PR Residency Obligations for second PR - Help from Experts

[montrealworker]

Dear Expert,

Our PR Residency Cards got extended till Feb 2029 after submitting Citizenship application in August 2023. Can we travel abroad for 3-4 months?

What would be our new cycle of PR Residency obligation, if the new PR card states March 2024 to March 2029, to keep our PR we need to stay 2 years during this period?

It is to confirm we stayed for 3.8 years during the first PR cycle Oct 2021-Oct 2025. (First PR expires in Oct 2025)

Any risks please?

Thank you a lot

 

[scylla]

Dear Expert,

Our PR Residency Cards got extended till Feb 2029 after submitting Citizenship application in August 2023. Can we travel abroad for 3-4 months?

What would be our new cycle of PR Residency obligation, if the new PR card states March 2024 to March 2029, to keep our PR we need to stay 2 years during this period?

It is to confirm we stayed for 3.8 years during the first PR cycle Oct 2021-Oct 2025. (First PR expires in Oct 2025)

Any risks please?

Thank you a lot

There is no new cycle. The residency obligation is a rolling obligation.

 

[armoured]

Dear Expert,

Our PR Residency Cards got extended till Feb 2029 after submitting Citizenship application in August 2023. Can we travel abroad for 3-4 months?

What would be our new cycle of PR Residency obligation, if the new PR card states March 2024 to March 2029, to keep our PR we need to stay 2 years during this period?

It is to confirm we stayed for 3.8 years during the first PR cycle Oct 2021-Oct 2025. (First PR expires in Oct 2025)

Any risks please?

Thank you a lot

There's no such thing as a 'cycle.'

There's also no such thing as a PR card or PR status 'extension' - only a PR card renewal or replacement with an entirely new card, and PR status is, well, permanent (unless revoked or renounced).

If your old ones were valid until Oct 2025, it's odd that you were approved for new cards - they usually will only renew PR cards nine months before the old ones expire. Possibly you meant october 2025?

Overall I can't make sense of your dates.

At any rate, if you've done 3.8 yrs in Canada until now, yes, you can travel for 3-4 months with no issues. (Ignoring whether there are any steps requiring action on the citizenship app while away).

Or put differently - as long as you are outside of Canada less than 3 years in any rolling five year period, your PR status will be fine.

 

[montrealworker]

There's no such thing as a 'cycle.'

There's also no such thing as a PR card or PR status 'extension' - only a PR card renewal or replacement with an entirely new card, and PR status is, well, permanent (unless revoked or renounced).

If your old ones were valid until Oct 2025, it's odd that you were approved for new cards - they usually will only renew PR cards nine months before the old ones expire. Possibly you meant october 2025?

Overall I can't make sense of your dates.

At any rate, if you've done 3.8 yrs in Canada until now, yes, you can travel for 3-4 months with no issues. (Ignoring whether there are any steps requiring action on the citizenship app while away).

Or put differently - as long as you are outside of Canada less than 3 years in any rolling five year period, your PR status will be fine.

our PRs were stolen and we had to replace them.... what do you mean by rolling five year period, the new PRs date validity March 2024 to March 2029 ? please

 

[montrealworker]

There is no new cycle. The residency obligation is a rolling obligation.

What do you mean by rolling obligation ?

if the new dates printed on the new PR state Validity period March 2024 to March 2029?

Does it mean the expiry date provided on the PR is not true?

 

[scylla]

What do you mean by rolling obligation ?

if the new dates printed on the new PR state Validity period March 2024 to March 2029?

Does it mean the expiry date provided on the PR is not true?

The date on the PR card is irrelevant. The residency obligation is a rolling obligation, meaning that at any given time, you must be able to look back at the previous five years and have spent at least 2 of those 5 years in Canada.

 

[scylla]

our PRs were stolen and we had to replace them.... what do you mean by rolling five year period, the new PRs date validity March 2024 to March 2029 ? please

Again, the dates on the card are irrelevant. Forget about these dates. You must meet the residency obligation at all times.

 

[montrealworker]

Again, the dates on the card are irrelevant. Forget about these dates. You must meet the residency obligation at all times.

Yes we spent 2 years out of the 5 years in Canada during the past 5 years if we count it from August 2025.

August 2025 - August 2020 (we spent 2 years plus).... would that be still a problem for us? Please advice

 

[scylla]

Yes we spent 2 years out of the 5 years in Canada during the past 5 years if we count it from August 2025.

August 2025 - August 2020 (we spent 2 years plus).... would that be still a problem for us? Please advice

I can't tell you because the dates matter and this is something you would need to determine yourself since only you know your exact dates both in the past and planned for the future. So for example today, if you count back five years, have you spent 2 out of those 5 years in Canada? If so, you are good. Same question tomorrow and the next day and the day after that, etc. You need to make sure you continue to meet the residency obligation on a rolling basis until you take the citizenship oath.

 

[montrealworker]

Dear Mr. Scylla,

This is the actual presence: 21 June 2022 till 20 July 2024 full period inside Canada.

