Born outside Canada to CDN parent who was also born outside of Canada - Clarify?

[VermiciousKnish]

Hi Fellas,

Just wanted some clarification with regard to the rights for Citizenship as the laws were changed in 2009 and then again in 2015 I believe?

As far as I understand, if a child was born outside of Canada to a Canadian parent who was born in Canada, then that child will have the right to Canadian citizenship no matter what year the child was born (excluding armed forces, public servants cases).

If the child was born outside of Canada to a parent who holds Canadian citizenship but that parent was also born outside of Canada, then the child will only be entitled to CDN citizenship if they were born prior to 2009. If they were born after 2009, the citizenship only passes to the first generation children and so the automatic citizenship right stops at that parent since they themselves were also born outside of Canada?

Is that accurate?

If so, what then of a family with one parent who is CDN citizen, but the parent was born in the USA and received citizenship through his mom who was CDN. This parent has 3 children all born in the USA. First child was born prior to 2009, but second and third child born after 2009. Is only the firstborn child entitled to CDN citizenship now? They are all currently living in the USA.

Thanks!

 

[screech339]

Hi Fellas,

Just wanted some clarification with regard to the rights for Citizenship as the laws were changed in 2009 and then again in 2015 I believe?

As far as I understand, if a child was born outside of Canada to a Canadian parent who was born in Canada, then that child will have the right to Canadian citizenship no matter what year the child was born (excluding armed forces, public servants cases).

If the child was born outside of Canada to a parent who holds Canadian citizenship but that parent was also born outside of Canada, then the child will only be entitled to CDN citizenship if they were born prior to 2009. If they were born after 2009, the citizenship only passes to the first generation children and so the automatic citizenship right stops at that parent since they themselves were also born outside of Canada?

Is that accurate?

If so, what then of a family with one parent who is CDN citizen, but the parent was born in the USA and received citizenship through his mom who was CDN. This parent has 3 children all born in the USA. First child was born prior to 2009, but second and third child born after 2009. Is only the firstborn child entitled to CDN citizenship now? They are all currently living in the USA.

Thanks!

You are correct. Only the first born child would get citizenship. The rest will not get citizenship since they were born after the 2009 law.

 

[VermiciousKnish]

You are correct. Only the first born child would get citizenship. The rest will not get citizenship since they were born after the 2009 law.

What if parent picks up and move to Canada. How would the other two children go about getting citizenship? Would they have to be sponsored as dependant children? Or will living in Canada somehow entitle them to a faster, more automatic route?

 

[screech339]

What if parent picks up and move to Canada. How would the other two children go about getting citizenship? Would they have to be sponsored as dependant children? Or will living in Canada somehow entitle them to a faster, more automatic route?

The parents can move to Canada and apply for PR for their children while inside Canada. The children would have to maintain legal status in Canada during the PR process since their PR papers would be filed as outland.

The canadian parent can also apply for spousal PR for the non-canadian spouse as well.

The lone canadian parent can apply for spousal PR along with the 2 children for PR as same time while living in US. The parent would have to prove that they will move to Canada before spouse and children get PR.

 

[VermiciousKnish]

So they can't apply for citizenship directly once they are living in Canada?

Also, once they get PR, this would mean they would not become Canadian citizens for at least the length of the PR process, plus at least an additional 3 years of residency in Canada?

 

[screech339]

So they can't apply for citizenship directly once they are living in Canada?

Also, once they get PR, this would mean they would not become Canadian citizens for at least the length of the PR process, plus at least an additional 3 years of residency in Canada?

They can't apply for citizenship just by living in Canada. They need to get PR status first. Once they get PR, as children, they do not need to meet the residency qualification for citizenship since their one parent is already Canadian. But as PR they do need to maintain PR residence obligations (2 years out of 5 years in canada) to keep their PR status valid.

 

[VermiciousKnish]

They can't apply for citizenship just by living in Canada. They need to get PR status first. Once they get PR, as children, they do not need to meet the residency qualification for citizenship since their one parent is already Canadian. But as PR they do need to maintain PR residence obligations (2 years out of 5 years in canada) to keep their PR status valid.

