The PoF nightmare!!!!!!

[Ustaad]

Hello Asivad and friends,

I read about the PoF thing confusion going around on this forum. I am being invited to apply in the 14th draw, and have until Oct 6, 2015 to submit the required documents. I am being invited under FSW and being a single applicant, I need to show $12,000 that are not borrowed. Like many people I am also confused about PoF and fear being denied on its grounds, despite having everything else well in order. I request you to clear my confusion on PoF, I am presenting my case as under:

A. Bank Account in my home country [Which I do not use, as I live in Canada]

Ending Balance in April 2015 = $0
Ending Balance in May 2015 = $0
Ending Balance in June 2015 = $0
Ending Balance in July 2015 = $3,000 ----> Came from the sale of my car; I have the copy of the car sale document
Ending Balance in August (will be approx.) = $3,000 + $5,500 = $8,500 ----> $5,500 transferred by my dad from his Provident fund, both his account debit and my account credit bank statements available
Ending Balance in September (will be approx.) = $3,000 + $5,500 + $3,500 = $12,000 ----> $3,500 again will be transferred by my dad from his Provident fund, both his account debit and my account credit bank statements will be available

Bottom Line: (i) Average Balance of 6 months = Approx. $4,000, Ending Balance at the time of applying = Approx. $12,000

(ii) The difference of $8,000 between the ending balance and average balance explained explicitly by

a. Bank Statements showing the debit of money from dad's account and credit of same amount of money in my account a couple of days later
b. Car Sale document, showing the amount for which the car sold and then the credit of same amount in my account, supported by my bank statement
c. An affidavit on stamp paper furnished by my father stating that he has given out his money to facilitate the PoF for his son's immigration to Canada
d. An affidavit furnished by me stating that I needed these funds to meet the PoF requirement, so I sold my car and my father gifted me the rest
e. A signed and stamped, letterheaded document from my dad's office stating his overall Provident Fund balance, and then highlighting in the affidavit furnished by me and him in point (c) and point (d) that he has given out only 20% of his Provident Fund as a gift to me (making it more conclusive that he hasn't gifted ALL of his PF to me, just a small fraction of the same, causing the officer less suspicion)


MY QUESTION IS : AS PER MY CASE MENTIONED ABOVE, ARE THE FACTS SHOWN AND THEN THE EVIDENCES ATTACHED IN THE FROM OF DOCUMENTS (TO PROVE THAT THE MONEY IS NOT BORROWED AND IS READILY AVAILABLE TO ME) CONCLUSIVE ENOUGH NOT TO CAUSE MY REJECTION BECAUSE OF POF?

B. Banks generally have standard formats for the letters they issue to their clients e.g. a bank statement, a document showing current balance etc. I talked to my bank and they said they don't print things such as average balance etc. So how do I resolve this issue? Get a letter from bank stating everything except average balance and then attach all the bank statements, and calculate the average of ending balances in the past 6 months in an LOE? Would that suffice?

Awaiting your replies!

Thanks a lot!

 

[scylla]

I think it's impossible for any of us to say for certain if this is enough to convince the officer the money is yours. I don't think you'll have any problems with the money that came from the sale of your car. It's possible CIC may be concerned by the funds received from your father since they amount to $9K (i.e. 75% of the POF). Again, really impossible for any of us to say for certain. It would be better if all of the funds were yours - but since that's not possible you'll just have to wait and see what happens.

Good luck.

 

[kateg]

MY QUESTION IS : AS PER MY CASE MENTIONED ABOVE, ARE THE FACTS SHOWN AND THEN THE EVIDENCES ATTACHED IN THE FROM OF DOCUMENTS (TO PROVE THAT THE MONEY IS NOT BORROWED AND IS READILY AVAILABLE TO ME) CONCLUSIVE ENOUGH NOT TO CAUSE MY REJECTION BECAUSE OF POF?

