Toward Understanding Bill C-6 to Amend Citizenship Act; new 3/5 rule plus

[capermanet]

My dear, Truduea can easily fill 19 vacant senate seats and go to majority. He is just being decent on his Senate reform promise he did in elections. Don't underestimate his capacity due to decency(which CONs never had).

Yeahh, when he does that plz let me know,

 

[screech339]

My dear, Truduea can easily fill 19 vacant senate seats and go to majority. He is just being decent on his Senate reform promise he did in elections. Don't underestimate his capacity due to decency(which CONs never had).

Even if Trudeau filled the 19 seats. They are independent thus not accountable to Trudeau. The independent liberals supported the amended assisted suicide bill despite the majority conservative senate. Who is to say that some of the independent liberals may support amending C-6 bill with terrorist clause removed. Only time will tell.

 

[quasar81]

Even if Trudeau filled the 19 seats. They are independent thus not accountable to Trudeau. The independent liberals supported the amended assisted suicide bill despite the majority conservative senate. Who is to say that some of the independent liberals may support amending C-6 bill with terrorist clause removed. Only time will tell.

Very good point.

But I think we agree that Trudeau has power to appoint 19(liberals or independents) and tilt the balance. One point to think is that why does only liberals vote independent. CONs just stay cons and never vote independent, or atleast much fewer times.

I think in all honesty, although it hurts C-6 passage, Truduea is doing much better than Harper to keep Senate non-political.

 

[screech339]

Very good point.

But I think we agree that Trudeau has power to appoint 19(liberals or independents) and tilt the balance. One point to think is that why does only liberals vote independent. CONs just stay cons and never vote independent, or atleast much fewer times.

I think in all honesty, although it hurts C-6 passage, Truduea is doing much better than Harper to keep Senate non-political.

Until the conservative senators are a part of the conservative caucus, they will not be "independents".

 

[747-captain]

Very good point.

But I think we agree that Trudeau has power to appoint 19(liberals or independents) and tilt the balance. One point to think is that why does only liberals vote independent. CONs just stay cons and never vote independent, or atleast much fewer times.

I think in all honesty, although it hurts C-6 passage, Truduea is doing much better than Harper to keep Senate non-political.

Sorry, but this does not work! It is actually absolutely and totally stupid! Look at what happened here in the US. Obama tried his best to compromise with the Republicans and all he got was obstruction and partisanship. That is why they did not get a lot of what they wanted, even when democrats were the majority in all 3 branches of government. They failed miserably, because they were so concerned about appearing "fair" to the other side, while the republicans were just laughing at their stupidity. :

Same thing applies to Canada. As they say "it takes two to tango". So if the conservatives play hardball, then liberals should play hardball as well. Unfortunately that is the name of the game! So when conservatives have been rabidly partisan, liberals have to push back the same way. Otherwise nothing will get done. Conservatives will get their entire agenda shoved through, while liberals just look stupid with nothing accomplished! So if the conservatives start "playing games" with these bills, then liberals have an obligation to the voters to push back in a strong way by appointing liberal Senators ASAP!

 

[screech339]

Sorry, but this does not work! It is actually absolutely and totally stupid! Look at what happened here in the US. Obama tried his best to compromise with the Republicans and all he got was obstruction and partisanship. That is why they did not get a lot of what they wanted, even when democrats were the majority in all 3 branches of government. They failed miserably, because they were so concerned about appearing "fair" to the other side, while the republicans were just laughing at their stupidity. :

Same thing applies to Canada. As they say "it takes two to tango". So if the conservatives play hardball, then liberals should play hardball as well. Unfortunately that is the name of the game! So when conservatives have been rabidly partisan, liberals have to push back the same way. Otherwise nothing will get done. Conservatives will get their entire agenda shoved through, while liberals just look stupid with nothing accomplished! So if the conservatives start "playing games" with these bills, then liberals have an obligation to the voters to push back in a strong way by appointing liberal Senators ASAP!

We seen that happening when Mulroney was in government with liberal majority senate. Liberal Senators were playing hardball then. This is no different.

