Parent Sponsorship - Pros and Cons

[screech339]

Everyone's situation is different. In my specific case :

1. My parents are old and they need support, love and care. Yes they have friends and relatives back home but what we (me and my brother) can do for them nobody can. It's our moral duty to take care of them in their old-age.

2. My parents would rather spend time with us and their grand kids as we are close knitted family.

3. We can and will support our parents financially with all their needs while they are here in Canada. They won't be leeching the system.

4. If they need they will use Canadian Health care but my family is already paying for it via taxes.

5. We are doing everything as per rules laid out by Canadian Government.

As for note #4, your family are not the only one paying for your parents medical care. Every taxpayer in Canada is paying to your parents Canadian Health Care. Your taxes goes towards a fund pool that gets sent to provincial government which pays for medical cost. You don't pay for your parents medical directly. If you want to claim that your parents won't be leeching the system, you can pay for their medical insurance through supervisa.

On another note: The baby boomers/elderly are paying towards their health care by taxes on their retirement pension so to claim that they are getting "free health care" too is false. They are still contributing to their health care through their retirement pension.

Screech339

 

[Rob_TO]

3. We can and will support our parents financially with all their needs while they are here in Canada. They won't be leeching the system.

4. If they need they will use Canadian Health care but my family is already paying for it via taxes.

Typically the only cost worth worrying about when it comes to parents, is the healthcare.

No matter which way you say it, having older people enter Canada without ever having paid into our tax system, is a drain. Taxes of the "typical" Canadian are set up so that you pay taxes over your entire working life, so by the time you end up using healthcare the most (in old age) you have already contributed your fair share. Having too many people entering Canada and start using healthcare, results in either higher taxes for everyone else, or in longer wait times and a lower quality of the system.

There is of course a place for parents here, and all other types of immigrants. The only question is what the ideal numbers are that give a fair balance to the humanitarian and family reunification aspects, and the real costs/taxes aspect. I like the way CIC is doing it now with introducing the caps and having a long wait time for parents sponsorship. Personally I would go even 1 step further and restrict parents sponsorship to citizens only, which PRs could achieve in around 5 years time after arriving in Canada.

I also like that during time waiting to qualify or while application is in process... the supervisa is offered in which other Canadian taxpayers are not responsible for healthcare burden costs.

 

[janpreet]

As for note #4, your family are not the only one paying for your parents medical care. Every taxpayer in Canada is paying to your parents Canadian Health Care. Your taxes goes towards a fund pool that gets sent to provincial government which pays for medical cost. You don't pay for your parents medical directly. If you want to claim that your parents won't be leeching the system, you can pay for their medical insurance through supervisa.

I understand I do not pay directly for my parents medical but fact is we are contributing enough to that pool on my parents behalf which makes them eligible to use that pool.

Are you directly paying for your medical?

Who is eligible for Ontario health insurance coverage?

You may be eligible for the Ontario Health Insurance Plan (OHIP) if you are included under one of the following categories:

you are a Canadian citizen, permanent resident or landed immigrant, or are registered as an Indian under the Indian Act;
you have submitted an application for permanent residence in Canada, and Citizenship and Immigration Canada has confirmed that you meet the eligibility requirements to apply for permanent residence in Canada ;
.....

Who are you to tell me my parents are leeching the system when our laws does not says that?
Please go and write to your local politician, get the laws changed and then come back here.

 

[janpreet]

Typically the only cost worth worrying about when it comes to parents, is the healthcare.

No matter which way you say it, having older people enter Canada without ever having paid into our tax system, is a drain. Taxes of the "typical" Canadian are set up so that you pay taxes over your entire working life, so by the time you end up using healthcare the most (in old age) you have already contributed your fair share. Having too many people entering Canada and start using healthcare, results in either higher taxes for everyone else, or in longer wait times and a lower quality of the system.

There is of course a place for parents here, and all other types of immigrants. The only question is what the ideal numbers are that give a fair balance to the humanitarian and family reunification aspects, and the real costs/taxes aspect. I like the way CIC is doing it now with introducing the caps and having a long wait time for parents sponsorship. Personally I would go even 1 step further and restrict parents sponsorship to citizens only, which PRs could achieve in around 5 years time after arriving in Canada.

I also like that during time waiting to qualify or while application is in process... the supervisa is offered in which other Canadian taxpayers are not responsible for healthcare burden costs.

The income tax we pay as a household is enough to cover for my parents medical.

That's why I meet LICO + 30% from last flipping so many years.

That's why Canadian government allows us to sponsor our parents.

 

[user828]

Janpreet, while many don't share or understand other cultural norms especially when it comes to Parents - considering this is forum of multiple personalities, just cool it. It won't matter what they think or say, it's not an govt official, its a phantom comment so take it easy.

Canadian govt knows that they cannot abolish parents sponsorship, only make it harder.

 

[janpreet]

Janpreet, while many don't share or understand other cultural norms especially when it comes to Parents - considering this is forum of multiple personalities, just cool it. It won't matter what they think or say, it's not an govt official, its a phantom comment so take it easy.

Canadian govt knows that they cannot abolish parents sponsorship, only make it harder.

I apologize if my comments came out 'angry'. But I do not appreciate an indirect personal attack.
Would you also say, non earning dependent kids are leeching the system too?