That's up to CIC. The better your explanation, the less problems you will have. Any documentation you can show that the money is not a loan may help.

 

[se7en]

Hello Asivad and friends,

I read about the PoF thing confusion going around on this forum. I am being invited to apply in the 14th draw, and have until Oct 6, 2015 to submit the required documents. I am being invited under FSW and being a single applicant, I need to show $12,000 that are not borrowed. Like many people I am also confused about PoF and fear being denied on its grounds, despite having everything else well in order. I request you to clear my confusion on PoF, I am presenting my case as under:

A. Bank Account in my home country [Which I do not use, as I live in Canada]

Ending Balance in April 2015 = $0
Ending Balance in May 2015 = $0
Ending Balance in June 2015 = $0
Ending Balance in July 2015 = $3,000 ----> Came from the sale of my car; I have the copy of the car sale document
Ending Balance in August (will be approx.) = $3,000 + $5,500 = $8,500 ----> $5,500 transferred by my dad from his Provident fund, both his account debit and my account credit bank statements available
Ending Balance in September (will be approx.) = $3,000 + $5,500 + $3,500 = $12,000 ----> $3,500 again will be transferred by my dad from his Provident fund, both his account debit and my account credit bank statements will be available

Bottom Line: (i) Average Balance of 6 months = Approx. $4,000, Ending Balance at the time of applying = Approx. $12,000

(ii) The difference of $8,000 between the ending balance and average balance explained explicitly by

a. Bank Statements showing the debit of money from dad's account and credit of same amount of money in my account a couple of days later
b. Car Sale document, showing the amount for which the car sold and then the credit of same amount in my account, supported by my bank statement
c. An affidavit on stamp paper furnished by my father stating that he has given out his money to facilitate the PoF for his son's immigration to Canada
d. An affidavit furnished by me stating that I needed these funds to meet the PoF requirement, so I sold my car and my father gifted me the rest
e. A signed and stamped, letterheaded document from my dad's office stating his overall Provident Fund balance, and then highlighting in the affidavit furnished by me and him in point (c) and point (d) that he has given out only 20% of his Provident Fund as a gift to me (making it more conclusive that he hasn't gifted ALL of his PF to me, just a small fraction of the same, causing the officer less suspicion)


MY QUESTION IS : AS PER MY CASE MENTIONED ABOVE, ARE THE FACTS SHOWN AND THEN THE EVIDENCES ATTACHED IN THE FROM OF DOCUMENTS (TO PROVE THAT THE MONEY IS NOT BORROWED AND IS READILY AVAILABLE TO ME) CONCLUSIVE ENOUGH NOT TO CAUSE MY REJECTION BECAUSE OF POF?

B. Banks generally have standard formats for the letters they issue to their clients e.g. a bank statement, a document showing current balance etc. I talked to my bank and they said they don't print things such as average balance etc. So how do I resolve this issue? Get a letter from bank stating everything except average balance and then attach all the bank statements, and calculate the average of ending balances in the past 6 months in an LOE? Would that suffice?

Awaiting your replies!

Thanks a lot!

I guess you don't need any further suggestions on the paperwork that you are going to do for your PoF and I believe this is the best you can do in your situation.

Good Luck!

 

[JB007]

Please do get a notarized letter ( an affidavit ) frim your dad say goodbye he's gifting you this money and wouldn't asknow this back under any circumstances. Good luck!

 

[Rahul12]

dont do anything stupid. just get a letter from the bank stating that you have this much on your account on this day. that shud be enuf. no need of showing 6 month statements . dont over complicate your things and do not send any kind of LOE. thats soo stupid

 

[Asivad Anac]

dont do anything stupid. just get a letter from the bank stating that you have this much on your account on this day. that shud be enuf. no need of showing 6 month statements . dont over complicate your things and do not send any kind of LOE. thats soo stupid

Incorrect advise.

