Thai national refused TRV

[Ritchieyyc]

Any guidance is appreciated. My friends application was refused based on 4 items all related to failure to convince IRC that she would leave at the end of stay.
Family ties, financial, employment prospects at home and personal assets.
Very standard form letter.
I was her designated unpaid representative and also would be her host in Canada. Our hope was that she would come for an extended visit and meet my family and see the country. I wrote her a letter of invitation as did my Dad and sister. I pledged to cover all expenses and to be accountable for adherence to the visa.
Do these things make any difference? Or Is there just a formula that is applied ?

 

[canuck78]

Any guidance is appreciated. My friends application was refused based on 4 items all related to failure to convince IRC that she would leave at the end of stay.
Family ties, financial, employment prospects at home and personal assets.
Very standard form letter.
I was her designated unpaid representative and also would be her host in Canada. Our hope was that she would come for an extended visit and meet my family and see the country. I wrote her a letter of invitation as did my Dad and sister. I pledged to cover all expenses and to be accountable for adherence to the visa.
Do these things make any difference? Or Is there just a formula that is applied ?

Your promise makes no difference. If anything there will be concern that you are in a relationship and you will get married while she is in Canada. She needs to show that she can afford all travel expenses on her own and has the savings not to drain her savings on the trip. She needs to have well paid employment longterm so there is temptation for her to try and remain in Canada.

 

[Ritchieyyc]

Your promise makes no difference. If anything there will be concern that you are in a relationship and you will get married while she is in Canada. She needs to show that she can afford all travel expenses on her own and has the savings not to drain her savings on the trip. She needs to have well paid employment longterm so there is temptation for her to try and remain in Canada.

Your promise makes no difference. If anything there will be concern that you are in a relationship and you will get married while she is in Canada. She needs to show that she can afford all travel expenses on her own and has the savings not to drain her savings on the trip. She needs to have well paid employment longterm so there is temptation for her to try and remain in Canada.

Thank you for your response it’s much appreciated since the process is a difficult one.
Could you explain the marriage concern. Why is this an issue? Is it not reasonable to want to marry in Canada?
Also, why are there questions about who will pay for the visit and a requirement to provides hosts financial statements if it is not accepted as meeting the financial burden?
Thank you again for any insight you can provide since we need to decide if reapplying for a TRV is worthwhile or not.

 

[scylla]

Thank you for your response it’s much appreciated since the process is a difficult one.
Could you explain the marriage concern. Why is this an issue? Is it not reasonable to want to marry in Canada?
Also, why are there questions about who will pay for the visit and a requirement to provides hosts financial statements if it is not accepted as meeting the financial burden?
Thank you again for any insight you can provide since we need to decide if reapplying for a TRV is worthwhile or not.

The marriage concern is an issue since IRCC is concerned the visitor will come here, get married and then apply for PR (and not leave). So this would mean they are not a genuine visitor but are coming here with an intent to remain in Canada long term.

In terms of financials, IRCC wants to see that the visitor has the funds on their own to pay for their entire trip.

 

[Ritchieyyc]

The marriage concern is an issue since IRCC is concerned the visitor will come here, get married and then apply for PR (and not leave). So this would mean they are not a genuine visitor but are coming here with an intent to remain in Canada long term.

In terms of financials, IRCC wants to see that the visitor has the funds on their own to pay for their entire trip.

Thanks for the quick response. It is discouraging but looks like our hope of my partner meeting my family and visiting my home before marriage is not going to happen.
if we proceed to get married then apply for spousal sponsorship any advice? Thanks again.

 

[Jets13]

Thanks for the quick response. It is discouraging but looks like our hope of my partner meeting my family and visiting my home before marriage is not going to happen.
if we proceed to get married then apply for spousal sponsorship any advice? Thanks again.

So for you to apply for spousal sponsorship you must prove that your marriage is legal, which should be easy....and that it is genuine for which you must have proof. So advice would be to make sure you have evidence of your relationship. Pictures, chat logs, times you went to visit together, pictures from the wedding, proof of friends and family going to your wedding, and if they don't go why not. Proof that they know about the relationship etc. The idea is to prove that the marriage is genuine and not for the purposes of immigration.

