could have some time as husband and wife. I missed work in December, therefore I lost income. And so on!

I know things are not expensive in Morocco, but my husband and his family covered the food, the transportation and the outings. My husband showered me with gifts when I left. Many times my husband told me he felt bad about me working so much and to pay for all these trips. Many times he assured me he would make it up to me once he is in Canada. My house needs repairs and he was supposed to do all of them once he arrives in Canada. He told me not to pay someone as he would do the job himself. When I was there, he did everything... he never wanted me to tidy up or to cook or to wash dishes or to carry bags. He did everything.

I don't want to write too much as I am not physically feeling well. I just wanted to say a big THANK YOU for taking the time to read me, to understand me, to encourage me. This is what I need the most right now. I feel like a widow. I feel I am in mourning. My husband cannot be there for me. Himself, he is dealing with pain. He had to go to work this morning with a bleeding heart and after work he went into the forest to scream and cry. I know I did not lose him as he wants to fight our case but for the moment I feel like I lost him as we are both so crushed that we cannot give each other what we need.

After two days of absence from work, I will try to go to work tomorrow.
 

ddobro2

Champion Member
May 4, 2011
2,589
38
124
Montreal, QC Canada
Category........
Visa Office......
Buffalo, NY
Job Offer........
Pre-Assessed..
Well, it was the very last thing in my post, for one, after I had tried to give her encouragement and sympathized with her. Secondly, she apparently was not offended. Chances are, that's because she feels very confident of her relationship, which is great. Then, let's be honest, we cannot completely censor ourselves from talking (in a sensitive and polite way, of course, and I don't believe I crossed that line.....especially given that other post by AAL) about the circumstances surrounding the relationships of people here who are sponsoring Moroccan husbands. I think a bit of honesty among women will not hurt the discussion and most importantly, that honesty is rooted in playing Devil's advocate and looking at it from the other perspective. It's not like I am trying to harm anybody's relationship - the contrary. I tried to look at the situation from both sides but I could not just ignore the fact that she was left with that huge bill. Yes, I did not know all the details (and by the way, I do not believe I like to read minds). However, when I thought about how my husband will often not even want me to pay for groceries when I go out, I began thinking of how a man in love would act when faced with his woman having so many expenses related to their relationship. She has since given me a bit more context, obviously. Anyway, no one has to prove anything to me but to CIC, however I thought posing a seemingly innocent question would not take away from the discussion of her future.

Lois Lane said:
"Habibti, the only thing that I'm concerned about as far as your husband's intentions go, is why he did not pay for any part of that $15,000 sum for wedding and trips. Aren't you?"

seemed/seems like a very insensitive thing to say!
"concerned" about"your husbands INTENTIONS"
questioning "Aren't you?" is way over the top...in my opinion

ESPECIALLY given the news

but we all have opinions
 

Lois Lane

Hero Member
May 14, 2008
414
13
(close to Toronto) Ontario
Category........
Visa Office......
Rabat, Morocco
Job Offer........
Pre-Assessed..
App. Filed.......
10 2007
ddobro2 said:
Well, it was the very last thing in my post, for one, after I had tried to give her encouragement and sympathized with her. Secondly, she apparently was not offended. Chances are, that's because she feels very confident of her relationship, which is great. Then, let's be honest, we cannot completely censor ourselves from talking (in a sensitive and polite way, of course, and I don't believe I crossed that line.....especially given that other post by AAL) about the circumstances surrounding the relationships of people here who are sponsoring Moroccan husbands. I think a bit of honesty among women will not hurt the discussion and most importantly, that honesty is rooted in playing Devil's advocate and looking at it from the other perspective. It's not like I am trying to harm anybody's relationship - the contrary. I tried to look at the situation from both sides but I could not just ignore the fact that she was left with that huge bill. Yes, I did not know all the details (and by the way, I do not believe I like to read minds). However, when I thought about how my husband will often not even want me to pay for groceries when I go out, I began thinking of how a man in love would act when faced with his woman having so many expenses related to their relationship. She has since given me a bit more context, obviously. Anyway, no one has to prove anything to me but to CIC, however I thought posing a seemingly innocent question would not take away from the discussion of her future.
i am pleased she wasnt offended. had the same statement and question been posed prior to the refusal or even sometime from now, perhaps it wouldnt have seemed so insensitive.

