FSW WORLDWIDE

[Alysson]

TBH, Canada was a different country when my sister moved here. A place in Toronto downtown coster 250k. Right now, the same place is 1M+. I don't think I have an unrealistic expectation of Canada; my expectation was to live in 1st world country with strong economy. Canada just isn't it. If I cannot see a doctor and someone close to me is suffering from pain, then I start to question my decisions and the country I moved to. In the end of the day, I am paying for the medical service, police, other public services through my taxes. Then why I cannot receive what I am paying for? If you cannot provide me with the service, fine, allow me to opt out of the taxes and go with private healthcare provider.

While we are talking about all of that. UK doesn't bring in 437K immigrants every year. I am ok with that number but FFS, scale the infrastructure. You cannot keep bringing people over without building more affordable housing, without increasing funding for healthcare (thank you Ford, funds were cut).

I’ve noticed a huge uptick in news stories more anti immigration (at least anti current levels of immigration) due to lack of infrastructure. Liberals will end up causing immigration to become part of the debate in the next election. Something that never was, other than by irrelevant parties like the PPC.

 

[AndyUK]

TBH, Canada was a different country when my sister moved here. A place in Toronto downtown coster 250k. Right now, the same place is 1M+. I don't think I have an unrealistic expectation of Canada; my expectation was to live in 1st world country with strong economy. Canada just isn't it. If I cannot see a doctor and someone close to me is suffering from pain, then I start to question my decisions and the country I moved to. In the end of the day, I am paying for the medical service, police, other public services through my taxes. Then why I cannot receive what I am paying for? If you cannot provide me with the service, fine, allow me to opt out of the taxes and go with private healthcare provider.

While we are talking about all of that. UK doesn't bring in 437K immigrants every year. I am ok with that number but FFS, scale the infrastructure. You cannot keep bringing people over without building more affordable housing, without increasing funding for healthcare (thank you Ford, funds were cut).

All fair points. But sadly these issues are not limited to Canada. It seems like it's very similar in the UK. And yes, the UK may not be bringing such number of immigrants but that's part of the problem - since Brexit there isn't enough healthcare staff, lorry drivers, etc. etc. Plus 10+ years of austerity, frozen pay in the public sector, etc.

And regarding unrealistic expectations - I'm honestly not sure if there are currently any 1st world countries with strong economies. It just feels like we need another couple of years for everything to stabilise after all this covid-related crap. Personally, I'm expecting big-ish pullback in the stock market at some point in the next few months, a recession, and eventually a drop in real estate prices and then a slow recovery.

 

[Deleted member 1083629]

All fair points. But sadly these issues are not limited to Canada. It seems like it's very similar in the UK. And yes, the UK may not be bringing such number of immigrants but that's part of the problem - since Brexit there isn't enough healthcare staff, lorry drivers, etc. etc. Plus 10+ years of austerity, frozen pay in the public sector, etc.

And regarding unrealistic expectations - I'm honestly not sure if there are currently any 1st world countries with strong economies. It just feels like we need another couple of years for everything to stabilise after all this covid-related crap. Personally, I'm expecting big-ish pullback in the stock market at some point in the next few months, a recession, and eventually a drop in real estate prices and then a slow recovery.

Not once for the last 10 years I saw a drop in real estate in GTA. Not once. That's one of the reasons why I talk crap about Canada. Everything that is happening could have been avoided. Easily. Medicine? It happened because Ford pulled the funding. Real estate? Allowed foreign investors to get in. AND both of those things are linked to massive immigration numbers, which (SURPRISE) could have also been approached in a little more planned fashion.

 

[Deleted member 1083629]

I’ve noticed a huge uptick in news stories more anti immigration (at least anti current levels of immigration) due to lack of infrastructure. Liberals will end up causing immigration to become part of the debate in the next election. Something that never was, other than by irrelevant parties like the PPC.

It already is. That guy from conservative (Pierre) makes sure to talk about it a lot.

There is a very strong anti-immigration mood is starting to form. I will give you example. Couple of months ago, Indians from Brampton attacked a police car. The most popular comments on reddit were: "This is what is happening when they start to form community" and "As a country, we are going nowhere if those are the people we allow in the country". Of course, Reddit is minority but 1) it's a liberal community; 2) it consists of younger people.

