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[GandiBaat]

I am just imagining fighting for a condo and getting help at ER in 2025. JC, the infrastructure won't scale up with such an increased level of newcomers.

Disagree with infra part. I have been to Victoria General with an acquaintance for a MRI. They have lots of MRIs but too few staff to operate that. Surgeons have a 14 hours a day schedule. It’s maddening. What Canada needs is workers in critical areas. It has a lot of infra. In Vancouver island there is a ferry to connect it to mainland. They have staff shortage so they cancel it every now and then.

where Canada goes wrong is to enable people it brings. It basically ties their hands with crappy beauracqcy.

 

[Impatient Dankaroo]

Canada to welcome 500,000 new immigrants in 2025

https://www.cicnews.com/2022/11/canada-immigration-levels-plan-2023-2025-1131587.html

I mean I get that Canada needs more people but this is a crazy social experiment on a wide scale lol

Canada seems to have head-start on talent which all aging western nations (besides USA) will soon be fighting for

 

[Deleted member 1083629]

Disagree with infra part. I have been to Victoria General with an acquaintance for a MRI. They have lots of MRIs but too few staff to operate that. Surgeons have a 14 hours a day schedule. It’s maddening. What Canada needs is workers in critical areas. It has a lot of infra. In Vancouver island there is a ferry to connect it to mainland. They have staff shortage so they cancel it every now and then.

where Canada goes wrong is to enable people it brings. It basically ties their hands with crappy beauracqcy.

My guy, infra is not hardware only )) It includes people as well. The reason why there is 12-17 hours wait at ER is not because of bad hospitals or lack of those; it's because there are not enough nurses or doctors to take care of patients. So, when they will bring 500K and keep the same number of doctors, the wait times will increase and thus, "the infra won't scale up with such an increased level of newcomers".

Well, they do need to review their licensing process. Many doctors are Uber drivers in Canada. Mainly, because it will take very long time and lots of money to prove that one is able to practice medicine in Canada. This is fair, on one hand. On the other hand, something needs to be done with that, since they will literally have people dying in the lobbies. However, knowing the current government (not just liberals but also conservatives of Ontario), nothing will be done and then, **surprised Pikachu face**

 

[Deleted member 1083629]

I mean I get that Canada needs more people but this is a crazy social experiment on a wide scale lol

Canada seems to have head-start on talent which all aging western nations (besides USA) will soon be fighting for

Talent? lol. Young people are not necessarily talented )) Canada tries to bring in young people to fight the demographic crisis; whether they are talented or not, is secondary.

 

[Impatient Dankaroo]

Talent? lol. Young people are not necessarily talented )) Canada tries to bring in young people to fight the demographic crisis; whether they are talented or not, is secondary.

I guess, the govt. is a throwing a fishing net in the sea. Some will be 'real talent', others will be min wage workers. Regardless, they will all help in one way or another. Canadians are old and not particularly productive and the immigrants will basically be funding their social services

 

[Deleted member 1083629]

I guess, the govt. is a throwing a fishing net in the sea. Some will be 'real talent', others will be min wage workers. Regardless, they will all help in one way or another. Canadians are old and not particularly productive and the immigrants will basically be funding their social services

You know what your last sentence reminded me? The movie "Elysium" with Matt Damon. How poor people live to support the rich ones living in Elysium lol.

 

[GandiBaat]

My guy, infra is not hardware only )) It includes people as well. The reason why there is 12-17 hours wait at ER is not because of bad hospitals or lack of those; it's because there are not enough nurses or doctors to take care of patients. So, when they will bring 500K and keep the same number of doctors, the wait times will increase and thus, "the infra won't scale up with such an increased level of newcomers".

Just one things. Those 500K are mostly young people. Much less likely to fall sick or need long term care or frequent ER visits. And they include people who can take up jobs of nurses (if red tape is cut). It also includes doctors who need to get their license and residency (again a red tape thing). So bringing in those 500K young workers is not wrong, you can tweak the composition.

What is wrong is having hurdles that disables most of these folks. It disables them from joining the work they trained for and take up survival jobs.

 

[ck_ca_ee]

what's the best way to get ircc on the phone from outside Canada?

 

[Deleted member 1083629]

Just one things. Those 500K are mostly young people. Much less likely to fall sick or need long term care or frequent ER visits. And they include people who can take up jobs of nurses (if red tape is cut). It also includes doctors who need to get their license and residency (again a red tape thing). So bringing in those 500K young workers is not wrong, you can tweak the composition.

What is wrong is having hurdles that disables most of these folks. It disables them from joining the work they trained for and take up survival jobs.

I mean, getting into ER is not linked to the age. Young people at the same risk but for different circumstances. For example, me. I used to be a kickboxer. Amount of times I had to go to ER in Moscow because of various injuries was pretty high. In Canada, you can replace kickboxing with snowboarding or crossfit, for example. So, young people is at the risk of needing a long term care but I would say, they are at the higher risk due to the active lifestyle.