we are talking about husbands from a third world country, not about husbands from canada and the usa,

timing is everything!
 

ddobro2

Champion Member
May 4, 2011
2,589
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124
Montreal, QC Canada
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Buffalo, NY
Job Offer........
Pre-Assessed..
I don't see "seemingly"/"no doubt" in my original question so I have no idea where that comes from. My timing was based on the fact that she gave that information about costs AFTER she got the news, not before, in which case I would have given MY opinion thereafter. I would also like to stress that not only did I write that at the very end, but after several posts in which I told her how sorry I was that she was refused. This was NOT the first thing I said to her in her grief, nor would it be to anyone who had something devastating happen to them. I am an empathetic person but I am not going to muzzle myself if I have something to say in a polite, inoffensive way, after I have let the person know that I am very sorry for what happened.

Lois Lane said:
i am pleased she wasnt offended. but found your remark to be not only insensitive but insulting especially given the timing, had you posed the same ("seemingly"..i have no doubt)" question prior or weeks from now it wouldnt to me have seemed as insensitive then. we are talking about husbands from a third world country, not about husbands from canada and the usa,

timing is everything!
 

Lois Lane

Hero Member
May 14, 2008
414
13
(close to Toronto) Ontario
Category........
Visa Office......
Rabat, Morocco
Job Offer........
Pre-Assessed..
App. Filed.......
10 2007
ddobro2 said:
I don't see "seemingly"/"no doubt" in my original question so I have no idea where that comes from. My timing was based on the fact that she gave that information about costs AFTER she got the news, not before, in which case I would have given MY opinion thereafter. I would also like to stress that not only did I write that at the very end, but after several posts in which I told her how sorry I was that she was refused. This was NOT the first thing I said to her in her grief, nor would it be to anyone who had something devastating happen to them. I am an empathetic person but I am not going to muzzle myself if I have something to say in a polite, inoffensive way, after I have let the person know that I am very sorry for what happened.
i edited my post...my reference to "seemingly/no doubt" was saying that i have no doubt your question was meant to be innocent...in MY opinion, i too cant be MUZELED, it was INSENSITIVE even though the post also was encouraging. cant see the relevance in it being said first second third last, ...in MY opinion it wasnt the right time to say it, especially since others had already said things that should have been held back...at least for the time being

obviously you commented on what was written, point is if the same discussion was held before the refusal...or in time to come i perhaps wouldnt have felt it was so insensitive

she didnt take offense to it which is great.....so enough said!
 

ddobro2

Champion Member
May 4, 2011
2,589
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124
Montreal, QC Canada
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Buffalo, NY
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Pre-Assessed..
Well, I'm glad you won't be muzzled about sharing your opinion. It does hurt my feelings when people insinuate that my comments that were made out of a genuine desire to understand where someone is coming from are "shame"ful and call me insensitive. My comment was made the next day, if you check the records, by the way. And if you say timing is everything, why no relevance about the order I put in my post? I would absolutely prefer if someone express sympathy first, ask a lil' question last, not the other way around. Anyway, I agree - enough said.
Lois Lane said:
i edited my post...my reference to "seemingly/no doubt" was saying that i have no doubt your question was meant to be innocent...in MY opinion which i will not be MUZELED either it was INSENSITIVE even though the post also was encouraging. cant see the relevance in it being said first second third last, ...in MY opinion it wasnt the day to say it especially since others had already said things that should have been held back at least for the time being and she was clearly distraught.

she didnt take offense to it which is great.....so enough said!
 

Lois Lane

Hero Member
May 14, 2008
414
13
(close to Toronto) Ontario
Category........
Visa Office......
Rabat, Morocco
Job Offer........
Pre-Assessed..
App. Filed.......
10 2007
ddobro2 said:
Well, I'm glad you won't be muzzled about sharing your opinion. It does hurt my feelings when people insinuate that my comments that were made out of a genuine desire to understand where someone is coming from are "shame"ful and call me insensitive. My comment was made the next day, if you check the records, by the way. And if you say timing is everything, why no relevance about the order I put in my post? I would absolutely prefer if someone express sympathy first, ask a lil' question last, not the other way around. Anyway, I agree - enough said.
that was my concern, that you were hurting someones feelings who was already distraught by being insensitive, with the question posed, even though it was a seemingly innocent question. shame...as in its a shame you added that in...it wasnt insinuated.

