why are people from outside canada favored by CIC than PGWP holders?

[mead]

i want to give an exaggerated example suppose ur toilet is clogged so u r looking for a plumber. u get two resumes one from an open work permit holder with just 1 year experience in canada and second from a plumber in india (i say india as I am indian) with 10 years experience, u dont get any resume from a canadian. U interview the plumber from india he is nice to talk to and u decide to hire him , u process his LMIA as u dont get any canadians to fill that position. once PR application is processed the plumber shows at ur door steps and u find out he cannot perform the work u r looking for . Now what the guy has already got PR he is happy but ur left with broken toilet. Ur only other choice will be to live in a hotel till the issue is fixed. So u see the problem. What I am trying to point out is if employers cant hire right and reliable talent they will either go under or leave canada . If they leave canada , canadians will also lose jobs example is target.

 

[GARJ]

I know. Was just being sarcastic given how being eligible for CEC as a PGWP holder means absolutely nothing when compared to a LMIA/PNP holder.

Well, I don't think you can compare CEC eligibility with holding LMIA or PNP. I am 100% convinced that the CRS score requirements for the CEC stream are gonna be lower the FSW stream. There has already been a CEC exclusive drawing late February. I am pretty sure that the only skilled worker program that will have exclusive EE draws will be CEC. Don't be surprised when the next CEC exclusive drawing picks people with scores as low as 350 under that stream, and then a subsequent general drawing brings the cutoff mark higher higher again. Being under CEC will prove as advantageous in the end, mark my words...

 

[mf4361]

@mead While I don't see Target's failure is due to foreign workers (They are disappointing, no doubt), I see your point. In the eyes of many employers, one has Canadian experiences are much more preferred to another with more experiences, but not Canadian. Especially in more skilled jobs (Engineers, accountants, medical staff, many trades etc) it requires knowledge in standards and codes that only applicable to Canada and nowhere else. Not to mention the Canadian way of doing things may be very different from rest of the world. Those fresh from overseas will need to relearn their profession/skills to fit Canadian companies. Businesses don't like retraining (Turnover cost).

In the past, CIC have been focused in retaining people who lived in Canada on WP/SP and relaxed the PR process (Thus the start of CEC) for the reason above. It's been proven beneficial to Canadian economy. Now with EE/CRS system, CIC is shifting back to people from outside of Canada, in the name of protecting Canadians.

 

[BankingExpressE]

Well, I don't think you can compare CEC eligibility with holding LMIA or PNP. I am 100% convinced that the CRS score requirements for the CEC stream are gonna be lower the FSW stream. There has already been a CEC exclusive drawing late February. I am pretty sure that the only skilled worker program that will have exclusive EE draws will be CEC. Don't be surprised when the next CEC exclusive drawing picks people with scores as low as 350 under that stream, and then a subsequent general drawing brings the cutoff mark higher higher again. Being under CEC will prove as advantageous in the end, mark my words...

You were the one who compared CEC eligibility and LMIA/PNP; stating that being CEC eligible is worth more than having LMIA/PNP. Anyways, I sure hope you are right in your prediction regarding future CEC specific draws.

 

[mf4361]

While I think EE-CRS and LMIA is unfair to PGWP/ICT/PostDoc/Other OWP, I don't think having paid 40k+ in tuition and 15k+ in taxes are a valid point of argument about PGWP in EE.

Tuition paid to schools are being used on the student himself (Whether tuition are expensive or not is another question). Taxes are paid because you have worked and lived in Canada during the year and used government services like the road, garbage collection, transit, health, many more. It's all fair game and has nothing to do with gaining priority in PR process.

 

[GARJ]

In the past, CIC have been focused in retaining people who lived in Canada on WP/SP and relaxed the PR process (Thus the start of CEC) for the reason above. It's been proven beneficial to Canadian economy. Now with EE/CRS system, CIC is shifting back to people from outside of Canada, in the name of protecting Canadians.