 

[Dave01]

Here is the link that shows it's gone to the senate.. Grin Tongue

http://www.parl.gc.ca/LegisInfo/BillDetails.aspx?Language=E&Mode=1&billId=8117654

 

[quasar81]

Here is the link that shows it's gone to the senate.. Grin Tongue

http://www.parl.gc.ca/LegisInfo/BillDetails.aspx?Language=E&Mode=1&billId=8117654

C-24 was passed by CON senate by doing 3 readings in 4 days.

Just for point of reference. C-24 was much bigger bill than than C-6. So, they should pass C-6 in 3 days, 3 readings. Oh, too much wishing and day dreaming... Forgot it's a liberal bill.

 

[artin2015]

For sure will pass before canada day this is government Bill and government bill never refused by senate if you go back always others bill refused not government bills

 

[dkera]

there are no other bills than government bills. any bill sent to the senate has already been voted in by the House. If the government disagrees (and it's not a minority government) then the bill doesn't get sent here.

 

[artin2015]

there are no other bills than government bills. any bill sent to the senate has already been voted in by the House. If the government disagrees (and it's not a minority government) then the bill doesn't get sent here.

U r wrong because they have private bills as well.
According to the Order Paper, Senate 2nd Reading will start on Monday 20 June

 

[dkera]

First of all the order paper CLEARLY states Tuesday, June 21st for second reading. There is a MANDATORY 2 business day gap between first reading and second reading. Even if you don't know that just read the order paper.

Second, what I said above didn't imply that there are no private members bills. Of course there all.

All I said is that for a bill to reach Senate it has to pass House first. That means that, in principle, that bill has the government approval. Otherwise it would have been defeated in the House and NEVER went to the Senate.

 

[makpan]

What is next step from 21 June 16?

How many reading in senate and getting royal stamp?

When it will be in effect if it get royal approval let's say by July 1?

First of all the order paper CLEARLY states Tuesday, June 21st for second reading. There is a MANDATORY 2 business day gap between first reading and second reading. Even if you don't know that just read the order paper.

Second, what I said above didn't imply that there are no private members bills. Of course there all.

All I said is that for a bill to reach Senate it has to pass House first. That means that, in principle, that bill has the government approval. Otherwise it would have been defeated in the House and NEVER went to the Senate.

 

[dkera]

Like the House of Commons, the Senate steps are:

1) first reading (done on June 17th)
2) second reading (scheduled for June 21st)
3) referral to committee
4) report
5) third reading
6) royal assent (i.e. becomes law)

If the Senate proposes ANY amendments to the bill then (like C-14 last week) it has to be sent back to the House of Commons until they both agree. The House is now adjourned until mid September. If the Senate accepts the bill AS IS then it might get royal assent before July 1st.

The senate sittings remaining (starting from second reading) are: June 21, 22, 23, 27, 28, 29 and 30, which means there are only 7 sittings. It may happen but I see it as unlikely, given that the House of Commons with a liberal majority government took 5 months.

Now, even IF it passes royal assent, before summer break, then some provisions will automatically apply and others (e.g. the residency time requirement) will be phased in. NO ONE knows over how long that phase in process will take place. For C-24 for example, it was one year. So it might be next Summer. It might be next April. It might be January. No one knows.

 

[makpan]

Thanks for info .


Lets see how it go from here.

Like the House of Commons, the Senate steps are:

1) first reading (done on June 17th)
2) second reading (scheduled for June 21st)
3) referral to committee
4) report
5) third reading
6) royal assent (i.e. becomes law)

If the Senate proposes ANY amendments to the bill then (like C-14 last week) it has to be sent back to the House of Commons until they both agree. The House is now adjourned until mid September. If the Senate accepts the bill AS IS then it might get royal assent before July 1st.

The senate sittings remaining (starting from second reading) are: June 21, 22, 23, 27, 28, 29 and 30, which means there are only 7 sittings. It may happen but I see it as unlikely, given that the House of Commons with a liberal majority government took 5 months.

Now, even IF it passes royal assent, before summer break, then some provisions will automatically apply and others (e.g. the residency time requirement) will be phased in. NO ONE knows over how long that phase in process will take place. For C-24 for example, it was one year. So it might be next Summer. It might be next April. It might be January. No one knows.