If they can apply for citizenship without meeting the residency requirement, once they receive their citizenship certificate (after 6-8 months) they can technically just pick up and leave. Why would they need to keep their PR status valid if they receive citizenship?

 

[screech339]

If they can apply for citizenship without meeting the residency requirement, once they receive their citizenship certificate (after 6-8 months) they can technically just pick up and leave. Why would they need to keep their PR status valid if they receive citizenship?

They can pick up and leave Canada after they get citizenship. Their PR status must be valid until citizenship is granted. Remember you have to prove to CIC that you are going to move and settle in Canada for your spouse and/or children to get PR. They will not grant your children PR if they believe you are only sponsoring them for citizenship purposes.

 

[VermiciousKnish]

So for argument's sake, let's suppose they apply outland for sponsorship of wife and children (or even just children). They submit proof that they will return to live in Canada with school acceptance letters (children were born after 2009 so presumably (ya never know!) they won't have job offers or rental leases). They are accepted as PR while they are still living in USA. They come back, to land in Canada and receive their PR status. They then apply for citizenship that same day.

Suppose they now travel back and forth while waiting for citizenship certificate but they never really establish themselves in Canada. What's to stop them from taking this route? If they don't need residency requirement to apply for citizenship after becoming PR's, then technically they do not ever have to live in Canada!

 

[Leon]

So for argument's sake, let's suppose they apply outland for sponsorship of wife and children (or even just children). They submit proof that they will return to live in Canada with school acceptance letters (children were born after 2009 so presumably (ya never know!) they won't have job offers or rental leases). They are accepted as PR while they are still living in USA. They come back, to land in Canada and receive their PR status. They then apply for citizenship that same day.

Suppose they now travel back and forth while waiting for citizenship certificate but they never really establish themselves in Canada. What's to stop them from taking this route? If they don't need residency requirement to apply for citizenship after becoming PR's, then technically they do not ever have to live in Canada!

Theoretically, yes. However, the first question would be if immigration would accept school acceptance letters for your children as proof that you are intending to move to Canada. Surely your children have to live somewhere and even if the lease is not in their name, it would be in your name. And you also need a job, so they might want more proof.

Lets say you get them to accept your proof and you then apply for citizenship with a Canadian address and keep this address and travel back and forth during the processing time. Also have someone check your mail there so you don't miss anything. In some cases they do want to interview children, I have even heard of a child as young as 5 being called in for an interview. Now, they did not ask him any hard questions like who is the prime minister or something like that but they basically wanted to meet the child and parent. They could also check if the children are actually going to school in Canada. There is no law against moving away after applying for citizenship, however, the citizenship application currently has an intent to reside clause which means that immigration must believe that you and your children intend to reside in Canada. So if they find out that you never actually moved although you said you would when you applied for PR for them and now you have applied for citizenship for them and you still haven't moved, they might not be so happy about that.

So instead of thinking of ways to circumvent the rules, if you want your children to have citizenship, why not live in Canada for a couple of years?

 

[screech339]

So for argument's sake, let's suppose they apply outland for sponsorship of wife and children (or even just children). They submit proof that they will return to live in Canada with school acceptance letters (children were born after 2009 so presumably (ya never know!) they won't have job offers or rental leases). They are accepted as PR while they are still living in USA. They come back, to land in Canada and receive their PR status. They then apply for citizenship that same day.

Suppose they now travel back and forth while waiting for citizenship certificate but they never really establish themselves in Canada. What's to stop them from taking this route? If they don't need residency requirement to apply for citizenship after becoming PR's, then technically they do not ever have to live in Canada!

Why bother having your children to get PR / citizenship if you have no intention of actually moving and settling in Canada.

You have already shown no interest in settling in canada when you and your parents have not even bothered to move back despite being born outside canada. Right now you have 3 generations of canadians of born abroad (your parent/yourself/your first born) that have shown no desire to move back to canada or have any solid connection to Canada at all. You seems only interested in having all your children getting canadian citizenship for conveniences sake.

