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Canadian Experience​ - a systemic unfair employment barrier to new comers

CanuckForEver

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Feb 2, 2013
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[size=10pt][size=10pt]Petitioning The Honourable Dr. Kellie Leitch
The Honourable Dr. Kellie Leitch, The Honourable Yasir Naqvi: “Canadian Experience” a systemic unfair employment barrier to new comers

Petition by: One Voice Canada Employment and Community Services
[/size] [/size]

Internationally educated new comer professionals to Canada are facing two common systemic unfair employment barriers, 1) credentials not recognized, 2) wealth of knowledge and experience they bring from the world is not valued by the employers in Canada. The irony is internationally educated professional were granted permanent resident status due to their credentials and experience along with their professional skills.

The Ontario Human Rights Commission (OHRC) on Monday launched a new policy directive denouncing the requirement for so-called “Canadian experience” as discriminatory.


“Some employers are using the Canadian experience requirement as a proxy for discrimination, which they know is illegal. But even when hidden, discrimination in employment is still against the law,” OHRC Chief Commissioner Barbara Hall told a news conference.


“The policy we are launching can help remove these barriers and give employers and regulatory bodies the tools they need to respect human rights. The starting point . . . is a simple one: insisting on Canadian experience is discrimination under the Human Rights Code.”

Source:

http://www.thestar.com/news/queenspark/2013/07/15/demanding_canadian_experience_from_newcomers_may_breach_ontarios_human_rights_code.html

An example of Thorncliffe Park in Toronto Canada, is presented here to understand the real picture of new comers socioeconomic problems to Canada. Thorncliffe Park is a home to more newcomers per square foot than anywhere else in Canada. It is the most densely populated neighborhood in Toronto. A population of 28,000 to 30,000 people live in Thorncliffe Park.

Sixty three percent (63%) of the entire population in Thorncliffe Park have a post-secondary education which is three times higher than the academic profile of any community in the GTA. Yet this community is facing over 27% unemployment or underemployment ratio, which is more than three times the average unemployment rate for the city of Toronto.

In fact, it is higher than the unemployment ratio recorded in 2012 for Spain 26% (2012), Greece 26% (2012) and Afghanistan 15% (Source: Trading Economics).

Most newcomers who experience unemployment and underemployment perceive the root cause to be racism and discrimination. Many newcomers, particularly those with an advanced level of education, feel frustrated and disenchanted because they cannot find commensurate employment, since their foreign credentials are not recognized.

When they cannot find desirable or suitable employment in accordance with their qualifications, they feel the loss of social status. They were once respected in the social circle of their country of origin and now become feel humiliated after receiving Canadian permanent status in the Canadian social fabric.

Despite these challenges, many newcomers have shown resilience in dealing with their economic problems in Canada. Some decided to go back to school to upgrade their education/training, or to acquire Canadian credentials. Some pick up survival jobs to feed their families.

In a new country, the cultural and environmental changes become daunting to some and in addition, the challenge of securing employment, becomes a daunting and often futile task for any newcomer. It takes a huge level of reserve and determination when foreign credentials are not recognized; world of experience is not valued; ethnic names on the resumes adds systemic discrimination in hiring and promotion opportunities.

How ethnic names negatively affect job search on the resumes, view this report “New Study Highlights Employment Barriers for Immigrants in Canada”

http://www.cpj.ca/en/blog/mariel/new-study-highlights-employment-barriers-immigrants

Internationally trained professionals can make a positive contributions to the Canadian labour market and society. They can strengthen inclusion and diversity in this country with the broad international expertise and diverse skills they bring with them. They can help Canadian businesses and non-profits leverage a diverse pool of talent to reflect their target market and connect them to new ethnic markets and demographic groups.

It’s about time for the Canadian Government to stop such discriminatory labor practices by employers against new comers .By introducing new legislation to binding the employers in Canada to consider new comers’ credentials and experience equally relevant to the job opportunity as they would consider it for any other Canadian.

Canadian Charter of Rights and Freedoms states very clearly about reducing disparity in opportunities.

Quote/

“PART III

EQUALIZATION AND REGIONAL DISPARITIES

Marginal note: Commitment to promote equal opportunities
36. (1) Without altering the legislative authority of Parliament or of the provincial legislatures, or the rights of any of them with respect to the exercise of their legislative authority, Parliament and the legislatures, together with the government of Canada and the provincial governments, are committed to
(a) promoting equal opportunities for the well-being of Canadians;
(b) furthering economic development to reduce disparity in opportunities;

/ Unquote

http://laws-lois.justice.gc.ca/eng/Const/page-16.html#docCont

Canadian employers are telling the new professional immigrants that their credentials are not recognized in Canada and their wealth of experience from the world have no value for them to be hired however Royal Bank of Canada is hiring cheap temp workers from India.

