Refugee status cessation and PRs applying for citizenship

[alexmathew244]

This is an off-topic tangent . . . especially if it is about a Foreign National and work permits . . .

. . . but the information posted by @abff08f4813c is likely a good (even if just a partial) answer:



. . . depending, nonetheless, on just what the circumstances are, including in particular if the matter before the IRB is a claim for refugee protection or a situation in which a Removal Order is being appealed. And also noting that NOT all work permits give the individual resident status in Canada (work permit issued to certain FNs under a removal order, for example). Leading to . . .



There is no useful answer to how these things "usually" go in these cases. The range of circumstances and possible outcomes range far too widely.

For the particular work permit application referenced here there is NO implied status pending the application, or to be more precise, there is NO "maintained status" (IRCC now refers to what it calls "maintained status" rather than "implied status").


Beyond that . . .

But, first, a suggestion to lawyer-up. Anyone in circumstances likely to involve an appeal should get assistance from a lawyer sooner rather than later. In many circumstances the availability, scope, and prospective relief that may be obtained in an appeal can be severely limited depending on what was litigated before the IRB, so a lawyer's help will often be of far more use BEFORE the IRB hearing rather than later in the appeal process.

So . . . despite being off-topic . . . more fully:



Post Query In More Relevant Forum:

This does not appear to be about cessation. So, this is the wrong thread for this query. Does not appear to even be about citizenship or those who may be eligible to apply for citizenship (PRs meeting the eligibility requirements, which includes PR-refugees). So wrong forum.

There is such a wide variety of circumstances and issues that can be decided by the IRB (Immigration and Refugee Board of Canada), to get information about real experiences in "similar circumstances" the query should be posted in a part of the forum that is actually about "similar circumstances," meaning circumstances similar to those involved in your friend's situation . . . such as one of the forums under the heading "Temporary Entry to Canada" or "Immigration to Canada" or applicable sub-heading such as "General - All Canadian Immigration" (which is grouped in the Immigration to Canada forum) . . . whichever forum is about matters involving circumstances/issues similar to those in which your friend is involved.

Probably a good idea to start a new thread with the query (unless in one of the more relevant forums you find a thread that is specifically about the particular circumstances and issues in your friend's situation).

Meanwhile, your query here provides no context, no particular set of circumstances, no indication what the IRB is addressing, so there is no indication of what would be "similar" circumstances. There is no indication just what this is about, or what division of the IRB this is before even, and that makes a huge difference in what happens, how things work. For example, whether there is even a right of appeal varies and thus depends on the particular circumstances.

That is . . . probably have better luck getting relevant information if you

(1) identify the forum which is more about your friend's situation and post the query there, and​

(2) provide some detail as to the circumstances and issues involved​

For Accounts of Similar Experiences Even Though Not Personal Experience:

I have no personal experience dealing with any division of the IRB. But as just referenced in my preceding post, for years I at least glanced over the vast majority of decisions involving immigration issues published by the Courts (colour me nerd of the insufferable bore sort), and despite some lapses more recently, I still make an effort to look at most immigration cases . . . albeit for several years now I only read in depth those involving the issues I follow, which again are cessation, misrepresentation, PR obligations and inadmissibility, and citizenship applications -- thus, for example, I do not read in depth the FC decisions reviewing RPD (the Refugee Protection Division of the IRB) decisions rejecting refugee claims.

Additionally I have researched and read scores and scores of published IRB (Immigration and Refugee Board of Canada) decisions, mostly focused on appeals heard by the IRB, especially those IRB hearings involving the appeal of a negative residency obligation decision, be that visa office denials of a PR TD or Removal Orders issued based on a 44(1) Report.

Which makes me aware of how things have gone for scores and scores of people who have run into non-routine immigration decision-making in a fairly broad range of circumstances. That is, despite not having any personal experience, I am acquainted with the experiences of scores and scores of other individuals who have gone before the IRB and who have appealed a negative decision. (Noting, however, that is only a limited subset of immigration matters.)

You and your friend can also read those decisions and become familiar with what many others have experienced, and in doing that focus in particular on those cases in which the circumstances really are similar to your friend's. Caveat: better, however, to obtain the assistance of an experienced immigration lawyer.

