June 2020 Outland. No sponsor approval 7 months after AoR. What can I do?

[DimT44]

My PR was approved couple of weeks after I left

So from IRCC's side you basically did not live in Canada even for a day as a PR before submitting a sponsorship application - Sponsorship is for PRs only if they are physically here.

Ignorance of the law is no excuse, especially when that's all laid out clearly in the guide.

I believe IRCC saw this as an application that was not sent in good faith.

Edit: That's assuming I understand your situation correctly.

 

[ItsTrue]

Hi @scylla @DimT44 @armoured @YVR123 Another question - we are wondering if we can apply for a Business visitor visa while sponsorship or any other application is in process ? We meet requirements listed here https://www.canada.ca/en/immigration-refugees-citizenship/services/visit-canada/business/eligibility.html#how

This seems to be another TRV, but what are the chances of refusals here even if you meet the requirements ? If we submit a good application and prove the agreement with the company operating abroad ? They cannot be refusing spouses from all known forms of TRV.

I'm am not certain if we are eligible for a LMIA exempt work permit from the International Mobility Program.
Another PR application in parallel in one of the eligible programs is another 7-8 months as well.
And withdrawing this one and re-applying is again another 1 year.

 

[ItsTrue]

I defer to others who may know better, but I believe one of the conditions of inland "landing" (the virtual landing process) in this way is that the individual physically be in Canada at the time this happens.

Were you asked to confirm at any point of this final part of process that you were in Canada? (I ask as this is part of the process now, I understand).

No I didn't have to confirm any final part. Auto-landed and that was it.
As a matter of fact, they issued my PR card the very same day they sent me the acknowledgement (AOR) for the spousal application. It arrived in 3-4 days after that.

 

[DimT44]

No I didn't have to confirm any final part. Auto-landed and that was it.
As a matter of fact, they issued my PR card the very same day they sent me the acknowledgement (AOR) for the spousal application. It arrived in 3-4 days after that.

My understanding is that virtual landing is done with the understanding that you are in Canada at the time of landing. Which is why you were mailed a PR card too. Did you notify IRCC that you were outside Canada at the time?

 

[DimT44]

Hi @scylla @DimT44 @armoured @YVR123 Another question - we are wondering if we can apply for a Business visitor visa while sponsorship or any other application is in process ? We meet requirements listed here https://www.canada.ca/en/immigration-refugees-citizenship/services/visit-canada/business/eligibility.html#how

This seems to be another TRV, but what are the chances of refusals here even if you meet the requirements ? If we submit a good application and prove the agreement with the company operating abroad ? They cannot be refusing spouses from all known forms of TRV.

I'm am not certain if we are eligible for a LMIA exempt work permit from the International Mobility Program.
Another PR application in parallel in one of the eligible programs is another 7-8 months as well.
And withdrawing this one and re-applying is again another 1 year.

There is no such thing as a business visitor visa. There is one visito visa (TRV) that can be used in cases like:
- Visititing as a tourist
- Visiting family
- Attending a meeting, conference, or trade show (i.e. business visitor)

You did say your spouse applied for TRVs and they were refused, correct? What were the reasons stated on the rejection letter?

 

[DimT44]

- Visititing as a tourist
- Visiting family
- Attending a meeting, conference, or trade show (i.e. business visitor)

One thing in common in all of these cases is showing that the visitor has strong enough ties to leave Canada at the end of their stay.

So if the reasons for leaving are strong enough to show that the visitor will leave at the end of their stay then it doesn't matter if one was visiting family or for business reasons (at least in principle, and assuming their visit reason is legitimate and everything else is in order).

So I'm saying this because if you think your spouse qualifies for visiting for business purposes, then they have no problem in qualifying for a family visit. (In principle)

I personally would advise against this business visit if your real purpose is for a family visit.

 

[ItsTrue]

My understanding is that virtual landing is done with the understanding that you are in Canada at the time of landing. Which is why you were mailed a PR card too. Did you notify IRCC that you were outside Canada at the time?

The virtual landing process was introduced during COVID time if not mistaken. They would land virtually all in land applicants regardless where they are. I did not inform I was away.

If the notes say 'PR residing abroad' why won't the officer refuse it right at that moment. In fact they issued AOR the next day (as per GCMS notes) as well as they approved my PR card and mailed it out. Also, social assistance check was initiated, but its been 7 months.

I guess they check entry/exit records and have all kind of data. But that would should have also applied to the 'virtual landing' part and approving the PR card application

 

[DimT44]

They would land virtually all in land applicants regardless where they are. I did not inform I was away.

This is wrong. In fact they do specifically ask for a proof you are in Canada, or a declaration at least as far as I understand. (Depending on when you did it can be one or the other - as far as Ican tell.)

Here's the official website explaining the portal:
"How the portal works
Once we approve your application we will send you an invitation to confirm

• your email address
• all email addresses for each person on your application
• you’re in Canada"

And here's a post as far back as July 2020, showing that they want you to be in Canada to land virtually.

I got an email mentioning to complete virtual landing they wanted to know if I was still in Canada and my address and the date and last point of entry into Canada.

Anyways, that's not the point of this thread. But I just wanted to clarify that this is another thing that might be causing some of the issues of sponsor approval.

Your sponsorship application, with three
TRV refusals for your spouse, and being sent when you did not meet the requirements of sponsorship (not physically here, and borderline not a PR either - virtual landing while outside too - at the time of sending it) are all good reasons for scrutiny and delays on IRCC's side. You even want to now apply for a business TRV or other PR streams? (I don't think you can have multiple PR applications anyway)

How to proceed is your call, but these are the facts as I see them. It doesn't seem like your chances of TRV approval are high. Focus on getting your sponsorship application in order.