[quote author= screech339] If you want to claim that your parents won't be leeching the system, you can pay for their medical insurance through supervisa. [\quote]

 

[screech339]

The income tax we pay as a household is enough to cover for my parents medical.

That's why I meet LICO + 30% from last flipping so many years.

That's why Canadian government allows us to sponsor our parents.

Are you saying that your 30% extra over 3 years will cover the actual medical cost of your parents for the rest of their lives when they have not contributed a single dime their whole lives supporting everyone else's medical needs after they gotten their PR? Nice try in justifying it. No matter how you slice it, they do add medical cost to everyone else in Canada.

Like Janpreet said, you need to cool your head and accept that they in fact add medical stress / taxes to everyone in Canada.

 

[screech339]

I apologize if my comments came out 'angry'. But I do not appreciate an indirect personal attack.
Would you also say, non earning dependent kids are leeching the system too?

If you want to claim that your parents won't be leeching the system, you can pay for their medical insurance through supervisa.

The different in the non-earning dependent kids is that they will be contributing to the workforce once they finish their education and begin working and earning an income, thus contributing taxes. Kids are also less likely to be a drain as they are already healthy for the most part. Parents/grandparents are never likely to find work thus will not contribute to health care all along.

Honestly, I rather have more sponsored kids, siblings over parents/grandparents as they can find work and contribute to economy and health care.

 

[janpreet]

Are you saying that your 30% extra over 3 years will cover the actual medical cost of your parents for the rest of their lives when they have not contributed a single dime their whole lives supporting everyone else's medical needs after they gotten their PR? Nice try in justifying it. No matter how you slice it, they do add medical cost to everyone else in Canada.

Like Janpreet said, you need to cool your head and accept that they in fact add medical stress / taxes to everyone in Canada.

Not just last three years, in my specific case I am meeting LICO + 30% since 2007.
And fact is, we will continue to contribute enough to that 'pool' for reminder of their lives.

Only reason why we are able pay taxes is because my parents spent all their saved money on our education. My parents gave us ability to earn and contribute to the Canadian society. So no they won't be leeching.

I am glad Canadian law makers does not endorse your opinion.

What you have to say about non earning kids, are they leeching the system too?

 

[janpreet]

The different in the non-earning dependent kids is that they will be contributing to the workforce once they finish their education and begin working and earning an income, thus contributing taxes. Kids are also less likely to be a drain as they are already healthy for the most part. Parents/grandparents are never likely to find work thus will not contribute to health care all along.

Honestly, I rather have more sponsored kids, siblings over parents/grandparents as they can find work and contribute to economy and health care.

What if non earning kids, study in Canada, use Canadian resource and system then migrate to USA?

 

[Rob_TO]

The income tax we pay as a household is enough to cover for my parents medical.

Actually, the income tax your household pays probably does not cover all of your parents healthcare costs.

Going by average healthcare spending rates in Canada by age group, 1 set of parents aged 65-69 will cost approx $12K per year in healthcare alone. At age 75-79 that is up to over $20K, and it keeps increasing every year.

If you look at all the total income taxes you pay, and how much of your taxes are dedicated just to healthcare, then you'll see that it's not just YOUR household that is paying for your parents healthcare, it is lots of other Canadians as well. From age 1 - 60, the "average" Canadian doesn't use all that much healthcare relative to the total demand. So the vast majority of healthcare costs being paid today via regular people paying their taxes... is going to pay for the costs of the older people in Canada.

It is not even debatable that the older one gets, the more healthcare they use (on average). This is a fact based on historical statistics of our healthcare system. So my entire point, is that Canada needs to be careful when they admit new immigrants that will realistically not be contributing much to our taxes, but are statistically much more likely to be a higher cost user of healthcare.

 

[Rob_TO]

What if non earning kids, study in Canada, use Canadian resource and system then migrate to USA?

Non-earning kids have earning parents that are paying taxes while they are in elementary or high school.

 

[screech339]

I am glad Canadian law makers does not endorse your opinion.

Canadian law makers does not have to endorse my opinion. They can look at the medical cost of elderly / baby boomers and see that the cost will be the same for sponsored PR parents/grandparents and how they can add cost to taxpayers to everyone in Canada. It is not that hard to make that determination.

 

[screech339]

What if non earning kids, study in Canada, use Canadian resource and system then migrate to USA?

I have no issue with that. How they use their education after high school graduation is their choice. The problem lies in students going to Canadian Universities at taxpayer's expense and then going else where outside Canada. For example, Provincial governments are investing a lot of money to open medical spots to increase availability of doctors in Canada to address the shortage only to have them skip town after graduating and going to US. Sticking the education cost to taxpayers with nothing to show for to fixing the medical shortage problem. This happens a lot.

 

[Patience09]

I understand both the pros and cons or your different viewpoints. The only thing that I feel is that all parents and grandparents shouldn't be lumped together. Many parents are young enough to put in at least 10 years in the workforce, not to mention consulting work afterwards.

Second thing is I wish they would consider the amount of money (savings) that they are bringing into the country. They are not all coming here to solely depend on their children and be completely helpless. They are bringing life savings to be spent in this country, possible invested in businesses etc.

I wish there was a way to meet in the middle when it comes to health care because I do understand people's concerns about being a strain on the system.