Wife & Children are Citizens or eligible, forms needed? Visitor status?

[DHAWK]

Hi. My name is Dave. I'm from the USA. My wife, Canadian, became a US citizen as well. Before doing so, not that it matters, we had four children in the States. All of which are US citizens, but eligible for Canadian citizenship. 2 already have, 2 are in process.

Now, I am currently considering becoming a Canadian myself. We are visiting family in BC and we love it!
I've noticed there are an indefinite number of forms.

I'm guessing we go with Family Class Sponsorship.
My children are dependents under 18.
I've seen that the sponsoring spouse fills out forms along with the applying spouse.
But isn't the status of my Canadian/near Canadian children a non issue?

Are there any forms I'm likely to need because of the 5 to 1 ratio of Canadians in my immediate family?

And, is it possible for my current visitor status to be rejected if I apply for PR and then CIT from within Canada?

Would it be better to apply from without?

 

[screech339]

Just curious here. Since your wife became US citizen, isn't it a requirement that your wife renounce her Canadian citizenship in order to get her American citizenship?

Only time US accept dual citizenship is if the children were born dual citizen. Actually US only recognize US citizen only despite being dual. So an American can become dual if American became naturalized Canadian. However Canadian cannot become dual if Canadian became American as requirement of being Naturalized American is to renounce any other citizenship.

Screech339

 

[Sweden]

Hi. My name is Dave. I'm from the USA. My wife, Canadian, became a US citizen as well. Before doing so, not that it matters, we had four children in the States. All of which are US citizens, but eligible for Canadian citizenship. 2 already have, 2 are in process.

Now, I am currently considering becoming a Canadian myself. We are visiting family in BC and we love it!
I've noticed there are an indefinite number of forms.

I'm guessing we go with Family Class Sponsorship.
My children are dependents under 18.
I've seen that the sponsoring spouse fills out forms along with the applying spouse.
But isn't the status of my Canadian/near Canadian children a non issue?

Are there any forms I'm likely to need because of the 5 to 1 ratio of Canadians in my immediate family?

And, is it possible for my current visitor status to be rejected if I apply for PR and then CIT from within Canada?

Would it be better to apply from without?

go for family sponsorship, and choose outland. It's faster than inland, and as a US citizen, you have nothing to gain from applying inland.
Your children are dependent for the "family information" form, but not as dependent to be sponsored, as they are already Canadians. Their status is not an issue, once you get their proof of citizenship, just include that in your application.

There is no extra form needed (because of the 5 to 1 ratio as you say!).

You could start the application when still living in the US as outland, and then either wait before you move, or go with your family. YOur visitor visa will likely not be an issue, IF you don't show up with a Uhaul at the border, and if you've never had issues at the border before. There are quite a few visa exempt applicants that come in to Canada to wait the PR out and stay on a tourist/visitor visa without issue. If your visa expires before the PR is issued, just make sure that you ask for an extension before it expires, it should be granted without much issues.

Good luck,
Sweden

 

[keesio]

Just curious here. Since your wife became US citizen, isn't it a requirement that your wife renounce her Canadian citizenship in order to get her American citizenship?

Only time US accept dual citizenship is if the children were born dual citizen. Actually US only recognize US citizen only despite being dual. So an American can become dual if American became naturalized Canadian. However Canadian cannot become dual if Canadian became American as requirement of being Naturalized American is to renounce any other citizenship.

Screech339

Actually if you become a US citizenship via naturalization, you can keep your other citizenship and be dual. It is the reverse - a US citizen who applies for another citizenship, that may lose their US citizenship. But again, the person would need to explicitly renounce their US citizenship for that to happen.

http://travel.state.gov/travel/cis_pa_tw/cis/cis_1753.html

 

[screech339]

Actually if you become a US citizenship via naturalization, you can keep your other citizenship and be dual. It is the reverse - a US citizen who applies for another citizenship, that may lose their US citizenship. But again, the person would need to explicitly renounce their US citizenship for that to happen.

http://travel.state.gov/travel/cis_pa_tw/cis/cis_1753.html

Isn't part of swearing in front of judge part of becoming a US citizen say that you renounce other citizenship.

