Probationary period for Family Class may be as soon as 2011!

[jessca88]

@rjessome: thank you. everything's clear now.

Do you guys have any idea when will the immigration probably implement this? Besides the fact that theyre planning to do it in 2011. Thanks

 

[waitingintz]

rjessome: are changes to immigration ALWAYS effective immediately??

Obviously this is just my opinion but I'm not really worrying about this effecting people already in progress very much. This seems likely to be a big change logistically...

Firstly, I think that the fee structure would have to change to accommdate the additional step and they can't really implement that on people who have already paid.

Secondly, if there are changes in how applications are assessed, it would mean re-assessing every application currently in progress... a HUGE job. Perhaps applications that have moved passed certain stages of assessment would not be effected.

So yes, I might be in for a very unpleasant surprise but I think that if you're already well into the process, it is not likely to apply to your application. And if it does, I don't think it will change whether you are approved or not, just might mean an extra step in a couple of years (which may be an extra expense and paperwork but shouldn't be an issue for the vast majority of genuine couples)

Anyway, absolutely nothing we can do about it until the announcement is made (or after really) so not much point guessing what might happen and stressing about it now...

 

[tim271]

hello everyone i think the new law will be great but what about the inland application that have been married for the past 4year send there inland application to CIC 3 to 4 years ago and CIC tell them they have back log what will happen to people like that will they still go under probation

 

[rjessome]

rjessome: are changes to immigration ALWAYS effective immediately??

Obviously this is just my opinion but I'm not really worrying about this effecting people already in progress very much. This seems likely to be a big change logistically...

Firstly, I think that the fee structure would have to change to accommdate the additional step and they can't really implement that on people who have already paid.

Secondly, if there are changes in how applications are assessed, it would mean re-assessing every application currently in progress... a HUGE job. Perhaps applications that have moved passed certain stages of assessment would not be effected.

So yes, I might be in for a very unpleasant surprise but I think that if you're already well into the process, it is not likely to apply to your application. And if it does, I don't think it will change whether you are approved or not, just might mean an extra step in a couple of years (which may be an extra expense and paperwork but shouldn't be an issue for the vast majority of genuine couples)

Anyway, absolutely nothing we can do about it until the announcement is made (or after really) so not much point guessing what might happen and stressing about it now...

Hi,

All changes to Acts of Parliment and/or Regulations must be published in the Canadian Gazette. There is a process that the government is required by law to go through to allow Canadians to be aware of any proposed changes and a mechanism for interested parties to provide feedback. The government also publishes the consultation process for any laws/regulations they are thinking of changing in the Gazette to "hear" what Canadians think before changes are made. Then finally, it also publishes the final changes to the language of the law and/or regulations and the date it will become effective. http://www.gazette.gc.ca/index-eng.html

I agree that this is going to be a big exercise in logistical changes, especially regarding fees, I don't think the actual assessment process is going to change. What I mean is that the applicant and sponsor are still going to have to prove to the best of their ability that the relationship is genuine and not entered into for the purposes of gaining status under the Act. So there would be no re-assessment required of this portion of the current process.

However, IF there are changes to the financial requirements of the sponsor, this would require a great deal of work so I really don't know what they would do for applications currently in process.

I also think that regarding the fee structure, it would be revamped meaning that they would have to eliminate the RFPR fee and implement a new fee for the conditional visa and then, 2 years later, a fee to have the condition removed and become a PR.

Whatever these logistical changes would be, the government would take into account applications currently in process and implement implement special procedures, concessions, etc. to accommodate those. Similar things have happened with Federal Skilled worker applications several times in the past few years.

You know, at this point, we are all making guesses. So far all we know is that the Minister WANTS to make changes and has gone through the consultation process. We know that his department is looking at models from the US, UK and Australia but we have no idea what ACTUAL changes he has in mind or if and when anything will occur. It seems obvious that some sort of changes are coming because the Minister has gone through the consultation process and it has been heavily reported in the media. But remember that we have a minority government and all it takes is a "no confidence" vote and an election will be called, meaning focus will shift as the current government tries to remain in power. If the government changes, all bets are off and who knows what will happen.

Following the Gazette will give notice of anything that is coming.

 

[toby]

Rjessome:

You mentioned that the new changes would make immigration specialists very busy (like yourself -- NOTE to readers: this was an unsolicited advertisement!!)

