The PoF nightmare!!!!!!

[Ustaad]

hi, a small question, sorry to the OP for hijacking. So, basically I will have CAD12000 in my account on the date I apply by accumulating my salary. So I started saving money only when I thought of applying for Canada. So you can assume that in my 6months bank statement, the opening balance would be zero and CAD2000 saved from salary every month for 6 months. So, average balance would be quite less. Is that okay or is it a concern?

Yes, we can clearly mention in the LOE that we have saved these funds for fulfilling CIC requirement, (else why would our money spending and saving pattern be as per CIC rules in the first place?). The CIC people rely on documents, just make sure your documentary and explanatory evidence for bridging the gap between Avg balance of 6 months and current balance after 6 months is strong enough to NOT cause the VO to suspect something fishy

 

[Asivad Anac]

Upstand from what I've gathered so far CIC doesn't like gifted funds so you have to provide sufficient evidence to show your father is really gifting you these funds with no intention of you returning it. See a link below I stumbled across.

trackitt.com/usa-discussion-forums/federal-skilled-workers/518637283/pr-rejected-fsw

Saw that link - good find.

Though the OP in that link did the exact opposite. They received funds from their father and did NOT inform CIC about this transfer upfront and got rejected because CIC identified the 'large deposit' and realized that there was no explanation for the same. The conclusion shouldn't be that CIC doesn't like gifts but that CIC doesn't like unproven or partially proven unencumbered funds. They want conclusive evidence that it was a gift/inheritance/sales of assets/whatever (provide documentary evidence and also provide physical evidence of the money being in 'your' possession in your bank account now) AND that the funds aren't borrowed from anyone.

 

[Ustaad]

Of course, a signed self-declaration from the person who gifted the money. As I've mentioned multiple times earlier, I suspect the LOE did not make it or wasn't convincing enough. In hindsight, I could've included bank statements proving that transaction took place (in addition to the bank certificate/letter that I uploaded) but there is no way of knowing (in this Universe, at least) if that would've worked in my favor.

Asivad, as far as I know, CIC people should be convinced by what you submitted. It might have been officer's bad day or they misunderstood your case somehow. Else, a signed declaration is a big thing for Canadians!!

P.S. I am living in Canada for two years. Completed my MBA, have been doing part-time jobs to support myself. I pay off my rent, utilities, phones and other bills, have a car, pay for gas, insurance etc., recently got PGWP and will soon be landing into a full time job, making $3,500 per month after tax. Don't really understand what they gonna see after seeing whether I have $12,000 or not. I am gonna earn and spend on my own though.

Were you applying from inside or outside Canada? If outside, which country?

 

[Anya654]

Saw that link - good find.

Though the OP in that link did the exact opposite. They received funds from their father and did NOT inform CIC about this transfer upfront and got rejected because CIC identified the 'large deposit' and realized that there was no explanation for the same. The conclusion shouldn't be that CIC doesn't like gifts but that CIC doesn't like unproven or partially proven unencumbered funds. They want conclusive evidence that it was a gift/inheritance/sales of assets/whatever (provide documentary evidence and also provide physical evidence of the money being in 'your' possession in your bank account now) AND that the funds aren't borrowed from anyone.

Yes I know the poster didn't inform CIC where the money came from. I posted the link so the OP will take that as a lesson to really demonstrate with all evidence he has his source of funds.

 

[dobes]

Hello Asivad and friends,

I read about the PoF thing confusion going around on this forum. I am being invited to apply in the 14th draw, and have until Oct 6, 2015 to submit the required documents. I am being invited under FSW and being a single applicant, I need to show $12,000 that are not borrowed. Like many people I am also confused about PoF and fear being denied on its grounds, despite having everything else well in order. I request you to clear my confusion on PoF, I am presenting my case as under:

A. Bank Account in my home country [Which I do not use, as I live in Canada]

Ending Balance in April 2015 = $0
Ending Balance in May 2015 = $0
Ending Balance in June 2015 = $0
Ending Balance in July 2015 = $3,000 ----> Came from the sale of my car; I have the copy of the car sale document
Ending Balance in August (will be approx.) = $3,000 + $5,500 = $8,500 ----> $5,500 transferred by my dad from his Provident fund, both his account debit and my account credit bank statements available
Ending Balance in September (will be approx.) = $3,000 + $5,500 + $3,500 = $12,000 ----> $3,500 again will be transferred by my dad from his Provident fund, both his account debit and my account credit bank statements will be available

Bottom Line: (i) Average Balance of 6 months = Approx. $4,000, Ending Balance at the time of applying = Approx. $12,000

(ii) The difference of $8,000 between the ending balance and average balance explained explicitly by

a. Bank Statements showing the debit of money from dad's account and credit of same amount of money in my account a couple of days later
b. Car Sale document, showing the amount for which the car sold and then the credit of same amount in my account, supported by my bank statement
c. An affidavit on stamp paper furnished by my father stating that he has given out his money to facilitate the PoF for his son's immigration to Canada
d. An affidavit furnished by me stating that I needed these funds to meet the PoF requirement, so I sold my car and my father gifted me the rest
e. A signed and stamped, letterheaded document from my dad's office stating his overall Provident Fund balance, and then highlighting in the affidavit furnished by me and him in point (c) and point (d) that he has given out only 20% of his Provident Fund as a gift to me (making it more conclusive that he hasn't gifted ALL of his PF to me, just a small fraction of the same, causing the officer less suspicion)


MY QUESTION IS : AS PER MY CASE MENTIONED ABOVE, ARE THE FACTS SHOWN AND THEN THE EVIDENCES ATTACHED IN THE FROM OF DOCUMENTS (TO PROVE THAT THE MONEY IS NOT BORROWED AND IS READILY AVAILABLE TO ME) CONCLUSIVE ENOUGH NOT TO CAUSE MY REJECTION BECAUSE OF POF?

