Conjugal Partner

[Erina]

I think you have a strong case, as long as you can prove the relationship. Not only the emotional aspect of it, but also financially. In my opinion, considering you're from two different religions, and that you live in a country where Muslims cannot marry a non- Muslim, can strengths your case. As for my case, we're both born in Iran, and therefore born Muslim. So you have some kind of marriage barrier (for religious matters) as well. Good luck

 

[Erina]

Dear Suuza, I'm actually checking whether if you have gone for a conjugal sponsorship. You can read my posts in a thread I created based on updates I received from CIC. They asked us why we didn't get married in Turkey where we don't need parental permission. So although your situation is a bit different of mine, I'd recommend if you can, get married in a third country, because apparently they'd ask you the same thing, if you can't, include that in your application. Bests.

 

[suuza]

Dear Suuza, I'm actually checking whether if you have gone for a conjugal sponsorship. You can read my posts in a thread I created based on updates I received from CIC. They asked us why we didn't get married in Turkey where we don't need parental permission. So although your situation is a bit different of mine, I'd recommend if you can, get married in a third country, because apparently they'd ask you the same thing, if you can't, include that in your application. Bests.

Dear Erina!
Thank you for your messages and informing me of your partners visa process!
Last month I applied for a TRV and now have the result ... I got refused !
so I think now, maybe I can finally apply for a conjugal partner visa,
but I saw your message a min ago and here is the thing :

Actually before we think of applying for conjugal partner visa, we thought of getting married in Turkey, but the problem is that : it's not possible... !
according to marriage law in Turkey:
Turkish officials can not perform a marriage for foreigners that would not be recognized in their own countries...! am I right ?
if parental permission is a requirement for marriage in Iran then, according to what's been said in this site, it is required even for getting married in Turkey.
it also indicates that:
Foreigners (or local people) who want to marry in Turkey must provide their marriage licences issued by the proper Civil Status Register of his/her own country and prove that they're not already married at the moment. Otherwise, Turkish relevant authorities do not conduct these marriages. This means that the married couples cannot again be married in Turkey under the Turkish law.

but , what is this marriage licence? well of course I can get a licence that shows I'm not married, but does it give the permission to me to marry to a non Muslim?
or maybe I'm wrong? do you know anything about this case ? marriage laws in Turkey for foreigners ?
please inform me if you are planning on this and if you are sure and know the rules for getting married in Turkey.

I emailed an attorney in Ottawa few days ago about this case and he told me the same thing:" if you can get married in Turkey or any other countries you better do, because in your case, even proving the very basic fact that you are in this relationship is very hard and almost impossible!"
as you mentioned, not only emotionally but also financially we need to be related somehow, right ? but we are not , (due to sanctions)
and now we are even having problem with getting visa for him to come to Iran!

I would be more than happy if you can help me with any additional information on this case.

sincerely!

 

[frege]

Dear Erina!
Thank you for your messages and informing me of your partners visa process!
Last month I applied for a TRV and now have the result ... I got refused !
so I think now, maybe I can finally apply for a conjugal partner visa,
but I saw your message a min ago and here is the thing :

Actually before we think of applying for conjugal partner visa, we thought of getting married in Turkey, but the problem is that : it's not possible... !
according to marriage law in Turkey:
Turkish officials can not perform a marriage for foreigners that would not be recognized in their own countries...! am I right ?
if parental permission is a requirement for marriage in Iran then, according to what's been said in this site, it is required even for getting married in Turkey.
it also indicates that:
Foreigners (or local people) who want to marry in Turkey must provide their marriage licences issued by the proper Civil Status Register of his/her own country and prove that they're not already married at the moment. Otherwise, Turkish relevant authorities do not conduct these marriages. This means that the married couples cannot again be married in Turkey under the Turkish law.

but , what is this marriage licence? well of course I can get a licence that shows I'm not married, but does it give the permission to me to marry to a non Muslim?
or maybe I'm wrong? do you know anything about this case ? marriage laws in Turkey for foreigners ?
please inform me if you are planning on this and if you are sure and know the rules for getting married in Turkey.

I emailed an attorney in Ottawa few days ago about this case and he told me the same thing:" if you can get married in Turkey or any other countries you better do, because in your case, even proving the very basic fact that you are in this relationship is very hard and almost impossible!"
as you mentioned, not only emotionally but also financially we need to be related somehow, right ? but we are not , (due to sanctions)
and now we are even having problem with getting visa for him to come to Iran!

I would be more than happy if you can help me with any additional information on this case.

sincerely!

Hello Suuza,

If you wrote in your TRV application that you wanted to marry your boyfriend in Canada, I think that will be a very good thing.