Is this just because any new procedure takes time (and expertise) to understand, or because the new requirements (as far as one can foresee them) will be more complex to satisfy?

 

[HoneyBird]

hmmm well it cant be february. maybe later.
the good thing is i got my passport request this week.
so i should be in before the door closes.

 

[rjessome]

Is this just because any new procedure takes time (and expertise) to understand, or because the new requirements (as far as one can foresee them) will be more complex to satisfy?

Toby, basically yes and yes. First of all, there will be no precedents to follow in a new system. Nobody will have the "experience" to help and guide others in the process. Consultants and lawyers have groups and associations that meet with CIC regularly to discuss changes to immigration law and the "intent" and "expectations" of CIC when changes are made. We have Continuing Professional Development and Continuing Legal Education seminars/courses that we attend on a regular basis to provide legal training to us in how to interpret changes and guide us in proper representation in the various areas of immigration law. These are NOT free or open to the public.

Secondly, there is a "feeling" that IF changes are made, they will be much more "by the book" than the current system, somewhat like the American procedures. Hard to believe but CIC is forgiving of small errors in application forms, like answering NO to the question about have you ever applied for immigration status to Canada. A common mistake is that people will think this means PR but it also means visiting, working, etc. This error will be overlooked if the VO does not believe the intent was misrepresentation. IF we become more "by the book" an error like this could mean the application will be sent back or refused because of a small mistake and you have to start over AND get back in line. No one wants that to happen to them so they will seek representatives to ensure the application is done right the first time and that they didn't miss anything.

Third, if changes are made to the financial requirements of the sponsor, it WILL get much more complex to satisfy this. Again, there is no way of knowing right now IF that portion of the application will change but all of the models the Minister has been studying have much greater financial requirements for the sponsor in the spousal/partner category than we currently have. AND, if the sponsor is unable to meet any new financial requirements, there will be an increase in H&C applications to ask CIC to overlook them. Think about the number of people on this board who are students or on EI who are currently eligible to sponsor spouses/partners. This could change. Also, the current system does not look into your debts (other than bankruptcy) or whether or not you owe back taxes. What if any new one does? The US system currently makes a person ineligible for a visa if there is a belief they will become a "public charge" meaning reliant on government assistance. We have this under our current regulations too but, although it is exercised from time to time, not nearly as often as the US system as we currently don't require very much financial proof from the sponsor. If co-signers are allowed in this category, then we are involving family members and getting statements of their assets and debts. More red tape! Then there are also citizens abroad who want to return to Canada and bring their foreign spouses. Will they have to show a certain amount of "money in the bank" before they are eligible?

Fourth, in all of these models, interviews are required much more often than they currently are in the Canadian systems. Interview preparation will be that much MORE important. Interviews are make or break points in this process and you had better be well prepared.

Finally, there will be the removal of conditions side of the process and that's where a million and one things can happen. Genuine marriages breakdown, abuse is claimed, children are born, etc. Applying for waivers, if there are any, will be a whole new area of practice in immigration law. In the US system, they are VERY difficult to get so then there is an appeal process, H&C's, etc.

Without knowing what exactly the Minister "may" implement, all of the above is just supposition based on what he has been saying in the media and the models he is studying. So those are just my thoughts about what could make this more difficult for applicants.

 

[toby]

Thanks, Rjessome.

So, I take it that the purpose of the proposals being considered by CIC is not to speed up the process, but rather to make it tougher for people to qualify (as applicants, as sponsors).

 

[abdel33]

Hi I am new to this forum.

I would like to know whether this probationary law will effect the processing time. Since a temporary visa will be issued i guess the processing time will be much faster than PR Visa. What do you think guys?

Beside I am a bit shocked for the processing time of the Nairobi ViSA office the , spousal visa processing time is about 2 years and 4 months (29 months). While China it is about 4 months only.
I also noticed that the Provincial Nominee VISA is much faster in Nairobi office it is 24 months , faster than the spousal VISA.

I think the goverment must put the most priority on Spousal and Childeren Visa. For Europe, UK, US and Australia it takes about 6-9 months to get a temporary VISA to these countries which is pretty fast. 29 Months it is a distaster for a family to bring them to canada. So why don't the goverment make some deadlines for these application similar to the US, OR UK.

