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Bill C-24 Second Reading on February 27th:

taleodor

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Sharif11 said:
Just to clarify: There are thousands and thousands of Internationale students who are fully sponsored by their governments (don't have to work) come to Canada every year. Yes, they receive good education but, they also contribute to Canada. They pay 2x tuition fees, buy cars pay for auto-insurance, they rent or buy houses, buy food and the list goes on.

Same goes for foreign workers.
Absolutely, plus they pay fees for visas, permits and other Government services, not required for Canadians. Free money for Canadian budget.

+ They also raise Canada's prestige as a country. Suppose you don't have International Students / Foreign Workers, that means you are not so good as a country.

BTW, I'm not sure about people leaving Canada after the new law, but I'm absolutely sure, there will be less interest in Canada from the side of high-skilled and reasonably thinking immigrants. On the other side, there will be more abusers than ever. And more abusers raise questions about courruption, and maybe that's what Conservatives are aiming for, I don't know..
 

Sharif11

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alwayspositive said:
I have been following posts here for a while and I'm particularly surprised by the assertion that foreign students do not contribute anything to the Canadian society. I'm surprised by this because every year Canadian universities come to my country to recruit students using enticing packages, trying to convince students with reasons why they should study in Canada. Is it purely an act of kindness on the part of these universities and the Canadian government? As a PhD student, my husband did groundbreaking research which resulted in several publications with his supervisors while still a student. He presented papers at conferences and was made to present at workshops to share with scientists groundbreaking research which by the way earned him job offers even before his graduation. Surely, this should count as contribution to society. Pls correct me if I'm wrong. If I'm wrong, then I need to be educated on what contribution to society means.
Wish everyone the best.
Cheers.
+1
 

shaazdeh

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I just checked the Parliament Website, it does not show anything about third reading stage in HoC... and I did n't see any meeting for tomorrow at least up to now. I appreciate the clarification.
 

chakrab

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taleodor said:
+ They also raise Canada's prestige as a country. Suppose you don't have International Students / Foreign Workers, that means you are not so good as a country.
i don't know if i would agree to that statement. many good schools in canada weren't recruiting international students to their premier programs till the last 10 years. most schools have opened up to international students in recent years, specially in graduate studies. the schools dont get funding for international students from the province in graduate programs. the funding is based on resident students. same with foreign workers, the laws were pretty tough to hire a foreign worker before 2006/2007. there were no PGWP for international students as well.

also the influx of immigrants to canada has increased due to stricter immigration laws in UK, europe and US.
 

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alwayspositive said:
I have been following posts here for a while and I'm particularly surprised by the assertion that foreign students do not contribute anything to the Canadian society. I'm surprised by this because every year Canadian universities come to my country to recruit students using enticing packages, trying to convince students with reasons why they should study in Canada. Is it purely an act of kindness on the part of these universities and the Canadian government? As a PhD student, my husband did groundbreaking research which resulted in several publications with his supervisors while still a student. He presented papers at conferences and was made to present at workshops to share with scientists groundbreaking research which by the way earned him job offers even before his graduation. Surely, this should count as contribution to society. Pls correct me if I'm wrong. If I'm wrong, then I need to be educated on what contribution to society means.
Wish everyone the best.
Cheers.
True, if Students (Especially people at PhD level) do not contribute to Canadian Society ... why CIC has implemented the PhD Stream for Immigration? Huge number of successful Professional workers and professors in Canada came as International Students and established their residency this way and became Canadian Citizens eventually!
 

Tolerance

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alwayspositive said:
I have been following posts here for a while and I'm particularly surprised by the assertion that foreign students do not contribute anything to the Canadian society. I'm surprised by this because every year Canadian universities come to my country to recruit students using enticing packages, trying to convince students with reasons why they should study in Canada. Is it purely an act of kindness on the part of these universities and the Canadian government? As a PhD student, my husband did groundbreaking research which resulted in several publications with his supervisors while still a student. He presented papers at conferences and was made to present at workshops to share with scientists groundbreaking research which by the way earned him job offers even before his graduation. Surely, this should count as contribution to society. Pls correct me if I'm wrong. If I'm wrong, then I need to be educated on what contribution to society means.
Wish everyone the best.
Cheers.
You are absolutely right. Canada bases its economic growth partly on attracting international students. We are talking billions annually. Thousands of people would loose their jobs in the education industry if only canadian- born folks went to school. And it is not only education. In Toronto, all kinds of slimeballs have become rental property barrons, renting out crappy accomodation to immigrants and students, they are having a ball! Such people will support immigration and foreign students, because they do not even have to advertise :).

