Australia Immigration

[jairichi]

I've been reading this thread over the last day or so. Our case is the opposite of yours. We applied for Oz 189 visa as backup and it came through very efficiently in Dec 2015, just 6 months after start of skills assessment process in June and only 3 months after application date. We did a validation trip right away in Jan 2016 so as to not lose the PR because our entry deadline was short (June 2016).

Right now we're waiting endlessly for this Canada PR and it is excruciating. But we're waiting because Canada is our preferred option. We have weighed pros and cons of both countries and feel we'll be happier in Canada as it ticks more of our boxes when it comes to what we want. But knowing that Oz is also a splendid place and we are technically already permanent residents of that place and waiting for Canada is... very irritating.

I have to say that I was quite impressed with the efficiency and speed of Australian govt processing. We got the PR in almost exactly 3 months after lodging the appln. And I love how everything is online. You don't have to send your passport for unnecessary stamping. Plus, the agents were a lot friendlier and more helpful over the phone when I called Adelaide, my processing office.

Australia is definitely a splendid option for permanent residency but our main worrisome points personally are (a.) It is isolated from the rest of the world. Flights to anywhere take forever! and (b.) Internet commerce is still not as well established in Oz like it is in Canada/US. .... Plus we very much prefer colder climate and snow to hot hotter & hottest! But that's a more minor point I guess.

Well, it is nice to see someone with a different look at the country to settle down. It makes sense that a lot of things in Canada looked favorable for you while a lot looked favorable for us in Australia which made both of us to choose one country as top priority and another as a backup. I appreciate the fact that you put forth your reasoning in a better way rather than in some posts where they vehemently attack the decision taken without taking into consideration the reason behind choosing one country.

Yes, Australia is kind of far away from most of the countries and no wonder they call it down under Since we are from India, Australia is kind of near to our home country where our parents still reside. Now ticket prices have become very cheap to fly from India to Australia. But a flight from India to Canada is pretty long and expensive. In case if our parents prefer to visit us any trip to Australia is short and they will be able to withstand a bit hot climate compared to long trip to Canada and cold Canadian winter. We have no issues with cold as we have stayed in Minnesota for 4.5 years and we have seen -25 degrees easily. One critical issue for us is not able to take our daughter outside for a walk or play area during winter season. Basically kids are stuck indoors for reasonable time during winter. Personally I do not prefer that. Career wise we find better opportunities for our occupations in Australia compared to Canada. The pay is also good. If I land the same job I am currently doing in UK I would get 1.5 times of what I make here and my spouse will get twice of what she makes here.

I have not investigated much about their healthcare system and other benefits for PRs and citizens. When the pay is more I do not mind spending a bit extra from my pocket to get good healthcare.

Like we discussed anyone who looks at Australia & Canada has to do their homework to find which will suit them and their family in the long run and make an informed choice. Herd mentality (I am doing this because others are doing the same) will not always work out.

Being far away has an advantage. We will be far away from conflicts . Another advantage with an Aus PR is one can enter NZ and work there without the need for a work permit. I have heard (not confirmed) from few friends that IT market is good there. Also, in later days if one likes to settle down in a quiet country it is easy to retire in NZ.

 

[jairichi]

Jairichi, did you read my post? Thought maybe you missed it.

I did not miss it. Wanted to reply you immediately but got jobs to apply for. Have responded to it now.

 

[Musikwala]

Actually we totally fell in love with Sydney and Melbourne when we visited there in Jan for our validation trip. I kind of almost forgot about our Canadian application in process when I was there. After endless discussions about Canada vs Australia with my wife, we decided to do an in-depth comparison Excel sheet on every damn thing in each of these countries, from job scope to salaries, cost of living to travel time, climate, taxation rates, healthcare, education etc etc.

Incidentally, travel time to India is not that significantly shorter from Sydney, by the way. Sydney to Delhi takes 14 to 16 hrs by flight whereas Toronto to Delhi takes 17 to 19 hours. Shorter, yes but not significant. Time zone difference is significant though. 4.5 hrs vs 9 or 10 hrs.

