Bill C-6, Messages between the HoC and the Senate, FACTS ONLY

[PedDoc]

No, no updates. And do not expect one within days. Check back in some weeks. I will not check this forum every single day until C-6 is back on the House's agenda.

So no need to ask for an update every single day. Concentrate on other things in life for a bit, it'll be healthier than checking for an update every day.

I agree

 

[rizwan150]

Is there any expected timeline that when it will be scheduled in HOC for discussion and decision?

 

[uncomfortable]

Is there any expected timeline that when it will be scheduled in HOC for discussion and decision?

I guess on Friday we will have the projected order of business for next week, and we'll see if a discussion is expected before the late May 1-week break. Otherwise the discussion will go into June.

 

[spyfy]

I guess on Friday we will have the projected order of business for next week, and we'll see if a discussion is expected before the late May 1-week break. Otherwise the discussion will go into June.

The Projected Order of Business is only reliable up to the next sitting day. Beyond that, most items are missing and/or get adjusted later. So Don't take the POB of Friday as reliable info on ALL sitting days of next week. It's only useful to judge the next day of a sitting, not more.

 

[naturalca]

House of Commons has twitter accounts now, please follow to get latest news.

https://twitter.com/SenateCA/status/864152169770999808

 

[spyfy]

Hello everyone,

before you get too excited: There is no news on Bill C-6 in particular.
However, as you might have heard there are plenty of other amended bills before the House of Commons at the moment.

What we CAN NOT learn from these other bills
We shouldn't use the progress of these other bills as an indicator as to how fast the government will propose their position on the C-6 amendments. After all, all these other bills cover very different topics, some of them less complicated and less debated than C-6.

What we CAN learn from these other bills
I've followed these other bills closely and based on that I can give you some new info on how things will go for Bill C-6. There are some good news involved below!

Step 1: The government proposes how to deal with these amendments
This first step is the big mystery: When will it happen? Which amendments will the government accept? We don't know exactly. But there is a nice quote that I can give you here: Senator Omidvar asked the Government Representative in the Senate last week when the HoC will deal with the Senate amendments. The Government Representative said: "The government is considering the Senate bill, as amended, and will be making a decision very shortly." (You can find this quote in writing in the Hansard of the Senate meeting on March 10) That doesn't sound too bad, does it? Anyways, once the government made up their mind, you will find their suggestion under this link:
http://www.ourcommons.ca/DocumentViewer/en/42-1/house/sitting-178/order-notice/page-13
(You have to jump to the newest date of course)
There is nothing about C-6 yet, but this is where the suggested motion will be published.
Note: The suggested motion showing up there does NOT mean that it will be discussed at the next sitting.

Step 2: The bill has to make it on the Projected Order of Business (POB)
Your next step is to wait for the bill to show up on the Projected Order of Business here:
http://www.ourcommons.ca/DocumentViewer/en/42-1/house/projected-business
It might take some sitting days before the HoC will put C-6 on the POB. Note: Only look at the Projection for the very next sitting. Ignore the part about "Projection For Subsequent Days". These subsequent days are missing most of the interesting stuff, namely government bill debates. Only look at the very next day of the Projection.
The good news is: Once the bill is on the POB it will actually be discussed that very day! No crazy limbo like in the Senate (will they discuss it?!)

Step 3: The bill is debated in the Chamber
Now they will debate the amendments. Please note though: At this point, the debate will not change much. It is basically 99.9% guaranteed that the Liberal Majority will vote for whatever the government suggested anyways.