What you said about Turkey is true in many countries - the marriage would have to be legal in your own country in order for them to perform the ceremony. In fact, you and your boyfriend are in a similar situation to same-sex couples in some places.

But things don't work this way in all countries. There are countries that welcome foreign couples - including same-sex ones sometimes - to marry even if it would be illegal in their home country. For example, I saw this article about foreign same-sex couples marrying in Argentina:

http://upsidedownworld.org/main/news-briefs-archives-68/3642-buenos-aires-offers-same-sex-marriage-to-foreign-couples

Perhaps you can marry in a country like that. You could pick a country that doesn't have visa requirements for you. Or you could pick a country that does have a visa requirement, but it would be easier to get a visa for that country than it was for Canada because that country country wouldn't be concerned about you staying there, given that your boyfriend has nothing to do with that country. Maybe this would even work with the United States so that his family come to the ceremony easily.

From Canada's perspective, the important thing is that the marriage be legal in the country where it was celebrated. Also, I imagine that since your country won't recognize the marriage, depending on its laws, it could be dangerous for you if your country's authorities found out about the marriage being consummated. This would be a good reason to hide the marriage from your country's authorities altogether. (I'm a bit embarrassed to mention this at all, but I know that some Muslim countries are very conservative concerning unmarried couples.)

 

[frege]

Suuza,

To add to what I was saying before, I've had a look at some countries Iranians don't need visas for to see what documents foreigners need in order to get married there.

You might want to investigate whether it would be possible for you to get married in Georgia (the country). It appears Iranian citizens can enter the country visa-free for 45 days, and the marriage process seems easy there. Flights from Tehran to Tbilisi via Istanbul are inexpensive with Turkish Airlines. The following page lists visa requirements.

http://www.mfa.gov.ge/index.php?lang_id=ENG&sec_id=96

I understand that you will want to minimize the number of documents you need from the Iranian authorities. According to this webpage of the British Foreign Office, a certificate of no impediment is no longer required in order to get married in Georgia.

http://ukingeorgia.fco.gov.uk/en/help-for-british-nationals/living-in-georgia/how-register-marriage-or

The following page lists the documents necessary.

http://www.cra.gov.ge/index.php?lang_id=ENG&sec_id=8

Basically, it seems your passports and entry stamps to Georgia are all you need, as well as a written statement by both of you.

That government page does mention a certificate of no impediment, but my impression is that this is to tell you about the documents you would need in order for them to *issue* a certificate of no impediment to you. This would be for Georgians who want to get married outside Georgia.

I hope I'm not misstating things here, as the references aren't authoritative-looking. But if you're interested in doing this, you or your boyfriend could contact the Georgian embassy in Canada or Iran to find out more.

P.S., According to this article in Russian, you can even get married or divorced online in Georgia. It's a strange way to celebrate the happiest day of your life! (It's not a good idea for you, in any case, because CIC won't like it.)

http://www.epress.am/ru/2011/05/02/в-грузии-можно-жениться-и-разводиться.html

Edit: Here's another page on getting married in Georgia.
http://house.gov.ge/index.php?sec_id=288&lang_id=ENG

Edit: The following article in Russian is specifically about foreigners marrying in Georgia. It says that the number of foreign couples marrying there went up (to 57 !?) in 2010. It says that the justice ministry has simplified the marriage procedure as much as possible for foreigners and Georgians alike. It says specifically that foreigners no longer need special permission to marry, certificates of no impediment, proof of income or translations of their passports.

http://newsgeorgia.ru/society/20101222/213656799.html
http://www.cra.gov.ge/index.php?lang_id=RUS&sec_id=49&info_id=1468

 

[frege]

If instead of getting married abroad, you choose to file a conjugal partner application, it might be advisable to get advice from an immigration lawyer.

It may be important to include information from expert sources about the situation in Iran for mixed couples and women who don't have their father's permission to marry. In other words, you give information about your own personal situation, but wherever possible, include expert information about general conditions in Iran.

For example, I found the following two pages with infomation from the Immigration and Refugee Board of Canada.

http://www.unhcr.org/cgi-bin/texis/vtx/refworld/rwmain?page=country&docid=3ae6ad2d24
http://www.unhcr.org/cgi-bin/texis/vtx/refworld/rwmain?page=country&docid=3ae6aab464

This information underscores why it might be dangerous for you to marry.

 

[BCgirl2012]

Suuza,

To add to what I was saying before, I've had a look at some countries Iranians don't need visas for to see what documents foreigners need in order to get married there.

You might want to investigate whether it would be possible for you to get married in Georgia (the country). It appears Iranian citizens can enter the country visa-free for 45 days, and the marriage process seems easy there. Flights from Tehran to Tbilisi via Istanbul are inexpensive with Turkish Airlines. The following page lists visa requirements.