 

[anandg12]

Just to play devil's advocate, cost of living in Toronto is cheaper than Sydney (significantly) and Melbourne (not by much).

http://www.numbeo.com/cost-of-living/compare_cities.jsp?country1=Australia&city1=Sydney&country2=Canada&city2=Toronto
http://www.numbeo.com/cost-of-living/compare_cities.jsp?country1=Canada&city1=Toronto&country2=Australia&city2=Melbourne

Also Toronto is 1 hour from NYC and 7 hours from London while Australia is relatively isolated. Wages do tend to be higher there but cost of living will eat into some of it. If you are in IT or software, pay scales are similar and there are more companies and startups hiring for those roles in Canada. Lastly, if one gets Canadian citizenship, they are eligible to work (in certain occupations) in world's biggest economy - USA

 

[JZPASSI]

Hi musik,
you have almost same case as of mine. I have Australian assignment from my current employer for at least two years. I have already worked there for a year. Currently I am waiting for my wife 457 visa. We both will have job there after landing plus PR will be sure shot . But I am preferring Canada because of my family ( brother , parents) are already there plus cold whether.

But definitely Australia has huge edge when it comes to job hunt especially in IT and banking.

 

[poper]

Employer Nomination Scheme (186)

The Employer Nomination Scheme (186) gives you (and any family members) permanent residency.

There are two Employer Nomination Scheme (186) streams.

As the most commonly applied for and granted visa program for skilled workers to obtain sponsorship and employment in Australia, the 457 visa program allows people to work temporarily in Australia for up to four years, but it does not guarantee residence.


How does the 457 visa work?

With a 457 visa you can work in Australia for up to four years. You can bring your family with you (they can work and study) and you can travel in and out of Australia as often as you like.
The employer/sponsor must
apply to be a sponsor to recruit overseas workers; nominate the positions they want to fill; recruit the overseas workers to fill the nominated positions; and act as a sponsor for employees applying for a visa.
You as the employee accept the offer of employment from the employer; apply for the visa; and meet all the conditions of your visa.

Am I eligible for the 457 visa?

To apply for a 457 visa as an employee, your application must follow that of your sponsoring employer. To be considered for a 457 visa, you must meet the following criteria:
•You must be sponsored by an employer to fill a nominated position.
•You must work in a skilled occupation that's been approved by the Australian Government on the Consolidated sponsored occupations list.
•You must have skills, qualifications, experience and an employment background which match those required for the position.
•You must have English language skills equivalent to a test score of at least 5 across the four test components in an International English Language Testing System (IELTS) test, or higher. You may also be required to demonstrate these skills through a formal test.
•You must be eligible for any relevant licences or registration required for the nominated position.
•You must demonstrate that you are to be paid at least the minimum salary level that applies at the time a decision is made on your visa.
•You must meet all health requirement as set out by Information Form 1163i.
•You must meet all character requirements.
•If you are in Australia at the time of application, you must not have prohibitive restrictions or limitations placed on your current visa.
•You must, if over the age of 18, be willing to declare your respect of Australian values and adhere to Australian law.
•You must have health insurance.
•You must pay all relevant non-refundable application fees.



1. TEMPORARY RESIDENT TRANSITION
If you currently hold a 457 visa, and have done so for at least two years (with the same 457 sponsor), you are eligible for the Temporary Resident Transition stream on the Employer Nomination Scheme (186).

2. DIRECT ENTRY
If you have not been working on a 457 visa for two years (with the same employer), but you can pass the skill assessment and have three years post-qualification work experience in your nominated occupation, you are eligible for the Direct Entry stream on the Employer Nomination Scheme (186).

SKILL ASSESSMENT
If you require a skill assessment we will manage this with you. We provide checklists of documents needed, we review and advise on your paperwork and we lodge and following up with the assessment body.

APPROVAL TO SPONSOR
You must be sponsored by an eligible employer. The employer will need to meet the training benchmark. We help your employer with this and all other steps of their sponsorship of you on the Employer Nomination Scheme (186). Your employer can be located anywhere in Australia to sponsor you on this visa.

ELIGIBILITY FOR THE EMPLOYER NOMINATION SCHEME (186)
You must meet the requirements around age, English skills and skill (work experience and/or qualifications) in an occupation on the Consolidated Skilled Occupation List (CSOL). The job must be at the correct salary level, full time and be offered for at least two years.

FREE VISA ASSESSMENT
We can determine your eligibility for the Employer Nomination Scheme (186). Please complete our online assessment form and we will provide information on the steps, fees and process.

 

[poper]

For now Canada's immigration is stricter than Australia. Why we waste our time here. Think About this.