I don't think CIC is shifting towards protecting or promoting anyone. The reason CRS and EE were created was to eliminate the "First come/ first serve" model that was prevalent in the old system. If you have LMIA or PN that means that Canada has deemed you as a requirement to fill an economic gap or need in the country or province, so why would you have to wait 13+ months processing time when you are needed in Canada now? Enter EE: a new method that selects the most skilled applicants first. CEC applicants have essentially been told: "You will get picked, but you gotta go to the back of the line unless you get a LMIA or PN"

 

[mf4361]

CEC applicants have essentially been told: "You will get picked, but you gotta go to the back of the line unless you get a LMIA or PN"

You can't make claims like that. How do you know? (CEC in the past is pass/fail. Meaning, given all documents are clean and complete, PR is almost certainly granted)

 

[canadadreamming]

I honestly believe that anyone in Canada must be given the ABSOLUTE PRIORITY compared to people from offshore such as India, China, Phillipines and so on. Reason being, you cannot trust whatever from outside Canada, degrees can be faked, job experience can be bought and references can be purchased too

 

[mf4361]

I honestly believe that anyone in Canada must be given the ABSOLUTE PRIORITY compared to people from offshore such as India, China, Phillipines and so on. Reason being, you cannot trust whatever from outside Canada, degrees can be faked, job experience can be bought and references can be purchased too

There are ECA to make sure education credentials aren't fake (Though you can argue WES or whoever is not doing a good job in spotting fakes). IELTS scores (I believe) is linked to IELTS HQ server so it's not just the certificate. It depends on how good CIC picks out the fake documents.

But you are right, those already in Canada are definitely more suitable to be welcomed than those outside because their Canadian work earned them skills closer to what Canadian businesses wants. Thus this the whole CEC program was all about.

 

[AshesNdust]

I honestly believe that anyone in Canada must be given the ABSOLUTE PRIORITY compared to people from offshore such as India, China, Phillipines and so on. Reason being, you cannot trust whatever from outside Canada, degrees can be faked, job experience can be bought and references can be purchased too

I think it depends on the skill required and the job. For example, you can't fake 20 years of experience as a surgeon in NY City and I think most people would want a surgeon with 20 years experience from NY than a surgeon with 3 years experience from Toronto.
Just based on what I read on this board it seems that a lot of people already in Canada are trying to fake or manipulating things. There seems to be quite a few posts saying how they are being paid below the median wage for a job and some saying their employer outright says that they won't both getting them a LMIA because they don't view the employee as worth it or they are easily replacable. In both cases it seems that the EE systems is working as intended to keep those people from getting PR.
Although, I do think maybe more points for adaptability/integration for people living in Canada might be appropriate. It really depends on each person's case which is why the CIC has the whole application process.

 

[mf4361]

But you can fake 20 years of experiences from China, and a degree (maybe couple of them) and business records, and many others to CIC. Maybe you can't fake them before a real doctor, but you can fake them to CIC.

I don't see anyone in this board (apart from spams) trying to play tricks CIC on median wage or other requirement. Most of us (including myself) are not entirely clear of LMIA requirements and that's what we are asking. That's what internet forums are for. In fact, that's where most PGWP are struggling with (How can you expect a new engineer graduate, Canadian or otherwise, earns $38/hr? This should be more like wages of licensed engineers with >4 year of work)

If somebody were to ask for ways to fake CIC/ESDC/CRA..., they are not welcomed here.

 

[aaro27]

Well, I don't think you can compare CEC eligibility with holding LMIA or PNP. I am 100% convinced that the CRS score requirements for the CEC stream are gonna be lower the FSW stream. There has already been a CEC exclusive drawing late February. I am pretty sure that the only skilled worker program that will have exclusive EE draws will be CEC. Don't be surprised when the next CEC exclusive drawing picks people with scores as low as 350 under that stream, and then a subsequent general drawing brings the cutoff mark higher higher again. Being under CEC will prove as advantageous in the end, mark my words...

I hope CIC starts having draws exclusively for PGWP holders... and also hope it be soon...

one of my friend will have to leave the country since he's work permit is expiring and we could see no hope for lower cut off any sooner...

 

[aaro27]

I honestly believe that anyone in Canada must be given the ABSOLUTE PRIORITY compared to people from offshore such as India, China, Phillipines and so on. Reason being, you cannot trust whatever from outside Canada, degrees can be faked, job experience can be bought and references can be purchased too

+1

 

[doubleym]

I hope CIC starts having draws exclusively for PGWP holders... and also hope it be soon...

one of my friend will have to leave the country since he's work permit is expiring and we could see no hope for lower cut off any sooner...

Why would they need to do an exclusive draw for PGWP holders? There are other people on Open permits in the same boat.

If a PGWP holder can't get an LMIA then why should they receive special treatment? That would indicate that they weren't really needed in Canada.

 

[aaro27]

Why would they need to do an exclusive draw for PGWP holders? There are other people on Open permits in the same boat.

If a PGWP holder can't get an LMIA then why should they receive special treatment? That would indicate that they weren't really needed in Canada.

PGWP/ open work permit holders like me, are LMIA exempt...we have been working before this express entry came in... get ur facts straight