 

[AndyUK]

Not once for the last 10 years I saw a drop in real estate in GTA.

That's it though - there was no major global recession since the sub-prime lending crisis in 2007-2008 - hence why the prices kept going up.
Yes, Covid messed things up but governments all over the world just started printing money so there was no crash like it should be... only in recent months we started seeing the fallout of it. If there's a worldwide recession this year (and a lot is pointing to it), we should see at least some pullback in the property prices... that being said, they're so inflated in many places, that it probably won't make much of a difference anyway.

And I totally agree with everything else in your post.

 

[Alysson]

It already is. That guy from conservative (Pierre) makes sure to talk about it a lot.

There is a very strong anti-immigration mood is starting to form. I will give you example. Couple of months ago, Indians from Brampton attacked a police car. The most popular comments on reddit were: "This is what is happening when they start to form community" and "As a country, we are going nowhere if those are the people we allow in the country". Of course, Reddit is minority but 1) it's a liberal community; 2) it consists of younger people.

PP talks about it, but still in good light. A lot of PPC hate him calling him a fake conservative because of that. But yeah, he’s a flip-flopper so things can change if the outrage keeps increasing.

 

[Vonput]

Well, like already highlighted, no country is perfect. Canada has some downsides, but to me, it has a lot of positives compared to my home country.

 

[GandiBaat]

I know this makes me a hypocrite as I am in the process of migrating to Canada, but I think western societies in general are just failing now. I can't think of a single "western" country that is doing well. If I hadn't spent last four years of life dedicating to emigrating out of my country, I would have stayed.

In the limited amount of time I had spent in Canada, I got the feeling that someone lied to me. I couldn't exactly pinpoint who did, but I felt like I had been sold a lemon. If nothing else, I have gotten over my colonial mindset that seems to plague almost every Indian.

Yes, problems exist everywhere and no place is a utopia, those problems you have listed don't exist even in "third-world" countries, or atleast not in the one I have lived in. What direction is the west heading into? I think we are witnessing the fall of the west.

inb4 "then maybe you should just stay where you are lol"

If I look at it objectively, the biggest advantage Canada has over India is that it is a mature society. India has a mature civilization which is why Indians are comfortable about their identity mostly: we know what we are. But India is an immature nation and society. We are just 70 year old in that sense. How it impacts me? Canada is ...

Mature in the sense, they know they can not wish disabled folks away so they have to accomodate them and they do. This is close home and personal for me and my son. It is something that money can not buy. Society tolerant for disabled is evolved after many many decades of suffering and in a country where there are a lot of people who may need to tread that path -- namely older folks. India always had an abundance of young folks to chew up, it will take some more time to become tolerant for disabled.

Mature in the sense, people live long enough to worry about long term consequences. Like dust in air, like environment degradation. In India, we did not live long enough till very recently so we did not really bother about long term consequences. We would be dead before those consequences hit anyway. Just 50 years back we were only living till the ripe old age of 47 years. Now we are living upto 70 years on an average, so we are figuring that long terms consequences matter.

Mature in the sense, people know how to hold their alcohol. India is still learning it. May be for a lot of us(middle class Indians), alcohol was something very rich folks drank or very poor folks did so they never really learnt about controlling it. Thats changing but it will take sometime before we will learn how to do it.

 

[Deleted member 994371]

Well, like already highlighted, no country is perfect. Canada has some downsides, but to me, it has a lot of positives compared to my home country.

Which country is that?

 

[GandiBaat]

I know this makes me a hypocrite as I am in the process of migrating to Canada, but I think western societies in general are just failing now.

Most of this failing feeling has its base in 2008 crash. Its neither new nor unique. Before 2008 west was sort of living in this idea that recession and downturn are a thing of past.

Well, if we were living in late 1920s, we would have felt that end of the world is near. I mean look at it. World war 1 just ended in 1919 or so, great pandemic hit just 1 dacade back and now massive depression! Couple of dacades of misery can make you feel that end is near.

These things happen in ebs and flows.

