Inland Spousal Application Delays petitioning to UN Human Rights Possible?

[chakrab]

I don't mind private individuals making any amount of assumptions, thoughts are free. As for myself, I chose Canada because of the vast distances, the open skies in the prairies, the friendly smile of people in small rural stores, still beautiful nature despite all the hard work and efforts to ruin it - things that might count as rubbish for many. As for being lucrative, I would not be so enthusiastic. It depends of course on the basis of comparison.

However, it is outrageous for a government body to mistreat masses of people because there were some who abused the system. A civilized country responds by closing up the holes, so that abusers can not get in. A communist country responds by punishing everybody attempting to go through the procedure.

you do realize canada does follow a large number of socialist policies as so many Scandinavian countries. being a socialist or communist country doesn't make the country bad, it all depends on the leaders or govt.

 

[canuck_in_uk]

I took the time to check it out, beside others it means heartless, wicked, cruel, bad acts or actions. Where is the mockery?

People did not knowingly choose to be subjected to a procedure where the only rule is that there are no rules and the only certainty is that what was true yesterday is no more true today. Forget about the aspiring immigrant, he/she is apparently expendable, most likely a criminal or at least a potential scammer. But why does the country treat its own citizens the way it does? What is the rational explanation for the lack of transparency?

Are you defending this sort of attitude? Are you saying that yes, Canada is no better than a one-time communist country in its treatment of its own citizens? That it is very much in order that its citizens have no access to information that is crucial for their own well-being? That instead of a clearly defined procedure taking place one is told to seek out one's MP for help in a completely muddled up situation?

Please go tell Syrian refugees or Congolese rape victims or the parents of missing and murdered Aboriginal women here in Canada about the "atrocities" you are facing.

People chose to go through the inland sponsorship process. They had other options: apply outland, move to the other spouse's country, move to a third country, etc. And there are rules and very clear laws regarding immigration, which are in place to protect Canada. It is unfortunate that those who DID SCAM the system have made it so much harder for others but first and foremost, Canada needs to protect itself from such further abuse. I am a Canadian citizen and I fully understand this; I never expected Canada to simply let my partner come live here. As for the lack of transparency, that is common in pretty much every government organization in the world.

Don't be so melodramatic as to compare Canada to a communist country.

 

[Awesomeg]

Applying for and becoming a PR of Canada is a privilege, not a right. So there are no human "rights" being violated anywhere.

A country is free to put whatever measures they deem fit when it comes to spousal immigration, in order to prevent abuse and fraud of the system. This is done to protect it's own citizens first. They could make the processing times 10 years and still no human rights violations would be occurring.

The way to show your displeasure for Canada's current immigration rules is with your vote, and/or petitioning to your MP.

You have little to say about the experience of being separated from your spouse, or about what means to be in the country without permanent status, even when you are married to a Canadian Citizen, Your spouse took less than 5 months to land after you filed the application..... If you would waited for much longer.... like many in the forum have to.. then you probably would have a little bit more understanding.... Some things you will never understand. I wish you had to wait for your spouse to arrive 10 years, like you are suggesting....... "They could make the processing times 10 years and still no human rights violations would be occurring."... don't understand how an human being even can consider using this comparison ....

 

[Rob_TO]

You have little to say about the experience of being separated from your spouse, or about what means to be in the country without permanent status, even when you are married to a Canadian Citizen, Your spouse took less than 5 months to land after you filed the application..... If you would waited for much longer.... like many in the forum have to.. then you probably would have a little bit more understanding.... Some things you will never understand. I wish you had to wait for your spouse to arrive 10 years, like you are suggesting....... "They could make the processing times 10 years and still no human rights violations would be occurring."... don't understand how an human being even can consider using this comparison ....

You don't understand the difference between a privilege and a right. It is not a right for spouses of Canadians to be allowed immigration to Canada.

If the process were to take 10 years for my wife, then we would make other arrangements like moving to her home country instead. Yes it would suck and I would probably complain, but at no point would any rights be violated. It's completely up to the Canadian government how any by what means anyone, family member or not, is allowed to immigrate here. I'm not saying the process is perfect or doesn't have major problems, what I'm saying is it's foolish to compare this to a human rights issue of which it doesn't even come close.

 

[gsize]

Please go tell Syrian refugees or Congolese rape victims or the parents of missing and murdered Aboriginal women here in Canada about the "atrocities" you are facing.