The irony is top talent from India and other South Asian countries are already in Canada however they are not being considered due to so called "No Canadian Experience". Yet temp cheap employees are being imported across Atlantic over new professional immigrants who are trying to make a living for their families and trying hard to contribute in the Canadian economy..

Read the recent news report of the Star and an apology letter from Royal Bank of Canada on the link below

http://www.thestar.com/business/2013/04/11/rbc_chief_issues_open_letter_apology_to_canadians_over_outsourcing.html

http://www.cbc.ca/news/canada/british-columbia/story/2013/04/05/bc-rbc-foreign-workers.html

As an internationally trained professional myself, I had faced many employment systemic barriers and discriminatory practices both in the corporate and in the not for profit sector. Time has come for new comers to take their destiny into their own hands. New comer socioeconomic systemic barriers will receive a vigorous voice from a community based organization formed by new comers in the name of One Voice Canada Employment and Community Services.

Through this online petition we are pleading to Canadian Minister of Labour, The Honourable Lisa Raitt and to the Ontario Minister of Labour, The Honourable Yasir Naqvi to introduce the needed legislation in both houses according to the Canadian Charter of Rights and Freedoms and provide equal opportunities to new comers for economic development to reduce disparity in their socioeconomic life in Canada.

New comers are hoping through this petition, Canadian experience used regularly as a cliché by the employers, should be replaced with the relevant experience, and credentials after the professional evaluation from a recognized Canadian academic institute should be considered equal as local Canadians.

Most Sincerely,

Aamir Khawaja

http://onevoicecanada.org/

Sign the petition at: https://www.change.org/en-CA/petitions/the-honourable-dr-kellie-leitch-the-honourable-yasir-naqvi-canadian-experience-a-systemic-unfair-employment-barrier-to-new-comers?utm_campaign=petition_message_notice&utm_medium=email&utm_source=supporter_message
 

emamabd

Champion Member
Jun 22, 2012
1,815
428
CanuckForEver said:
[size=10pt][size=10pt]Petitioning The Honourable Dr. Kellie Leitch
The Honourable Dr. Kellie Leitch, The Honourable Yasir Naqvi: “Canadian Experience” a systemic unfair employment barrier to new comers

Petition by: One Voice Canada Employment and Community Services
[/size] [/size]

Internationally educated new comer professionals to Canada are facing two common systemic unfair employment barriers, 1) credentials not recognized, 2) wealth of knowledge and experience they bring from the world is not valued by the employers in Canada. The irony is internationally educated professional were granted permanent resident status due to their credentials and experience along with their professional skills.

The Ontario Human Rights Commission (OHRC) on Monday launched a new policy directive denouncing the requirement for so-called “Canadian experience” as discriminatory.


“Some employers are using the Canadian experience requirement as a proxy for discrimination, which they know is illegal. But even when hidden, discrimination in employment is still against the law,” OHRC Chief Commissioner Barbara Hall told a news conference.


“The policy we are launching can help remove these barriers and give employers and regulatory bodies the tools they need to respect human rights. The starting point . . . is a simple one: insisting on Canadian experience is discrimination under the Human Rights Code.”

Source:

http://www.thestar.com/news/queenspark/2013/07/15/demanding_canadian_experience_from_newcomers_may_breach_ontarios_human_rights_code.html

An example of Thorncliffe Park in Toronto Canada, is presented here to understand the real picture of new comers socioeconomic problems to Canada. Thorncliffe Park is a home to more newcomers per square foot than anywhere else in Canada. It is the most densely populated neighborhood in Toronto. A population of 28,000 to 30,000 people live in Thorncliffe Park.

Sixty three percent (63%) of the entire population in Thorncliffe Park have a post-secondary education which is three times higher than the academic profile of any community in the GTA. Yet this community is facing over 27% unemployment or underemployment ratio, which is more than three times the average unemployment rate for the city of Toronto.

In fact, it is higher than the unemployment ratio recorded in 2012 for Spain 26% (2012), Greece 26% (2012) and Afghanistan 15% (Source: Trading Economics).

