Bill C-24 Second Reading on February 27th:

[Loulou79]

Hi


1. Read through a lot of the posts where the person has applied for citizenship and then immediately leaves for overseas and returns only for the test and oath. It would appear that all they want is the passport.

Its just a psychological thing. You do not want to feel like a prisoner. what if some of us got scholarships, jobs you cant say no to, got married to ppl who live in an another country etc.????

 

[May2014]

Hello everyone .. Check out this ... Clarification of intent to reside by Chris Alex ..
https://m.youtube.com/watch?v=uMoa1vbxRWk

 

[pk2ca]

Hello everyone .. Check out this ... Clarification of intent to reside by Chris Alex ..
https://m.youtube.com/watch?v=uMoa1vbxRWk

Very informative share. +1

 

[MUFC]

Thanks for this video May

That means that there is language problems with some texts of this law. Very funny situation.

So at the end of the day what is the purpose of this, when presumably a PR is applying for passport when he is eligible apply.

 

[Windsor_PhD]

Hello everyone .. Check out this ... Clarification of intent to reside by Chris Alex ..
https://m.youtube.com/watch?v=uMoa1vbxRWk

Thanks for sharing this! it was really informative!

 

[anya]

Hello everyone .. Check out this ... Clarification of intent to reside by Chris Alex ..
https://m.youtube.com/watch?v=uMoa1vbxRWk

Thanks for sharing. Like the lady mentioned there is confusing language used.

The intent to reside should be present on the PR application not the citizenship application as the person applying for citizenship would already have resided their 4/6 years in Canada before applying.

 

[jsamiraziz]

Thanks for this video May

That means that there is language problems with some texts of this law. Very funny situation.

So at the end of the day what is the purpose of this, when presumably a PR is applying for passport when he is eligible apply.

Well, when you read the law document at http://www.parl.gc.ca/HousePublications/Publication.aspx?doc=C-24&pub=bill&File=30#2

You will realize that there is a confusion because we just talk about it and not read it.

Extracting the clarification on intention:

Intention: For the purposes of paragraphs (1)(c.1) and 11(1)(d.1), the person's intention must be continuous from the date of his or her application until they have taken the oath of citizenship.

The effect that this "intention" statement introduces is that those who wants to apply for citizenship then leave the country will no longer be able to legally do this as it proves that their intention was not to stay in Canada but just get the Passports.

This effectively means that you have to stay in Canada not only for 4 years but potentially more till your oath date.

 

[screech339]

Just wanted to let everyone know that Britain has the same kind of wording in their nationality act as a reference. I put in BOLD in the text refer to fulfilling Section 1 and "intention".
Britain doesn't go around revoking Britons of their citizenship simply because they left Britain and settled elsewhere. I happen to know a few Britons living in Canada and US and none of them has ever lost their citizenship because of staying permanently outside Britain.

http://www.legislation.gov.uk/ukpga/1981/61

British Nationality Act 1981

6 Acquisition by naturalisation.
(1)If, on an application for naturalisation as a British citizen made by a person of full age and capacity, the Secretary of State is satisfied that the applicant fulfils the requirements of Schedule 1 for naturalisation as such a citizen under this subsection, he may, if he thinks fit, grant to him a certificate of naturalisation as such a citizen.
(2)If, on an application for naturalisation as a British citizen made by a person of full age and capacity who on the date of the application is married to a British citizen, or is the civil partner of a British citizen the Secretary of State is satisfied that the applicant fulfils the requirements of Schedule 1 for naturalisation as such a citizen under this subsection, he may, if he thinks fit, grant to him a certificate of naturalisation as such a citizen.

18 Acquisition by naturalisation.
(1)If, on an application for naturalisation as a British overseas territories citizen made by a person of full age and capacity, the Secretary of State is satisfied that the applicant fulfils the requirements of Schedule 1 for naturalisation as such a citizen under this subsection, he may, if he thinks fit, grant to him a certificate of naturalisation as such a citizen.
(2)If, on an application for naturalisation as a British overseas territories citizen made by a person of full age and capacity who on the date of the application is married to such a citizen, or is the civil partner of such a citizen the Secretary of State is satisfied that the applicant fulfils the requirements of Schedule 1 for naturalisation as such a citizen under this subsection, he may, if he thinks fit, grant to him a certificate of naturalisation as such a citizen.
(3)Every application under this section shall specify the British overseas territory which is to be treated as the relevant territory for the purposes of that application; and, in relation to any such application, references in Schedule 1 to the relevant territory shall be construed accordingly.

