DM for ONLY one member of a family

[Rooben]

6 weeks and counting

 

[Pcanadian]

Any updates?

 

[Pcanadian]

I'm trying to understand the process of security clearances by CSIS.have many questions and can't find answers.

First, When does the IRCC request it from CSIS , is it when they send us the AOR or when the status updates to IP?
Is it as someone in the forum said It's random and doesn't apply to everyone? Do they request it for people from specific religions and countries?

Then, How the CSIS processing it after they get the IRCC request ? Is it subjected to the rule of FIRST IN FIRST OUT, especially for people who never left the country during the eligibility period and have no criminal history at all in Canada or any other country. Those should not have a long processing time from the CSIS. Right?

I noticed that people who got in process status in NOVEMBER and DECEMBER are now receiving DM , their test/interview was in January or February though. So do we have to wait until they start processing people who got IN PROCESS STATUS in January to get our decision made. If that's the case, then, YES SECURITY CLEARANCES ARE RANDOM AND DOES NOT APPLY TO EVERYONE because there are people who were in process after JAN OR FEB got their oath letters already.

I'm really frustrated, confused and can't understand why ,for example , families who applied together and got AOR/IP/TEST AND INTERVIEW , all together, some of them got DM and one member not.
Is there any criteria they should depend on ? Or is it just random?

@dpenabill can you please share you thoughts?

 

[dpenabill]

I'm trying to understand the process of security clearances by CSIS.have many questions and can't find answers.

First, When does the IRCC request it from CSIS , is it when they send us the AOR or when the status updates to IP?
Is it as someone in the forum said It's random and doesn't apply to everyone? Do they request it for people from specific religions and countries?

Then, How the CSIS processing it after they get the IRCC request ? Is it subjected to the rule of FIRST IN FIRST OUT, especially for people who never left the country during the eligibility period and have no criminal history at all in Canada or any other country. Those should not have a long processing time from the CSIS. Right?

I noticed that people who got in process status in NOVEMBER and DECEMBER are now receiving DM , their test/interview was in January or February though. So do we have to wait until they start processing people who got IN PROCESS STATUS in January to get our decision made. If that's the case, then, YES SECURITY CLEARANCES ARE RANDOM AND DOES NOT APPLY TO EVERYONE because there are people who were in process after JAN OR FEB got their oath letters already.

I'm really frustrated, confused and can't understand why ,for example , families who applied together and got AOR/IP/TEST AND INTERVIEW , all together, some of them got DM and one member not.
Is there any criteria they should depend on ? Or is it just random?

@dpenabill can you please share you thoughts?

Reminder: I am NO expert.


TIMELINES IN GENERAL:

Mostly applicants need to be patient. For the vast majority all is well. All is on track. The next step will come in due course even if not nearly so quickly as one might expect let alone hope. Most applicants have little or nothing to worry about. All they need to do is watch for notification from IRCC as to the next step and follow the instructions. Even though forum reports reveal others in similar scenarios reaching the next step, even the oath, much sooner, the timeline varies and varies widely and for the vast majority there is NO REASON for concern. The prudent approach is to remain patient and wait.

(Sure, some have cause to worry, but the vast majority of those who will have cause to worry KNOW this and KNOW why and can anticipate it, and for them the better, prudent approach is still to be patient and wait . . . they either know why or they could easily know why if they objectively consider their case from, as best they can, the perspective of a total stranger bureaucrat.)

If it has been more than 8 to 10 months since the application received AOR status, then it is time to make a help centre telephone query to inquire as to the application's status.

For those who applied after October 11, 2017, it may be prudent to be MORE PATIENT than that, given the huge surge in applications which will almost certainly result in a substantial number of applications taking longer . . . even though many applicants proceed through the process rather quickly.

How to proceed after that, if it appears the case is inexplicably stalled, depends . . . and the various aspects of this are the subject of numerous other threads in this forum.

Unfortunately there is a widespread malaise in the forum rooted in unfounded and unsound, and to some extent hyped if not grossly exaggerated expectations about processing time lines.

How it goes for individual applicants is almost certainly NOT RANDOM. But it does vary greatly, even within a particular local office the timeline can vary and indeed it will vary a lot from one applicant to another. There are scores of reasons, scores of little and big factors.