Travel date is planned on 21 July 2024.

Citizenship application submitted 31 August 2023.

Please advise if you see any risk... the rolling obligation seems to be worrisome :"(

 

[Ponga]

Dear Mr. Scylla,

This is the actual presence: 21 June 2022 till 20 July 2024 full period inside Canada.

Travel date is planned on 21 July 2024.

Citizenship application submitted 31 August 2023.

Please advise if you see any risk... the rolling obligation seems to be worrisome :"(

Pretty bold to `assume' the gender of that member.

 

[montrealworker]

Pretty bold to `assume' the gender of that member.

you mean i write in bold letters is better?

Thanks for the advice

This is the actual presence: 21 June 2022 till 20 July 2024 full period inside Canada.

Travel date is planned on 21 July 2024.

Citizenship application submitted 31 August 2023.

Please advise if you see any risk... the rolling obligation seems to be worrisome :"(

 

[YVR123]

Dear Mr. Scylla,

This is the actual presence: 21 June 2022 till 20 July 2024 full period inside Canada.

Travel date is planned on 21 July 2024.

Citizenship application submitted 31 August 2023.

Please advise if you see any risk... the rolling obligation seems to be worrisome :"(

Date seems odd. How did you have enough physical present days to apply for citizenship in Aug 2023 if your actual presence days are 21 June 2022 till 20 July 2024?

Advise is hard without details. Were you in Canada from July 2019 at all? As your physical presence is a rolling 5 years period.

Guess you can wait for Mr. Scylla also. May be s/he is nice enough to reply.

 

[dpenabill]

This is the actual presence: 21 June 2022 till 20 July 2024 full period inside Canada.

Travel date is planned on 21 July 2024.

Citizenship application submitted 31 August 2023.

Please advise if you see any risk... the rolling obligation seems to be worrisome :"(

Responses by @scylla and @armoured have already answered your questions.

I also concur in the recent post by @YVR123 . . .

Further Observations For Clarity:

Again, I am NOT an expert.

Largely for emphasis, as this is adequately stated by others above, as I also noted in the Citizenship part of the forum in response to very similar questions, for purposes of determining whether you are in compliance with the PR Residency Obligation the validity date of your PR card is NOT relevant. The date you made an application for citizenship is NOT relevant.

If you first became a PR less than five years ago, the RO calculation is based on the number of days IN Canada within the five year period beginning that date, that is what we call the date of landing, which again is the date a person became a Canadian (Canadian PR). For a PR still within the first five years since landing, it is easier to count the number of days outside Canada, and as long as the PR has not been outside Canada more than 1095 days since the date of landing they are in RO compliance.

Otherwise, the relevant five year period for calculation RO compliance is based on a new five year period each new day, depending on the day the compliance calculation is made. I listed several example in response to your query there:

Some examples:

If you arrive at a Port-of-Entry today, for example, the RO compliance calculation will be based on how many days you were IN Canada between June 17, 2019 and June 17, 2024.​

​

If you arrive at a Port-of-Entry tomorrow, for example, the RO compliance calculation will be based on how many days you were IN Canada between June 18, 2019 and June 18, 2024.​

​

If you arrive at a Port-of-Entry a month from now, for example, the RO compliance calculation will be based on how many days you were IN Canada between July 17, 2019 and July 17, 2024.​

​

If you arrive at a Port-of-Entry September 24, 2024, for example, the RO compliance calculation will be based on how many days you were IN Canada between September 24, 2019 and September 24, 2024.​

​

If you arrive at a Port-of-Entry January 11, 2025, for example, the RO compliance calculation will be based on how many days you were IN Canada between January 11, 2020 and January 11, 2025.​

Meanwhile, of course it is NOT possible, not yet, that you have been physically present in Canada until July 20, 2024 . . . but assuming you are in Canada and do not leave before July 20, 2024, and that you have been present in Canada since June 21, 2022, that means you will remain in compliance with the RO until at least July 19, 2027. This is because until then you have been IN Canada at least two years (730 days) within the previous five years.

Example: If a PR is present in Canada June 21, 2022 through July 20, 2024, and they leave Canada July 20, 2024, and they stay outside Canada until (for example) June 27, 2027, when this PR arrives at a PoE in Canada their RO calculation will be based on the five year period June 27, 2022 to June 27, 2027. For this period that would be 752 days credit toward RO compliance, so in compliance.

Obviously, as @YVR123 noted, more presence in Canada than that was necessary in order to meet the citizenship physical presence requirement.

 

[foodie69]

you mean i write in bold letters is better?

Thanks for the advice

This is the actual presence: 21 June 2022 till 20 July 2024 full period inside Canada.

Travel date is planned on 21 July 2024.

Citizenship application submitted 31 August 2023.

Please advise if you see any risk... the rolling obligation seems to be worrisome :"(

Hahaha, you are funny. Bold means brave. How do you know Scylla is a man? As a future Canadian you cannot make that assumption