 

[Ritchieyyc]

We can provide the evidence as you outline since we have been in an established relationship for over a year. I stayed with my partner on 4 visits last year each of 30 days duration or longer. Our social media footprint is extensive and we have a vast collection of photos etc. Marriage is in our plans. But before we give up on introducing my partner to my 90 year old Dad before we are married...
I have read on this form that in cases of application denial a request for reconsidering made through the IRCC webform portal can bear fruit, has that been your experience?
For an application to be denied for financial or employment reasons when full support and accountability has been pledged from a qualified host appears on the surface to be prejudicial and unjust. Thanks again for any feedback you may offer.

 

[Jets13]

We can provide the evidence as you outline since we have been in an established relationship for over a year. I stayed with my partner on 4 visits last year each of 30 days duration or longer. Our social media footprint is extensive and we have a vast collection of photos etc. Marriage is in our plans. But before we give up on introducing my partner to my 90 year old Dad before we are married...
I have read on this form that in cases of application denial a request for reconsidering made through the IRCC webform portal can bear fruit, has that been your experience?
For an application to be denied for financial or employment reasons when full support and accountability has been pledged from a qualified host appears on the surface to be prejudicial and unjust. Thanks again for any feedback you may offer.

I don't have experience on that subject, I cannot think of too many instances where reconsideration is applied for most probably just apply with a new application. Would one have to prove that there was an error made?

As mentioned earlier your promise really isn't enforceable. Lets say in a hypothetical situation where you have vouched to pay for and host everything. Then when she comes here there is a fight and you break up...and kick her out. I don't think you saying you will pay for everything is legally binding. Just like if she came here with what you thought were good intentions and secretly had another boyfriend here....you would not be held accountable for her actions.

So if a person cannot pay for their own trip that is a negative point against them. They could still get approved if other things outweigh that. Here are the basic requirements for a visitor.
You must meet some basic requirements to get a visitor visa. You must:

• have a valid travel document, like a passport
• be in good health
• have no criminal or immigration-related convictions
• convince an immigration officer that you have ties—such as a job, home, financial assets or family—that will take you back to your home country
• convince an immigration officer that you will leave Canada at the end of your visit
• have enough money for your stay
  • The amount of money you will need depends on how long you will stay and if you will stay in a hotel, or with friends or relatives.

So does she have a job back home? Kids? Property in her name? What is it back in Thailand that would ensure she goes back? If your real intention is to move to Canada that can be tough, as a visitor visa is for genuine visitors not for people who ideally want to live here. Canadian visa is difficult to get.


Sorry one more thing, if your father is 90 is there a big age gap between you and your girlfriend? the reason I ask is that will be a hurdle that you must overcome and provide explanation for after marriage.

 

[canuck78]

Lots of family and relationship breakdown. Canada isn’t interested in having visitors showing up at homeless centres of airports with no way home. Unfortunately people so things like cancel return tickets after an argument. Suing Canadians to recoup fees for return tickets of visitors would be a waste of time and resources. Not predjudicial just smart a smart way to make sure visitors can make it home and a way to try to eliminate those who may be arriving with plans to work.

 

[Ritchieyyc]

Thanks Canuck78 - I’m 62 and she is 48 is that considered big with IRCC?

your input has helped me see the weakness in the application. Length of stay requested was 5 months, her bank account CDN $10k owns 2 homes but not the land they sit on. Owns farming rights to 2.5 acres of irrigated land. Has a 22 y.o.son. Had been fully employed and/or self-employed for the last 10 years+, I started to support her several months ago and discouraged her from working, upgraded her qualifications during this time, Also we travelled together to Japan and Hong Kong in last 3 months. Had plans to open a small business on our return to Thailand after the visit.