Step 4: The debate on the bill will end soon, guaranteed (you better believe it!)
This is the best news of all: The whole crazy delay tactics in the Senate can NOT happen in the House of Commons. Usually, the second day they debate the amendments, the House majority passes a motion like this (and for anyone who went through the Senate hell will us, this will sound like unicorns with sugar on top):
Pursuant to Standing Order 78(2), Mr./Ms. [...], moved, — That, in relation to Bill […], not more than one further sitting day shall be allotted to the stage of consideration of Senate amendments to the Bill; and that, 15 minutes before the expiry of the time provided for Government Orders on the day allotted to the consideration of the said stage of the said Bill, any proceedings before the House shall be interrupted, if required for the purpose of this Order, and in turn every question necessary for the disposal of the said stage of the Bill shall be put forthwith and successively without further debate or amendment.
This means, the clock ticks and then the House is forced to drop all business and they MUST vote on all motions, amendments etc. without any further debate or even new amendments allowed.
Well doesn't that sound just great?

Step 5: The bill goes back to the Senate
By now, I think it is almost certain that the HoC will not just blindly accept all amendments by the Senate but reject or modify some of them. So the bill will go back to the Senate. I want to keep it to facts and therefore not make any prediction as of how long the Senate will need for this.

What should you take from this?
The big question is: When will the Government position be published in the notice paper. But once it's there, things will move rather quick. Also, based on the quote from the Senate above, we can be cautiously optimistic that we won't have to wait too long.

 

[naturalca]

Hello everyone,

before you get too excited: There is no news on Bill C-6 in particular.
However, as you might have heard there are plenty of other amended bills before the House of Commons at the moment.

What we CAN NOT learn from these other bills
We shouldn't use the progress of these other bills as an indicator as to how fast the government will propose their position on the C-6 amendments. After all, all these other bills cover very different topics, some of them less complicated and less debated than C-6.

What we CAN learn from these other bills
I've followed these other bills closely and based on that I can give you some new info on how things will go for Bill C-6. There are some good news involved below!

Step 1: The government proposes how to deal with these amendments
This first step is the big mystery: When will it happen? Which amendments will the government accept? We don't know exactly. But there is a nice quote that I can give you here: Senator Omidvar asked the Government Representative in the Senate last week when the HoC will deal with the Senate amendments. The Government Representative said: "The government is considering the Senate bill, as amended, and will be making a decision very shortly." (You can find this quote in writing in the Hansard of the Senate meeting on March 10) That doesn't sound too bad, does it? Anyways, once the government made up their mind, you will find their suggestion under this link:
http://www.ourcommons.ca/DocumentViewer/en/42-1/house/sitting-178/order-notice/page-13
(You have to jump to the newest date of course)
There is nothing about C-6 yet, but this is where the suggested motion will be published.
Note: The suggested motion showing up there does NOT mean that it will be discussed at the next sitting.

Step 2: The bill has to make it on the Projected Order of Business (POB)
Your next step is to wait for the bill to show up on the Projected Order of Business here:
http://www.ourcommons.ca/DocumentViewer/en/42-1/house/projected-business
It might take some sitting days before the HoC will put C-6 on the POB. Note: Only look at the Projection for the very next sitting. Ignore the part about "Projection For Subsequent Days". These subsequent days are missing most of the interesting stuff, namely government bill debates. Only look at the very next day of the Projection.
The good news is: Once the bill is on the POB it will actually be discussed that very day! No crazy limbo like in the Senate (will they discuss it?!)

Step 3: The bill is debated in the Chamber
Now they will debate the amendments. Please note though: At this point, the debate will not change much. It is basically 99.9% guaranteed that the Liberal Majority will vote for whatever the government suggested anyways.

Step 4: The debate on the bill will end soon, guaranteed (you better believe it!)
This is the best news of all: The whole crazy delay tactics in the Senate can NOT happen in the House of Commons. Usually, the second day they debate the amendments, the House majority passes a motion like this (and for anyone who went through the Senate hell will us, this will sound like unicorns with sugar on top):
Pursuant to Standing Order 78(2), Mr./Ms. [...], moved, — That, in relation to Bill […], not more than one further sitting day shall be allotted to the stage of consideration of Senate amendments to the Bill; and that, 15 minutes before the expiry of the time provided for Government Orders on the day allotted to the consideration of the said stage of the said Bill, any proceedings before the House shall be interrupted, if required for the purpose of this Order, and in turn every question necessary for the disposal of the said stage of the Bill shall be put forthwith and successively without further debate or amendment.
This means, the clock ticks and then the House is forced to drop all business and they MUST vote on all motions, amendments etc. without any further debate or even new amendments allowed.
Well doesn't that sound just great?

