I
iarblue
Guest
Catholic does not recgonize a civil marriage as a real marriage since when??????This must be new.
R
rosieposie
Guest
between two baptized Catholics it's an invalid marriage, for all others it's recognized as valid by the Church. I'm not trying to argue about religion, just explaining the reasons concerning my situation.iarblue said:
Your options are pretty clear in my opinion (which is all this is).
If you want to be married, get married - Immigration and the rest of the civil world is going to acknowledge it so you may as well also. If you are married and don't acknowledge it then you are asking for skepticism and increased interrogation as this is a process built to sniff out the guilty.
If you aren't ready to be married, then you had best wait and ride the process out like the rest of us. Unfortunately there isn't any "great" way to get around the system.
If you are prepared to compromise your beliefs to get a desired outcome then you should be prepared for the questions and comments that come along with it.
Good luck either way.
If you want to be married, get married - Immigration and the rest of the civil world is going to acknowledge it so you may as well also. If you are married and don't acknowledge it then you are asking for skepticism and increased interrogation as this is a process built to sniff out the guilty.
If you aren't ready to be married, then you had best wait and ride the process out like the rest of us. Unfortunately there isn't any "great" way to get around the system.
If you are prepared to compromise your beliefs to get a desired outcome then you should be prepared for the questions and comments that come along with it.
Good luck either way.
I was raised Catholic and can see both sides.rosieposie said:
However why not just get married. Otherwise Catholic and non-Catholic will see this as fraud.
Plenty of spouses on these forums get married then spend months and some years waiting for immigration.
I
iarblue
Guest
Its not the marriage i dont really care about religion or what your beliefs are you asked if lying to the border would be a problem and you were only getting married for the immigration purpose thats what the problem is.Because you feel that your civil marriage is not a true marriage tell that to immigration.
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rosieposie
Guest
Just to clarify, it's not fraudulent to be married civily, start the PR process, tell Immigration authorities at the airport the truth, then move to Canada legally after being approved and then having a religious ceremony ?sogwap said:
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iarblue
Guest
No were just telling you tell the truth.When you arrive at the border you are married on the PR process you are married,if and when approved if you have a church wedding cograts.
The only thing that upsets people here is we are all trying hard very hard to be with our spouse got married however to prove we loved eachother and then you say you are only doing it for immigration purposes,and are not going to live with eachother and not consider eachother a spouse.
All we can says is do as you like and suffer the concequences of your actions.
Best of Luck
The only thing that upsets people here is we are all trying hard very hard to be with our spouse got married however to prove we loved eachother and then you say you are only doing it for immigration purposes,and are not going to live with eachother and not consider eachother a spouse.
All we can says is do as you like and suffer the concequences of your actions.
Best of Luck
R
rosieposie
Guest
perhaps I was not clear. We love eachother and will be living together as husband and wife when we areiarblue said:
married in our Church. We are doing the civil
marriage so when we are
married in the Church I can hopefully be approved by then and can legally live with him in Canada.
rosieposie said:
The issue I believe that everyone is having with this is that you asked if it was a good idea to lie to the immigration officer when crossing back and forth over the border.
I don't know about anyone else but I see a conflict of value when someone says that they can't do something they view as immoral because of their religion but they are willing to do something else that could be considered immoral, in order to justify what they want to accomplish.
It isn't fraudulent to get married (if you are a real couple who wants to be married) and then tell immigration that you are married and then down the road have another ceremony - lots of couples do it.
If you start lying and telling elaborate stories, then your credibility disappears, even when you are telling the truth and then you will have bigger problems.
R
rosieposie
Guest
fallenstar831
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Your IO is going to smell something is up from a mile away with this one.
The IO will not recognize a marriage if you don't... good luck to you both with the appeal process when you get there.
The IO will not recognize a marriage if you don't... good luck to you both with the appeal process when you get there.
Maybe the best person to ask about what to say when asked would be your priest. Although we can give you our opinion on what we think the IO might say or do or believe, your priest can answer whether or not it would be a lie to say you aren't married if you are married only by civil ceremony. My guess is that he would still suggest that you are married, even if you aren't married by the church. I don't know, as I am not Catholic.rosieposie said:
First off, I understand that you may not see a civil marriage as valid due to religious beliefs, but a civil marriage is one that is recognized by the law.rosieposie said:
Second, you should know that a lot of people get married legally, get the PR process started, then have a wedding/service/party afterwards when they are in a more stable situation. How much importance you wish to put on this is completely up to you.
Third, it is never a good idea to lie to an IO. They have your passport information and whatever comments or memos the IO may have attached to it, and Immigrations can bring up your file anytime they feel the need to. Also, if you lie to them now then you'll have to fabricate the majority of your PR application as well, and a small mistake or oversight on your part can raise red flags and end badly. Why take the risk?
My suggestion would be to get married civilly, start the paperwork ASAP, and when you are visiting Canada make sure you have sufficient proof that you will return to the US before your visitor's visa is expired. Most IOs would understand that you cannot be together in Canada because you cannot work legally in Canada yet (or whatever reason), but you still want to be together and see each other as often as possible. This is the situation for many outland applications. You can tell the IO at the border that you are going to see your husband, because if you are married civilly (legally) then he is your husband. I understand that, due to religious beliefs, you may not feel comfortable referring to him as your "husband" before your church ceremony, but that is something you'll have to work out.
On a side note, I'm really surprised by the negative answers to this post. When I read the initial post I didn't think the writer was talking about a marriage of convenience, just that her (and her partner's) idea of a valid marriage differed from most people's and she was unsure of how to explain her situation to the IO at the border (Immigrations *has* been known to be unaccomodating to personal cases at times). Maybe she just wanted some advice on how to get into Canada to see her fiance with the least amount of trouble. Isn't that what we're all trying to do? I'm not going to say it was the most well-worded question, but I think people are focusing too much on the wrong point here.