Wow, frege Quite a thorough set of links about Georgia!

I came across these last year when we were planning to get married. My husband is Georgian, so we basically were looking for similar set of info. Getting married in Georgia is really hassle free. It's true that they don't require certificate of no impediment. Just keep in mind that Canadian documents need to be legalized by Canadian authorities, and then by Georgian consulate/embassies. This is called Legalization and is necessary because Canada hasn't signed the Apostille treaty.

Suuza, if you feel what frege is suggesting is an alternative for you, please feel free to ask and I'll be happy to share my experience with you. Best of luck.

 

[frege]

Wow, frege Quite a thorough set of links about Georgia!

I came across these last year when we were planning to get married. My husband is Georgian, so we basically were looking for similar set of info. Getting married in Georgia is really hassle free. It's true that they don't require certificate of no impediment. Just keep in mind that Canadian documents need to be legalized by Canadian authorities, and then by Georgian consulate/embassies. This is called Legalization and is necessary because Canada hasn't signed the Apostille treaty.

Suuza, if you feel what frege is suggesting is an alternative for you, please feel free to ask and I'll be happy to share my experience with you. Best of luck.

Well, Iranians are limited in where they can travel to without visas, so there weren't a ton of countries to look at.

What you said about legalization sounds unfortunate, because Iran hasn't signed the Hague Convention either. But according to the webpage, the only documents needed will be a passport and entry stamp.

What Canadian documents did you need? After reading all this, I'm really curious myself.

 

[BCgirl2012]

Well, Iranians are limited in where they can travel to without visas, so there weren't a ton of countries to look at.

What you said about legalization sounds unfortunate, because Iran hasn't signed the Hague Convention either. But according to the webpage, the only documents needed will be a passport and entry stamp.

What Canadian documents did you need? After reading all this, I'm really curious myself.

It wasn't the case for us, but we were told in case of a previous marriage, the divorce certificate must be shown. A Canadian divorce certificate wouldn't be accepted unless it is legalized. They want any foreign document to be either Apostilled or Legalized.

All they checked for us was my entry/exit stamps in my passport to make sure I'm there legally, and my husband's ID. The fee is also really modest. They have an option of just going to the office and signing, but they also have what they call Wedding Houses, which are for civil ceremonies and are glorified versions of a registry that only deals with marriages.

They never asked us anything about religion. I just double-checked and in our marriage certificate it only mentions our names (before and after - in case a couple chooses to change their name), DOBs, nationalities, and the date of marriage.

 

[frege]

It wasn't the case for us, but we were told in case of a previous marriage, the divorce certificate must be shown. A Canadian divorce certificate wouldn't be accepted unless it is legalized. They want any foreign document to be either Apostilled or Legalized.

All they checked for us was my entry/exit stamps in my passport to make sure I'm there legally, and my husband's ID. The fee is also really modest. They have an option of just going to the office and signing, but they also have what they call Wedding Houses, which are for civil ceremonies and are glorified versions of a registry that only deals with marriages.

They never asked us anything about religion. I just double-checked and in our marriage certificate it only mentions our names (before and after - in case a couple chooses to change their name), DOBs, nationalities, and the date of marriage.

Right, I wasn't thinking of divorce. So it sounds like the only thing Suuza would need to explain to the Iranian authorities would be the entry stamp to Georgia. It still sounds a bit dangerous for her if anybody there found out. This will be a difficult decision for her regardless.

Do you know if the witnesses were required to be Georgian, or if you could have brought your own from abroad?

 

[BCgirl2012]

Right, I wasn't thinking of divorce. So it sounds like the only thing Suuza would need to explain to the Iranian authorities would be the entry stamp to Georgia. It still sounds a bit dangerous for her if anybody there found out. This will be a difficult decision for her regardless.

Do you know if the witnesses were required to be Georgian, or if you could have brought your own from abroad?

I've noticed a lot of Iranians recently travelling to Georgia just as tourists, so I'd say it shouldn't be a big deal to explain it.

The witnesses don't need to be Georgian. Two witnesses are needed, and in our case one of them was not Georgian. They just need their passport and their exit/entry stamps, again to demonstrate that they are in Georgia legally.

 

[frege]

I've noticed a lot of Iranians recently travelling to Georgia just as tourists, so I'd say it shouldn't be a big deal to explain it.

The witnesses don't need to be Georgian. Two witnesses are needed, and in our case one of them was not Georgian. They just need their passport and their exit/entry stamps, again to demonstrate that they are in Georgia legally.