there is no timing to make insensitive questions. i have made the point that the same question being posed another time may not have seemed insensitive....so no whether u said it at the end or in the middle...the timing is off

no rights or wrongs....simply....differences of opinions
 

Habibti

Hero Member
Apr 4, 2011
804
44
Vancouver, Canada
Category........
Visa Office......
Rabat, Morocco
Job Offer........
Pre-Assessed..
App. Filed.......
08-02-2011
File Transfer...
31-03-2011
Med's Done....
10-01-2011 / 06-09-2012
Interview........
12-09-2011 / Denied 4-11-2011
VISA ISSUED...
January 9, 2013
LANDED..........
January 18, 2013 in Montreal
dddbro has been very supportive and quite helpful since I have been on this forum.

You want to know what is insensitive??? It happened to me this morning at work and I am sure you will scream. I am trying to reach Personnel Resources at the school district because I want to quit. Let me explain.

One of my 3 jobs is to work for the school district in 2 French immersion schools at the library. I am a library-assistant. At one school, I work 23 hours a week and at the other school I work 8 hours a week.

This morning I went to the school where I work 8 hours a week. As soon as I put my foot in the library, the teacher-librarian came to me and said: "So, do you have any developments regarding your husband and you?" I said yes and I explained. Then, she said: "You know... Morocco is the second country in the world where there are marriages of fraud and you should give up. Everything is against you and you should not trust your husband". I said that I was married to him and I am in a better position to know him and I do trust him. She said: "You know... you are responsible for him for 10 years if he comes here". I said no and I explained to her. Then, she said: "It was not professional of you to take this phone call on Monday. Your husband should have NEVER called you at work. You should not mix your personal life with your work life. The principal is on my side on this, so is the school board". BELIEVE ME!!! My mouth was wide open. Then, I said: "You are hard on me." And I left.

Believe me... for 2 hours I was shaking, barely standing on my two legs. I just shut my mouth and shelved books and took care of the circulation. I tried to see the principal to tell him I wanted to quit my job but he was gone for the day.

WHAT ARE MY RIGHTS??? I am afraid to work there now! But 8 hours a week represents 32 hours a month which is a big chunk of money and will allow me to have a bigger pension!

Then, I went to the other school and the teacher-librarian who was a psychologist before took me in her arms and gave me this most wonderful hug as soon as I set foot in the library.
 

rjessome

VIP Member
Feb 24, 2009
4,354
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Job Offer........
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Oh geez! Don't quit. Go see the principal and tell him that you don't appreciate that person's insensitive comments about your personal life and ask him if his wife was giving birth would it be ok if he was called at work! Both are life changing events that supercede everything else. Family is more important than work and your husband is family, bottom line. This phone call was a life-changing event (like having a baby) that affects your WHOLE life and they should be able to see it that way. Also, DEMAND an apology from the librarian.

You need to toughen up now. A thick skin is required for what lies ahead. Do NOT quit over this. Don't give that insensitive person the satisfaction.

Lois and ddobro2, what the heck are you two fighting over? ddobro2 has always seemed to be supportive from what I've read. Lois, you know as well as I do that the money question was a valid one. We both know that marriage fraud is an issue with Moroccan men and European and North American women. Any Google search will tell you that so why jump all over that point? Any average person would ask the same thing about the money. That doesn't make them insensitive. And I thought Habibti explained her situation well. I mean at the end of the day, it's her money and she can do what she wants with it, including spend it on her husband, her mother, her child, her dog, Elvis memorabilia, whatever. I could tell you stories that would make your hair curl about what some Moroccan men have done to scam women for money. For example, this one guy I know of bandaged up his little brother and posed him in a wheel chair, took a picture and sent it to an Italian woman he had met in Morocco while she was on vacation. He told her his brother was very sick and needed money for medicine. I don't know whether or not she ever sent him any money though. That's just the tip of the iceberg.

There's a whole culture of "hunters" in Morocco that target tourists for sex and money. You know that nice Moroccan boy who helped you navigate the shops in the souqs while you were vacationing? He got a kickback from the shop owner. Common practice. My husband and I used to do that. We'd go into the shops, he'd speak in Arabic and tell the owner that I was a tourist, I would haggle as best I could and buy what I wanted, we'd leave and then he'd head back to get the money. We made a game out if it. Saved us a bunch of money. :) We'd do it with restaurants too because some would pay a kickback to the Moroccan for bringing tourists. Those were the good old days. I miss Morocco.
 

