NOC rejection. Anyone?

[thecoldperson]

Hello Guys

Just a question. Has anybody got rejected from CIC due to NOC not matched with the relevant NOC ?

Please tell me what had they replied and what will happen in such a case do they straightaway reject or they give u time ?

 

[DelPiero07]

Yes.

 

[thecoldperson]

Hello Delpiero

Thanks for the reply. Can u throw some more light on this ?
Was this recent in 2016 2017 ?
Also please tell me what had they replied and what will happen in such a case do they straightaway reject or they give u time ?

 

[Srushti]

Hello Guys

Just a question. Has anybody got rejected from CIC due to NOC not matched with the relevant NOC ?

Please tell me what had they replied and what will happen in such a case do they straightaway reject or they give u time ?

Why do you ask ? Can you please be more specific with your case ?

 

[adanac_ati]

Yeah why did you ask? This is a sensitive point and i guess most of us want to know about it.

 

[thecoldperson]

Just want to know about this because my frnd and I both are in a similar situation u can assume and answer that. Thanks.

 

[DelPiero07]

It's a common rejection for express entry applications, NOC not matching with the duties and responsibilities in your reference letter.

You are free to look at the "reasons for rejection" thread to find the exact wording of such rejections but I can tell you they rejected those applications without asking for supporting documentation.

 

[Sugar2016]

Im also hoping CIC exercise some discretion when accessing cases e.g. show flexibility if working for a blue chip company, high salary/POF, good IELTS scores etc.

In my view CIC should really only be rejecting if risk of unskilled NOC - i.e. what difference does it make to Canada if your NOC is 1111 or 1112? They are both skilled NOCs.

 

[Ezgi84]

Im also hoping CIC exercise some discretion when accessing cases e.g. show flexibility if working for a blue chip company, high salary/POF, good IELTS scores etc.

In my view CIC should really only be rejecting if risk of unskilled NOC - i.e. what difference does it make to Canada if your NOC is 1111 or 1112? They are both skilled NOCs.

I agree with this... if the duties are still showing a skill of 0,A or B there should be some flexibility...

 

[g126]

They do show flexibility, but:
- If you Reference Letter is just a Copy and Paste of your NOC description
- If you don't have duties that match at least 60% of what's stated on your NOC

You MAY be in trouble!

This depends and a few things:
- For CEC they expect a letter matching the NOC pretty closely as Canadians Companies should know how to write such letters
- For FSW there is more discretion, but still if they are not convinced you do at least 60% of what you're supposed to do then you may have problems (see below)
- For PNP they may exercise even more discretion given that the province has already looked over the ref letter and is happy with it (but that's not always the case)

As for problems, these may be as follows:
- You may get a call form the officer basically interviewing you about your position
- You company/manager may get a call (this may happen even if your ref letter is 100% - depends on how reputable your company is I guess)
- You may be called in for an interview to better explain your activities (this is more common for self employed)
- You may be refused on the basis that the office is not satisfied that you can do what your NOC requires

I've also seen more than one case of refusal just because the reference letter supplied had the same duties as in the NOC word for word (copy and paste). But again this may depend on how reputable you company is.

I agree with this... if the duties are still showing a skill of 0,A or B there should be some flexibility...

Not necessarily, if you claim NOC of a doctor but have engineering duties in you ref letter (still Skill A) you'll get refused.

Im also hoping CIC exercise some discretion when accessing cases e.g. show flexibility if working for a blue chip company, high salary/POF, good IELTS scores etc.

In my view CIC should really only be rejecting if risk of unskilled NOC - i.e. what difference does it make to Canada if your NOC is 1111 or 1112? They are both skilled NOCs.

Again... You company's reputation matters, yes! If they are a global company and they are present in Canada then it's quite probable there will be more discretion, but to me this counts more towards the question of whether or not they'll be contacted than if they'll accept your duties for your NOC.

 

[Ezgi84]

Not necessarily, if you claim NOC of a doctor but have engineering duties in you ref letter (still Skill A) you'll get refused.

I guess thats pretty obvious in that section that it is a doctor If I declare that I am a heart surgeon and if I say some other duty with it (along with surgery) I am pretty sure that I will not be considered an engineer

 

[msudershan2]

Just to give my opinion on this

I have given three reference letter and fingers crossed, I am assuming everything is going fine as File is with NDVO.