B. Banks generally have standard formats for the letters they issue to their clients e.g. a bank statement, a document showing current balance etc. I talked to my bank and they said they don't print things such as average balance etc. So how do I resolve this issue? Get a letter from bank stating everything except average balance and then attach all the bank statements, and calculate the average of ending balances in the past 6 months in an LOE? Would that suffice?

Awaiting your replies!

Thanks a lot!

I think your father's notarized letter needs to make it absolutely crystal clear that he is giving you the money and does not expect it to be repaid, nor does he expect anything from you in future because he gave you this money now. Showing that it is only a small portion of his fund is good as well. But don't let modesty keep you from making it absolutely clear that it is a gift, free and clear.

 

[Rahul12]

Some of us prefer keeping shut when we don't know something. Others prefer being less cocksure about their limited knowledge. Still others prefer researching before speaking. Your call.

Source ---> http://www.cic.gc.ca/english/resources/tools/perm/express/intake-complete.asp

Lol shut up man! he is an inland applicant. I did not give any 6 month statement. Infact not even one! He just needs a letter from the bank stating that he has this much money on this date.

Lol, follow Asivad advice, end up giving LOEs and ....make things complicated

 

[YamPower]

Lol shut up man! he is an inland applicant. I did not give any 6 month statement. Infact not even one! He just needs a letter from the bank stating that he has this much money on this date.

Lol, follow Asivad advice, end up giving LOEs and ....make things complicated

How rude are you? Yes, follow Asivad's advice. She knows all too well that statements are required. Good luck doing whatever you feel like doing.

 

[Rahul12]

haha. who is rude in the first place? You people are making things complicated. Things worked for me as an inland applicant and my bank letter. A bank letter and pay slips wud suffice for inland applicants. Know the facts!

 

[EFK]

I had transferred x amount (lets say 10k) from my account to dads account last yr for investment purposes... now dad has transferred me back x- some amount (8k)...should I bother with explaining that hes just returning me the money? I think itl get so complicated...
or should I say it as a gift or inheritance?

 

[sraj07]

Asivad ,

Thanks for your advice on POF . Do we need to get attestation of bank statements from bank ? or just a online st will do ?

My fund is not a gift , but it is accumulated over the last 6 months to come up to the CIC limit , do you feel I need an LOE for this ? (I forgot to ask abt this LOE to you last time , my apologies )

 

[Asivad Anac]

Asivad ,

Thanks for your advice on POF . Do we need to get attestation of bank statements from bank ? or just a online st will do ?

My fund is not a gift , but it is accumulated over the last 6 months to come up to the CIC limit , do you feel I need an LOE for this ? (I forgot to ask abt this LOE to you last time , my apologies )

Someone got rejected for submitting online statements. Recommend getting them signed/stamped at the bank.

You don't need an LOE to explain gradual accumulation of funds.

 

[Aranaszek]

Hi Guys,

to avoid creating another PoF related topic I will post my question here.

My situation is as follows. As a PoF I will provide statements from two banks from different countries (both from EU as I;m applying from outside of Canada). One will include average balance for 2014 (as one figure) and the current balance (around 65% of the required 23k CAD) and I assume there should be no problem with it. However, I have a dillema with the second one as money comes from the gift from my mum (remaining 35% - a bit more actually) and have been transfered today hence obviously that ruins my average balance. Now, I have two options:

1. Provide bank statement that do not mention the average balanace for the second account and hope it would be accepted.
2. Provide bank statement which includes the average balance together with LoE, self declaration from my mum, transfer confirmation printout plus a certified translation of the notarial gift contract between me and my mum (as I had to have one due to the law regulations in that particular country)

Now, lets get to the question. Frankly, I am more keen on the first option, as the second one might be fishy for an officer who maynot be convinced the money are actually a gift and not a loan. Normally, I could wait 6 months, but I stand on 460 points and my IELST expires in 15 days.

Therefore here comes the grand question: what are the chances that my application might be refused without any request for additional documents mentioning average balance? If the bank statement was not enough for the office then I could provide all the documents mentioned in the second point. What I would like to avoid is the refusal straight away.

Thanks for an input!

 

[Aranaszek]

any thoughts guys?

 

[rohitsinp23]

Pls help, i have two accounts in two different banks, one is saving accounts( joint with spouse) and second one is salary account, but For POF all amount exists in saving accounts from last 6-7 months. And salary account hv nt much money bcoz i used it for home expensives or for daily use so always balance is below than $100. Only in the first week of every month balance goes up when salary transfered to it. So now question is-: Bank statements are mandatory or not. I have more than six months old balance in my joint account with my spouse and average balance is also same as current balance, just 3-4% variation. If im sending bank letter which stating average balance for last six months, current balance, credit card accounts( limits and balance available), no loan then bank statement for last six months should be submitted or not. And should i submit same letter ( no loan, current balance, avg balance, credit cards) for salary account from other bank or statement is mandatory

 

[kakhileshreddy]

hi all,

i have my friend diposited 10K cheque with in canada in my account. do i need to show any proofs for this

i need not to provide any money back to him its gift for me from my friend..


please advise what to do..