Published immigration decisions in any of the courts and the IRB can be easily accessed at the CanLII website here: https://www.canlii.org/en/ca/ There are links there to specific venues, including a link to the IRB, where most published IRB decisions can be easily found. The latter can also be found here: https://www.canlii.org/en/ca/irb/

It is worth noting that the experiences reported in both the FC and IRB decisions are official accounts of actual experiences oriented to the actual issues being decided, so those sources are a far more reliable source, in that they are more accurate and often more relevant, than the personal experiences recounted in anecdotal reports. This is not to dismiss how useful the anecdotal reports of personal experience are, but rather to emphasize how important it is to consider those reports in the context of known rules and laws and how the rules and laws are applied in actual cases as recounted in published decisions.

Hi, sorry my apologies for not sharing the full context. Below is the edited version with more details.

--------------------------------
Hi everyone,

I’m seeking some insight from anyone who might have experienced a similar situation. My friend has an IRB hearing coming up in a few months (Cessation Hearing for the first time), and if the decision is negative, he plans to appeal. I understand that the appeal process (or judicial review I think) might take around eight months or more.

My main questions are:

• During the appeal period, would he be considered to be living in Canada under implied status, and if so, can he continue working on an implied work permit?
• Has anyone dealt with this situation, and how did you or your friend manage work permit and legal status while awaiting the appeal decision?

My friend came to Canada 7 years ago as a refugee claimant, his refugee claim was successfully accepted, and after a couple of years he became a PR. He currently holds a valid PR card but since he travelled to his home country once for an emergency, CBSA has opened a cessation case against him now.

I appreciate any experiences or advice you can share. (I’m not a lawyer, so I’m just gathering experiences from those who have been through similar circumstances.)

Thank you for your help!

 

[alexmathew244]

This is an off-topic tangent . . . especially if it is about a Foreign National and work permits . . .

. . . but the information posted by @abff08f4813c is likely a good (even if just a partial) answer:



. . . depending, nonetheless, on just what the circumstances are, including in particular if the matter before the IRB is a claim for refugee protection or a situation in which a Removal Order is being appealed. And also noting that NOT all work permits give the individual resident status in Canada (work permit issued to certain FNs under a removal order, for example). Leading to . . .



There is no useful answer to how these things "usually" go in these cases. The range of circumstances and possible outcomes range far too widely.

For the particular work permit application referenced here there is NO implied status pending the application, or to be more precise, there is NO "maintained status" (IRCC now refers to what it calls "maintained status" rather than "implied status").


Beyond that . . .

But, first, a suggestion to lawyer-up. Anyone in circumstances likely to involve an appeal should get assistance from a lawyer sooner rather than later. In many circumstances the availability, scope, and prospective relief that may be obtained in an appeal can be severely limited depending on what was litigated before the IRB, so a lawyer's help will often be of far more use BEFORE the IRB hearing rather than later in the appeal process.

So . . . despite being off-topic . . . more fully:



Post Query In More Relevant Forum:

This does not appear to be about cessation. So, this is the wrong thread for this query. Does not appear to even be about citizenship or those who may be eligible to apply for citizenship (PRs meeting the eligibility requirements, which includes PR-refugees). So wrong forum.

There is such a wide variety of circumstances and issues that can be decided by the IRB (Immigration and Refugee Board of Canada), to get information about real experiences in "similar circumstances" the query should be posted in a part of the forum that is actually about "similar circumstances," meaning circumstances similar to those involved in your friend's situation . . . such as one of the forums under the heading "Temporary Entry to Canada" or "Immigration to Canada" or applicable sub-heading such as "General - All Canadian Immigration" (which is grouped in the Immigration to Canada forum) . . . whichever forum is about matters involving circumstances/issues similar to those in which your friend is involved.

Probably a good idea to start a new thread with the query (unless in one of the more relevant forums you find a thread that is specifically about the particular circumstances and issues in your friend's situation).

Meanwhile, your query here provides no context, no particular set of circumstances, no indication what the IRB is addressing, so there is no indication of what would be "similar" circumstances. There is no indication just what this is about, or what division of the IRB this is before even, and that makes a huge difference in what happens, how things work. For example, whether there is even a right of appeal varies and thus depends on the particular circumstances.