 

[sushsub]

After going through this thread, i did some ground work on Australian PR. For Developer Programmer like me atleast you need 65 points for invitation and 70 is sure shot. And also the year cap is almost full and another 300 is left now. I think there as well, need to wait till January to get an invite if i have 65 points. So i dont think process will be fast there. But to be in queue with 65 points, i have to spend around 1000$ for ACS for me and husband. Instead i can wait for canada with which atleast i will get my oinp nomination before EOY. So before jumping in, research well and take a decision.

Seniors please give your thoughts if my understanding is correct.

 

[FORESIGHT]

@ Sushsub, You have spoken well. I am only bothered about the idea of having to wait only on the Canada option when you have the opportunity of pursuing a back-up plan.
Canada is becoming stricter with too many persons on the queue. The result of the last draw was a big blow to many. I will advise we share our eggs into the Australia plan too. Except you don't really like Australia at all.
This is just my personal opinion. I thank you.

After going through this thread, i did some ground work on Australian PR. For Developer Programmer like me atleast you need 65 points for invitation and 70 is sure shot. And also the year cap is almost full and another 300 is left now. I think there as well, need to wait till January to get an invite if i have 65 points. So i dont think process will be fast there. But to be in queue with 65 points, i have to spend around 1000$ for ACS for me and husband. Instead i can wait for canada with which atleast i will get my oinp nomination before EOY. So before jumping in, research well and take a decision.

Seniors please give your thoughts if my understanding is correct.

 

[jairichi]

I think there as well, need to wait till January to get an invite if i have 65 points. So i dont think process will be fast there.

Incorrect statement. The quota for occupation for Australia runs from July to June and not from January to December like Canada. So, coming July new cap opens up. The best part is for majority of the applicants after getting an invitation you apply for PR visa and upload all documents upfront you will get your visa within a month or two.

 

[jairichi]

@ Sushsub, You have spoken well. I am only bothered about the idea of having to wait only on the Canada option when you have the opportunity of pursuing a back-up plan.
Canada is becoming stricter with too many persons on the queue. The result of the last draw was a big blow to many. I will advise we share our eggs into the Australia plan too. Except you don't really like Australia at all.
This is just my personal opinion. I thank you.

If you already have an ITA from Canada or with scores around 460 plus or willing to wait then yes what you say makes sense . Anyone below score of 450 or 440 and looks for an opportunity to move abroad quickly Australia will be a good bet. Having said that there are many other things one need to consider before planning to apply for Aus PR.

 

[jairichi]

Employer Nomination Scheme (186)

The Employer Nomination Scheme (186) gives you (and any family members) permanent residency.

There are two Employer Nomination Scheme (186) streams.

As the most commonly applied for and granted visa program for skilled workers to obtain sponsorship and employment in Australia, the 457 visa program allows people to work temporarily in Australia for up to four years, but it does not guarantee residence.


How does the 457 visa work?

With a 457 visa you can work in Australia for up to four years. You can bring your family with you (they can work and study) and you can travel in and out of Australia as often as you like.
The employer/sponsor must
apply to be a sponsor to recruit overseas workers; nominate the positions they want to fill; recruit the overseas workers to fill the nominated positions; and act as a sponsor for employees applying for a visa.
You as the employee accept the offer of employment from the employer; apply for the visa; and meet all the conditions of your visa.

Am I eligible for the 457 visa?

To apply for a 457 visa as an employee, your application must follow that of your sponsoring employer. To be considered for a 457 visa, you must meet the following criteria:
•You must be sponsored by an employer to fill a nominated position.
•You must work in a skilled occupation that's been approved by the Australian Government on the Consolidated sponsored occupations list.
•You must have skills, qualifications, experience and an employment background which match those required for the position.
•You must have English language skills equivalent to a test score of at least 5 across the four test components in an International English Language Testing System (IELTS) test, or higher. You may also be required to demonstrate these skills through a formal test.
•You must be eligible for any relevant licences or registration required for the nominated position.
•You must demonstrate that you are to be paid at least the minimum salary level that applies at the time a decision is made on your visa.
•You must meet all health requirement as set out by Information Form 1163i.
•You must meet all character requirements.
•If you are in Australia at the time of application, you must not have prohibitive restrictions or limitations placed on your current visa.
•You must, if over the age of 18, be willing to declare your respect of Australian values and adhere to Australian law.
•You must have health insurance.
•You must pay all relevant non-refundable application fees.



1. TEMPORARY RESIDENT TRANSITION
If you currently hold a 457 visa, and have done so for at least two years (with the same 457 sponsor), you are eligible for the Temporary Resident Transition stream on the Employer Nomination Scheme (186).