I worked in the education industry. It is not only the foreign students; they regularly tell PRs who just came here "You dont have any Canadian experience, eh?" You should go to school.

Contribution to society came out of the same dictionary as citizenship of convenience and other con inventions.

Don' t pay attention to Marcus, he sold his soul to the devil :). Just ignore him, like torontosm.
 

alwayspositive

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We estimate that in 2010, international students in Canada spent in excess of $7.7 billion on tuition, accommodation and discretionary spending; created over 81,000 jobs; and generated more than $445 million in government revenue.
Altogether there were more than 218,200 long-term (staying for at least six months) international students in Canada in 2010, generating more than $6.9 billion to the Canadian economy. It is estimated that nearly 37 percent of that revenue came from two countries – China and South Korea. As of December 2010 there were 56,900 Chinese and 24,600 South Korean citizens in Canada undertaking a formal education program. Ontario and BC hosted nearly two thirds of the international students in Canada (85,300 and 60,500 respectively) while Quebec was a distant third.
Short term students who pursued language training also contributed an estimated $788 million to the Canadian economy.
Overall, the total amount that international students spend in Canada ($8.0 billion) is greater than our export of unwrought aluminium ($6 billion), and even greater than our export of helicopters, airplanes and spacecraft ($6.9 billion) to all other countries.
When the value of educational services provided in Canada to international students is compared to the value of the more traditional goods that Canada exports, the impact for some countries is even more striking. The Saudi Arabians, for example, spend the equivalent of 44% of the value of the goods they import from Canada on educational services. Similarly, we see that South Korea (19.1%), China (13.9%), India (27.9%), and France (14.2%) all spend significantly for educational services when compared to the trade in goods they import from Canada.
In total, the annual expenditure of $8.0 billion by international students translated to estimates of almost $4.9 billion worth of contribution to GDP, 86,570 jobs, and $455 million of government tax revenue.

The full report:
http://www.international.gc.ca/education/assets/pdfs/economic_impact_en.pdf
 

chakrab

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Tolerance said:
You are absolutely right. Canada bases its economic growth partly on attracting international students. We are talking billions annually. Thousands of people would loose their jobs in the education industry if only canadian- born folks went to school. And it is not only education. In Toronto, all kinds of slimeballs have become rental property barrons, renting out crappy accomodation to immigrants and students, they are having a ball! Such people will support immigration and foreign students, because they do not even have to advertise :).

I worked in the education industry. It is not only the foreign students; they regularly tell PRs who just came here "You dont have any Canadian experience, eh?" You should go to school.

Contribution to society came out of the same dictionary as citizenship of convenience and other con inventions.

Don' t pay attention to Marcus, he sold his soul to the devil :). Just ignore him, like torontosm.
that has more to do with provincial support to higher education. within a decade or so, you will see most universities/colleges establishing themselves as private institutions than public. universities are recruiting foreign students as cash cows and there are plenty of students all around the world who are willing to pay 10 times for that very purpose. it's a win-win for both parties.
 

taleodor

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chakrab said:
i don't know if i would agree to that statement. many good schools in canada weren't recruiting international students to their premier programs till the last 10 years. most schools have opened up to international students in recent years, specially in graduate studies. the schools dont get funding for international students from the province in graduate programs. the funding is based on resident students. same with foreign workers, the laws were pretty tough to hire a foreign worker before 2006/2007. there were no PGWP for international students as well.

also the influx of immigrants to canada has increased due to stricter immigration laws in UK, europe and US.
Presence of International Students is one of the important points that is considered by any serious University rating.