That is . . . probably have better luck getting relevant information if you

(1) identify the forum which is more about your friend's situation and post the query there, and​

(2) provide some detail as to the circumstances and issues involved​

For Accounts of Similar Experiences Even Though Not Personal Experience:

I have no personal experience dealing with any division of the IRB. But as just referenced in my preceding post, for years I at least glanced over the vast majority of decisions involving immigration issues published by the Courts (colour me nerd of the insufferable bore sort), and despite some lapses more recently, I still make an effort to look at most immigration cases . . . albeit for several years now I only read in depth those involving the issues I follow, which again are cessation, misrepresentation, PR obligations and inadmissibility, and citizenship applications -- thus, for example, I do not read in depth the FC decisions reviewing RPD (the Refugee Protection Division of the IRB) decisions rejecting refugee claims.

Additionally I have researched and read scores and scores of published IRB (Immigration and Refugee Board of Canada) decisions, mostly focused on appeals heard by the IRB, especially those IRB hearings involving the appeal of a negative residency obligation decision, be that visa office denials of a PR TD or Removal Orders issued based on a 44(1) Report.

Which makes me aware of how things have gone for scores and scores of people who have run into non-routine immigration decision-making in a fairly broad range of circumstances. That is, despite not having any personal experience, I am acquainted with the experiences of scores and scores of other individuals who have gone before the IRB and who have appealed a negative decision. (Noting, however, that is only a limited subset of immigration matters.)

You and your friend can also read those decisions and become familiar with what many others have experienced, and in doing that focus in particular on those cases in which the circumstances really are similar to your friend's. Caveat: better, however, to obtain the assistance of an experienced immigration lawyer.

Published immigration decisions in any of the courts and the IRB can be easily accessed at the CanLII website here: https://www.canlii.org/en/ca/ There are links there to specific venues, including a link to the IRB, where most published IRB decisions can be easily found. The latter can also be found here: https://www.canlii.org/en/ca/irb/

It is worth noting that the experiences reported in both the FC and IRB decisions are official accounts of actual experiences oriented to the actual issues being decided, so those sources are a far more reliable source, in that they are more accurate and often more relevant, than the personal experiences recounted in anecdotal reports. This is not to dismiss how useful the anecdotal reports of personal experience are, but rather to emphasize how important it is to consider those reports in the context of known rules and laws and how the rules and laws are applied in actual cases as recounted in published decisions.

Hi, sorry my apologies for not sharing the full context. Below is the edited version with more details.

--------------------------------
Hi everyone,

I’m seeking some insight from anyone who might have experienced a similar situation. My friend has an IRB hearing coming up in a few months (Cessation Hearing for the first time), and if the decision is negative, he plans to appeal. I understand that the appeal process (or judicial review I think) might take around eight months or more.

My main questions are:

• During the appeal period, would he be considered to be living in Canada under implied status, and if so, can he continue working on an implied work permit?
• Has anyone dealt with this situation, and how did you or your friend manage work permit and legal status while awaiting the appeal decision?

My friend came to Canada 7 years ago as a refugee claimant, his refugee claim was successfully accepted, and after a couple of years he became a PR. He currently holds a valid PR card but since he travelled to his home country once for an emergency, CBSA has opened a cessation case against him now.

I appreciate any experiences or advice you can share. (I’m not a lawyer, so I’m just gathering experiences from those who have been through similar circumstances.)

Thank you for your help!

 

[dpenabill]

I’m seeking some insight from anyone who might have experienced a similar situation. My friend has an IRB hearing coming up in a few months (Cessation Hearing for the first time), and if the decision is negative, he plans to appeal. I understand that the appeal process (or judicial review I think) might take around eight months or more.

My main questions are:

• During the appeal period, would he be considered to be living in Canada under implied status, and if so, can he continue working on an implied work permit?
• Has anyone dealt with this situation, and how did you or your friend manage work permit and legal status while awaiting the appeal decision?

My friend came to Canada 7 years ago as a refugee claimant, his refugee claim was successfully accepted, and after a couple of years he became a PR. He currently holds a valid PR card but since he travelled to his home country once for an emergency, CBSA has opened a cessation case against him now.