Wow! This is useful information. Georgia sounds like the place to get married for a lot of people who can't do it at home for some reason. There are many countries whose citizens don't have a visa requirement for entering Georgia.

http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Visa_policy_of_Georgia
http://www.mfa.gov.ge/index.php?lang_id=ENG&sec_id=96

Unfortunately, marriage there seems to be restricted to opposite-sex couples.

 

[BCgirl2012]

Wow! This is useful information. Georgia sounds like the place to get married for a lot of people who can't do it at home for some reason. There are many countries whose citizens don't have a visa requirement for entering Georgia.

http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Visa_policy_of_Georgia
http://www.mfa.gov.ge/index.php?lang_id=ENG&sec_id=96

Unfortunately, marriage there seems to be restricted to opposite-sex couples.

I have asked around, and it seems to be so regarding the opposite-sex couples. I have asked for the exact text in the law, because your question made me curious to see how exactly they are defining marriage here. I'll share here if I find something interesting.

 

[Erina]

Dear Erina!
Thank you for your messages and informing me of your partners visa process!
Last month I applied for a TRV and now have the result ... I got refused !
so I think now, maybe I can finally apply for a conjugal partner visa,
but I saw your message a min ago and here is the thing :

Actually before we think of applying for conjugal partner visa, we thought of getting married in Turkey, but the problem is that : it's not possible... !
according to marriage law in Turkey:
Turkish officials can not perform a marriage for foreigners that would not be recognized in their own countries...! am I right ?
if parental permission is a requirement for marriage in Iran then, according to what's been said in this site, it is required even for getting married in Turkey.
it also indicates that:
Foreigners (or local people) who want to marry in Turkey must provide their marriage licences issued by the proper Civil Status Register of his/her own country and prove that they're not already married at the moment. Otherwise, Turkish relevant authorities do not conduct these marriages. This means that the married couples cannot again be married in Turkey under the Turkish law.

but , what is this marriage licence? well of course I can get a licence that shows I'm not married, but does it give the permission to me to marry to a non Muslim?
or maybe I'm wrong? do you know anything about this case ? marriage laws in Turkey for foreigners ?
please inform me if you are planning on this and if you are sure and know the rules for getting married in Turkey.

I emailed an attorney in Ottawa few days ago about this case and he told me the same thing:" if you can get married in Turkey or any other countries you better do, because in your case, even proving the very basic fact that you are in this relationship is very hard and almost impossible!"
as you mentioned, not only emotionally but also financially we need to be related somehow, right ? but we are not , (due to sanctions)
and now we are even having problem with getting visa for him to come to Iran!

I would be more than happy if you can help me with any additional information on this case.

sincerely!

I'm sorry you got refused for TRV, but we knew the results beforehand right?
Yes, marrying in Turkey is impossible for you as again you will have to deal with Iranian authorities, but there are countries where they take marriage for foreigners easier, some people mentioned Georgia here, and there must be some other. So hun, if by getting married you don't risk your life, try to do so. Then the whole process will go smooth and less stressfull. But what did you mean you are not emotionally and financially related ? Even if you do marry, they still need relationship proof and all.

Ankara has our file for 7 months, and 10 months since initial application. 2.5 months passed since they received additional documents, and still, nothing.... Conjugal partner is risky and full of stress, once you apply, you get paranoid you'll be refused everymorning you wake up, lol, or that's the case for me. Try your best to marry your partner before taking any action. Cheers and good luck.

 

[Pori]

I'm sorry you got refused for TRV, but we knew the results beforehand right?
Yes, marrying in Turkey is impossible for you as again you will have to deal with Iranian authorities, but there are countries where they take marriage for foreigners easier, some people mentioned Georgia here, and there must be some other. So hun, if by getting married you don't risk your life, try to do so. Then the whole process will go smooth and less stressfull. But what did you mean you are not emotionally and financially related ? Even if you do marry, they still need relationship proof and all.

Ankara has our file for 7 months, and 10 months since initial application. 2.5 months passed since they received additional documents, and still, nothing.... Conjugal partner is risky and full of stress, once you apply, you get paranoid you'll be refused everymorning you wake up, lol, or that's the case for me. Try your best to marry your partner before taking any action. Cheers and good luck.

Somehow, her situation is similar to mine..
And I would just like to clarify one thing.. If getting married is what you suggest, won't there be any problem if me and boyfriend haven't live continuously for a year? He just visited my country twice for a total of 3 weeks but we've been in this relationship for almost 3 years now.
I just got my PR a month ago and he is living in Iran. Yes, we can get married in my country, there's no problem with that, religion -- I'm a catholic and he's a Muslim, but from my side, it's allowed. My family is not against our relationship too. Getting married is most likely the option from my point of view.

But then again, my question is, is it possible to sponsor him once I get to Canada via the Out-land Spouse Sponsorship even without having to lived together for a year?

Thank you!