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iarblue
Guest
My Canadian fiance and I(American) will be getting married civily for the sole purpose of starting the immigration process, but won't marry in our Church for another year. Due to our beliefs, neither of us recognize the civil marriage as valid, will be getting married civily for the sole purpose of starting the immigration process,etc. When we travel to and from the US and Canada should we tell customs at the airport we are married? I don't want them to refuse me entrance if I have to say I am going to visit my husband. Will Canada easily be able to find out we are civily married in the US? Will Canada easily be able to find out we are civily married in the US? I'm afraid they will turn me or him away for fear of staying illegally? Or will sufficient proof of my ties to the US be satisfactory(I can have my boss write a letter saying I am employed with him, US address, etc) Any advice? Thanks!
will be getting married civily for the sole purpose of starting the immigration process
will be getting married civily for the sole purpose of starting the immigration process
When we travel to and from the US and Canada should we tell customs at the airport we are married?
Will Canada easily be able to find out we are civily married in the US
Will Canada easily be able to find out we are civily married in the US
there i broke it down for you its fraud the easiest way is tell the truth
will be getting married civily for the sole purpose of starting the immigration process
will be getting married civily for the sole purpose of starting the immigration process
When we travel to and from the US and Canada should we tell customs at the airport we are married?
Will Canada easily be able to find out we are civily married in the US
Will Canada easily be able to find out we are civily married in the US
there i broke it down for you its fraud the easiest way is tell the truth
Like I said, it wasn't the most well-worded question, but I can understand where she is coming from.
My husband and I, to put it plainly, got "married civilly for the sole purpose of starting the immigration process." We got married so we could start the paperwork and, once approved, live together in Canada without having to worry about a visa expiring or not having an offer of employment. This does not mean that our relationship isn't genuine. Neither one of us believe the concept of marriage (as seen by society today) to be sacred or even important. Look at all the unhappy "married" couples and the current divorce rate. The important thing is for us to be together and do the things we want to do in life together. To us, marriage is nothing more than a piece of paper that states you made a social contract, and one that can be broken very easily at that. We had both discussed our feelings on the matter in great detail for several years before we decided we wanted to spend the rest of our lives together. To make this happen, we decided the easiest way would be to jump through Immigration's hoops and apply for PR under the spouse category (we were not eligible for common-law and conjugal just seemed shady). I would have been just as happy to live with him for the rest of my life as his girlfriend, but truth is it's just easier to go places and do things if you're legally married. I am also perfectly happy being his wife. It's just not that important to us, but since it's important to Immigrations, and they're the ones who decide where, when, and how I can travel to be with my husband, we decided to do things their way, if only to save us trouble in the future.
Would I have said all this (the "truth") on my application?
Of course not.
Did I lie on my application?
No, I stated clearly that we got married because we loved each other and wanted to be together, and that we were applying for PR because we were planning on living together in Canada for the time being and this seemed like the best possible solution.
Can I understand that someone may be confused as to how to approach the matter, when their ideas on marriage and those commonly accepted by society differ?
Definitely.
Being honest and straightforward is important, of course, but it's also important to make sure *Immigrations* doesn't percieve you as fraudulent. Not always the same thing, unfortunately. Numerous genuine couples have had their PR application denied because something didn't seem right to the IO. That said, trying to cover up the fact that you're civilly married because you're afraid of being turned away at a point of entry when you're trying to visit definitely does not sound like a good idea.
I'm just glad she posted this before trying to visit Canada, and I hope she gets things worked out.
My husband and I, to put it plainly, got "married civilly for the sole purpose of starting the immigration process." We got married so we could start the paperwork and, once approved, live together in Canada without having to worry about a visa expiring or not having an offer of employment. This does not mean that our relationship isn't genuine. Neither one of us believe the concept of marriage (as seen by society today) to be sacred or even important. Look at all the unhappy "married" couples and the current divorce rate. The important thing is for us to be together and do the things we want to do in life together. To us, marriage is nothing more than a piece of paper that states you made a social contract, and one that can be broken very easily at that. We had both discussed our feelings on the matter in great detail for several years before we decided we wanted to spend the rest of our lives together. To make this happen, we decided the easiest way would be to jump through Immigration's hoops and apply for PR under the spouse category (we were not eligible for common-law and conjugal just seemed shady). I would have been just as happy to live with him for the rest of my life as his girlfriend, but truth is it's just easier to go places and do things if you're legally married. I am also perfectly happy being his wife. It's just not that important to us, but since it's important to Immigrations, and they're the ones who decide where, when, and how I can travel to be with my husband, we decided to do things their way, if only to save us trouble in the future.
Would I have said all this (the "truth") on my application?
Of course not.
Did I lie on my application?
No, I stated clearly that we got married because we loved each other and wanted to be together, and that we were applying for PR because we were planning on living together in Canada for the time being and this seemed like the best possible solution.
Can I understand that someone may be confused as to how to approach the matter, when their ideas on marriage and those commonly accepted by society differ?
Definitely.
Being honest and straightforward is important, of course, but it's also important to make sure *Immigrations* doesn't percieve you as fraudulent. Not always the same thing, unfortunately. Numerous genuine couples have had their PR application denied because something didn't seem right to the IO. That said, trying to cover up the fact that you're civilly married because you're afraid of being turned away at a point of entry when you're trying to visit definitely does not sound like a good idea.
I'm just glad she posted this before trying to visit Canada, and I hope she gets things worked out.