I worked as Biological Scientist and honestly I didn't put 60% of Responsibilities as Molecular Biologist does only 3-4 mentioned in NOC Code 2121 compared to Pharmacologist who only do 4-5 mentioned in NOC Code 2121. Now CIC is putting this immense pressure on you to ask companies to put around 60% on paper, I don't think so! Therefore when people say to put at least 50-60% of your responsibilities, how could that be true, you can be 60% of all job titles mentioned in the NOC Code. I went to CIIP Session in Hyderabad where I had the opportunity to ask this question to Visa Officer / Case Analyst (at least that what they said they have experience of handling applications, so I assumed they are VOs or Case Analysts) and they say...they do not expect even 50% of responsibilities on Reference Letter (If you get this is obviously great)....They check Company - R&D, Awesome (Company Profile Fits) >> They are ok with 20-30% as long as company's profile show this. One of them mentioned all they want to assure that what you are saying is genuine!

Now I have also worked in Consulting...and CIC has put this again Broad Remit of NOC Code 4163 (Market Researcher, Consultants, and Business Development Officers)...how could you expect that consultant do work of Market Researcher if you want to fill that 60% thing...(In my opinion, this usually comes from people working in IT, my opinion do not take anything against me on this)....but this doesn't work for other NOC Codes

Now here I tell I showed Three Employers

Employer 1 (UK): Worked for 2 years. Big Pharma R&D - Wasn't able to get Reference Letter, just a letter from HR mentioning Salary, Hours, Position and she also mentioned due to EU Guidelines they are not able to issue such letters. I attached Payslips, Awards, Contract Letter, Promotion Letter along with Reference from Mentor in Big Pharma R&D on simple paper (Not even got it Notarized as she gave her Business Card and to show authenticity I even scanned Courier Package showing that she sent from the UK to India)

Employer 2 (Switzerland): Worked for a year to be precise 10 months. Known Pharma Consulting firm, however very brief reference letter which states my Roles within 4 lines. Attached Pay Slips + Income Tax Documents and luckily HR here also mentioned due to EU Guidelines on Data Protection they cannot give out detailed letters. Made my case even more strong. Thye mentioned Hours of Work, Salary, psotion too!

Employer 3 (India): Worked for a year to be precise 10 months. Start Up (Pharma Analytics) Ended on a bad note, never showed reference letter. Explained the reason company is not willing to give reference letter. Still attached Payslips, Promotion Letter, Resignation Letter, Form 16 and Income Tax Documents.

Employer 4 (India): Worked for 2 years to be precise 22.5 months. Small Start Up, however known in Pharma Market Research and Consulting. Gave 3 Page Detailed Letter (OMG this company went crazy)...on that and they even asked me if I am satisfied. They were the only one who actually mentioned 60-70% of responsibilities. Still attached Payslips, Promotion Letter, Resignation Letter, Form 16 and Income Tax Documents.

Since my file is at NDVO, I am assuming it passed A11.2 and R10 Review (Been 3.5 Months)...

In conclusion, I think company's core business should reflect what you are doing and please attach any documents you can for the employer. It just gives credibility and reliability to your work experience. Remember they want to establish you are genuine!

This is just my opinion.

I never showed my current job as I think I had documents to prove my 24 +10 + 10 + 22 = 66 Months Work Ex (5.5 Years) which gives me maximum points. Yes I do wake up in middle of night thinking that my AOR was in Nov End and mostly 40-50% have got PPRs, however, I have immense travel history and I do keep contemplating that what I have provided is more than sufficient to tell that I am genuine

I hope this helps people that it's not all matching duties. Think in shoes of VOs

 

[farazafzal]

Hello Guys

Just a question. Has anybody got rejected from CIC due to NOC not matched with the relevant NOC ?

Please tell me what had they replied and what will happen in such a case do they straightaway reject or they give u time ?

See point number 2 in this thread.

http://www.canadavisa.com/canada-immigration-discussion-board/reasons-for-rejection-faraz-summary-t471670.0.html

Good luck.

 

[thecalmestsea]

If my job function is made of several NOCs and I only choose one, this shouldn't be an issue, right?

The NOC I am using is 5122 - Editors, because the NOC duties are straightforward.
However, I (technically) work in 2 departments (but report to 1 Manager). The other part of my job comprises handling our company's complaint management process. But I can't find the corresponding NOC for this, so I went with 5122.