For example, just where in a queue an application is can determine if a criminal or security clearance referral goes out in a batch or has to sit and wait until the next batch, which can sometimes mean just days or weeks longer, or it can result in having to wait months more. Note for example, last we had internal information, referrals to update criminal and security clearances typically went out in batches of up to a HUNDRED at a time. Obviously, for some groups (such as a Northern Ontario group of applicants who will be scheduled for events as Itinerant Services), waiting for enough applicants to send a full hundred in a batch could take way too long, so smaller batches are undoubtedly referred at times to avoid adding six months or a year more to the timeline . . . but almost as undoubtedly, just this one little piece in the processing puzzle can bump any given application by weeks or some months.

OVERALL: Timeline expectations in this forum are out of control. As a rough, rather rough guideline, if the timeline being reported by other applicants shows that many to around most are, say, taking five to six months from AOR to Oath, others can anticipate ROUTINE processing for many others will approach a FULL YEAR. Historically the range between fastest timelines and still well within ROUTINE processing timelines, is that the latter can take two to three times as long as the fastest. That is just how it HAS BEEN and I'd guess will CONTINUE TO BE, since bureaucracy is what bureaucracy does. Saying this is unfair is akin to complaining winters in Manitoba are too long . . . they are too long, but that is not a matter of what is fair or not.


CRIMINAL and SECURITY CLEARANCES (RCMP and CSIS):

This is itself a big subject oft addressed in many other threads in the forum.

The simple and ROUTINE end of the spectrum, however, is NOT complicated. At the same time the application passes the completeness check and the application is entered into GCMS as an active citizenship application, which concurrently results in AOR, the processing agent handling that step makes referrals to RCMP and CSIS for criminality and security background checks. The application itself continues to proceed through the process (much of this is no longer public information so the best we can do is discern what we can based on older information considered in light of whatever clues there are about current processing), and will in due course be referred to a local office. It will be a processing agent in the local office who later verifies the appropriate clearances are in the file.

Many times those clearances need to be updated. Other than the passage of a certain amount of time (which is unknown), we do not know what criteria triggers the need for an updated clearance. We can easily guess some things which are very likely to trigger a referral for an update (FOSS hit in GCMS for name-record criminal charge for example), but we do not know anywhere near what other facts or circumstances might trigger the referral. Indeed, these days it may be that IRCC makes the referral as part of the final approval process. As I noted previously, last we knew such referrals can be made in batches of up to one hundred at a time, so where in the queue a particular applicant happens to fall could make a difference in weeks or months . . . also note that this element can vary considerably if, say, there are multiple processing agents handling files in a local office and one of those proceeds through this or that batch of files on a timeline faster or slower than the others. Kind of like being in a particular queue at the grocers, noticing that the line for another cashier is going faster or slower . . . but put dozens and dozens of individuals in the respective queues.

Beyond that, what is involved in CSIS checks is especially well-protected, concealed confidential information. There is a nearly impenetrable curtain concealing just about every aspect of the CSIS clearance process. It is easy to guess that there are scores and scores of variables affecting how it goes. The particular applicant's background, his or her full background, looming large . . . thus, for example, while I hardly know for sure, it is a safe bet that persons who are from or who have, at some time in their life, spent a significant amount of time in areas of the world where there has been widespread conflict, criminal or terrorist related activities, or social or political instability, are at risk for CSIS to conduct a more extensive and thus lengthy background check.

I cannot guess what criteria might trigger an overseas referral to do further background checking, but I can guess that among likely criteria there are factors outside particulars during the applicant's eligibility period, and it is very easy to apprehend that there can be huge, huge variations in the timeline for any overseas referrals.

In other words, there are so many variables, so many potential side-trips, it is impossible to forecast the timeline for a CSIS clearance for any given individual . . . albeit of course for some applicants it should obviously be easier and faster . . . American citizens who never lived anywhere outside North America, for example, can probably anticipate no CSIS delays.

BUT HERE TOO, AGAIN, THE VAST MAJORITY OF APPLICANTS HAVE LITTLE OR NO REASON TO WORRY. Again, the particular timeline can vary a great deal . . . SIX months or more, faster or slower, for individuals who otherwise appear to have very similar cases.

