When to have medical exam

[Zake424]

I'm an American married to a Canadian. We will be filing the PR application and sponsorship forms in the next couple of weeks. I called to make an appointment with the Canadian Panel approved physician here where I live. However, the doctors office said they file their report electronically with Canadian Immigration so they need my UCI #. I told them that I thought I was suppose to do the medical before filing the PR application so I don't have the UCI # (or whatever its called). Do I just go ahead and do the medical, put a note in with my application that I had the medicals done and then have the doctor's office send my report electronically once I receive my UCI #?

 

[bladeguard]

Hi there.. what the medical officers or physicians told you was true.. that they need the email from the Canadian Embassy (Where your application will be processed) inorder for them to proceed or conduct the examination. This email is actually a request letter for medical examination, containing information about the applicant who will undergo medical examination, which includes the Unique Client Identification number (UCI) which the immigration or visa office assigned to certain applicant (the one being sponsored) once they received the spousal sponsorship application. Normally, visa office requires the need to submit the medical examination result from the embassy approved panel of physicians once the complete assessment of an application (including background checks) has been done by the immigration officers. A medical and security clearances, most of the time and on general immigrant visa processing procedures are the federal requirements needed by the visa officer prior to issuance of Immigrant Visa. ;-) Wishing you the best of luck!!!

 

[TZCanada15]

You are able to do a medical prior to your application being sent it called an upfront medical (this is without a UCI).

If the doctor works with the eMedical electronic system:

they will give you an up-front medical notification printout.
If the doctor works with a paper system:

they will give you a copy of the IMM 1017B Upfront Medical Report form.
You must attach that form to your application before you submit it to the visa office. If you apply online, you must upload that form before you can submit your application.

 

[wowsers]

What TZ Canada says is correct. Ignore what Bladeguard states: that advice is not correct. Some doctors on the panel and their staff completely misunderstand the system and perpetuate myths about it. Tell them that they are wrong! You do not need an UCI for the medical. You will get that at a much later stage. You simply book the medical, take along to the examination the information which CIC requires you to take (identification, photographs, money etc) and get the medical done. You may not need the photographs because the panel doctor may take the photograph himself on a digital camera and incorporate it in your documentation, but take the photographs with you nevertheless. The medical report incorporates its own barcode which will be sufficient to identify you in the process from then on. At the end of the medical you will be handed a sheet of paper, the first page of the medical exam record. That incorporates the barcode. When you send off your application to CIC you include that sheet in your bundle of application forms. That will enable CIC in due course to marry up your application with the medical report. The doctor sends off the medical report, not you; he will not give a copy of that to you. That is all that is needed. You do not need an email from the Canadian Embassy!

 

[Zake424]

Thanks for the replies ;D The panel physician's office said they take the digital photograph of me. I'm going to book my appointment so we can get our applications filed in two weeks.

 

[BrianDell]

"Some doctors on the panel and their staff completely misunderstand the system and perpetuate myths about it."

Based on my actual experience I've come to the conclusion that most Panel Physicians in fact understand the system quite well and it's in fact posters to online forums who "perpetuate myths" like Mississauga will send the application back if the medical wasn't done in advance.

I now think that one could just as well wait until until one's passport is requested (if one is from a country needing a visa) since the visa office will likely request the medical earlier (based on a preliminary check for missing elements that is done before the file substantively goes "in progress") OR absolute latest you'd be asked for the medical at the same time as the passport and if they are waiting for the one anyway they could just as well be waiting for both.

I've heard some talk about how one might be delayed by a BFD (bring forward date) but 1) you're gonna get a BFD anyway when the passport is requested and 2) this thread http://www.canadavisa.com/canada-immigration-discussion-board/-t39705.0.html clearly says that a file will be looked at BEFORE the BFD if what's requested comes in earlier: "If something like reports, results, documents etc. comes to the CHC in between, your file gets opened and assessed." So if that's right then a BFD doesn't create a delay anyway because the BFD gets ignored if what's requested comes in before the BFD.