CIC will want conclusive evidence that the monies belong to you and aren't borrowed. They specifically ask for 6 months average balance. You don't necessarily need to provide 6 months bank statements if your bank can include the average balance in their certificate/letter. If not, you will have to provide sufficient evidence to explain any unreasonably large difference between your present account balance and 6 months average balance.

While I agree with the general sentiment of not providing too much information, one has to provide at least the required information.

 

[Rahul12]

CIC did not specify anything about average account balance anywhre!

 

[Asivad Anac]

CIC did not specify anything about average account balance anywhre!

Some of us prefer keeping shut when we don't know something. Others prefer being less cocksure about their limited knowledge. Still others prefer researching before speaking. Your call.

Document requirements

The applicant should provide official letter(s) from financial institution(s) which list all current bank and investment accounts, as well as outstanding debts such as credit cards and loans. The letter(s) must be printed on the letterhead of the financial institution and must include applicant’s name, the contact information of the financial institution (address, telephone number and e-mail address), the account numbers, dates of when each account was opened and the current balance of each account as well as the average balance in the past six months.

Source ---> http://www.cic.gc.ca/english/resources/tools/perm/express/intake-complete.asp

 

[Ustaad]

Some of us prefer keeping shut when we don't know something. Others prefer being less cocksure about their limited knowledge. Still others prefer researching before speaking. Your call.

Source ---> http://www.cic.gc.ca/english/resources/tools/perm/express/intake-complete.asp

Hi Asivad, I am the OP of this post. Can you please go through the case presented by me and let me know whether I am rightfully handling the documents to bridge the gap b/w Avg bal and current balance?

2. If suppose I upload all documents on 5th Oct, Can I consider the month of Oct as the 6th month out of those 6 months or September as the 6th month?

thanks in advance

 

[Asivad Anac]

Hi Asivad, I am the OP of this post. Can you please go through the case presented by me and let me know whether I am rightfully handling the documents to bridge the gap b/w Avg bal and current balance?

You have understood the requirement clearly - Prove unfettered access to required funds and additionally prove that those funds are unencumbered. Do whatever you can to prove both of these. That is the best you can do under the circumstances.

2. If suppose I upload all documents on 5th Oct, Can I consider the month of Oct as the 6th month out of those 6 months or September as the 6th month?

October 6th 2015 can be counted within 6 months only if you start counting from April 6th 2015.

thanks in advance

 

[Ustaad]

Ya thanks a lot Asivad. Knowledge is power and just for the sake of knowledge, I want to know - did you just submit your self signed declaration of where the sudden spike in your funds came from OR did you get signed declaration from the person who put that money in your account, further supported by bank transfer details?

 

[Anya654]

Upstand from what I've gathered so far CIC doesn't like gifted funds so you have to provide sufficient evidence to show your father is really gifting you these funds with no intention of you returning it. See a link below I stumbled across.

http://www.trackitt.com/usa-discussion-forums/federal-skilled-workers/518637283/pr-rejected-fsw

 

[vipulgoyal88]

hi, a small question, sorry to the OP for hijacking. So, basically I will have CAD12000 in my account on the date I apply by accumulating my salary. So I started saving money only when I thought of applying for Canada. So you can assume that in my 6months bank statement, the opening balance would be zero and CAD2000 saved from salary every month for 6 months. So, average balance would be quite less. Is that okay or is it a concern?

 

[Asivad Anac]

Ya thanks a lot Asivad. Knowledge is power and just for the sake of knowledge, I want to know - did you just submit your self signed declaration of where the sudden spike in your funds came from OR did you get signed declaration from the person who put that money in your account, further supported by bank transfer details?

Of course, a signed self-declaration from the person who gifted the money. As I've mentioned multiple times earlier, I suspect the LOE did not make it or wasn't convincing enough. In hindsight, I could've included bank statements proving that transaction took place (in addition to the bank certificate/letter that I uploaded) but there is no way of knowing (in this Universe, at least) if that would've worked in my favor.