marcus66502 said:
I know it's risky to apply with no margin, and I'm not saying I've made my final decision on this. I have about four months to do that, during which time I'm collecting all the required documents to make sure I have a complete package ready to be sent off on June 3rd, if need be.
What I'm saying is that I just don't trust this government. And when I say I don't trust them I mean that I don't even trust what they say when they do say something at long last. I've seen them change their word and go back on their word so many times in the course of my applications that they've lost any shred of trust a normal person could have.
Ease of travel advantages of a Canadian passport aside, I actually have plans to seek a career with the federal government. Based on my qualifications, I've been told my odds are decent. But, needless to say, you need to be a citizen for that, and so having to wait an extra year pushes those plans back an extra year.
You are obviously keeping track of as much information as practically feasible, and are prepared to make an informed decision (well, as informed as any of us can be, and subject to whether the order, by the Governor in Council, precedes the date ordered by much) when the time comes. That's the best anyone can do.
While this government has acted with disdain, if not contempt, in the realm of communicating to the public, it is nonetheless a government operating within the rule of law. In many, if not in most regards the government can be trusted, and in particular it can be trusted to apply and follow the rule of law.
In particular, this government's informal communications are often highly suspect, some deliberately misleading (like then Minister Jason Kenney's characterization of the
termination of the parent sponsorship program as a
"temporary pause" in processing -- it was over two years before the terminated program was replaced by a different and more stringent program). Thus, yes, for example last June's announcement that the new residency requirements would take effect in "approximately a year" offers very little information to rely upon.
But, once the Governor in Council actually makes the order as to the date the new provisions come into force, that will be the day. That will be something prospective applicants can rely on. Of course the questions are:
(1) how far in advance of the effective date will the order be made (provisions ordered to take effect last August 1st were so ordered, by the Governor in Council, on July 31st and not published in the Gazette until weeks later, so the first effective public notice was later in the day August 1st when CIC published the news online)
(2) and the big one: what will that date be
For those, like you, on-the-cusp, as the decision-days approach it will be a good idea to daily (twice daily maybe, morning and evening) check the CIC website links to news and notices, and to periodically check the Gazette to see if the order has been published, and of course to follow news in the media and forums as well.
bananaman said:
I've been eagerly following this thread pretty much since it started because I will reach 1095 days on May 27th. Given this date is a Wednesday, if the bill were to come into force on June 1st, I'd only have two working days to get it there in time - by May 29th (last working day before Jun 1st). A brief look at UPS/Fedex etc. and this looks pretty much impossible because I'm in the west, short of flying to Nova Scotia myself which won't be possible for family reasons.
Given the decision to make on applying with exactly 1095 days is whether there are any mistakes on your record of exiting and re-entering Canada versus whether they bring the rule into force with little or no notice, wouldn't it be prudent for all of us on the cusp to request our records from Ports of Entry now? That way we can either attempt to get mistakes rectified before the all-important time, or just wait the extra number of days so we have 1095 days according to the record too?
At least I thought I read somewhere that it was possible to request POE records?
Yes, you can obtain a copy of your CBSA entry history, and for some that could be of assistance in confirming at least entry into Canada dates. This is ATIP request to CBSA and I believe (have not been following this aspect in a while now) there is a form available, and that it takes around a month. It will not necessarily be complete, but its date are almost always (so far as reports go) accurate . . . but again, mistakes are a part of real life.
Similar record can be obtained from the U.S., for entries into the U.S. (thus reflecting any exits from Canada when traveling to the U.S.), but I do not know the current procedure. When I did that, it took around a year (I requested the records months before applying for citizenship and did not get them until a long while after I had become a citizen), but I have seen anecdotal reports suggesting that the U.S. has had a better response time recently.
Of course, the best, the most complete and accurate records, are those kept by a PR who was carefully keeping such records. That does not mean CIC will be given totally accurate information from other sources.