Most newcomers who experience unemployment and underemployment perceive the root cause to be racism and discrimination. Many newcomers, particularly those with an advanced level of education, feel frustrated and disenchanted because they cannot find commensurate employment, since their foreign credentials are not recognized.

When they cannot find desirable or suitable employment in accordance with their qualifications, they feel the loss of social status. They were once respected in the social circle of their country of origin and now become feel humiliated after receiving Canadian permanent status in the Canadian social fabric.

Despite these challenges, many newcomers have shown resilience in dealing with their economic problems in Canada. Some decided to go back to school to upgrade their education/training, or to acquire Canadian credentials. Some pick up survival jobs to feed their families.

In a new country, the cultural and environmental changes become daunting to some and in addition, the challenge of securing employment, becomes a daunting and often futile task for any newcomer. It takes a huge level of reserve and determination when foreign credentials are not recognized; world of experience is not valued; ethnic names on the resumes adds systemic discrimination in hiring and promotion opportunities.

How ethnic names negatively affect job search on the resumes, view this report “New Study Highlights Employment Barriers for Immigrants in Canada”

http://www.cpj.ca/en/blog/mariel/new-study-highlights-employment-barriers-immigrants

Internationally trained professionals can make a positive contributions to the Canadian labour market and society. They can strengthen inclusion and diversity in this country with the broad international expertise and diverse skills they bring with them. They can help Canadian businesses and non-profits leverage a diverse pool of talent to reflect their target market and connect them to new ethnic markets and demographic groups.

It's about time for the Canadian Government to stop such discriminatory labor practices by employers against new comers .By introducing new legislation to binding the employers in Canada to consider new comers' credentials and experience equally relevant to the job opportunity as they would consider it for any other Canadian.

Canadian Charter of Rights and Freedoms states very clearly about reducing disparity in opportunities.

Quote/

“PART III

EQUALIZATION AND REGIONAL DISPARITIES

Marginal note: Commitment to promote equal opportunities
36. (1) Without altering the legislative authority of Parliament or of the provincial legislatures, or the rights of any of them with respect to the exercise of their legislative authority, Parliament and the legislatures, together with the government of Canada and the provincial governments, are committed to
(a) promoting equal opportunities for the well-being of Canadians;
(b) furthering economic development to reduce disparity in opportunities;

/ Unquote

http://laws-lois.justice.gc.ca/eng/Const/page-16.html#docCont

Canadian employers are telling the new professional immigrants that their credentials are not recognized in Canada and their wealth of experience from the world have no value for them to be hired however Royal Bank of Canada is hiring cheap temp workers from India.

The irony is top talent from India and other South Asian countries are already in Canada however they are not being considered due to so called "No Canadian Experience". Yet temp cheap employees are being imported across Atlantic over new professional immigrants who are trying to make a living for their families and trying hard to contribute in the Canadian economy..

Read the recent news report of the Star and an apology letter from Royal Bank of Canada on the link below

http://www.thestar.com/business/2013/04/11/rbc_chief_issues_open_letter_apology_to_canadians_over_outsourcing.html

http://www.cbc.ca/news/canada/british-columbia/story/2013/04/05/bc-rbc-foreign-workers.html

As an internationally trained professional myself, I had faced many employment systemic barriers and discriminatory practices both in the corporate and in the not for profit sector. Time has come for new comers to take their destiny into their own hands. New comer socioeconomic systemic barriers will receive a vigorous voice from a community based organization formed by new comers in the name of One Voice Canada Employment and Community Services.

Through this online petition we are pleading to Canadian Minister of Labour, The Honourable Lisa Raitt and to the Ontario Minister of Labour, The Honourable Yasir Naqvi to introduce the needed legislation in both houses according to the Canadian Charter of Rights and Freedoms and provide equal opportunities to new comers for economic development to reduce disparity in their socioeconomic life in Canada.

New comers are hoping through this petition, Canadian experience used regularly as a cliché by the employers, should be replaced with the relevant experience, and credentials after the professional evaluation from a recognized Canadian academic institute should be considered equal as local Canadians.