The link you provided only mention dual citizenship by birth or by law. Not by choice. So the link you provided does not cover those who acquire American citizenship by choice.

I have come across naturalized US citizens and they told me they had to choose US citizen or their own Foreign citizenship. Naturalized US children get to keep dual until 18 years old. Once they turn 18 they have a choice. Their own foreign citizenship or US citizenship. Cannot get to keep dual.

Screech339

 

[DHAWK]

Thanks everyone.
I'm already here, though, on visitor status. It's been a bit dodgy with the border folks. They don't like my answers, but since I've got my kids with me, they let me through. Hope to stay.

So being here, I could still apply outland, through, right? Nobody really cares?

How much of my application must go together at the same time? Is that the best and wisest way to do it for speed?
Photos, of course.
But I have two kids that still need to get processed as citizens. Wait for that, or apply as soon as possible, even if it happens in parts?

And fingerprinting that needs to be taken care of (from my home country, which I can't enter currently - complex)
And a medical exam.

All this needs to go together?

 

[Alurra71]

I think they here is the statement with the key word as INTENTION

In order to lose U.S. citizenship, the law requires that the person must apply for the foreign citizenship voluntarily, by free choice, and with the intention to give up U.S. citizenship

The US does not require you to 'renounce' your citizenship to another country, however you COULD loose your citizenship to the US by using 'intent'.

A person wishing to renounce his or her U.S. citizenship must voluntarily and with intent to relinquish U.S. citizenship:

appear in person before a U.S. consular or diplomatic officer,
in a foreign country (normally at a U.S. Embassy or Consulate); and
sign an oath of renunciation

While the US doesn't readily encourage you to become dual, you can usually become dual with their interference and without having to renounce or relinquish your US citizenship so long as you don't like accept a citizenship to say Iraq or some other warring known terrorist area.

So, in short, yes you can keep and will continue to keep your US citizenship if you apply to become a Canadian Citizen.

Each country does vary, so if you wish to do this with another countries citizenship, check the rules on dual citizenship for that country.

 

[Alurra71]

Thanks everyone.
I'm already here, though, on visitor status. It's been a bit dodgy with the border folks. They don't like my answers, but since I've got my kids with me, they let me through. Hope to stay.

So being here, I could still apply outland, through, right? Nobody really cares?

How much of my application must go together at the same time? Is that the best and wisest way to do it for speed?
Photos, of course.
But I have two kids that still need to get processed as citizens. Wait for that, or apply as soon as possible, even if it happens in parts?

And fingerprinting that needs to be taken care of (from my home country, which I can't enter currently - complex)
And a medical exam.

All this needs to go together?

It does not matter if you apply INLAND or OUTLAND. You can stay inside Canada while they process. However, I would get a visitor record to avoid the hassle or potential for confrontation. You will need to show proof of each childs citizenship, so if they are on a temporary Canadian Passport, they should suffice for doing the paperwork.

ALL parts of the application MUST go together, sponsors and applicants. Because your children are canadian citizens, you are the only applicant, your wife would be the sponsor.

You can get your fingerprints done in Canada and send them to the FBI to get your PCC. You can also do your medical from within Canada at a panel approved physician.

Is there a criminality issue for you? Is that why you are having a hard time and can not enter into your own country?

 

[keesio]

Isn't part of swearing in front of judge part of becoming a US citizen say that you renounce other citizenship.

The link you provided only mention dual citizenship by birth or by law. Not by choice. So the link you provided does not cover those who acquire American citizenship by choice.

I have come across naturalized US citizens and they told me they had to choose US citizen or their own Foreign citizenship. Naturalized US children get to keep dual until 18 years old. Once they turn 18 they have a choice. Their own foreign citizenship or US citizenship. Cannot get to keep dual.

Screech339

"a person naturalized as a U.S. citizen may not lose the citizenship of the country of birth. "

I interpreted the above as meaning if you become a naturalized US citizen, you don't lose your current citizenship.

Anyway there are tons of Canadians who moved to the US and obtained US citizenship and remain dual. Michael J Fox, Jim Carrey, Pamela Anderson, Jason Priestley, etc...