Habibti

Hero Member
Apr 4, 2011
804
44
Vancouver, Canada
Category........
Visa Office......
Rabat, Morocco
Job Offer........
Pre-Assessed..
App. Filed.......
08-02-2011
File Transfer...
31-03-2011
Med's Done....
10-01-2011 / 06-09-2012
Interview........
12-09-2011 / Denied 4-11-2011
VISA ISSUED...
January 9, 2013
LANDED..........
January 18, 2013 in Montreal
She told me that the principal and school board are on her side. What's the point to see the principal if he is on her side?

With what I am going through, I cannot work in a poisonous environment. She has been mentally abusive to me for 3 years. I endured her month after month. What happened this morning is the last drop.

I believe that universe is intelligent and will fill that hole. A door closes, another opens. I have the faith.
 

Lois Lane

Hero Member
May 14, 2008
414
13
(close to Toronto) Ontario
Category........
Visa Office......
Rabat, Morocco
Job Offer........
Pre-Assessed..
App. Filed.......
10 2007
rjessome said:
Oh geez! Don't quit. Go see the principal and tell him that you don't appreciate that person's insensitive comments about your personal life and ask him if his wife was giving birth would it be ok if he was called at work! Both are life changing events that supercede everything else. Family is more important than work and your husband is family, bottom line. This phone call was a life-changing event (like having a baby) that affects your WHOLE life and they should be able to see it that way. Also, DEMAND an apology from the librarian.

You need to toughen up now. A thick skin is required for what lies ahead. Do NOT quit over this. Don't give that insensitive person the satisfaction.

Lois and ddobro2, what the heck are you two fighting over? ddobro2 has always seemed to be supportive from what I've read. Lois, you know as well as I do that the money question was a valid one. We both know that marriage fraud is an issue with Moroccan men and European and North American women. Any Google search will tell you that so why jump all over that point? Any average person would ask the same thing about the money. That doesn't make them insensitive. And I thought Habibti explained her situation well. I mean at the end of the day, it's her money and she can do what she wants with it, including spend it on her husband, her mother, her child, her dog, Elvis memorabilia, whatever. I could tell you stories that would make your hair curl about what some Moroccan men have done to scam women for money. For example, this one guy I know of bandaged up his little brother and posed him in a wheel chair, took a picture and sent it to an Italian woman he had met in Morocco while she was on vacation. He told her his brother was very sick and needed money for medicine. I don't know whether or not she ever sent him any money though. That's just the tip of the iceberg.

There's a whole culture of "hunters" in Morocco that target tourists for sex and money. You know that nice Moroccan boy who helped you navigate the shops in the souqs while you were vacationing? He got a kickback from the shop owner. Common practice. My husband and I used to do that. We'd go into the shops, he'd speak in Arabic and tell the owner that I was a tourist, I would haggle as best I could and buy what I wanted, we'd leave and then he'd head back to get the money. We made a game out if it. Saved us a bunch of money. :) We'd do it with restaurants too because some would pay a kickback to the Moroccan for bringing tourists. Those were the good old days. I miss Morocco.
there was no fight! a difference of opinion were being expressed, just as you are expressing yours.

the question posed is actually not just insensitive but RUDE in my opinion!!!!!!!!!!!!!

i thought it had been put to rest but since you have brought it to the fore front, unnecessarily, i will yet again express my opinion

if the question was asked ...Was your husband not able to contribute towards that large some? it wouldnt seem so insensitive
but to say to someone they are questioning their husbands INTENTIONS given the "LIFE CHANGING" events is in MY opinion INSENSITIVE...to further question if someone isnt questioning their own husbands INTENTIONS is way off the scale!...not withstanding that she has been supportive.

the question in and of its self regardless of timing is some what insensitive, add to that the way it was posed and the timing magnifies it making it that much more insensitive

as to the "game" playing in Morocco...on the times i have been with my husband in morocco i would never let him haggel on something i was purchasing. i know thats how it goes there but its not a few extra bucks that is going to enrich my life...but it will make a differnce in theirs

to each their own