Most Sincerely,

Aamir Khawaja

http://onevoicecanada.org/

Sign the petition at: https://www.change.org/en-CA/petitions/the-honourable-dr-kellie-leitch-the-honourable-yasir-naqvi-canadian-experience-a-systemic-unfair-employment-barrier-to-new-comers?utm_campaign=petition_message_notice&utm_medium=email&utm_source=supporter_message
already signed the petition, i hope everyone else in this forum does the same
 

immigrant1

Full Member
Jun 3, 2013
20
8
CanuckForEver said:
[size=10pt][size=10pt][size=10pt]Petitioning The Honourable Dr. Kellie Leitch
The Honourable Dr. Kellie Leitch, The Honourable Yasir Naqvi: “Canadian Experience” a systemic unfair employment barrier to new comers

New comers are hoping through this petition, Canadian experience used regularly as a cliché by the employers, should be replaced with the relevant experience, and credentials after the professional evaluation from a recognized Canadian academic institute should be considered equal as local Canadians.

Most Sincerely,

Aamir Khawaja










same here, already signed the petition
 

Bargeld

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I won't sign the petition (which already doesn't seem like it would have any useful effect) and this is why..

It's up to a business who hires people as to what qualifications they desire. So long as they respect Canadian and provincial law, and especially protected statuses, I don't see any problem with this in a legal sense. However, even as an American immigrant I noticed this very thing -- my first instinct though was not to fruitlessly try and change the way businesses require Canadian experience (good luck with that) but to move away from provinces like Ontario (rife with anti-immigrant sentiment despite, esp in the GTA, such a high percentage of immigrants) to a province like Alberta which have many businesses that are more likening to recognize foreign experience and education.

You cannot tell a business how to conduct itself when it looks for experience and background any more than you can tell an individual to look for a partner who is experienced with specific people. That really doesn't make sense and is far too much an intrusion upon a business and it's right to conduct itself relating to business matters.

The logical thing to do instead of trying to change the experience requirements of business by signing petitions and fruitlessly trying to change laws dictating to a business what kind of experience they should consider, is to decide where you live based on where you get a job, and if you're stubborn about where to live then deal with the consequences of such limiting decisions. Instead of complaining or wasting time being angry, do what's necessary to get the experience and qualifications that makes companies want to hire you. Or, you can start your own business and have the freedom to decide what kind of employment and educational background you desire.
 

emamabd

Champion Member
Jun 22, 2012
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Bargeld said:
I won't sign the petition (which already doesn't seem like it would have any useful effect) and this is why..

It's up to a business who hires people as to what qualifications they desire. So long as they respect Canadian and provincial law, and especially protected statuses, I don't see any problem with this in a legal sense. However, even as an American immigrant I noticed this very thing -- my first instinct though was not to fruitlessly try and change the way businesses require Canadian experience (good luck with that) but to move away from provinces like Ontario (rife with anti-immigrant sentiment despite, esp in the GTA, such a high percentage of immigrants) to a province like Alberta which have many businesses that are more likening to recognize foreign experience and education.

You cannot tell a business how to conduct itself when it looks for experience and background any more than you can tell an individual to look for a partner who is experienced with specific people. That really doesn't make sense and is far too much an intrusion upon a business and it's right to conduct itself relating to business matters.

The logical thing to do instead of trying to change the experience requirements of business by signing petitions and fruitlessly trying to change laws dictating to a business what kind of experience they should consider, is to decide where you live based on where you get a job, and if you're stubborn about where to live then deal with the consequences of such limiting decisions. Instead of complaining or wasting time being angry, do what's necessary to get the experience and qualifications that makes companies want to hire you. Or, you can start your own business and have the freedom to decide what kind of employment and educational background you desire.
i haven't been to alberta, but from my friends experience its no different than ontario...canadian experience will haunt you wherever
you go in canada - your situation may be different because you are north american - but for others who came from different continents - we do have an issue here, besides - if you are not in the oil industry there's not much opportunities to seek in alberta.

the aim of the petition is not to dictate to the business whom they should hire or what experience...but rather to consider the foreign experiences which newcomers bring along with them, i.e. if a company wants to hire someone lets say with an engineering degree and with "x" years of experience on a specific technology - the hiring company should consider and evaluate the "experience" itself and not the "geographical location" where that experience has occurred.
 

newtone

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Nov 10, 2010
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Bargeld said:
I won't sign the petition (which already doesn't seem like it would have any useful effect) and this is why..

It's up to a business who hires people as to what qualifications they desire. So long as they respect Canadian and provincial law, and especially protected statuses, I don't see any problem with this in a legal sense. However, even as an American immigrant I noticed this very thing -- my first instinct though was not to fruitlessly try and change the way businesses require Canadian experience (good luck with that) but to move away from provinces like Ontario (rife with anti-immigrant sentiment despite, esp in the GTA, such a high percentage of immigrants) to a province like Alberta which have many businesses that are more likening to recognize foreign experience and education.