My sense is that the risk of errors in this vein are low for any applicant who kept complete records for himself or herself and who accurately declares all trips. But there is always some risk.
And many applicants who believe they reported accurately have made errors. A perfect submission is, well, perfect, no problem. But . . . one common mistake some have made is to overlook that the entry into Canada was actually after midnight, so the absence was for another day. Another error arises when applicants rely on passport entry stamps in a destination country to declare a date of exit from Canada, which stamps are sometimes the next day (red-eye flights) or can even be two days later (red-eye flight west to western Pacific destination), thus failing to report the day, or two, additional absence (due to having actually exited Canada the day, or two, earlier than the date reflected in the entry stamp). Day trips to the U.S. that slipped past midnight before the return to Canada are another common source of error. And of course many simply forgot this or that brief trip to the U.S.
But the idea of applying with a margin is not entirely about covering the possibility of mistakes. Sure, the current emphasis on meeting the technical minimum threshold of presence puts more importance on making sure any deduction from the calculation as submitted does not result in a shortfall. But there is also the
appearance factor, or looking at it from the other side of the issue, the
suspect factor. Think about it: think about what sort of impression is made by an applicant applying based on barely meeting the
minimum requirements. Bureaucrats are people too. Total strangers, total strangers trying to assess the credibility and completeness and accuracy of just some selected information, relying on just a slice of information about the applicant's life. While they mostly operate according to policy, practice, and specified criteria (contrary to the assertions of some, subjective judgment probably plays a rather small role), overall impressions can, and sometimes will, affect their judgment. For those applicants cutting it real, real close, it is obvious, they cut it real, real close, and sometimes this can invite some doubt, if not a measure of skepticism.
Just some things to think about and be aware about. Problem is that this year, for those on-the-cusp, there is so little room to maneuver.
As I said, the fair thing for this government to do would be to give at least five or six weeks advance notice. I tend to agree with
marcus66502 on this one, that this government cannot be trusted to do the fair thing . . . not by wide margin. But, my sense and hope is that this government will not be so blatantly unfair that it fails to give at least a week or two advance notice. I understand why many do not trust the government to do even this, to even have some semblance of decency, some consideration for impact their decisions have on the lives of real people, Canadians (PRs are Canadians, Canadian Permanent Residents to be precise).
Regarding reaching the 1095 day threshold as of a date like May 27.
I feel your pain. Most bets seem to be on July 1st being the date. That's my second bet. My first bet is indeed June 1st. (Just a bet, no inside information whatsoever, no authorative source of information, mostly my first guess, with July 1st being a very, very close second. It could be May 1st, or September 1st. And I doubt that even CIC personnel, even those in higher-up positions, know at this stage, that they know any more than anyone here.)
Remember: The qualified applicant must meet the requirements as of the day
before the application is signed and submitted.
And the application must be
received by CIC on or before the last working day
before the date the new provisions come into force.
So, sure, there will be dozens if not hundreds of PRs cutoff by the specific date itself, by a margin of just one day. But that will happen no matter which date it happens. Whatever the day is, there will be many who could have met the current requirements if only the effective day was one day later.
IMPORTANT REMINDER: Be sure to be absolutely meticulous in preparing the application, certain to include all required information and documentation. As of last August 1st, there is no room to argue about the date a returned application was "made." Applications returned as incomplete are not made, and will not be made unless and until a complete application is sent and received at CIC.
In the rush to get an application submitted, some are bound to overlook something. Make sure the photos meet the specifications. Make sure there are no gaps in address or work history. Make sure educational records are properly included. And so on. Some will slip and suffer the pain of having sent the application off in time, only to get it back and miss the deadline to beat the new residency requirement.
This is especially true for anyone applying in the next few months. While it appears that CIC has improved its timeline for returning applications it deems incomplete, there are many anecdotal reports of it sometimes being months later, after sending the application off. Last thing an applicant wants to see is his application sent off in March arrive as returned two days before the new provisions come into force, not enough time to get the application re-submitted to beat the new law.