Step 5: The bill goes back to the Senate
By now, I think it is almost certain that the HoC will not just blindly accept all amendments by the Senate but reject or modify some of them. So the bill will go back to the Senate. I want to keep it to facts and therefore not make any prediction as of how long the Senate will need for this.

What should you take from this?
The big question is: When will the Government position be published in the notice paper. But once it's there, things will move rather quick. Also, based on the quote from the Senate above, we can be cautiously optimistic that we won't have to wait too long.

In my opinion, we should check "Motions Respecting Senate Amendments to Bills" in the latest order paper because, based on what happens to other three bills, the motions regarding the bill will be posted before it's scheduled for debate.
http://www.ourcommons.ca/DocumentViewer/en/42-1/house/sitting-178/order-notice/page-13

 

[spyfy]

In my opinion, we should check "Motions Respecting Senate Amendments to Bills" in the latest order paper because, based on what happens to other three bills, the motions regarding the bill will be posted before it's scheduled for debate.
http://www.ourcommons.ca/DocumentViewer/en/42-1/house/sitting-178/order-notice/page-13

That is exactly the link I shared in my post

 

[rdbr]

Thanks for the updates spyfy, appreciate your effort. Amazing to see that there is a systematic/structured approach provided to simply the whole chaos.

 

[oomuchi]

another way to see it
Parliamentary Business calendar/Agenda
http://www.ourcommons.ca/en/parliamentary-business/2017-05-16

 

[amir36]

Just a quick question. Sorry if it was answered before. If bill c-6 does not become law by 1st July 2017. Will it have to wait till next July 2018 or it can become effective on immigration website in any other month also? Like August 2017 or December 2017?

 

[spyfy]

Just a quick question. Sorry if it was answered before. If bill c-6 does not become law by 1st July 2017. Will it have to wait till next July 2018 or it can become effective on immigration website in any other month also? Like August 2017 or December 2017?

Bills can become law at any given point in time, there is no need to wait for a full year. However, the House does not sit in the months of July, August and the first half of September. Same for the Senate. So if the bill doesn't become law by the end of June, the earliest it will be dealt with again is late September, simply because there are no sessions until then.

 

[naturalca]

Bills can become law at any given point in time, there is no need to wait for a full year. However, the House does not sit in the months of July, August and the first half of September. Same for the Senate. So if the bill doesn't become law by the end of June, the earliest it will be dealt with again is late September, simply because there are no sessions until then.

Good news! From yesterday's debate:

Hon. Bardish Chagger (Leader of the Government in the House of Commons and Minister of Small Business and Tourism, Lib.):
Mr. Speaker, this afternoon, we will continue the debate we began this morning on the Conservative opposition day motion. Tomorrow, we will begin debate on Bill C-46 on impaired driving. Next week, members will work in their ridings.

When we come back, we will proceed with Bill C-6 on citizenship.

 

[Anvatrix]

When we come back, we will proceed with Bill C-6 on citizenship.

So when exactly will they come back? Which day?

 

[spyfy]

Good news! From yesterday's debate:

Hon. Bardish Chagger (Leader of the Government in the House of Commons and Minister of Small Business and Tourism, Lib.):
Mr. Speaker, this afternoon, we will continue the debate we began this morning on the Conservative opposition day motion. Tomorrow, we will begin debate on Bill C-46 on impaired driving. Next week, members will work in their ridings.

When we come back, we will proceed with Bill C-6 on citizenship.

Good news indeed!

So when exactly will they come back? Which day?

Monday, May 29