"I respect myself too much to stay in Canada": Why so many new immigrants are leaving

[Wacky1.nash]

Thank you.
I have to say I find that the younger generation is the one that has very little perseverance. Too many there who wants everything served on a platter, preferably spoon fed. Good luck to them. In the article it seems the young architect gave up after a couple of months. Really??!! *facepalm*

I am an immigrant architect from Toronto. I can tell from the story of the architects, this article is misleading.

I moved here from Singapore. It took me only a couple of weeks to find a well paying job as a senior architect. I didn’t have to step down the ladder.

The mistake these guys make is go to these agencies that place immigrant architects. These companies are in the business of providing cheap labour to a handful of exploitative architectural firms. That’s the reason they asked the candidates to dumb down their resumes. They only cater to those technologist and entry level positions.

I was never asked for Canadian experience, and found that my experience in Singapore allowed me to hit the ground running at my job in Toronto. I was leading projects and training interns from day 1.

Also cost of living in Dubai is not higher than that in Toronto. Another lie in the article.

 

[bas12]

I am an immigrant architect from Toronto. I can tell from the story of the architects, this article is misleading.

I moved here from Singapore. It took me only a couple of weeks to find a well paying job as a senior architect. I didn’t have to step down the ladder.

The mistake these guys make is go to these companies that place immigrant architects. These companies are in the business of providing cheap labour to a handful of exploitative firms. That’s the reason they asked the candidates to dumb down their resumes. They only cater to those technologist and entry level positions.

I was never asked for Canadian experience, and found that my experience in Singapore allowed me to hit the ground running at my job in Toronto. I was leading projects and training interns from day 1.

Also cost of living in Dubai is not higher than that in Toronto. Another lie in the article.

There are no overly complicated licensing requirements for architects? Or does it depend on the country you had your qualifications in?

 

[rcincanada2019]

I am an immigrant architect from Toronto. I can tell from the story of the architects, this article is misleading.

I moved here from Singapore. It took me only a couple of weeks to find a well paying job as a senior architect. I didn’t have to step down the ladder.

The mistake these guys make is go to these companies that place immigrant architects. These companies are in the business of providing cheap labour to a handful of exploitative firms. That’s the reason they asked the candidates to dumb down their resumes. They only cater to those technologist and entry level positions.

I was never asked for Canadian experience, and found that my experience in Singapore allowed me to hit the ground running at my job in Toronto. I was leading projects and training interns from day 1.

Also cost of living in Dubai is not higher than that in Toronto. Another lie in the article.

Yeah, same here, I was never asked for the dreaded “Canadian experience”. Due to my extensive experience, I was handling major network projects in my first month. During interview, me and my would-be boss were both conversing in technical jargons all throughout.

I guess people just need to do a more thorough research in their job hunting. Just my opinion, though.

 

[Wacky1.nash]

During interview, me and my would-be boss were both conversing in technical jargons all throughout.

Yeah, my boss remarked during my interview when we were talking about courthouse design, that I spoke as a peer and fellow expert.

I ran into one of those architectural bridging program companies during a panel discussion with CACB. Their representatives embarrassed themselves by asking the panel questions that belied their total ignorance of the licensing procedure. These Companies are started by immigrants looking to exploit new immigrants.

 

[Wacky1.nash]

There are no overly complicated licensing requirements for architects? Or does it depend on the country you had your qualifications in?

Architects require licence to practice in almost every country, and the procedure is lengthy and difficult in most of these countries (atleast developed ones). And rightfully so, because architects have in their hand the safety of the occupants of the building you design. This cannot be compromised. In countries where there is no procedure for licensing, the industry is simply not regulated enough, and results in terrible, and unsafe buildings.

The process to licensure is more or less the same in most countries - credentials + a certain number of hours + exams. Some have additional interview / portfolio / case study submissions. Canada is not really any tougher than most of countries.

If anything I have found the licensing body in Canada encouraging and helpful in guiding immigrant architects to licensure unlike their counterparts in countries like Singapore. Even Australia is tougher.

