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I failed to be clear about an important distinction for shortfall cases not relying on credit for presence in Canada prior to date of landing. Even though the odds of success, for almost all shortfall applications (applying with less than 1095 days actual presence), are obviously daunting, the odds are probably significantly better for those with a shortfall not relying on pre-landing credits, particularly for applicants who have a small shortfall, strong equitable reasons for the shortfall (ill parent abroad for example), and who otherwise have centralized their life in Canada for well over three years, even more so for those with over four years.

I admit this is not encouraging for some in a position similar to that of nadeem55, but it is a significant consideration for those with a small shortfall not relying on pre-landing credit.

Still a difficult decision, given the higher fees now, the prospect of a profoundly intrusive RQ process with attendant delays in processing, and the fact that regardless of equitable arguments CJs can (and apparently most will) apply the strict presence test . . . which I suspect will be even more the case once the amended residency requirement is in force (that is, even if the strict presence test is not absolutely required, it will most likely be the test applied CJs choose to apply).

Overall there are many factors which will tend to tip the scales toward waiting rather than applying with a shortfall just before the deadline.

There is also an anticipated rush of applicants who meet the physical presence threshold test but who will apply sooner, with significantly less of a margin, in order to beat the deadline . . . and this will include, in particular, many applicants in a similar position to that of nadeem55 getting in just under the wire with 1095+ days credit including time based on pre-landing presence. Indeed, this is the group of PRs who are currently watching the news most closely, who will be sitting close to the edge of their keyboards, ready to send off that application in short order. As the end of April approaches, many will be able to see that if the coming into force date is May 1st, they meet the 3/4 rule and beat the 4/6 rule if they get the application delivered by April 30th . . . and similarly so as the end of May approaches, if the provision has not already come into force, and again as the end of June approaches if again the provision has not yet already come into force.

For example, if an applicant will meet the 1095 days of presence test on June 25th, counting ten months credit for time in Canada prior to landing, and the provision comes into force on July 1st, this individual better get the application delivered to CIC . . . I would say by Monday June 29th . . . recognizing that this individual cannot sign the application and send it until June 26th. If this individual misses the deadline, he will not be eligible again until May 2017 at the soonest. There are probably many thousands of PRs in this situation, thousands for whom June is the critical month, a different group of thousands for whom May or July are the critical month. Regardless which month it is, the impact will affect many thousands.

So for a PR who was planning to spend a two week holiday in Cuba or Jamaica in March, but for whom that will mean not meeting the 1095 day test until July 5th instead of in mid-June, does he cancel the holiday? But what if the government decides to make the provision come into force June 1st rather than July 1st? He will have cancelled his holiday for nothing.

I know which way I would lean (toward waiting), personally, but we all have our own priorities, our own plans, our own histories and circumstances . . . and as nadeem55 illustrates, one factor that can make a huge difference is if one has career ambitions for a position requiring Canadian citizenship.

It warrants noting, though, that at least there has been a lot, lot, lot more advance notice this was coming than what was anticipated right up to mid-June last year, when it was expected that Bill C-24 would pass and be fully implemented on a much shorter timeline . . . most observers having the opinion (back then) that the new residency requirements would be in effect by September 2014, some time in December at the latest. Minister Alexander, and before him Minister Kenney, had promised the changes would be made, initially promising before the end of 2013 and later at the least before the end of 2014 . . . and since the legislation was tabled in February 2014, there has been practical notice of these changes coming for well over a year, leaning toward a year and a half.
 
dpenabill: Thank you for the detailed insight. so when the citizenship judge applies the three tests to determine the qualifications of the applicant, if one of them fails, is the applicant automatically rejected?
 
ronaldoyaronaldo said:
dpenabill: Thank you for the detailed insight. so when the citizenship judge applies the three tests to determine the qualifications of the applicant, if one of them fails, is the applicant automatically rejected?

CJ chooses which test to use. Totally the CJ's decision. If the applicant fails to meet that test, the one the CJ chooses to apply, the applicant will be denied.

One caveat: if applicant meets the actual physical presence test, that meets the residency requirement. CJ cannot apply one of the qualitative tests to deny an applicant who was actually physically present 1095+ days.
 
Hey dpenabill,

this is almost my situation I got my PR on April 2nd 2013, and I'll apply on june 2nd 2015. and like you said I will apply with almost 10 month of pre-PR (student/skilled worker). Do you think this will be risky? because if I can't make it in June, then the next time I will be able to apply is June-July 2017.

Thanks.


dpenabill said:
For example, if an applicant will meet the 1095 days of presence test on June 25th, counting ten months credit for time in Canada prior to landing, and the provision comes into force on July 1st, this individual better get the application delivered to CIC . . . I would say by Monday June 29th . . . recognizing that this individual cannot sign the application and send it until June 26th. If this individual misses the deadline, he will not be eligible again until May 2017 at the soonest. There are probably many thousands of PRs in this situation, thousands for whom June is the critical month, a different group of thousands for whom May or July are the critical month. Regardless which month it is, the impact will affect many thousands.
 
na123 said:
Hey dpenabill,

this is almost my situation I got my PR on April 2nd 2013, and I'll apply on june 2nd 2015. and like you said I will apply with almost 10 month of pre-PR (student/skilled worker). Do you think this will be risky? because if I can't make it in June, then the next time I will be able to apply is June-July 2017.

Thanks.

There is really nothing you can do unfortunately. we are all in the same bought - most like to miss the cutoff date:(
 
I will be in the same situation on July 1st, Enough Basic residence , but not enough Physical residence. It would be a waste of time if I apply with a shortage of physical presence. I will get denial at some point later on , because I am not fully eligible to apply.