I appreciate any experiences or advice you can share. (I’m not a lawyer, so I’m just gathering experiences from those who have been through similar circumstances.)

So this is an on-topic query . . . sorry for being so loud about it not being (I was not allowed to edit that post).

First and foremost: LAWYER-UP. In particular, if in doubt, lawyer-up; otherwise, yep, lawyer-up.

A cessation proceeding takes place before the RPD (Refugee Protection Division) of the IRB. While I have seen some of their decisions published, I do not know how to access them generally or even to what extent they can be accessed publicly. The decisions I have seen are typically permeated by redactions and it can be difficult figuring out just what is important or why. I will reference an example below, which I will link and partially discuss, which is perhaps the most recent example I can find.

Even though I have been following cessation cases in-depth for a decade now, I have not been following the post-cessation process other than the procedures and review attendant the appeal itself. My sense (but this is not something I have been following) is that the procedure for applying for an OWP, referenced by @abff08f4813c above, applies. But I do not know much about that beyond the information at the IRCC website linked in that post. That has to do with enforcement of Removal Orders, and individuals who do not have status in Canada but for reasons beyond their control cannot actually be deported.

I cannot emphasize enough that the PR-refugee facing cessation really needs a lawyer.

There may be further discussion of the post-cessation process in the forum for refugees and asylum generally, I am not sure, but again that is not something I follow.


Example of RPD cessation decision:

Here is an example of what perhaps is the most recent RPD decision I can access: X (Re), 2022 CanLII 138139 (CA IRB), https://canlii.ca/t/jz4lf

This case is noteworthy because all the trips made to the home country by this PR-refugee occurred BEFORE the change in law in 2012, which means that at the time she made those trips doing so was not a reason for taking away her PR status. She could not have known she was risking her PR status because there was nothing in the law putting her PR status at risk. Also note the timeline: the decision resulting in the cessation of her protected person status, which automatically terminated her PR status, took place in October 2021, around NINE YEARS after her last trip to the home country.

The RPD panel in that case essentially declined to give any weight to the fact that the PR-refugee did not know that traveling to Peru could result in the loss of her status . . . noting, again, she would not have known that because the law did not provide for that at the time of the travel. This is contrary to the Camayo decision by the Federal Court of Appeal, discussed in many posts above, a decision which is binding but which was later, after this case was heard by the RPD.

Here the panel stated:

[28] The panel is of the opinion that the main issue in this case is not whether she had been informed of the consequences of returning to her country, but why she returned. The issue is not whether she wanted to maintain her status in Canada, but whether she voluntarily reavailed herself of the protection of her country of nationality.​

Camayo makes it clear that cessation based on reavailment requires a showing the refugee INTENDED to reavail home country protection, and in determining this the RPD must consider the refugee's subjective knowledge in regards to the effect of traveling to the home country. Here, even if that inquiry was limited to what the refugee should have known (objectively), apart from they subjectively did know, it is clear this refugee did NOT know that travel to the home country would put her status at risk because at the time of the travel the law did not provide for the loss of PR status for refugees who did that. (I have often railed about how unfair this retroactive application of the law is.)

This case may be among those that have been addressed by the Federal Court, and I will attempt to research that, but given how much information is redacted that could be difficult.

 

[ConfusedGuy28]

Hi, First I want to apologize to the moderators if I posted this in the wrong forum.

My question is would I and my 2 sisters still be able to apply for Citizenship? For background My parents went to Germany to visit my uncle but in that 1 week period my father got called that his mom is sick, Unfortunately he went home to Hungary for 3 days out of that 1 week they were away. On their way back they got sent to secondary where CBSA found out they were in Hungary and seized their Canadian Travel Document, They also had someone from immigration come down and fill out information which she then said gets sent in to a board ( I assume Immigration board who handled cessation?) She said it's up to them if they want to pursue their case or not.

We are also looking for lawyers but online I haven't been able to find one who is willing to help them out so if anyone has any recommendations that would be much appreciated.