Also NOTE, I suspect, without much hard evidence, that applicants are sometimes told the application is waiting on a background clearance when in fact the application is actually just in queue, just waiting for IRCC to handle the file and proceed to the next step. Not sure of this, not by a long shot, but my sense is this happens.

Also NOTE: some applicants do indeed get bogged down by a particularly lengthy CSIS background check. It happens. I believe most (nearly all) who will suffer this probably KNOW there is a risk of this and why. BUT this is NOT something the vast majority of applicants need to worry about.

 

[migrant-seeker]

Called IRCC again and the same answer: background check is still ongoing, we received your FP already from RCMP since January, all looks good, we don’t require any information or action from you, just wait and don’t worry you are still within the 12 months !!!
I have not left Canada since I came here even for a single day, I was always employed full time, I paid all my taxes on time, so I don’t understand what background check they are doing for 3 months AFTER receiving my FP from RCMP?!
Very frustrating and almost hopeless

 

[Pcanadian]

Called IRCC again and the same answer: background check is still ongoing, we received your FP already from RCMP since January, all looks good, we don’t require any information or action from you, just wait and don’t worry you are still within the 12 months !!!
I have not left Canada since I came here even for a single day, I was always employed full time, I paid all my taxes on time, so I don’t understand what background check they are doing for 3 months AFTER receiving my FP from RCMP?!
Very frustrating and almost hopeless

I think you should go to see your MP

 

[imm_leb_01]

Called IRCC again and the same answer: background check is still ongoing, we received your FP already from RCMP since January, all looks good, we don’t require any information or action from you, just wait and don’t worry you are still within the 12 months !!!
I have not left Canada since I came here even for a single day, I was always employed full time, I paid all my taxes on time, so I don’t understand what background check they are doing for 3 months AFTER receiving my FP from RCMP?!
Very frustrating and almost hopeless

I hate to say it but i think we have to count 6 months after test to receive DM ... i saw multiple cases like that

 

[imm_leb_01]

I think you should go to see your MP

It's too early to see MP ... 6 months only after application received and processing time is 12 months

 

[Pcanadian]

It's too early to see MP ... 6 months only after application received and processing time is 12 months

I think in his case everything is done since he has done FP. I believe FP will show if there is any security concerns. So if he is 100% sure that he has a clean file then I think the security clearances are done and the delay is caused by the local office.if I had the same situation I will contact MP to get the latest update by the officer in my file.

 

[migrant-seeker]

It's too early to see MP ... 6 months only after application received and processing time is 12 months

For how long you have been waiting?

 

[imm_leb_01]

For how long you have been waiting?

Applied october 2017
Test Feb 05 2018
Still no DM since

 

[migrant-seeker]

I think in his case everything is done since he has done FP. I believe FP will show if there is any security concerns. So if he is 100% sure that he has a clean file then I think the security clearances are done and the delay is caused by the local office.if I had the same situation I will contact MP to get the latest update by the officer in my file.

My FP was completed within 24 hours from doing it. 100% there is nothing. I already submitted during the last two RCMP clearances to access some job sites

 

[imm_leb_01]

I think in his case everything is done since he has done FP. I believe FP will show if there is any security concerns. So if he is 100% sure that he has a clean file then I think the security clearances are done and the delay is caused by the local office.if I had the same situation I will contact MP to get the latest update by the officer in my file.

You brought an interesting point ... my friend got FP after test and few days after they received FP he got DM !
So i guess he passed security based on his FP results

My question is why didn't they ask me FP ... only thing pending for me is security so i wish they would ask me for FP and therefore maybe pass security

 

[migrant-seeker]

My understanding FP from RCMP is only one step, there are other security checks by other agencies to be completed, if I am not mistaken. This is what I read in other threads.

 

[Pcanadian]

You brought an interesting point ... my friend got FP after test and few days after they received FP he got DM !
So i guess he passed security based on his FP results

My question is why didn't they ask me FP ... only thing pending for me is security so i wish they would ask me for FP and therefore maybe pass security

They only ask for FP if your name, last name and date of birth match with another person on their records.
No one actually knows everything about the way the process applications.