People chose to go through the inland sponsorship process. They had other options: apply outland, move to the other spouse's country, move to a third country, etc. And there are rules and very clear laws regarding immigration, which are in place to protect Canada. It is unfortunate that those who DID SCAM the system have made it so much harder for others but first and foremost, Canada needs to protect itself from such further abuse. I am a Canadian citizen and I fully understand this; I never expected Canada to simply let my partner come live here. As for the lack of transparency, that is common in pretty much every government organization in the world.

Don't be so melodramatic as to compare Canada to a communist country.

you might think differently if they screwed around your file for 5 years. We can do better !

 

[brucem]

Atrocities and human rights aside as I mentioned in another thread the issue I feel is most pertanent is transparency. For me its a simple solution, provide people with basic information about their application through ecas and they can plan....if I knew it was going to be 1 month...1 year I might not be jumping for joy at the latter but at least I can plan. I have no clue when my application will be complete, and peoples frustration is compounded by the fact that some lucky ones get processed in 3-4 months yet others with virtually identical cases are waiting over 12 months or in the case of inland 2-3 years.

As an outland applicant I cant get info through the call centre (not that I'd probably want it to be honest) and I can't call the Ottawa office. They don't respond to emails and they won't acknowledge that they have received information sent. So, if for example my position right now...I sent additional info but according to Canada Post its been out for delivery for 3 weeks. I sent it by email but Ottawa won't acknowlede if they have it. So...lets say worst case scenario CIC lose my mail and Ottawa just dont have the resources to check the email and they deny my application, I am for want of a better word, shafted. I can appeal but that takes years, or I can reapply which takes another whack of money and probably another year or more of our lives.

First world problems....in the big picture definitely, and I agree with Rob PR is not a right it is a privelage but a few simple changes like taking a tiny amount of time to update ecas would go a long way to reassuring people. And relax Bruce!

 

[Rexess]

Please go tell Syrian refugees or Congolese rape victims or the parents of missing and murdered Aboriginal women here in Canada about the "atrocities" you are facing.

People chose to go through the inland sponsorship process. They had other options: apply outland, move to the other spouse's country, move to a third country, etc. And there are rules and very clear laws regarding immigration, which are in place to protect Canada. It is unfortunate that those who DID SCAM the system have made it so much harder for others but first and foremost, Canada needs to protect itself from such further abuse. I am a Canadian citizen and I fully understand this; I never expected Canada to simply let my partner come live here. As for the lack of transparency, that is common in pretty much every government organization in the world.

Don't be so melodramatic as to compare Canada to a communist country.

As for the first sentence of your response let me quote a classic: don't be so melodramatic as to compare the atrocities in Canada's immigration system to the atrocities of Syria or Congo. But really how shallow can one get? Just because there are terrible things committed in the world any injustice, any abuse, any ATROCITY that is less terrible becomes justifiable? Shouldn't maybe the whole judicial system be abolished? Why punish criminals if there are war crimes far more terrible? Or how far do we go down this road? How about sexual harassment at the workplace? Isn't that a hilarious complaint in light of rape and mayhem in Congo? If per chance you get mugged on the street you would not think of going to the police because there are people who get murdered in the same situation?

Or is it that the atrocities of the Canadian immigration system can only be defended if they are juxtaposed against war crimes? Some defense....

To the second part: you either don't know how things work, or you don't want to know. There is and has been no clear information about wait times. You enter the system and lo and behold there is no processing for 6 months out of 12. And no explanation either. But that of course is perfectly OK in the light of missing aboriginal women. Or hunger in Africa. It is OK to let students with a 3-day training work on files that determine a huge chunk of the life of applicants. They make mistakes, applicants suffer, but what is that in comparison to (place here you favorite suffering).

Now about scammers. So it is OK to treat everybody as if they were scammers instead of working out a system that can catch most of the scammers. Nice clear road to a police state. There are criminals. "Successful" criminals who get away with it. So, let's assume everybody is a criminal and treat them accordingly. Let's monitor phones, build up a system where citizen A is spying and reporting on citizen B and vice versa, let's establish curfews, so at least the state can rest at night, etc. Or where do you want to draw the line? If a Canadian is gullible enough to fall for an inland scammer, a fortune hunter, that is not a problem, the judicial system can handle it (or not). It is only the foreign scammers that are so lethal that everybody needs to suffer less one of them can get away with it. But as somebody kindly explained it would be too difficult and time consuming to set up a properly functioning system. Let the applicants wait, after all there is so much suffering in the world, they have no real reason to complain.