SCHEDULE 1
REQUIREMENTS FOR NATURALISATION
C82Sch. 1 modified (7.11.2002, partly retrospective) by Nationality, Immigration and Asylum Act 2002 (c. 41), s. 11
Naturalisation as a British citizen under section 6(1)
1(1)Subject to paragraph 2, the requirements for naturalisation as a British citizen under section 6(1) are, in the case of any person who applies for it—
(a)the requirements specified in sub-paragraph (2) of this paragraph, or the alternative requirement specified in sub-paragraph (3) of this paragraph; and
(b)that he is of good character; and
(c)that he has a sufficient knowledge of the English, Welsh or Scottish Gaelic language; and
(ca)that he has sufficient knowledge about life in the United Kingdom; and
(d)that either—
(i)his intentions are such that, in the event of a certificate of naturalisation as a British citizen being granted to him, his home or (if he has more than one) his principal home will be in the United Kingdom; or
(ii)he intends, in the event of such a certificate being granted to him, to enter into, or continue in, Crown service under the government of the United Kingdom, or service under an international organisation of which the United Kingdom or Her Majesty's government therein is a member, or service in the employment of a company or association established in the United Kingdom.
(2)The requirements referred to in sub-paragraph (1)(a) of this paragraph are—
(a)that the applicant was in the United Kingdom at the beginning of the period of five years ending with the date of the application, and that the number of days on which he was absent from the United Kingdom in that period does not exceed 450; and
(b)that the number of days on which he was absent from the United Kingdom in the period of twelve months so ending does not exceed 90; and
(c)that he was not at any time in the period of twelve months so ending subject under the immigration laws to any restriction on the period for which he might remain in the United Kingdom; and
(d)that he was not at any time in the period of five years so ending in the United Kingdom in breach of the immigration laws.
(3)The alternative requirement referred to in sub-paragraph (1)(a) of this paragraph is that on the date of the application he is serving outside the United Kingdom in Crown service under the government of the United Kingdom.

 

[zardoz]

Just wanted to let everyone know that Britain has the same kind of wording in their nationality act as a reference. I put in BOLD in the text refer to fulfilling Section 1 and "intention".
Britain doesn't go around revoking Britons of their citizenship simply because they left Britain and settled elsewhere. I happen to know a few Britons living in Canada and US and none of them has ever lost their citizenship because of staying permanently outside Britain.

http://www.legislation.gov.uk/ukpga/1981/61

British Nationality Act 1981

6 Acquisition by naturalisation.
(1)If, on an application for naturalisation as a British citizen made by a person of full age and capacity, the Secretary of State is satisfied that the applicant fulfils the requirements of Schedule 1 for naturalisation as such a citizen under this subsection, he may, if he thinks fit, grant to him a certificate of naturalisation as such a citizen.
(2)If, on an application for naturalisation as a British citizen made by a person of full age and capacity who on the date of the application is married to a British citizen, or is the civil partner of a British citizen the Secretary of State is satisfied that the applicant fulfils the requirements of Schedule 1 for naturalisation as such a citizen under this subsection, he may, if he thinks fit, grant to him a certificate of naturalisation as such a citizen.

18 Acquisition by naturalisation.
(1)If, on an application for naturalisation as a British overseas territories citizen made by a person of full age and capacity, the Secretary of State is satisfied that the applicant fulfils the requirements of Schedule 1 for naturalisation as such a citizen under this subsection, he may, if he thinks fit, grant to him a certificate of naturalisation as such a citizen.
(2)If, on an application for naturalisation as a British overseas territories citizen made by a person of full age and capacity who on the date of the application is married to such a citizen, or is the civil partner of such a citizen the Secretary of State is satisfied that the applicant fulfils the requirements of Schedule 1 for naturalisation as such a citizen under this subsection, he may, if he thinks fit, grant to him a certificate of naturalisation as such a citizen.
(3)Every application under this section shall specify the British overseas territory which is to be treated as the relevant territory for the purposes of that application; and, in relation to any such application, references in Schedule 1 to the relevant territory shall be construed accordingly.

SCHEDULE 1
REQUIREMENTS FOR NATURALISATION
C82Sch. 1 modified (7.11.2002, partly retrospective) by Nationality, Immigration and Asylum Act 2002 (c. 41), s. 11
Naturalisation as a British citizen under section 6(1)
1(1)Subject to paragraph 2, the requirements for naturalisation as a British citizen under section 6(1) are, in the case of any person who applies for it—
(a)the requirements specified in sub-paragraph (2) of this paragraph, or the alternative requirement specified in sub-paragraph (3) of this paragraph; and
(b)that he is of good character; and
(c)that he has a sufficient knowledge of the English, Welsh or Scottish Gaelic language; and
(ca)that he has sufficient knowledge about life in the United Kingdom; and
(d)that either—
(i)his intentions are such that, in the event of a certificate of naturalisation as a British citizen being granted to him, his home or (if he has more than one) his principal home will be in the United Kingdom; or
(ii)he intends, in the event of such a certificate being granted to him, to enter into, or continue in, Crown service under the government of the United Kingdom, or service under an international organisation of which the United Kingdom or Her Majesty's government therein is a member, or service in the employment of a company or association established in the United Kingdom.
(2)The requirements referred to in sub-paragraph (1)(a) of this paragraph are—
(a)that the applicant was in the United Kingdom at the beginning of the period of five years ending with the date of the application, and that the number of days on which he was absent from the United Kingdom in that period does not exceed 450; and
(b)that the number of days on which he was absent from the United Kingdom in the period of twelve months so ending does not exceed 90; and
(c)that he was not at any time in the period of twelve months so ending subject under the immigration laws to any restriction on the period for which he might remain in the United Kingdom; and
(d)that he was not at any time in the period of five years so ending in the United Kingdom in breach of the immigration laws.
(3)The alternative requirement referred to in sub-paragraph (1)(a) of this paragraph is that on the date of the application he is serving outside the United Kingdom in Crown service under the government of the United Kingdom.