Similar with Foreign Workers, if higher skilled expatriates are willing to come to your country, it raises its prestige.

On the other hand, I agree, that since 2006 Conservatives have completely screwed the whole Immigration system. Right now it's such a mess to the point that it's hard to say, from which end it should be fixed.

Problem is, they are continuing to make it worse.
 

Tolerance

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alwayspositive said:
We estimate that in 2010, international students in Canada spent in excess of $7.7 billion on tuition, accommodation and discretionary spending; created over 81,000 jobs; and generated more than $445 million in government revenue.
Altogether there were more than 218,200 long-term (staying for at least six months) international students in Canada in 2010, generating more than $6.9 billion to the Canadian economy. It is estimated that nearly 37 percent of that revenue came from two countries – China and South Korea. As of December 2010 there were 56,900 Chinese and 24,600 South Korean citizens in Canada undertaking a formal education program. Ontario and BC hosted nearly two thirds of the international students in Canada (85,300 and 60,500 respectively) while Quebec was a distant third.
Short term students who pursued language training also contributed an estimated $788 million to the Canadian economy.
Overall, the total amount that international students spend in Canada ($8.0 billion) is greater than our export of unwrought aluminium ($6 billion), and even greater than our export of helicopters, airplanes and spacecraft ($6.9 billion) to all other countries.
When the value of educational services provided in Canada to international students is compared to the value of the more traditional goods that Canada exports, the impact for some countries is even more striking. The Saudi Arabians, for example, spend the equivalent of 44% of the value of the goods they import from Canada on educational services. Similarly, we see that South Korea (19.1%), China (13.9%), India (27.9%), and France (14.2%) all spend significantly for educational services when compared to the trade in goods they import from Canada.
In total, the annual expenditure of $8.0 billion by international students translated to estimates of almost $4.9 billion worth of contribution to GDP, 86,570 jobs, and $455 million of government tax revenue.

The full report:
http://www.international.gc.ca/education/assets/pdfs/economic_impact_en.pdf
Good job, thanks.

So enough of the 'they do not contribute' crap.
 

chakrab

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taleodor said:
Presence of International Students is one of the important points that is considered by any serious University rating.

Similar with Foreign Workers, if higher skilled expatriates are willing to come to your country, it raises its prestige.

On the other hand, I completely agree, that since 2006 Conservatives have completely screwed the whole Immigration system. Right now it's such a mess to the point that it's hard to say, from which end it should be fixed.

Problem is, they are continuing to make it worse.
influx of international students may look like a good thing right now, because we originated from the same category. but it is setting a very bad precedence. the economic system is much different in canada than let's say china or south korea. if local students are now made to compete with fees paid by the international students, that will have a huge negative impact. there should definitely be a limit to international student percentage like it used to be.
 

taleodor

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chakrab said:
influx of international students may look like a good thing right now, because we originated from the same category. but it is setting a very bad precedence. the economic system is much different in canada than let's say china or south korea. if local students are now made to compete with fees paid by the international students, that will have a huge negative impact. there should definitely be a limit to international student percentage like it used to be.
These all are just small parts in a total Immigration failure led by Conservatives. I think, the following is really the quote of the day:
"....barbers trying to perform brain surgery......"
 

chakrab

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taleodor said:
These all are just small parts in a total Immigration failure led by Conservatives. I think, the following is really the quote of the day:
"....barbers trying to perform brain surgery......"
lol. look i understand you guys and your worries. but in 10 to 20 years when we are planning to send the kids to college, i don't any of us will be thinking how much international students are helping with generating revenue for the govt when we are paying similar rates.
 

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What is the news regarding the third reading? Any Idea? Any Idea when is the first reading at the Senate?
 

jrjayl

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shaazdeh said:
I just checked the Parliament Website, it does not show anything about third reading stage in HoC... and I did n't see any meeting for tomorrow at least up to now. I appreciate the clarification.
might have not finished yet. Just need to check it tomorrow morning. If HoC 3rd reading passes, guess tomorrow will be senate 1st reading.