2. DIRECT ENTRY
If you have not been working on a 457 visa for two years (with the same employer), but you can pass the skill assessment and have three years post-qualification work experience in your nominated occupation, you are eligible for the Direct Entry stream on the Employer Nomination Scheme (186).

SKILL ASSESSMENT
If you require a skill assessment we will manage this with you. We provide checklists of documents needed, we review and advise on your paperwork and we lodge and following up with the assessment body.

APPROVAL TO SPONSOR
You must be sponsored by an eligible employer. The employer will need to meet the training benchmark. We help your employer with this and all other steps of their sponsorship of you on the Employer Nomination Scheme (186). Your employer can be located anywhere in Australia to sponsor you on this visa.

ELIGIBILITY FOR THE EMPLOYER NOMINATION SCHEME (186)
You must meet the requirements around age, English skills and skill (work experience and/or qualifications) in an occupation on the Consolidated Skilled Occupation List (CSOL). The job must be at the correct salary level, full time and be offered for at least two years.

FREE VISA ASSESSMENT
We can determine your eligibility for the Employer Nomination Scheme (186). Please complete our online assessment form and we will provide information on the steps, fees and process.

Good that you shared this other path of getting a PR through 457 followed by 186. Getting an employer sponsor a 457 is tough and equally tough is employer sponsoring a PR later. I am not saying it is impossible it is just that chances are less.

 

[jairichi]

Actually we totally fell in love with Sydney and Melbourne when we visited there in Jan for our validation trip. I kind of almost forgot about our Canadian application in process when I was there. After endless discussions about Canada vs Australia with my wife, we decided to do an in-depth comparison Excel sheet on every damn thing in each of these countries, from job scope to salaries, cost of living to travel time, climate, taxation rates, healthcare, education etc etc.

Incidentally, travel time to India is not that significantly shorter from Sydney, by the way. Sydney to Delhi takes 14 to 16 hrs by flight whereas Toronto to Delhi takes 17 to 19 hours. Shorter, yes but not significant. Time zone difference is significant though. 4.5 hrs vs 9 or 10 hrs.

Oh wow such detailed analysis like using an excel spreadsheet. Great.
I am from south India. The flight time from my city to Delhi is 2.5 hours. So you can reduce those 2.5 hours to Sydney and increase 2.5 hours to Toronto .

 

[jairichi]

Just to play devil's advocate, cost of living in Toronto is cheaper than Sydney (significantly) and Melbourne (not by much).

http://www.numbeo.com/cost-of-living/compare_cities.jsp?country1=Australia&city1=Sydney&country2=Canada&city2=Toronto
http://www.numbeo.com/cost-of-living/compare_cities.jsp?country1=Canada&city1=Toronto&country2=Australia&city2=Melbourne

Also Toronto is 1 hour from NYC and 7 hours from London while Australia is relatively isolated. Wages do tend to be higher there but cost of living will eat into some of it. If you are in IT or software, pay scales are similar and there are more companies and startups hiring for those roles in Canada. Lastly, if one gets Canadian citizenship, they are eligible to work (in certain occupations) in world's biggest economy - USA

You might be correct but I had mentioned before we found salary better based on our professions. I am a biomolecular researcher and the average salary in academia is around CAD 40 to 50K. But, CAD 70 to 80K (without superannuation) in Australia. I would not mind parting an extra amount for living expenses.

I am a temporary resident of UK. Originally from India. With a Canadian citizenship a TN visa is required to work in US and obtaining that is not tough. And, you need to look at US fiscal deficit. It is running in trillions of dollars for some years now. Long run I am not confident of US economy. I am not a economist but this is my assumption with little knowledge I have. Do not want to put my child there even though she holds an US passport by being born there.

 

[sushsub]

Incorrect statement. The quota for occupation for Australia runs from July to June and not from January to December like Canada. So, coming July new cap opens up. The best part is for majority of the applicants after getting an invitation you apply for PR visa and upload all documents upfront you will get your visa within a month or two.

Oh that is great to now. I think you are making absolute sense. The below is the lines from the australian website which is supporting your statement.

"Due to the continuing high numbers of EOIs received for the below occupations, invitations for these occupations will be issu
ed on a pro rata basis in each
monthly invitation round over the 2015-16 programme year. These arrangements are subject to change throughout the programme year."

So month of july may give us better opportunity for people in 65. +1 for you. I was about to stop the direction of pursuing this. You gave me a different perception.