Both Basic and Physical residence should be at least 1095 days.

Now the main attention is on the physical days.

Everybody can apply whenever he/she wants, but the expectation should be realistic, applying with less than 1095 days of physical presence is not realistic for positive outcome, specially after the amendments made on 1st of August last year. The message from the calculator is also updated to say when somebody will be fully eligible to apply... and again the focus is on the physical days.
 
Assume that the cutoff date for 4/6 requirement will be July 1 , 2015 for example , then what about the case when some body like me who will become qualified on June 28 , 2015 (by both basic and physical residency) and he signs and sends his application on June 29, 2015 using the fastest available express courier but the application will be received only on July 1 or 2 (this is very probable case given that the courier can not deliver the shipment to the CIC in Sydney in less than 3 days for this specific case). What is the expected scenario? will they accept it or it will be returned.
 
If the cutoff date is indeed July 1, and the application is not delivered by June 30, it will arrive after the deadline, which falls on a holiday. The rules that are in force on the date they receive it are all that matters.
 
dpenabill said:
There is also an anticipated rush of applicants who meet the physical presence threshold test but who will apply sooner, with significantly less of a margin, in order to beat the deadline . . . and this will include, in particular, many applicants in a similar position to that of nadeem55 getting in just under the wire with 1095+ days credit including time based on pre-landing presence. Indeed, this is the group of PRs who are currently watching the news most closely, who will be sitting close to the edge of their keyboards, ready to send off that application in short order.

I know that's exactly what I'll be doing: send in my application with precisely 1096 days of physical presence under proper PR status (assuming this will be possible on June 3rd, i.e. the new residency requirement hasn't kicked in by then).

Ask me if I care whether CIC likes my doing so. If I beat them to the deadline, they can squirm and huff but game will be over. I will have won.

I realize there's very little I as an applicant can do to avoid being served an RQ if they decide to serve me with one, but the way I see it, even if I'm served an RQ, it still beats having to wait a whole extra year just to have an application in the system to begin with.

dpenabill said:
So for a PR who was planning to spend a two week holiday in Cuba or Jamaica in March, but for whom that will mean not meeting the 1095 day test until July 5th instead of in mid-June, does he cancel the holiday? But what if the government decides to make the provision come into force June 1st rather than July 1st? He will have cancelled his holiday for nothing.

I know which way I would lean (toward waiting), personally, but we all have our own priorities, our own plans, our own histories and circumstances . . . and as nadeem55 illustrates, one factor that can make a huge difference is if one has career ambitions for a position requiring Canadian citizenship.

Vacations abroad are the last thing in my mind right now. There's not a lot of places I can go to with my current passport without needing an old-style visa anyway (not that I'd want to be identified as a national of that country in the first place).
 
Thanks dpenabill, I always enjoy the content you produce, I'll follow up with any lawyer to ask if there's a chance of win, I would definitely go for it instead of waiting 2 more years.

If Govt. don't want to consider my pre-PR days and giving no value then govt. should return back all my taxes and pennies which I paid as legal temporary worker, that's ridiculous.
 
How a layer can help when the applicant is not eligible to be granted with citizenship, because the physical days are not at least 1095?

CIC is showing that they are keen to the physical presence.

Is there anyone who is granted with citizenship after 1st August last year, and who has been with short physical presence days?

Realistically I don't think that a layer can help., but for sure the layer will be glad to promise positive outcome just to get the money for the service.
 
nadeem55 said:
Thanks dpenabill, I always enjoy the content you produce, I'll follow up with any lawyer to ask if there's a chance of win, I would definitely go for it instead of waiting 2 more years.

If Govt. don't want to consider my pre-PR days and giving no value then govt. should return back all my taxes and pennies which I paid as legal temporary worker, that's ridiculous.

As much as you disagree, you have to remember that you were in TEMPORARY before your PR status. Thus really your time towards citizenship qualification actually starts the day you landed as PR. US citizenship qualification only considered days spent in US as Green Card Holders. It is no difference from any other countries that offers qualification from PR status to qualify for citizenship. If I'm not mistaken, I think Canada is the only country that allowed pre-PR days. It is time for Canada to get with the times and program like every other countries.
 
screech339 said:
As much as you disagree, you have to remember that you were in TEMPORARY before your PR status. Thus really your time towards citizenship qualification actually starts the day you landed as PR. US citizenship qualification only considered days spent in US as Green Card Holders. It is no difference from any other countries that offers qualification from PR status to qualify for citizenship. If I'm not mistaken, I think Canada is the only country that allowed pre-PR days. It is time for Canada to get with the times and program like every other countries.

I think Australia does... Not just Canada
 
screech339 said:
As much as you disagree, you have to remember that you were in TEMPORARY before your PR status. Thus really your time towards citizenship qualification actually starts the day you landed as PR. US citizenship qualification only considered days spent in US as Green Card Holders. It is no difference from any other countries that offers qualification from PR status to qualify for citizenship. If I'm not mistaken, I think Canada is the only country that allowed pre-PR days. It is time for Canada to get with the times and program like every other countries.

But in US you can send your citizenship application before evening reaching the actual required time, so an applicant can lodge the citizenship application even 1 or 2 months before, whereas, in Canada they are too strict to counting days
 
nadeem55 said:
But in the US an applicant can send their citizenship application before evening reaching the actual required time, so s/he can lodge the application even 1 or 2 months before, whereas, in Canada they are too strict to counting days