Yes, of course. I agree about the red tape. My point is that I don't think that will change. Ontario had some talks about changing the licensing procedure for foreign medical professionals but I don't think it got anywhere.

 

[Deleted member 1083629]

what's the best way to get ircc on the phone from outside Canada?

TextNow. This is what I used. I think I got to an agent 2 times in total for the period of 18 months.

 

[ck_ca_ee]

TextNow. This is what I used. I think I got to an agent 2 times in total for the period of 18 months.

thanks!!, do you have the number ?

 

[GandiBaat]

Well, they do need to review their licensing process. Many doctors are Uber drivers in Canada. Mainly, because it will take very long time and lots of money to prove that one is able to practice medicine in Canada. This is fair, on one hand. On the other hand, something needs to be done with that, since they will literally have people dying in the lobbies. However, knowing the current government (not just liberals but also conservatives of Ontario), nothing will be done and then, **surprised Pikachu face**

During last two year, MANY MANY doctors closed their clinics. MANY MANY nurses quit due to the workload and emotional toll. These folks already have some money and they do not want to enter the same rat race again. You need to replace them. Somehow. Getting young people is a good starting point. Getting needed talent is much better.

Now lets see some numbers.

1. Canada Deaths per year : 323000 for 2021-22 (https://www.statista.com/statistics/443061/number-of-deaths-in-canada/)
2. Canada Births per year : 10.148 per 1000 people (https://www.macrotrends.net/countries/CAN/canada/birth-rate) = 38,250,000 * 10.148/1000 = 388161.0

So only some 388161 - 323000 = 65161 in growth

For a country of 38 million and massive amount of land and natural resources if only some 65K are growing in one year, it needs fixing.

Because this does not even take into account people who want to retire or who can not work anymore.

This is why 500K is needed. To counteract this shrap decline.

For a baseline look at year 2019. 10.376 briths per 1000 and only 283K deaths. That gives a 390K births (on a population of 37.6M). This is already 50K more people added than 2021.

The entire unsustainable trope is nothing but a farce. If Canada's birth rate keeps declining this is the only solution.

 

[Deleted member 1083629]

thanks!!, do you have the number ?

Were you banned in Google?

 

[Deleted member 1083629]

During last two year, MANY MANY doctors closed their clinics. MANY MANY nurses quit due to the workload and emotional toll. These folks already have some money and they do not want to enter the same rat race again. You need to replace them. Somehow. Getting young people is a good starting point. Getting needed talent is much better.

Now lets see some numbers.

1. Canada Deaths per year : 323000 for 2021-22 (https://www.statista.com/statistics/443061/number-of-deaths-in-canada/)
2. Canada Births per year : 10.148 per 1000 people (https://www.macrotrends.net/countries/CAN/canada/birth-rate) = 38,250,000 * 10.148/1000 = 388161.0

So only some 388161 - 323000 = 65161 in growth

For a country of 38 million and massive amount of land and natural resources if only some 65K are growing in one year, it needs fixing.

Because this does not even take into account people who want to retire or who can not work anymore.

This is why 500K is needed. To counteract this shrap decline.

For a baseline look at year 2019. 10.376 briths per 1000 and only 283K deaths. That gives a 390K births (on a population of 37.6M). This is already 50K more people added than 2021.

The entire unsustainable trope is nothing but a farce. If Canada's birth rate keeps declining this is the only solution.

Are you using the profession with the toughest licensing process to support your argument? When you say that 500K immigrants are needed to replace those doctors/nurses, are you taking in consideration how many of them WILL ACTUALLY become doctors and nurses in Canada? I don't think that many will. For every other profession, I can partially agree; the partially is due to the fact that Canadian market just doesn't pay enough. For many, Canada is a temporary stop before they head down the south for some major salary hike.

Regardless, as I have mentioned before, 500K is not sustainable rate without scaling up everything else. I can see that Canadian government is not scaling up or reworking other parts of the process; just keep pumping those numbers up. That won't end well. Before inviting 500K people: 1) Need enough medical professionals (need to rework the licensing); 2) Need to have affordable housing (ban private equality and massive foreign investments).

 

[GandiBaat]

Are you using the profession with the toughest licensing process to support your argument? When you say that 500K immigrants are needed to replace those doctors/nurses, are you taking in consideration how many of them WILL ACTUALLY become doctors and nurses in Canada? I don't think that many will. For every other profession, I can partially agree; the partially is due to the fact that Canadian market just doesn't pay enough. For many, Canada is a temporary stop before they head down the south for some major salary hike.

I am saying this much : "IF birthrate is going to decline and death rate is going to climb, you will NEED to increase your immigration target. There is NO way out. This is why 500K is not a wrong target. If you don't do it, your long term population goals will be impacted. You workforce and economy will be impacted."

Doctors are just a side effect of this phenomenon. It is exerbated by the fact that there is USA down south and Canadian beaurocracy is too complex to work with for any immigrant doctor.