For architects licensed in other countries, Canada provides pathways to licensure through other pathways. There are some mutual recognition for people licensed in US / UK. For those from other countries, they can skip the hours and exams and submit a portfolio demonstrating their expertise.

It can be argued by providing this path Canada even makes it easier for a foreign architect to get licensed than a local graduate.

 

[iSaidGoodDay]

Yeah, same here, I was never asked for the dreaded “Canadian experience”. Due to my extensive experience, I was handling major network projects in my first month. During interview, me and my would-be boss were both conversing in technical jargons all throughout.

I guess people just need to do a more thorough research in their job hunting. Just my opinion, though.

Can mirror what you say. I hold an exec role in BC, got this role 1.5 years ago (and I've not even been to Canada yet). Canadian exp is more likely to be expected in regulated professions or poorly managed companies. Canadian talent pool is terrible and I don't really see how any top 80 percentile candidate should be expected to justify for the lack of a Canadian exp.

Also, the scale at which most Canadian tech companies operate is very low too. For example, let's take the look at company like Vendasta (Canadian Narwhal), IPO scale org but barely spends $10-20 mil in yearly advertisements, has small sales teams, bad PMs, questionable CRO to CMO, etc.

In my home country, we had 10-20x such companies every 2-3 years with 10x the scale. I really don't how comparable any Canadian exp can be when the scale is that poor. We have worked with companies who had department level budgets that are entire OPEX of most Canadian companies. I think most immigrants should be rather aware of this part.

My opinion could be heavily biased towards tech, management or consulting - but I don't think if someone is actually a top 80 percentiler they'll have to worry. One thing is, Canada unlike US, attracts lower quality of migrants. So, maybe that's where some of us find these stories very difficult to relate to.

 

[rcincanada2019]

My opinion could be heavily biased towards tech, management or consulting - but I don't think if someone is actually a top 80 percentiler they'll have to worry. One thing is, Canada unlike US, attracts lower quality of migrants. So, maybe that's where some of us find these stories very difficult to relate to.

IMHO, probably due to the weather. Also, I find Canadians as usually laid back. In addition, there's not much to see in Canada, except probably the Niagara falls which it shares with the US (Aurora Borealis is too far up north to visit, at least for me).

 

[flipper11]

IMHO, probably due to the weather. Also, I find Canadians as usually laid back. In addition, there's not much to see in Canada, except probably the Niagara falls which it shares with the US (Aurora Borealis is too far up north to visit, at least for me).

There are plenty of things to see in Canada if you care to explore.
We've seen most things in the East Coast...it's beautiful!!!

 

[Dr. Walden]

Respectfully, to the heritage, history, culture (multiculturalism), politicians have destroyed a generation. This is what happens when most of our government are also landlords. Including our housing minister buying two rental properties since 2021.

Stop saying anything about greed, supply, cost, salary. Yes those are important but trust me, nothing will matter so long as the politicians are also involved in the housing market.

You can harp on about everything. But unless policy changes it won't be a lasting fix or even a fix. The policy makers are part of the problems and they set the rules.

You basically need to migrate across the country to find something affordable. It's almost as far as driving from Spain to Ukraine as it is from Toronto to Calgary.

 

[lr108]

IMHO, probably due to the weather. Also, I find Canadians as usually laid back. In addition, there's not much to see in Canada, except probably the Niagara falls which it shares with the US (Aurora Borealis is too far up north to visit, at least for me).

I don't think I understand this case about not much to explore. Besides exploring Canada, one can explore US too. Vancouver & Seattle, Toronto/ Niagara & Michigan/ PA/ NY are all located in the same geographical proximity. Most cities are located close to the border so they have similar options to those living on the other side of the border.

 

[Rutherfords]

I am an immigrant architect from Toronto. I can tell from the story of the architects, this article is misleading.

I moved here from Singapore. It took me only a couple of weeks to find a well paying job as a senior architect. I didn’t have to step down the ladder.

The mistake these guys make is go to these agencies that place immigrant architects. These companies are in the business of providing cheap labour to a handful of exploitative architectural firms. That’s the reason they asked the candidates to dumb down their resumes. They only cater to those technologist and entry level positions.