Anyone anxious about getting a medical in before requested by an overseas visa office should be equally anxious about submitting their passport in advance of it being requested since there is no evidence that the two don't operate similarly in terms of creating a delay (or not).

 

[Majromax]

Based on my actual experience I've come to the conclusion that most Panel Physicians in fact understand the system quite well and it's in fact posters to online forums who "perpetuate myths" like Mississauga will send the application back if the medical wasn't done in advance.

In my particular case, I've noticed that panel physicians are not always the most diligent about parsing the specific immigration stream. When I underwent medicals, I first tried to book an appointment for a medical for permanent residence, but the office was clear that I had to do it for sponsorship (emphasis original) to do the upfront medical. Since some streams request an upfront medical and some tell the applicant to wait for CIC to request one, it is easy for language to be ambiguous.

I now think that one could just as well wait until until one's passport is requested (if one is from a country needing a visa) since the visa office will likely request the medical earlier (based on a preliminary check for missing elements that is done before the file substantively goes "in progress") OR absolute latest you'd be asked for the medical at the same time as the passport and if they are waiting for the one anyway they could just as well be waiting for both.

Is there any record of applicants who have had their first medical exam requested concurrently with the passport?

As I understand it, a decision cannot be made when a file is still subject to medical checks. For visa offices that request the passport for stamping at the end of the process, the visa request will not be issued until the remainder of the file is complete. Although spouses are not subject to medical inadmissibility for undue-burden grounds, applicants still must not be a danger to public safety -- the medical check is more than trivial, which means it does take time to complete.

Besides, you're making considerable assumptions that the visa office will begin processing an incomplete application. This may be true and would be true in an ideal world, but I see no policy rule stating that the office must do this. A busy office may choose to not begin processing a file at all until it is complete, so as to save scarce resources for those applications that can indeed be finalized.

I've heard some talk about how one might be delayed by a BFD (bring forward date) but 1) you're gonna get a BFD anyway when the passport is requested

Better one point of possible delay rather than two, all things equal.

and 2) this thread http://www.canadavisa.com/canada-immigration-discussion-board/-t39705.0.html clearly says that a file will be looked at BEFORE the BFD if what's requested comes in earlier: "If something like reports, results, documents etc. comes to the CHC in between, your file gets opened and assessed." So if that's right then a BFD doesn't create a delay anyway because the BFD gets ignored if what's requested comes in before the BFD.

Notice a followup comment of the source being "me," based on experience.

I will entirely believe that visa offices have the discretion to process a file before a bring-forward date. However, I again see no authoritative evidence that they must do so. Anecdotally, a number of users here have reported movement on their files only after the bring forward date even with an early submission of requested documents. Medical exams would also be different than ordinary document requests such as relationship proof, since medical exams are assessed by dedicated staff, who presumably have their own queues to work through.

Anyone anxious about getting a medical in before requested by an overseas visa office should be equally anxious about submitting their passport in advance of it being requested since there is no evidence that the two don't operate similarly in terms of creating a delay (or not).

And this is where I admit confusion. Instruction guides clearly tell outland applicants to submit an upfront medical. Mississauga reminds applicants upon sponsorship approval to complete an upfront medical. Saying "nah, you don't have to do the upfront medical" seems as silly as the derided advice in your linked thread to wait until the expiry of a document deadline to submit anything.

In the worst case, submitting an upfront medical does not delay an application; in the best case it can prevent delays. The balance of convenience suggests following directions.

 

[BrianDell]

"... the office was clear that I had to do it for sponsorship (emphasis original) to do the upfront medical."

And I believe the office was absolutely correct that if you want to do an upfront immigration medical you must be family class and not some other class. Not sure what your contention is here. Mine is simply that these Panel Physicians have more experience with filing medicals with CIC than applicants do and it accordingly requires a large assumption to conclude that any given applicant knows better than the Panel Physician does concerning what CIC is looking for and when.

"Is there any record of applicants who have had their first medical exam requested concurrently with the passport?"