My role/rank will also just be 'Assistant Manager', due to the organisation's structure, but my job scope does specify 'Editor of xxxxx'.

 

[ButterflyChemist]

Just to give my opinion on this

I have given three reference letter and fingers crossed, I am assuming everything is going fine as File is with NDVO.

I worked as Biological Scientist and honestly I didn't put 60% of Responsibilities as Molecular Biologist does only 3-4 mentioned in NOC Code 2121 compared to Pharmacologist who only do 4-5 mentioned in NOC Code 2121. Now CIC is putting this immense pressure on you to ask companies to put around 60% on paper, I don't think so! Therefore when people say to put at least 50-60% of your responsibilities, how could that be true, you can be 60% of all job titles mentioned in the NOC Code. I went to CIIP Session in Hyderabad where I had the opportunity to ask this question to Visa Officer / Case Analyst (at least that what they said they have experience of handling applications, so I assumed they are VOs or Case Analysts) and they say...they do not expect even 50% of responsibilities on Reference Letter (If you get this is obviously great)....They check Company - R&D, Awesome (Company Profile Fits) >> They are ok with 20-30% as long as company's profile show this. One of them mentioned all they want to assure that what you are saying is genuine!

Now I have also worked in Consulting...and CIC has put this again Broad Remit of NOC Code 4163 (Market Researcher, Consultants, and Business Development Officers)...how could you expect that consultant do work of Market Researcher if you want to fill that 60% thing...(In my opinion, this usually comes from people working in IT, my opinion do not take anything against me on this)....but this doesn't work for other NOC Codes

Now here I tell I showed Three Employers

Employer 1 (UK): Worked for 2 years. Big Pharma R&D - Wasn't able to get Reference Letter, just a letter from HR mentioning Salary, Hours, Position and she also mentioned due to EU Guidelines they are not able to issue such letters. I attached Payslips, Awards, Contract Letter, Promotion Letter along with Reference from Mentor in Big Pharma R&D on simple paper (Not even got it Notarized as she gave her Business Card and to show authenticity I even scanned Courier Package showing that she sent from the UK to India)

Employer 2 (Switzerland): Worked for a year to be precise 10 months. Known Pharma Consulting firm, however very brief reference letter which states my Roles within 4 lines. Attached Pay Slips + Income Tax Documents and luckily HR here also mentioned due to EU Guidelines on Data Protection they cannot give out detailed letters. Made my case even more strong

Employer 3 (India): Worked for a year to be precise 10 months. Start Up (Pharma Analytics) Ended on a bad note, never showed reference letter. Explained the reason company is not willing to give reference letter. Still attached Payslips, Promotion Letter, Resignation Letter, Form 16 and Income Tax Documents.

Employer 4 (India): Worked for 2 years to be precise 22.5 months. Small Start Up, however known in Pharma Market Research and Consulting. Gave 3 Page Detailed Letter (OMG this company went crazy)...on that and they even asked me if I am satisfied. They were the only one who actually mentioned 60-70% of responsibilities. Still attached Payslips, Promotion Letter, Resignation Letter, Form 16 and Income Tax Documents.

Since my file is at NDVO, I am assuming it passed A11.2 and R10 Review (Been 3.5 Months)...

In conclusion, I think company's core business should reflect what you are doing and please attach any documents you can for the employer. It just gives credibility and reliability to your work experience. Remember they want to establish you are genuine!

This is just my opinion.

I never showed my current job as I think I had documents to prove my 24 +10 + 10 + 22 = 66 Months Work Ex (5.5 Years) which gives me maximum points. Yes I do wake up in middle of night thinking that my AOR was in Nov End and mostly 40-50% have got PPRs, however, I have immense travel history and I do keep contemplating that what I have provided is more than sufficient to tell that I am genuine

I hope this helps people that it's not all matching duties. Think in shoes of VOs

I'm a chemist and it would be impossible for any chemist to match the NOC duties as described. I wasn't worried about it. It's not so much about matching the duties as it is about resembling some aspect of the broad description in the lead statement. Then of course, the education, experience and salary must align. People focus so much on matching duties instead of actually documenting what they do, that they end up shooting themselves in the foot sometimes.

As for how many applicants with Nov AORs have gotten PR, we tend to forget that this forum is but a fraction of people who apply to CIC. Not everyone is on the forum and many who are stay silent so it's inaccurate to use the forum as if it represents everyone.