You cannot tell a business how to conduct itself when it looks for experience and background any more than you can tell an individual to look for a partner who is experienced with specific people. That really doesn't make sense and is far too much an intrusion upon a business and it's right to conduct itself relating to business matters.

The logical thing to do instead of trying to change the experience requirements of business by signing petitions and fruitlessly trying to change laws dictating to a business what kind of experience they should consider, is to decide where you live based on where you get a job, and if you're stubborn about where to live then deal with the consequences of such limiting decisions. Instead of complaining or wasting time being angry, do what's necessary to get the experience and qualifications that makes companies want to hire you. Or, you can start your own business and have the freedom to decide what kind of employment and educational background you desire.
I will sign the petition because change is required and most importantly its the right thing to do. We should stop living in the ice age and embrace international experience instead of rejecting it. We should educate Canadians on globalization and stop making ridiculous cliche statements like "Canadian experience", which in itself sounds very discriminatory, limited and exclusionary.

Assumption:
You are assuming there are jobs and people dont want to do it because they are stubborn

Here is my response,
The problem is not with people being stubborn about moving, who wouldn't relocate for a job related to their field? after all most new immigrants have moved more than half way across the world to come to Canada, so relocation is not the issue. The issue is getting the job they actually qualified for under the immigration process. Unfortunately there are no jobs in Canada. There is a disconnect between what immigration is saying compared to what is actually available in the market. Its a fair statement to say Canada has the most educated factory workers, security guards and taxi drivers in the world
If an Engineer, IT professional, Accountant, who has qualified through the skilled worker program to come to Canada because there is a shortage of this profession in is being offered a job flipping hamburgers 2000 miles and if he chooses not to do it dosent make him stubborn, rather it makes the person making this statement sound very arrogant. It would make sense if there were professional jobs in this country in the first place but the that is far from reality. Either they stop the immigration process altogether so that professional positions can be filled by qualified unemployed Canadians or create more professional jobs so that new qualified immigrants can fill those positions. We have more than enough Canadians who are unemployed let along hiring new immigrants.
 

Bargeld

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newtone said:
I will sign the petition because change is required and most importantly its the right thing to do

Assumption:
You are assuming there are jobs and people dont want to do it because they are stubborn

Here is my response,
The problem is not with people being stubborn about moving, who wouldn't relocate for a job related to their field? after all most new immigrants have moved more than half way across the world to come to Canada, so relocation is not the issue. The issue is getting the job they actually qualified for under the immigration process. Unfortunately there are no jobs in Canada. There is a disconnect between what immigration is saying compared to what is actually available in the market. Its a fair statement to say Canada has the most educated factory workers, security guards and taxi drivers in the world
If an Engineer, IT professional, Accountant, who has qualified through the skilled worker program to come to Canada because there is a shortage of this profession in is being offered a job flipping hamburgers 2000 miles and if he chooses not to do it dosent make him stubborn, rather it makes the person making this statement sound very arrogant. It would make sense if there were professional jobs in this country in the first place but the that is far from reality. Either they stop the immigration process altogether so that professional positions can be filled by qualified unemployed Canadians or create more professional jobs so that new qualified immigrants can fill those positions. We have more than enough Canadians who are unemployed let along hiring new immigrants.
A few things:

I agree that the Canadian government should recognize any shortages in the work industry and halt work related visa issuance accordingly. That, to me, is where their responsibility lies.

Beyond that, no. Qualifications for a job at a business is determined by the employer, not by you or the Canadian government. That's why it's important to have where you live in Canada, especially for those of us with an education and work experience from a foreign country, based on where you find employment. This is reiterated up and down these very forums. You can't force a company to change it's criteria to hire you, nor can you force a job to be where it isn't.

This is just logic speaking.. for those who wish to sulk and mope, and not do what it takes to find a job (there's a lot of people who believe emailing a resume or walking in and handing a resume is all they need to do.. naively), I'd suggest moving back to their country of origin to not leech upon the Canadian government for assistance or drain their personal savings. Canada is not a country that will hand you a job as soon as you arrive. It's all up to you, and either luck (for most, to find their career job in their specific area using abroad education/experience), or your ability to go get one.

So no I won't sign it, for reasons stated, but also because of the silly complaint that it must be racism, when in most cases it's not. I had the same difficulty at first, being a white blue-green eyed American, I doubt I was racially profiled. I just didn't fit their employment-based criteria, especially in Ontario, for business management. This is where one should either learn to adapt, to fit into the local market, or find a job elsewhere in the country where there is demand, or move back to their country of origin.