Is there any record of an applicant who was delayed by waiting until the medical was requested by the overseas visa office? That's the relevant question here. It's entirely possible that a medical will always be requested before a passport but I don't see why that would necessarily entail any delays. My point was that the only way to go through the process free of all requests is to submit the passport in advance of request as well such that if it is a no no to wait for an overseas visa office request, presumably that advice would apply all around. For what it's worth, there are records of applicants being requested to submit documents prior to going "in progress", never mind "decision made," such that one could just as easily speculate that there is a round of preliminary inspection for document completion that is done well before document examination as speculate that a passport will not be requested prior to receiving medical results. And a passport request is no guarantee of visa issuance.

"A busy office may choose to not begin processing a file at all until it is complete"

This is a statement of the issue at hand as opposed to a definitive resolution of that issue. We know that an overseas office will begin processing a file without a passport. We also know that Mississauga will approve a sponsor despite the absence of an up-front medical form. We can state our opinions as much as we like but what would resolve the issue would be an actual report from someone saying they found evidence that they were delayed by virtue of waiting for the medical to be requested, and even then, I've got pretty good evidence my case was delayed by waiting for the passport to be requested instead of sending the passport in in advance of formal request for it (it's been "Decision Made" for weeks now such that it appears that examination of the documents has been completed and had the passport been there when that examination was complete they would have dealt with the passport as part of the examination), such that it's not clear why the medical should deserve a reputation as a notorious delayer to the exclusion of other requested materials.

"Anecdotally, a number of users here have reported movement on their files only after the bring forward date even with an early submission of requested documents."

This is something I suspect is true, but if you look at that thread about BFDs that I linked to, the community seems to think the original post in that thread is authoritative and it clearly said "no" to the question of whether visa offices wait until the BFD to look again at a file despite requested documents coming in prior to the BFD. Which in turn means that the conventional opinion one finds on internet forums is not necessarily authoritative.

In any case, again, a passport request would have the same problem (an associated BFD) such that it's not clear why there should be anxiety about submitting medical results submitted in advance of overseas visa office request and not about passports.

"Instruction guides clearly tell outland applicants to submit an upfront medical."

I don't agree, the CIC website says family class applicants have a choice, but I've argued about this before in other threads here so it's hardly necessary to go over that again. Bottom line is there's no record of Mississauga sending a file back as incomplete because an upfront medical wasn't done in advance of submission.

The actual data, as opposed to opinion, suggests that the balance of convenience is AGAINST doing the medical prior to submitting one's application to Mississauga, since there are many many reports of applicants having to re-do expired medicals and zero reports of someone having been delayed by waiting until at least sponsorship approval before doing the medical.

 

[BrianDell]

I'll make one more comment here, because I think it is concerns what could be a critical choke point in terms of delays:

"Medical exams would also be different than ordinary document requests such as relationship proof, since medical exams are assessed by dedicated staff, who presumably have their own queues to work through."

I see this as a PLUS, not a minus. Why? Because for other document requests there is good reason to believe that after the document has been received, it can ONLY be assessed by ONE individual, namely, whichever individual was assigned primary responsibility for making a decision on the application. If, for example, a passport was requested, if it has to be checked for consistency with the rest of the application (e.g. travel history), who's going to do that check? I would think it's highly likely that it'll be the same person who is responsible for assessing the veracity of the claims in the application. Another case officer would have to get up to speed on the application before being in a position to assess the requested document(s) in context and that would surely be seen as doubling up on the work from CIC's perspective. So it is that if a requested document comes back and the visa officer working your file has just left for his annual 4 week vacation back in Canada, well, there's nothing you can do but wait for that individual's return. With medical exam results, there may be more than one staff assigned to reviewing exams (a review that common sense says could be done in a single sitting as opposed to having to return to it day after day) and even if only one, there's a reasonable chance there would be a substitute should the principle reviewer be out of the office for an extended period of time. In any case, whoever is reviewing the medical results could be completely ignorant of the particulars in the rest of the application and so you don't have the single individual choke point that you do with other document submissions (like additional relationship proof).

EDITED 23 July:
I've just learned that in at least one scenario (mainland China applicants), decisions are made at one visa office (such as Hong Kong) but requested documents (such as passport) may go to another office (such as Beijing).