Now back to the original question, I was planning on applying for citizenship just next week once I got paid from WSIB as I'm currently on a work injury leave. My sisters were also in the same boat as me to apply around the same time with parents, Now we are confused if my sister and me (21M) could still apply ? CBSA wasn't able to give an answer and I wasn't able to find one online or on this forum.

 

[abff08f4813c]

Hi, First I want to apologize to the moderators if I posted this in the wrong forum.

My question is would I and my 2 sisters still be able to apply for Citizenship? For background My parents went to Germany to visit my uncle but in that 1 week period my father got called that his mom is sick, Unfortunately he went home to Hungary for 3 days out of that 1 week they were away. On their way back they got sent to secondary where CBSA found out they were in Hungary and seized their Canadian Travel Document, They also had someone from immigration come down and fill out information which she then said gets sent in to a board ( I assume Immigration board who handled cessation?) She said it's up to them if they want to pursue their case or not.

We are also looking for lawyers but online I haven't been able to find one who is willing to help them out so if anyone has any recommendations that would be much appreciated.

Now back to the original question, I was planning on applying for citizenship just next week once I got paid from WSIB as I'm currently on a work injury leave. My sisters were also in the same boat as me to apply around the same time with parents, Now we are confused if my sister and me (21M) could still apply ? CBSA wasn't able to give an answer and I wasn't able to find one online or on this forum.

It sounds like this is definitely a case where you need a lawyer, perhaps for yourself and your sisters too. Someone like https://www.bellissimolawgroup.com/success-stories/federal-court-overturns-decision-to-revoke-familys-refugee-status/ perhaps?

That being said, if I were to guess, I'd say it's unclear if you would be affected.

From https://www.bellissimolawgroup.com/cessation-and-reavailment-could-i-lose-my-refugee-protection-and-my-permanent-residence-too/

it may not count as reavailment if the act was not voluntary, was not intended to show reliance on that country’s protection, or did not successfully attract that country’s protection

And from what you describe, it was just your parents. You didn't go to Hungary yourself, thus your father's act was involuntary (you had no control or ability to stop him from going to Hungary) and you personally did not attract Hungary's protection (since you weren't even there at that time). Thus it seems to me like reavailment should not apply to you.

Further to this, from the same page,

In Canada, refugee protection can be ceased for any of the following five reasons:

1. the person has voluntarily reavailed themself of the protection of their country of nationality;

5. the reasons for which the person sought refugee protection have ceased to exist.

when your refugee protection is ceased for reasons (1) through (4), you also lose your Permanent Residence.

Since 1 doesn't apply to you (and i'm assuming 2-4 on the page wouldn't apply either), then I think at worst case, the gov't could only argue that 5 should apply to you - since your father no longer needed refugee protect, and presumably you got that same status through him (but note that if you had other independent reasons to claim refugee status on your own back then your case here would be even stronger to keep), the reason ceases to exist and you no longer have it either. But under reason 5, you don't lose your PR - which suggests you should remain eligible for citizenship.

 

[abeabeaeee]

omg guysssssss I really need help plssssssss

In my first citizenship application, I did not report to IRCC that I had traveled back to my home country. Later, I submitted a Webform to correct this information, but they did not respond. However, my application was canceled due to insufficient residency days after the correction. Now that I am reapplying, should I follow my original application form or use the corrected information from the Webform? I am very worried that this might lead to the cancellation of my permanent resident status.

 

[ConfusedGuy28]

It sounds like this is definitely a case where you need a lawyer, perhaps for yourself and your sisters too. Someone like https://www.bellissimolawgroup.com/success-stories/federal-court-overturns-decision-to-revoke-familys-refugee-status/ perhaps?

That being said, if I were to guess, I'd say it's unclear if you would be affected.

From https://www.bellissimolawgroup.com/cessation-and-reavailment-could-i-lose-my-refugee-protection-and-my-permanent-residence-too/




And from what you describe, it was just your parents. You didn't go to Hungary yourself, thus your father's act was involuntary (you had no control or ability to stop him from going to Hungary) and you personally did not attract Hungary's protection (since you weren't even there at that time). Thus it seems to me like reavailment should not apply to you.