1919s War + Pandemic -> Roaring 20s-> Late 1920s doom and gloom -> 1930s Economic recovery and super charged nationalism and political uphealve -> War again! of 40s -> Euphoria of victory of 50s and early 60s -> Disappointment and disillusionment of 60s (counter culture movement)->Oil shock of 70s->high inflation and stock crashes of 80s->Massive economic growth and globalization of 90s (most of us can start feeling this was the start of story, but well, it was just one stage)->Scare of tech burst of 2000->Internet boom of 2000s->Great Recession of 2008

As you can see history never repeats but it rhymes. This "decline of west" most likely will give rise of some nationalist or conservative movement which might lead to a conflict or something similar with emerging powers like China and things will come full circle.

Upshot : Every now and then, you will experience a period in your life where you will think that world around you (west or whatever) is going to crapper. Its natural. Deal with it!

 

[GandiBaat]

It sucks that when its my turn to go there, I am getting the short end of the stick.

Actually, I would not say it that way. Those who came before us, especially in 90s had other issues to deal with..

Just imagine : Right now, you can call IRCC (pray that they talk to you however), send email or web form and what not. How hard would it have been to get lost in the system in 90s or even early 2000s? We can get GCMS notes and monitor what the hell Canadian beaurocracy is thinking. I wonder how immigration might have been working in 90s with paper files or likewise.

Getting a well paying job here is tough due to stupid canadian employment requirement. Imagine in 90s... You were a professor back home and how you are a sewage plant operator in canada after stuggling for 5 years as a night cleck because of glass ceiling.

You can get a remote work in USA living in Canada. Our predecessor from 7-8 years back did not have this facility at this level of acceptance.

If either US or Canada's economy picks up, it is likely your personal job and money situation will change for better, much faster.

I think we have our shit to deal with, they had their shit.

 

[GandiBaat]

I was thinking of how Indians got obsessed with moving to the west. I think Phillipines and Nigerians are two other countries that I know of that are equally obsessed with emigrating. But I never hear them bashing each other on this forum for some reason. Always us.

Put it simply, there are way too many of us and we are more diverse than rest of the countries. This is why we bash each other up so much. (just my thought and I have a history of being wrong).
Also, our laundry dries in open since we speak english. I am sure if you look in some Chinese forums, there will be some glaring things to hear about.

 

[GandiBaat]

I think bollywood played a big role in perpatrating this culture in us. If you look at 90s movie, they were full of heroes living in phoren land, coming to India when they had the realization that Mother India is everything. You can't say that for movies till 80s. They were all "swadesi" till that point. Being born in 90s had something to do with that obsession.

Oh well, there were people who used to go to US and Canada but those were limited to certain parts of our country : think punjab kerala etc. People knew about this because they knew about those who went. Rest of us heard the stories only.

As far as movies go, foreign exposure always had a charm. 60s-70s movies (An evening in paris, Love in Tokyo, Des Pardes), all were there.

I believe (and again, with throat clearing of me being wrong sometime... a lot of time) it was internet boom of 2000s that led to this situation. Now people knew foreign visit is not merely a fantasy or it needs "appraoch" or it needs a lot of money. What was previously tricks of trade became common knowledge.

 

[Impatient Dankaroo]

Yeah...you are right. It does make sense.

It sucks that when its my turn to go there, I am getting the short end of the stick.

I was thinking of how Indians got obsessed with moving to the west. I think Phillipines and Nigerians are two other countries that I know of that are equally obsessed with emigrating. But I never hear them bashing each other on this forum for some reason. Always us.

I think bollywood played a big role in perpatrating this culture in us. If you look at 90s movie, they were full of heroes living in phoren land, coming to India when they had the realization that Mother India is everything. You can't say that for movies till 80s. They were all "swadesi" till that point. Being born in 90s had something to do with that obsession.

If I was Indian, I wouldn't move to Canada. Assuming that I belong to a well off family and have some wealth, I've heard that you can live with servants and cost of living is really low. Plus, India is soon to become the next sweat shop hub of the world due to political issues in China and rising costs and aging population. If you were to be a business owner or factory owner you could make bank.

Why would you come to Canada and become a corporate slave if you had this opportunity? Just to have a LinkedIn that says Product Manager next to your name

 

[wonderbly]

If you get a 150K US remote job, you will be nobility in Saskaschewan

Hubby currently at 120k per month remote job. I am aiming for similar in April. For now, I work for the sask govt with decent pay .