I was never asked for Canadian experience, and found that my experience in Singapore allowed me to hit the ground running at my job in Toronto. I was leading projects and training interns from day 1.

Also cost of living in Dubai is not higher than that in Toronto. Another lie in the article.

Singapore is respected for its cosmopolitan culture and architecture. Unfortunately this is not the same way architects from say a city like New Delhi or Mumbai are perceived and have to jump through way many more hoops than you've stated. That said everyone's situation and pathway in Canada is different. And is usually affected a lot by the specific country you're immigrating from.

 

[bas12]

I remember when I was reading the express entry forum 5-6 years ago, everybody was extremely optimistic. People were saying don't bother looking for a job before you arrive: once you're here you can come for interviews in person, and will get a job just like that. Looks like the mood in the citizenship forum is a lot more somber.

I guess the "do your research before you immigrate" part is made difficult by the fact that we have to rely on a number of personal anecdotes to make the decision. Worst case, you ask your cousin or friend in Canada about their immigration experience plus look at some "most livable cities in the world" pages and rely on that; best case you use google to find out more and your own professional network connections to get a better idea of the local job market and what life really looks like.
I don't think there is any representative data on life in Canada that anybody collects that could be used for evidence based decision making

On the other hand, some things are hard to understand before trying them. The place may check all the boxes, but ending up not being your cup of tea. Or it might not check many of them, but will turn out great for you. So there is that

 

[lila777]

I recently met 2 people in their 20s, whose parents brought them to Canada as kids to give them a better life. One is Thai, another is from Jordan. Both now left Canada for good due to a lack of career opportunities and now live in Europe.

 

[rcincanada2019]

There are plenty of things to see in Canada if you care to explore.
We've seen most things in the East Coast...it's beautiful!!!

I don't think I understand this case about not much to explore. Besides exploring Canada, one can explore US too. Vancouver & Seattle, Toronto/ Niagara & Michigan/ PA/ NY are all located in the same geographical proximity. Most cities are located close to the border so they have similar options to those living on the other side of the border.

When I made that comment, I was trying to see from the younger generations’ eyes. I presume you both are referring to the natural beauty of the country side. Usually, when one is younger, the preference is on the “busy” and “active” life (i.e. partying). And recently, the younger one’s prefer anything that would give them more social media mileage. While Michigan/PA/NY are in close proximity, that kind of reinforces my point about “not much to see in Canada”. While they are close, they are not in Canada.

Now, if you both could be gracious enough to share tourist spots in Canada, that would be very much appreciated. Canada’s Wonderland offers nothing new from Disney World or Universal Studios. Ripley’s Aquarium in Toronto is not unique in itself. CN Tower cannot really be considered an architectural wonder, if compared to the iconic buildings in the Mid East, or the ruins of ancient Greece and Rome, or even the Great Pyramids in Egypt. Museums also pales in comparison if we’re talking about the Louvre. France has the Eiffle Tower, and the US has the Statue of Liberty. Dubai has Burj Al Khalifa and Burj Al Arab. Even central America have the Mayan temples and Chichen Itza.

At my age past 50, one of the reasons I moved here was the quiet and serene lifestyle, hence my comment about “Canadians being too laid back”. How many younger immigrants do you think would be interested in a quiet and lazy afternoon beside a lake with a fishing rod on one hand and a beer in the other?

Lest I be misconstrued again, these are just my opinions.

 

[bas12]

I recently met 2 people in their 20s, whose parents brought them to Canada as kids to give them a better life. One is Thai, another is from Jordan. Both now left Canada for good due to a lack of career opportunities and now live in Europe.

There are also people who go the other way for the same reason. Though, understandably, Europe is much larger by population, so if you have a more niche occupation, chances are probably better there.
Also, I met different people who moved From Canada to France and from France to Canada for better work life balance, and that worked out for all of them.
So, it is hard to see the whole picture from a few stories. But it looks like a few stories is all we have to go on.

What I can see in press now is that unemployment in Canada is not very high, and employers are complaining about not being able to fill the positions due to low quality of candidates. It doesn't say if they tried offering a higher salary, or investing in training their staff.