No invitation for oath 8 months after exam

[Kurtz]

Hi regg4791,

I'm in the same situation. Wife and I took test around late July, and her status changed to DM 2 or 3 days after the test. I got the CIT 0520 and I sent in all required docs in about a month. My status changed to DM when I checked in early December.

We're still waiting.

 

[sfaisalm]

I requested atip on 10th January and received report on 10th February as they said 31 days. However when we see report it says "Generated on 18th January 2016", does this means ATIP report is usually one month old?
Does any one know what meant by "email sent to CMB"
the application was routine.

Thanks

 

[regg4791]

Hi regg4791,

I'm in the same situation. Wife and I took test around late July, and her status changed to DM 2 or 3 days after the test. I got the CIT 0520 and I sent in all required docs in about a month. My status changed to DM when I checked in early December.

We're still waiting.

Hello Kurtz,

My suggestion is not to wait any longer and ask your MP to intervene. The constituency assistant (Don Valley East) who interviewed us told us they're receiving countless similar cases being handled by the Scarborough office. She told us they have a mess there.

We need to raise our voices and put some pressure until they put their act together.

Good luck and all the best.

 

[Diplomatru]

I requested atip on 10th January and received report on 10th February as they said 31 days. However when we see report it says "Generated on 18th January 2016", does this means ATIP report is usually one month old?
Does any one know what meant by "email sent to CMB"
the application was routine.

Thanks

CMB stands for Colombo. Are you from Sri Lanka?

 

[sfaisalm]

Hmmm.... No, it has one more meaning in CIC terms if someone know more details, it refers to Ottawa as per my information

 

[asaif]

Unfortunately, there isn't much you can do. This is a systemic problem. Citizenship officers have a discretionary authority with little, if any, oversight. If they don't like you for whatever reason, they can virtually keep you in the citizenship limbo forever. You are a permanent resident with no voting rights; and hence, can't hold the government accountable in any way. There is no public opinion or special interests supporting your case. If you complain, the simplest answer you'll get is that "citizenship is a privilege, not a right". And this privilege is put in the hands of unaccountable bureaucrats. The only thing you can do is to wait patiently until you get the Canadian citizenship and then try to fix the system from within through democratic mechanisms.

 

[sfaisalm]

Unfortunately, there isn't much you can do. This is a systemic problem. Citizenship officers have a discretionary authority with little, if any, oversight. If they don't like you for whatever reason, they can virtually keep you in the citizenship limbo forever. You are a permanent resident with no voting rights; and hence, can't hold the government accountable in any way. There is no public opinion or special interests supporting your case. If you complain, the simplest answer you'll get is that "citizenship is a privilege, not a right". And this privilege is put in the hands of unaccountable bureaucrats. The only thing you can do is to wait patiently until you get the Canadian citizenship and then try to fix the system from within through democratic mechanisms.

If it is really like that then this definitely a problem!. I would say we need to raise the voice even with PR, as CIC shouldn't be allowed to play with peoples future, if they delay any application, they should inform person legitimate reason of delay

 

[regg4791]

Unfortunately, there isn't much you can do. This is a systemic problem. Citizenship officers have a discretionary authority with little, if any, oversight. If they don't like you for whatever reason, they can virtually keep you in the citizenship limbo forever. You are a permanent resident with no voting rights; and hence, can't hold the government accountable in any way. There is no public opinion or special interests supporting your case. If you complain, the simplest answer you'll get is that "citizenship is a privilege, not a right". And this privilege is put in the hands of unaccountable bureaucrats. The only thing you can do is to wait patiently until you get the Canadian citizenship and then try to fix the system from within through democratic mechanisms.

Hello asaif,

I agree with you when you say there's a "systemic problem", but I completely disagree with you when you say "there isn't much I can do". If the system is like you're describing, then we must definitely raise our voices until it's either fixed or changed. Voting is not the only way there is to change things and it's not true that only citizens have rights. Please follow this link to the CIC site (http://www.cic.gc.ca/english/newcomers/about-pr.asp) and read the section "What permanent residents can do". It clearly states: "protection under Canadian law and the Canadian Charter of Rights and Freedoms.", and if you read Section 15 (Equality Rights) (https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Canadian_Charter_of_Rights_and_Freedoms#Equality_rights) it clearly states: "equal treatment before and under the law, and equal protection and benefit of the law without discrimination." If, as you mentioned, "If they don't like you for whatever reason, they can virtually keep you in the citizenship limbo forever", then those CIC officers are guilty of discrimination and therefore braking the law.

As PRs, we may not be able to vote, but the law gives us the means to let our voices heard though the MPs whom are responsible for assisting residents in their respective electoral districts. Here's an extract from a pamphlet I collected form my MP's office.

"It is my office's responsibility to assit and facilitate your interactions with the federal goverment. My team and I are deeply committed to assuring that our government and its various departments treat you with equity, fairnes and respect. My office can assist you with the following:

- Old Age Security Pension (OAS)
- Employment Insurance (EI)
- Guaranteed Income Supplement (GIS)
- Canada Pension Plan (CPP)
- Canada Border Services Agency (CBSA)
- Canada Post
- Canada Revenue Agency (CRA)
- Passport Canada
- Veterans Affairs
- Citizenship and Immigration
- Canada Student Loan"

 

[ambient2]

regg4791

What one should do, when his MP sends a letter and gets the respond from CIC that application is still in process? That's what happened to me; MP called and sent the letter. In the end of this interaction, MP's assistant apologies that they could do anything.