If the petition just said that the Canadian government should be more responsible for bringing in work class immigrants related to the industry's demand, then I would sign it in a heartbeat, because that's correct, but it's saying quite a bit of other things which I find outrageous or simply stupid.
 

steaky

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Bargeld said:
A few things:

I agree that the Canadian government should recognize any shortages in the work industry and halt work related visa issuance accordingly. That, to me, is where their responsibility lies.

Beyond that, no. Qualifications for a job at a business is determined by the employer, not by you or the Canadian government. That's why it's important to have where you live in Canada, especially for those of us with an education and work experience from a foreign country, based on where you find employment. This is reiterated up and down these very forums. You can't force a company to change it's criteria to hire you, nor can you force a job to be where it isn't.
Well said!

+ 1 to you
 

newtone

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Bargeld said:
A few things:

I agree that the Canadian government should recognize any shortages in the work industry and halt work related visa issuance accordingly. That, to me, is where their responsibility lies.

Beyond that, no. Qualifications for a job at a business is determined by the employer, not by you or the Canadian government. That's why it's important to have where you live in Canada, especially for those of us with an education and work experience from a foreign country, based on where you find employment. This is reiterated up and down these very forums. You can't force a company to change it's criteria to hire you, nor can you force a job to be where it isn't.

This is just logic speaking.. for those who wish to sulk and mope, and not do what it takes to find a job (there's a lot of people who believe emailing a resume or walking in and handing a resume is all they need to do.. naively), I'd suggest moving back to their country of origin to not leech upon the Canadian government for assistance or drain their personal savings. Canada is not a country that will hand you a job as soon as you're "fresh off the boat". It's all up to you, and either luck (for most, to find their career job in their specific area using abroad education/experience), or your ability to go get one.

So no I won't sign it, for reasons stated, but also because of the silly complaint that it must be racism, when in most cases it's not. I had the same difficulty at first, being a white blue-green eyed American, I doubt I was racially profiled. I just didn't fit their employment-based criteria, especially in Ontario, for business management. This is where one should either learn to adapt, to fit into the local market, or find a job elsewhere in the country where there is demand, or move back to their country of origin.

If the petition just said that the Canadian government should be more responsible for bringing in work class immigrants related to the industry's demand, then I would sign it in a heartbeat, because that's correct, but it's saying quite a bit of other things which I find outrageous or simply stupid.
I agree with some of the things you've said but in reality things are very different

1. WRT work related visas, the RBC scandal comes to mind, having said that there were also reports about how Tim Hortons, Gas station attendants, cleaners where hired on work permit. I mean seriously how is that possible?

2. I agree that government should not interfere with business practices which is why there is a discrepancy between businesses and government. Government wants educated immigrants and businesses make their own rules of hiring.

3. There are many people who feel that they are entitled to a job just cause they landed in Canada, this is obviously stupid and I agree with you but having said that there are also many people who have been trying really hard and we possibly cannot overlook or discredit their efforts

I think overall we can agree to disagree on certain things but anything to help people out comes a long way towards social responsibility. Sometimes I wish the government would actually do things they promise, the world would be a far better place.
 

ADUFE

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I, personally, have NO DOUBT that he is either one of them (Harper's Cronies) or one of their staunchest supporter....... :p
 

Bargeld

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At very least a few trolls are here to fellate each other. We need to petition to give you guys your own forum for that.
 

ADUFE

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Bargeld said:
At very least a few trolls are here to fellate each other. We need to petition to give you guys your own forum for that.
You know what they say, "It takes one to know one"..... ;D ;D :p
 

leveragedhedging

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Bargeld said:
At very least a few trolls are here to fellate each other. We need to petition to give you guys your own forum for that.
+1 to you sir.

I personally went to Ontario on a study permit. Graduated in 2008 and was not able to get a job. So, i looked West and got a contract position in Winnipeg in 2009. After working there for a year, i applied through the provincial nominee program and was ACTUALLY SPONSORED by my employer (FYI I work at a stock brokerage firm) and they hired me full time on a permanent basis. I got my PR this May and completed my Landing. I took the risk to get to where i am. I was not satisfied with the "comfort" provided to me in that i had to leech off relatives in Ontario just to get by. Now i have saved up enough for a down-payment for a detached home and am looking to buy. Canadian experience or not. You have to make the life you want to build.