You are one of the reasons the government changed citizenship laws to limit passing of citizenship to 2nd generation born abroad.

 

[VermiciousKnish]

Why bother having your children to get PR / citizenship if you have no intention of actually moving and settling in Canada.

You have already shown no interest in settling in canada when you and your parents have not even bothered to move back despite being born outside canada. Right now you have 3 generations of canadians of born abroad (your parent/yourself/your first born) that have shown no desire to move back to canada or have any solid connection to Canada at all. You seems only interested in having all your children getting canadian citizenship for conveniences sake.

You are one of the reasons the government changed citizenship laws to limit passing of citizenship to 2nd generation born abroad.

This is not for me by any means. An old friend of mine from the USA called me as he watched the electoral map turn red last night and asked me all these questions as we discussed the citizenship and sponsorship rules and theorized about why the Canadian government set them up this way. The fellow is looking to have Canadian citizenship for his family as an escape means in case Trump destroys the US or causes WWIII. He would like to stay in the USA but wants to have all his children become Canadians in the event of an emergency. Do I think that his intentions (and enough Americans to make CIC website crash) are a little extreme? Certainly. Does that prevent us from having a discussion? Most certainly not...

 

[Cosmosis]

Hello
I'm sorry becouse I write here.
The situation is similar to my. It turned out that my father (born 1950 in Montenegro) has a right to Canadian citizenship, because my Grandfather was born 1922 in Canada.
He wants to apply for Canadian citizenship.
I wonder when my Father becomes a Canadian citizen, what are my options for example to be permanent resident or the right of citizenship maybe I have?
Is there any benefits in procedure for me, because my father is Canadian citizen and I am his Son (born 1985)?
Also brother of my Great-grandfather gave his life for Canada in the First World War 102nd Battalion. A grateful nation recognizes his sacrifise every year on June 13th when page 266 from the Book of Remembrance of the First World War is displayed for public viewing in the Memorial Chamber of the Parliament of Canada.
What is my best way to get an entry visa for me? If you can help me with well-intentioned advice?
Thanks in advance

 

[Leon]

Hello
I'm sorry becouse I write here.
The situation is similar to my. It turned out that my father (born 1950 in Montenegro) has a right to Canadian citizenship, because my Grandfather was born 1922 in Canada.
He wants to apply for Canadian citizenship.
I wonder when my Father becomes a Canadian citizen, what are my options for example to be permanent resident or the right of citizenship maybe I have?
Is there any benefits in procedure for me, because my father is Canadian citizen and I am his Son (born 1985)?
Also brother of my Great-grandfather gave his life for Canada in the First World War 102nd Battalion. A grateful nation recognizes his sacrifise every year on June 13th when page 266 from the Book of Remembrance of the First World War is displayed for public viewing in the Memorial Chamber of the Parliament of Canada.
What is my best way to get an entry visa for me? If you can help me with well-intentioned advice?
Thanks in advance

Your father should apply for a citizenship certificate and if he gets one, you can apply too and see if you get one. It is possible that you don't qualify but you can give it a try.

If you don't qualify, you are too old to be sponsored by your father for PR. You would have to find a way to immigrate on your own.

 

[Leon]

This is not for me by any means. An old friend of mine from the USA called me as he watched the electoral map turn red last night and asked me all these questions as we discussed the citizenship and sponsorship rules and theorized about why the Canadian government set them up this way. The fellow is looking to have Canadian citizenship for his family as an escape means in case Trump destroys the US or causes WWIII. He would like to stay in the USA but wants to have all his children become Canadians in the event of an emergency. Do I think that his intentions (and enough Americans to make CIC website crash) are a little extreme? Certainly. Does that prevent us from having a discussion? Most certainly not...

Your kids are small so you still have plenty of time. When they are 18, you can ask them if they'd be interested in getting PR and going to college in Canada. I believe it's cheaper than the US too. If they'd want, you can sponsor them for PR at that point. They go do college in Canada. Stay long enough to apply for citizenship on their own and voila.