As asaif said, yes they can put you in citizenship limbo, and I'm feeling that that's exactly where I'm floating now.

 

[Politren]

All that happens because CIC don't have any mandatory deadlines to follow. And this is indeed very problematic.

 

[regg4791]

regg4791

What one should do, when his MP sends a letter and gets the respond from CIC that application is still in process? That's what happened to me; MP called and sent the letter. In the end of this interaction, MP's assistant apologies that they could do anything.

As asaif said, yes they can put you in citizenship limbo, and I'm feeling that that's exactly where I'm floating now.

Hello ambient2,

Unfortunately I'm not a legal adviser nor an immigration lawyer. Anybody that suspects his/her rights are being violated should seek legal representation.

All I'm saying here is that we should not simply accept a system that is showing signs of not being working properly. CIC has established some absurd mechanisms and rules (Eg. call CIC and accept whatever nonsense they tell you, or simply wait). To that I say: If your case is a routine case (no RQ), and you passed you exam, and not additional documentation was required, and the interviewing officer told you everything was OK and you don't receive the invitation for oath within an month after the exam then, request an ATIP report and once you get it, go and complain with your MP. If the MP doesn't respond, keep calling the MP plus write to the Minister of Immigration. If they don't respond, then keep doing the same plus write to the PM as well. And so on.... In short, don't stay quiet. If people don't denounce how bad things are, the world will assume everything is OK. They might not hear a single voice, but they'll hear the voice of a crowd.

 

[Politren]

I am not in the process yet, but I feel strong sympathy for the applicants experiencing long timelines.
I am sure that even the very strong applications can drop into this long timeline scenarios. For that reason I have already send 2 letters to the minister with the request to implement fast processing times with approval or denials with fixed mandatory deadlines for the CIC staff to follow.

 

[ambient2]

Hello ambient2,

Unfortunately I'm not a legal adviser nor an immigration lawyer. Anybody that suspects his/her rights are being violated should seek legal representation.

Thanks regg4791, It was more rhetorical question rather than actual one.
I agree that we should raise our voices, but the fact is even the media is not wanting to cover this any more.
Few days ago one of the Roma refugees were allowed to return to Canada with the help of my MP, and these kind of stories are more beneficial to the PR of our 'new' government, cause it seems like a 'humanitarian act', same with the refugees. Have they asked current applicants, who are in this limbo, how do they feel ?

 

[asaif]

I agree with regg4791 that, just like Canadian citizens, we as PRs are protected by the Canadian laws against injustice or discrimination. However, unlike citizens, we don't put these laws to serve our interests. So, for example, we can't pass a law that requires citizenship officers to reach a decision on our applications within a reasonable span of time (e.g., 6 months), or provide a clear and reasonable justification for the delay that can be challenged in courts of law, whereas citizens can do that for the matters important to them.

The irony here is that once PRs become citizens, they don't care anymore about the citizenship process unless they have a relative or a friend waiting in the line. In fact, many newly naturalized Canadians become quite reluctant to easing the process because they think this undermines the value of the Canadian citizenship (which they think of as a costly investment they made). Therefore, PRs will always remain powerless and at the mercy of a lousy system. This is just the nature of things. The most likely reply you'll hear if you try to raise this issue publically is: "You are still an alien, so you don't have the right to tell us how to treat the citizenship applicants. If you don't like our system, find yourself another country".

The immigration system is, understandably, designed in a way that gives the upper hand to the Canadian authorities and no power at all to the immigrant. The immigration application you submitted is, in fact, a 'supplication' rather than a binding agreement between two equal parties. No promise is made that the process will end in you becoming a citizen within a specific horizon, or at all. You can be deported, at their full discretion, at any moment by an administrative order with no need for a court ruling. Until you become a Canadian citizen, you are just an alien resident that live by the rules they put for you.

 

[Shortie]

I agree with regg4791 that, just like Canadian citizens, we as PRs are protected by the Canadian laws against injustice or discrimination. However, unlike citizens, we don't put these laws to serve our interests. So, for example, we can't pass a law that requires citizenship officers to reach a decision on our applications within a reasonable span of time (e.g., 6 months), or provide a clear and reasonable justification for the delay that can be challenged in courts of law, whereas citizens can do that for the matters important to them.

To be fair, the average Canadian citizen also cannot pass a law that requires anyone to do anything! The ONLY thing my husband as a citizen, can do that I can't, is vote for his local Member of Parliament on the 3rd Monday of October every four years! Other than that there is nothing he can do that I can't. I can raise issues with my MP as he can, I can write to a newspaper to raise issues, I can start a petition.... There is nothing he can do that I can't, other than vote. Once he has voted for his choice, there is little he can do until the next election four years later.. He can do no more than I can in fact.