I am grateful to you for shedding light on the mindset of the politicians and bureaucrats involved in this immigration system. It is: "we can get away with anything and everything, because there are places that are much worse. We can do whatever we want, because these applicants might be scammers and scammers need to be punished. We can do anything we choose to, if the applicants don't like it, they can crawl back under their stone." Good. But why not say so on the front page of the CIC website? And then potential applicants could make informed choices.

 

[canuck_in_uk]

As for the first sentence of your response let me quote a classic: don't be so melodramatic as to compare the atrocities in Canada's immigration system to the atrocities of Syria or Congo. But really how shallow can one get?

As for your first sentence, go back and read my post; I'm am not comparing atrocities, I'm pointing out some real ones. You can insult me all you want but there are still no atrocities in Canada's immigration system.

To the second part: you either don't know how things work, or you don't want to know. There is and has been no clear information about wait times. You enter the system and lo and behold there is no processing for 6 months out of 12. And no explanation either. But that of course is perfectly OK in the light of missing aboriginal women. Or hunger in Africa. It is OK to let students with a 3-day training work on files that determine a huge chunk of the life of applicants. They make mistakes, applicants suffer, but what is that in comparison to (place here you favorite suffering).

Seriously? With 4000+ posts on here over the past few years, it's safe to say that I know a *little* about the process. Maybe not as much as you, obviously being a seasoned immigration expert... It sucks for those who applied when the processing times were different but processing times are always subject to change. I knew when I sponsored my partner that the processing times went up and down and that the time posted when we applied might be changed during the process. Again, read through my previous posts; I never said that it was OK, merely than it is not an atrocity and that at the end of the day, people CHOSE to go through the process.

Now about scammers. So it is OK to treat everybody as if they were scammers instead of working out a system that can catch most of the scammers. Nice clear road to a police state. There are criminals. "Successful" criminals who get away with it. So, let's assume everybody is a criminal and treat them accordingly. Let's monitor phones, build up a system where citizen A is spying and reporting on citizen B and vice versa, let's establish curfews, so at least the state can rest at night, etc. Or where do you want to draw the line? If a Canadian is gullible enough to fall for an inland scammer, a fortune hunter, that is not a problem, the judicial system can handle it (or not). It is only the foreign scammers that are so lethal that everybody needs to suffer less one of them can get away with it. But as somebody kindly explained it would be too difficult and time consuming to set up a properly functioning system. Let the applicants wait, after all there is so much suffering in the world, they have no real reason to complain.

Oh yes, Canada is really a police state. You go right ahead and explain the perfect system; you seem to know so much, so please, enlighten the rest of us on how CIC should do things differently. Let's stop all of the lengthy security and background checks on all applicants; I mean, who really cares if a murderer or terrorist immigrates to Canada. Let's not require proof of a genuine relationship because no one ever fakes a relationship to gain entry to Canada. Let's not require a medical and let infectious and ill people come to Canada and spread disease. Let's remove all checks and just hand a PR card to anyone who marries a Canadian citizen/PR. Hell, why even bother with that; let's just hand them Canadian citizenship.

Where do YOU want to draw the line?


On a different note, I do wonder who you actually are on the forum. You only created this profile a few days ago to respond to this thread and I'm guessing that you have an already established profile on here but don't want your comments on this thread to be associated with that profile.

 

[Rexess]

As for your first sentence, go back and read my post; I'm am not comparing atrocities, I'm pointing out some real ones. You can insult me all you want but there are still no atrocities in Canada's immigration system.


Seriously? With 4000+ posts on here over the past few years, it's safe to say that I know a *little* about the process. Maybe not as much as you, obviously being a seasoned immigration expert... It sucks for those who applied when the processing times were different but processing times are always subject to change. I knew when I sponsored my partner that the processing times went up and down and that the time posted when we applied might be changed during the process. Again, read through my previous posts; I never said that it was OK, merely than it is not an atrocity and that at the end of the day, people CHOSE to go through the process.


Oh yes, Canada is really a police state. You go right ahead and explain the perfect system; you seem to know so much, so please, enlighten the rest of us on how CIC should do things differently. Let's stop all of the lengthy security and background checks on all applicants; I mean, who really cares if a murderer or terrorist immigrates to Canada. Let's not require proof of a genuine relationship because no one ever fakes a relationship to gain entry to Canada. Let's not require a medical and let infectious and ill people come to Canada and spread disease. Let's remove all checks and just hand a PR card to anyone who marries a Canadian citizen/PR. Hell, why even bother with that; let's just hand them Canadian citizenship.