As an extra snippet of information, those applying under 6(2) do NOT have to declare "intent". Also, spouses of citizens get accelerated entitlement with a lower residency requirement. Pity Canada didn't take this up as well.

 

[screech339]

As an extra snippet of information, those applying under 6(2) do NOT have to declare "intent". Also, spouses of citizens get accelerated entitlement with a lower residency requirement. Pity Canada didn't take this up as well.

Not sure where you get this info that those under 6 (2) does not have to declare "intent" as it does say that the applicant must fulfill schedule 1. I don't see anywhere that they get their exemption. Please point it out in case I missed it.

Remember 3 years out of 4 years to qualify is still a lower threshold to qualify than the British Citizenship Law of 5 years to qualify and that applies to everyone. For those who are married to Britions get 3 year qualification period instead of 5. So in theory according to you, the 3/4 rule would still only apply to spouses of Canadians and everyone else gets the 4 / 6, again the threshold to qualify is still below the 5 year British version. That would be a nice proposition. Spouses get a 1 year qualification reduction.

 

[zardoz]

Not sure where you get this info that those under 6 (2) does not have to declare "intent" as it does say that the applicant must fulfill schedule 1. I don't see anywhere that they get their exemption. Please point it out in case I missed it.

Remember 3 years out of 4 years to qualify is still a lower threshold to qualify than the British Citizenship Law of 5 years to qualify and that applies to everyone. For those who are married to Britions get 3 year qualification period instead of 5. So in theory according to you, the 3/4 rule would still only apply to spouses of Canadians and everyone else gets the 4 / 6, again the threshold to qualify is still below the 5 year British version. That would be a nice proposition. Spouses get a 1 year qualification reduction.

Screech339

You missed it because you only quoted the 6(1) section of Schedule 1. http://www.legislation.gov.uk/ukpga/1981/61

Naturalisation as a British citizen under section 6(2)

3Subject to paragraph 4, the requirements for naturalisation as a British citizen under section 6(2) are, in the case of any person who applies for it—
(a)that he was in the United Kingdom at the beginning of the period of three years ending with the date of the application, and that the number of days on which he was absent from the United Kingdom in that period does not exceed 270; and

(b)that the number of days on which he was absent from the United Kingdom in the period of twelve months so ending does not exceed 90; and

(c)that on the date of the application he was not subject under the immigration laws to any restriction on the period for which he might remain in the United Kingdom; and

(d)that he was not at any time in the period of three years ending with the date of the application in the United Kingdom in breach of the immigration laws; and

(e)the [F177requirements specified in paragraph 1(1)(b), (c) and (ca)] .

 

[screech339]

You missed it because you only quoted the 6(1) section of Schedule 1. http://www.legislation.gov.uk/ukpga/1981/61

I see that I didn't post that part of the act in the post. I should have included that part.

Thanks for pointing it out.

Screech339

 

[screech339]

On another note on acquiring citizenship of other countries.

Under my wife's country citizenship qualification, as her spouse, I meet all the requirements to qualify to acquire for her citizenship except 1 condition. I have to live in her home country for 1 year to qualify. Otherwise, had I to acquire her citizenship outside marriage, I would have had to live in her country for 5 years and have knowledge of the country language.

Other countries allow citizenship through marriage only, for example, NDP leader Tom Mulclair. He has not never resided in France and yet he was able to get French Citizenship through his French wife.

Screech339

 

[MUFC]

[quote author=jsamirazis]
This effectively means that you have to stay in Canada not only for 4 years but potentially more till your oath date.
[/quote]

Yes I'm understanding it in the same way... this is my post from the previous page ...
[quote author=MUFC]
Intend to reside seems like a second stage of residence requirement.

The first is before you apply, and the second one is the time until the oath.
[/quote]

Apparently the Minister is not really aware what is written in the Bill

 

[munter]

He is completely wrong how can he justify it being a provision if it is already a necessity for satisfying another rule. Why even state it then?
Furthermore granted is past tense. If his interpretation is true it would have state "if citizenship is to be granted". The lawyers assertion that the context changes the meaning and indeed the tense of the language is completely bogus, lawyers still have to adhere to the laws of the English language even more stringently so.

What a load of bs.