Note: if you withdraw your application and send a new one, by that point you will have 3 TRV refusals, and 7 months of a sponsorship application that was withdrawn. All the more reasons for scrutiny, I think. So if you end up going down the withdrawal road, I'd highly suggest sending a strong explanatory letter justifying why all of these things exist in your file history. But you might be able to achieve the same results by sending the explanatory letter and without withdrawing.

Maybe you should even consult an expert at this point?

Edits: formatting

 

[scylla]

Hi @scylla @DimT44 @armoured @YVR123 Another question - we are wondering if we can apply for a Business visitor visa while sponsorship or any other application is in process ? We meet requirements listed here https://www.canada.ca/en/immigration-refugees-citizenship/services/visit-canada/business/eligibility.html#how

This seems to be another TRV, but what are the chances of refusals here even if you meet the requirements ? If we submit a good application and prove the agreement with the company operating abroad ? They cannot be refusing spouses from all known forms of TRV.

I'm am not certain if we are eligible for a LMIA exempt work permit from the International Mobility Program.
Another PR application in parallel in one of the eligible programs is another 7-8 months as well.
And withdrawing this one and re-applying is again another 1 year.

You can certainly try for a business visa if you meet the requirements. I assume her employer can provide evidence to support that you meet those requirements. You will want to put together a very strong application given she already has TRV refusals. It can't look like you're just trying to use the business visa as a way of getting her to Canada earlier. You have to demonstrate strong reasons for needing to come to Canada for business purposes and they need to be temporary and show she has an intent to leave. And you're right, it's basically another TRV. I'm not sure what you mean by "They cannot be refusing spouses from all known forms of TRV. " TRV approval rates for spouses seem to be around 50/50. We certainly see plenty of approval here - also plenty of refusals. Unfortunately you have falled into the refusals. However there certainly are people being approved.

In terms of going through IMP, I assume she has a job offer from an employer in Canada? Without knowing any details, it's hard to say if she qualifies for IMP.

Which is she looking to come to Canada on? Is she coming as a business visitor or is it the IMP/work permit? It cannot be both. You really need to pick one or the other to pursue. The business visa cannot be used as a way of getting to Canada and starting to work while you wait for the processing of an IMP / other work permit. Important to understand the difference and which one fits your spouse's situation and what she intends to do in Canada.

 

[armoured]

This is wrong. In fact they do specifically ask for a proof you are in Canada, or a declaration at least as far as I understand. (Depending on when you did it can be one or the other - as far as Ican tell.)

Here's the official website explaining the portal:
"How the portal works
Once we approve your application we will send you an invitation to confirm

• your email address
• all email addresses for each person on your application
• you’re in Canada"

And here's a post as far back as July 2020, showing that they want you to be in Canada to land virtually.

But I just wanted to clarify that this is another thing that might be causing some of the issues of sponsor approval.

This is precisely the reason I raised this - the point being that as far as I'm aware, one cannot 'land' and become a PR without physically arriving at a port of entry or already being in Canada. Yes, the virtual landing process makes it harder to confirm this - and also why, as far as I'm aware, IRCC also requires the individual to confirm they are in Canada.

This raises two important issues:
1) Misrepresentation: most importantly, if a statement was made (electronically or otherwise) that one was in Canada when one was not, this could be misrepresentation - and I believe IRCC considers that there is no 'statute of limitations' that would cure misrepresentation over time. Now, whether IRCC would even look into it or care to - I have no idea. But there's a risk there - and I believe is/can be grounds for revocation of PR status.

2) Even without misrepresentation - ie. even if it was purely mistaken - there is the question of whether the grant of PR status is valid. And it's not obvious that arriving in Canada later is sufficient to 'cure' that administrative error. A legal question really.

What to do? Don't know.

 

[brownistani]

Thought I should update people, since I’ve gotten a few message requests across social media about this. I finally got sponsor approval today – one full year after AoR. They asked me for documents to prove my residence a week ago, including list of absences, several months of paystubs, and every page of every passport since becoming a PR. My MP’s office submitted the documents on my behalf, which is much quicker (and safer) than going through the web form.

 

[sahiMay25]

Thought I should update people, since I’ve gotten a few message requests across social media about this. I finally got sponsor approval today – one full year after AoR. They asked me for documents to prove my residence a week ago, including list of absences, several months of paystubs, and every page of every passport since becoming a PR. My MP’s office submitted the documents on my behalf, which is much quicker (and safer) than going through the web form.

Congratulations! Please explain what steps you followed after your initial comment.

 

[Habby1]

Hi All, I need advise, I submitted my spousal application since the summer of 2020. My wife only did biometric and medical in 2021 April and nothing since then. What can I do?

Although my wife is now here on visiting visa but this application has taken too long.

 

[nikkic121]

Thought I should update people, since I’ve gotten a few message requests across social media about this. I finally got sponsor approval today – one full year after AoR. They asked me for documents to prove my residence a week ago, including list of absences, several months of paystubs, and every page of every passport since becoming a PR. My MP’s office submitted the documents on my behalf, which is much quicker (and safer) than going through the web form.

Hi
Could you please share the steps you followed?
Mine is stuck due to Secondary review.
Almost similar to your situation but the sponsor was inside Canada while applying.
Any help would be much appreciated.
Thanks in advance.

 

[YVR123]

Hi
Could you please share the steps you followed?
Mine is stuck due to Secondary review.
Almost similar to your situation but the sponsor was inside Canada while applying.
Any help would be much appreciated.
Thanks in advance.

Did yours pass the Social assistance check? If your case is in secondary review, you will need the case officer to request more document and proof on the issues the case officer sees. Order your GCMS notes.