There is an article i read about this issue Canadian visa office in Nairobi has longest wait times
From these article i can understand that refugees and economic visas and taking all the resources and the outweight the spousal.
It also mentions that all the processing time for many offices increased due to unkown reasson. Does it mean that fraud increased? or is it lack of man power. Even the american i guess they managed 100,000 DV-lottery applicants every year and they process it in a single year.
There must be something wrong with Canada either they are neglecting it or they wanna disappoint these applicants.


They CIC spokes man notes that poor communications systems and non-existent or crumbling infrastructure often hamper the application process. Conducting interviews in remote rural regions and the dangers of travelling in some of the countries also slow the work.

Also the Nairobi office also has a higher than average rate of no-shows for interviews.

"In some cases, in order to get to a particular country you have to go through three airports," he wrote. Do they actually travel or
"In some cases you cannot use the mail or courier services, because they don't exist. In many countries it's unlawful to use the mail to transfer passports over international borders."

 

[toby]

Beside I am a bit shocked for the processing time of the Nairobi ViSA office the , spousal visa processing time is about 2 years and 4 months (29 months). While China it is about 4 months only.

Please, where did you read that China processing times average 4 months? The CIC website for China advertises about 8 months for Beijing, and considerably longer for Hong Kong. My wife's application is being assessed in Hong Kong, and we've heard nothong for a full year.

I think the processing time depends partly on the degree of fraud in the region; if there is more fraud in certain areas (as apparently there is in south China, the area serviced by the Hong Kong consulate), processing takes more time.

 

[abdel33]

Please, where did you read that China processing times average 4 months? The CIC website for China advertises about 8 months for Beijing, and considerably longer for Hong Kong. My wife's application is being assessed in Hong Kong, and we've heard nothong for a full year.

I think the processing time depends partly on the degree of fraud in the region; if there is more fraud in certain areas (as apparently there is in south China, the area serviced by the Hong Kong consulate), processing takes more time.

Dear Toby

the CIC processing time updated at Last quarterly update: October 22, 2010 shows that Beijing average processing time is 4 months while hong kong is 15 months. Beijing is now the fastest office. I wish i was in Beijing beside if the load of one office is high they can create aonther one to split the load, for southern CHina they can open another office in Guangdong Region, they already got a consulate over there and the processing time of Hong Kong will be reduced to as half of the current time that will be 7-8 months which is a time someone can be patient for.

 

[medellinguy]

if the new law would passed, does that mean that when an immigrant arrives and wants to start school for example he will have to pay the same fees as a foreign student? My wife wants to do a master's degree but we have nowhere the money to pay up to 10K a semester....how are they going to handle those things? it would take even longer to be able to receive the citizenship if the immigrant as to wait 2-3 years -- perm residency 3 years ..would be up to 6 years instead of the current 3 years????

 

[KarenCee]

Wow...although I can't say I'm shocked. I figured eventually things would change in regards to Canadian Immigration, just didn't know when. Having been through U.S. Immigration (a hellacious and expensive journey indeed), having a condition placed on residency would not be a new thing to us. My husband (the Canadian) had to go through the 2 yr Conditional GC step before getting his 10 yr GC. Well, actually, before the 2 yr GC he had to apply for a work permit and travel rights when he adjusted status. Still, the conditions might not be such a bad thing. We never complained about the conditions on his GC here...we were married and able to spend that time together instead of apart as we did when we waited on the Fiance Visa (K-1). IF your relationship is genuine, then why does a conditional period matter, especially if you are spending that time with your spouse/partner? I know mine is and by the time we actually submit our application we will have been married over 10 years. If it keeps down fraudulent relationships/marriages, then I think that's a great idea.

Just my humble opinion of course.

 

[sierra_rose]

maybe this topic is hitting too close to home? people only get so angry about things that is true,that affects them personally.sounds like he is one of them.

 

[Iamrobot85]

I wonder if instituting a probationary period actually WOULD make it easier for genuine couples to immigrate. I don't see how that is. Would the process be quicker or less exhausting? I don't think there's much evidence to suggest this is true.

I also wonder if you would be able to WORK during this probationary period. If not, this would make things much, much harder for a lot of couples.

Also, there's the very real problem that this legislation would force some people to stay in abusive relationships. There should be some loophole where if a person can prove his or her partner is abusive they should be able to leave that relationship without losing PRS.