We can reapply for shorter visit and establish small business credentials and re-apply I guess there is no harm in trying since I understand rejected TRV applications would not effect a Spousal sponsorship/PR application?
We will be married within the next 6 to 8 months and will apply for PRV at that time.

thanks again

 

[scylla]

We can provide the evidence as you outline since we have been in an established relationship for over a year. I stayed with my partner on 4 visits last year each of 30 days duration or longer. Our social media footprint is extensive and we have a vast collection of photos etc. Marriage is in our plans. But before we give up on introducing my partner to my 90 year old Dad before we are married...
I have read on this form that in cases of application denial a request for reconsidering made through the IRCC webform portal can bear fruit, has that been your experience?
For an application to be denied for financial or employment reasons when full support and accountability has been pledged from a qualified host appears on the surface to be prejudicial and unjust. Thanks again for any feedback you may offer.

I don't think you'll have any issues with spousal sponsorship / PR. Sounds like you have plenty of evidence.

For the TRV, you can ask for reconsideration but this is rarely considered. No harm trying. I would focus your reconsideration request on ties to her home country / proof she has no plans on remaining in Canada long term (e.g. proof of employment, proof of assets / property ownership, etc.).

 

[canuck78]

Thanks Canuck78 - I’m 62 and she is 48 is that considered big with IRCC?

your input has helped me see the weakness in the application. Length of stay requested was 5 months, her bank account CDN $10k owns 2 homes but not the land they sit on. Owns farming rights to 2.5 acres of irrigated land. Has a 22 y.o.son. Had been fully employed and/or self-employed for the last 10 years+, I started to support her several months ago and discouraged her from working, upgraded her qualifications during this time, Also we travelled together to Japan and Hong Kong in last 3 months. Had plans to open a small business on our return to Thailand after the visit.

We can reapply for shorter visit and establish small business credentials and re-apply I guess there is no harm in trying since I understand rejected TRV applications would not effect a Spousal sponsorship/PR application?
We will be married within the next 6 to 8 months and will apply for PRV at that time.

thanks again

Yes the 5 months is way too long. It shows that she doesn’t really have strong ties to Thailand and essentially proves that you are in a relationship and may be getting married in Canada. I don’t believe she would have been approved had she asked for less time. Honestly she is unlikely to get a TRV after marriage either. I think you will have to wait for her sponsorship to be approved before she is able to come to Canada.

 

[scylla]

Thanks Canuck78 - I’m 62 and she is 48 is that considered big with IRCC?

your input has helped me see the weakness in the application. Length of stay requested was 5 months, her bank account CDN $10k owns 2 homes but not the land they sit on. Owns farming rights to 2.5 acres of irrigated land. Has a 22 y.o.son. Had been fully employed and/or self-employed for the last 10 years+, I started to support her several months ago and discouraged her from working, upgraded her qualifications during this time, Also we travelled together to Japan and Hong Kong in last 3 months. Had plans to open a small business on our return to Thailand after the visit.

We can reapply for shorter visit and establish small business credentials and re-apply I guess there is no harm in trying since I understand rejected TRV applications would not effect a Spousal sponsorship/PR application?
We will be married within the next 6 to 8 months and will apply for PRV at that time.

thanks again

Requesting a 5 month stay was unfortunately a pretty big mistake. Anyone who can travel to Canada for five months has effectively no ties to their home country. Knowing that now, I would NOT request reconsideration. I would reapply and ask for a 2-3 week trip.

 

[Ritchieyyc]

Requesting a 5 month stay was unfortunately a pretty big mistake. Anyone who can travel to Canada for five months has effectively no ties to their home country. Knowing that now, I would NOT request reconsideration. I would reapply and ask for a 2-3 week trip.

Yes we can do that. Property documents and affidavit’s to prove property rights. Establish a business license and plan. Reduce the planned stay to under a month.
Thanks for the guidance Canuck78 this process is difficult to understand but you have shed a lot of light on it.

 

[Ritchieyyc]

oops!!! Sorry scylla I apologize I have mistakenly thought I was replying only to 1 responder Canuck78.
you have both been most helpful. REALLY appreciate it.