Further to this, from the same page,



Since 1 doesn't apply to you (and i'm assuming 2-4 on the page wouldn't apply either), then I think at worst case, the gov't could only argue that 5 should apply to you - since your father no longer needed refugee protect, and presumably you got that same status through him (but note that if you had other independent reasons to claim refugee status on your own back then your case here would be even stronger to keep), the reason ceases to exist and you no longer have it either. But under reason 5, you don't lose your PR - which suggests you should remain eligible for citizenship.

Hi, Thank you for your detailed reply. Yes I received my PR status through my parents as I was just 8 years old when we moved to Canada and between 13-14 when we were granted PR status.

Yes it was just my parents and unfortunately this wasn't planned either as their original trip was just to Frankfurt to visit my Mother's step-brother.

Is bellissimo law one of the more experienced law groups regarding cases like this? I have been doing a lot of research since my parents told me what happened and bellissimo seems to pop-up more than any other law firm or group.

 

[Cayman]

omg guysssssss I really need help plssssssss

In my first citizenship application, I did not report to IRCC that I had traveled back to my home country. Later, I submitted a Webform to correct this information, but they did not respond. However, my application was canceled due to insufficient residency days after the correction. Now that I am reapplying, should I follow my original application form or use the corrected information from the Webform? I am very worried that this might lead to the cancellation of my permanent resident status.

Were you a refugee?

 

[abeabeaeee]

Were you a refugee?

yess

 

[scylla]

omg guysssssss I really need help plssssssss

In my first citizenship application, I did not report to IRCC that I had traveled back to my home country. Later, I submitted a Webform to correct this information, but they did not respond. However, my application was canceled due to insufficient residency days after the correction. Now that I am reapplying, should I follow my original application form or use the corrected information from the Webform? I am very worried that this might lead to the cancellation of my permanent resident status.

You need to report your travel history accurately in your citizenship application. If you traveled to your home country, you need to include this.

 

[scylla]

yess

You have to report your travel to your home country. Don't commit misrepresentation.

You may want to speak to an immigraiton lawyer before submitting your citizenship application again.

 

[abff08f4813c]

omg guysssssss I really need help plssssssss

In my first citizenship application, I did not report to IRCC that I had traveled back to my home country. Later, I submitted a Webform to correct this information, but they did not respond. However, my application was canceled due to insufficient residency days after the correction. Now that I am reapplying, should I follow my original application form or use the corrected information from the Webform?

I'd include it, as you sent it via webform so they almost certainly know about it.

I am very worried that this might lead to the cancellation of my permanent resident status.

I'd be concerned about this too, but leaving this out if they already know about it could bring about misrepresentation charges, which makes a negative outcome more likely.

I think you need professional advice on how to deal with the home country travel if you haven't already gotten it. (Depending on the situation, there are ways a good lawyer might be able to explain things away such that it doesn't qualify as a cause for cessation, or to keep PR anyways for H&C reasons perhaps.)

 

[Seym]

omg guysssssss I really need help plssssssss

In my first citizenship application, I did not report to IRCC that I had traveled back to my home country. Later, I submitted a Webform to correct this information, but they did not respond. However, my application was canceled due to insufficient residency days after the correction. Now that I am reapplying, should I follow my original application form or use the corrected information from the Webform? I am very worried that this might lead to the cancellation of my permanent resident status.

Neither. Don't apply for citizenship if you went back to your home country unless you go see an immigration lawyer first.

 

[abeabeaeee]

You have to report your travel to your home country. Don't commit misrepresentation.

You may want to speak to an immigraiton lawyer before submitting your citizenship application again.

thank u so much
Does anyone have a good lawyer? I don’t know any lawyers.

 

[abff08f4813c]

Neither. Don't apply for citizenship if you went back to your home country unless you go see an immigration lawyer first.

I'm of the opinion that this person needs to see the lawyer right away regardless... IRCC might already be investigating and preparing for the cessation process in response to the rejected citizenship app + webform.

thank u so much
Does anyone have a good lawyer? I don’t know any lawyers.

Is bellissimo law one of the more experienced law groups regarding cases like this? I have been doing a lot of research since my parents told me what happened and bellissimo seems to pop-up more than any other law firm or group.

I was seeing the same thing. In addition, they seem to have handled a cession case recently (just last month) as my earlier link states.