 

[DHAWK]

It does not matter if you apply INLAND or OUTLAND. You can stay inside Canada while they process. However, I would get a visitor record to avoid the hassle or potential for confrontation. You will need to show proof of each childs citizenship, so if they are on a temporary Canadian Passport, they should suffice for doing the paperwork.

ALL parts of the application MUST go together, sponsors and applicants. Because your children are canadian citizens, you are the only applicant, your wife would be the sponsor.

You can get your fingerprints done in Canada and send them to the FBI to get your PCC. You can also do your medical from within Canada at a panel approved physician.

Is there a criminality issue for you? Is that why you are having a hard time and can not enter into your own country?

Thank you for the info.
What does PCC mean?

Criminality is not an issue. The issue is unemployment and homelessness. We were in an African country, doing "relief" work. The government flipped out and we evacuated, leaving everything behind. We arrived in the States and our current employer at the time finished out our contract, but we were still homeless. So we crossed the border to visit relatives and ended up hitting a streak of unemployment. So, when the border guards find out that I don't have a US address from which I am "visiting" they're pretty pissed about it. Border guards told me to get my visitor status renewed until I had a place to live in the States. Otherwise, I cross the border and I don't get back in.

 

[DHAWK]

Also, does anyone really recommend using a "representative"?
(Need form 5476)
Or is it expensive enough as it is?

 

[Alurra71]

If you have visitor status now yes keep it renewed and valid.

PCC is your FBI certicate. You will need that as well as certificates from any other countries you have lived in for 6 months or more since turning 18.

Don't use a representative it is not worth the cost.

 

[screech339]

I think they here is the statement with the key word as INTENTION

The US does not require you to 'renounce' your citizenship to another country, however you COULD loose your citizenship to the US by using 'intent'.

While the US doesn't readily encourage you to become dual, you can usually become dual with their interference and without having to renounce or relinquish your US citizenship so long as you don't like accept a citizenship to say Iraq or some other warring known terrorist area.

So, in short, yes you can keep and will continue to keep your US citizenship if you apply to become a Canadian Citizen.

Each country does vary, so if you wish to do this with another countries citizenship, check the rules on dual citizenship for that country.

You seems to be confusing me with renunciation of US citizenship.

I'm not talking about losing US citizenship. I'm talking about the wife losing her Canadian citizenship when she became US citizen since she volunteerly became US citizen by choice. So in theory, depending on when she become US citizen, her children cannot get canadian citizen. If she had the children before becoming US citizen, then the children are canadian at time of birth since the wife is canadian at the time. If she had children after she became US citizen, it may be an issue for the children as she is not Canadian when children came along.

Screech339

 

[margobear96]

You seems to be confusing me with renunciation of US citizenship.

I'm not talking about losing US citizenship. I'm talking about the wife losing her Canadian citizenship when she became US citizen since she volunteerly became US citizen by choice. So in theory, depending on when she become US citizen, her children cannot get canadian citizen. If she had the children before becoming US citizen, then the children are canadian at time of birth since the wife is canadian at the time. If she had children after she became US citizen, it may be an issue for the children as she is not Canadian when children came along.

Screech339

I think you're operating on old information. I had classmates in high school who were born in Canada in the '70s, naturalized in the US as minors and had to choose which citizenship when they turned 18. However, Canada currently allows dual citizenship, including for its citizens who naturalize in a second country. Anyway, two of OP's kids (presumably the older ones) already have their citizenship certificates -- CIC has already made the determination that the wife was a Canadian citizen when they were born.

Also, the oath you take upon getting US citizenship isn't interpreted to mean that you're giving up prior citizenship(s)...just that if there is ever any conflict, your allegiance is to the US first.

 

[Alurra71]

You seems to be confusing me with renunciation of US citizenship.

I'm not talking about losing US citizenship. I'm talking about the wife losing her Canadian citizenship when she became US citizen since she volunteerly became US citizen by choice. So in theory, depending on when she become US citizen, her children cannot get canadian citizen. If she had the children before becoming US citizen, then the children are canadian at time of birth since the wife is canadian at the time. If she had children after she became US citizen, it may be an issue for the children as she is not Canadian when children came along.

Screech339

Canada operates much like the US, Screech. Should not be an issue.