Where do YOU want to draw the line?


On a different note, I do wonder who you actually are on the forum. You only created this profile a few days ago to respond to this thread and I'm guessing that you have an already established profile on here but don't want your comments on this thread to be associated with that profile.

I sincerely hope that most of the 4000+ are helpful at least if not compassionate. It was your arrogance that made me register after being a reader only for quite some time. I used to come here to find comfort and consolation among people with like or worse fate compared to mine. I loved all the comments written simply with the purpose of comforting and consoling others. But you... Why pour acid onto already hurting wounds? Do you really think that was necessary?
Hmm, 4000+ I think I should run. I don't want to be here for years, I have a life to live. Now do your worst, pour all your acid on me and try and be simply helpful with others. Don't know how to? Read messages from heroes who justifiably bear that distinction.
4000+ scary... I'm outahere

 

[chris1302]

I am also frustrated by the wait times for inland and outland application. Yeah CIC is slow with the process and is unfair to all of us who are waiting, but better that way then seeing so many people allowed into canada who abuse the system totally. I would rather wait and have the system work properly and for CIC to tale time to do background checks then to let in evryone and anyone in this country.
Over the past 20 years many immigrants have been abusing the system way too much..

 

[canuck_in_uk]

I sincerely hope that most of the 4000+ are helpful at least if not compassionate. It was your arrogance that made me register after being a reader only for quite some time. I used to come here to find comfort and consolation among people with like or worse fate compared to mine. I loved all the comments written simply with the purpose of comforting and consoling others. But you... Why pour acid onto already hurting wounds? Do you really think that was necessary?
Hmm, 4000+ I think I should run. I don't want to be here for years, I have a life to live. Now do your worst, pour all your acid on me and try and be simply helpful with others. Don't know how to? Read messages from heroes who justifiably bear that distinction.
4000+ scary... I'm outahere

I did not "pour acid" onto you; I simply pointed out the ridiculousness of the "atrocity" comment. I've not personally insulted you at all. You, on the other hand, have insulted me numerous times; your last post itself contains several insults.

I am quite confident in knowing all of the help I've provided on this forum. Your little put down doesn't change that.

Please, by all means, run away from this forum and take your insults with you.

 

[Ponga]

I did not "pour acid" onto you; I simply pointed out the ridiculousness of the "atrocity" comment. I've not personally insulted you at all. You, on the other hand, have insulted me numerous times; your last post itself contains several insults.

I am quite confident in knowing all of the help I've provided on this forum. Your little put down doesn't change that.

Please, by all means, run away from this forum and take your insults with you.

I am eternally grateful for the help you gave me with my fight for health insurance, so I'll take this opportunity to thank you again.

 

[canuck_in_uk]

I am eternally grateful for the help you gave me with my fight for health insurance, so I'll take this opportunity to thank you again.

Thanks Ponga . And a well deserved thanks to you for all of your help to everyone on the forum.

 

[bigredmoose]

I'm sorry but this is getting absurd. What's happening with immigration does not come close to being an atrocity. The wait times are not great and being separated that long, having your life in limbo, is horrible. Every single person on here knows it firsthand.

Having said that:

1. In no way, shape or form does this count as an atrocity. If you want to see atrocities committed by goverments, look to Rwanda in the 90's or Germany in the 40's or any one of a number of places today where people are being slaughtered.
2. There are no human rights being violated. Nowhere in the Canadian constitution does it say immigration will be done as quick as Joe Whoever from Wherever likes.
3. This is something we all signed up for. You don't like it, don't come here. It's that simple. Don't marry a Canadian or if you do, go to your country. I'm sure the government where you're from is spectacular, which is why you're coming here, right?
4. I'm a Canadian taxpayer, this system is funded by me. I don't want to speed immigration up if it means being lax on the checks required. I also don't want to spend more than I have to for something that benefits a very small proportion of Canadians (myself included)
5. You really do need to look at your own government. It's not Canada's fault that your government is maybe corrupt, or incompetent, or unwilling to work with the Canadian government or whatever. It's not logical to pin the blame for this solely on Canada.
6. Inland applicants get zero sympathy from me. I haven't seen my wife in 7 months and I've only been with her for a grand total of 6 weeks. And now they get a work permit in about 4 months? Boo hoo.

 

[bigredmoose]

Also, if you think Canadian bureaucracy is bad, you'll love the UN!