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scylla

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A depressing article from today's Toronto Star. Note that the rents shown at the end of the article are average rents for the entire city of Toronto (including suburbs). Downtown Toronto rents are far more expensive (e.g. 2 bedroom $2K+ per month).

http://www.thestar.com/news/canada/article/1155144--new-immigrants-are-the-hidden-homeless-hidden-homelessness-a-growing-problem-for-canada-s-newcomers?bn=1

New immigrants are the ‘hidden homeless’

Anthony Rosario, his wife and three adult children shared a two-bedroom apartment in Scarborough when they first came from Bangladesh in 1998.

At times, they also shared their already crowded dwelling with other families, converting available space into bedrooms.

Space was tight but so was their budget, with their $900-a-month rent eating up half the family’s monthly income.

Up until February, Rosario and his wife, Mary, were still sharing their two-bedroom apartment with his son, daughter-in-law and two grandchildren.

“It’s tough to live with so many people in so little space, but you are bound to live like this when you don’t have money,” said Rosario, 61, a bakery chef, who two months ago finally moved into a subsidized seniors’ apartment after four years on the waiting list.

But a new study on immigrant housing warns that thousands of newcomers continue to live in “hidden homelessness” — in shared, overcrowded housing — an issue that has grown more acute, especially in Toronto, where affordable rental units are in short supply.

The national study by Metropolis, an international network of researchers in immigration policy, found most newcomers reported spending more than 50 per cent of income on housing, with 15 per cent spending 75 per cent or more.

“Financial difficulties force many newcomers to share accommodations that are often poor quality, overcrowded and unsafe,” says the report.

The report is based on national housing data and surveys of 600 migrants in Toronto, Montreal and Vancouver. In Toronto, where the average wage is $69,000, most newcomers surveyed had incomes under $20,000.

“New rooming houses are being created in the suburbs, in locations without rooming house regulations. Often illegal, suburban rooming houses can offer deplorable housing,” the report continued.

Newcomers also face discrimination in the housing market, with refugees, temporary residents, single parents, large families and people who do not speak English or French facing the greatest challenge, said University of British Columbia professor Daniel Hiebert, the study’s lead author. “The housing situation generally improves over time for most immigrants but there’s a fraction of the immigrant population where the challenges remain and persist for a long time,” he said.

In Toronto, the vacancy rate for rental accommodation fell to 2.1 per cent in 2010, well below the 3 to 4 per cent threshold, a decline more “sustained and dramatic” compared with other immigrant gateway cities, the report states. (The city’s vacancy rate in 2011 fell again to 1.4 per cent.)

Since the 2008 global financial meltdown, the report says, construction projects were cancelled and the number of apartment starts fell by almost 50 per cent in the city.

The recent supply of apartments is mostly intended for the condominium market, which has increased from 22.1 per cent of all starts in 1996 to 44.6 per cent in 2010.

Since 2000, the Toronto Housing Databank found that units with rents between $600 and $900 have decreased by 66,069, while those with rents between $901 and $1,500 and over have increased by 48,760.

“With rising rents, the loss of inexpensive rental units, and disproportionate growth in condominiums, the supply of affordable accommodation for newcomers, particularly those with children is limited,” said the study, whose Toronto section was led by York University professor Valerie Preston.

Toronto is home to the largest stock of social housing in Canada, with 127,545 units of rent-geared-to-income housing in which residents pay no more than 30 per cent of total income before taxes on housing. However, almost 90,000 households are on the waiting list, meaning wait times of four to 21 years.

The study calls for a national housing strategy by all levels of government and the redesigning of housing services for newcomers.

Vacancy and average rents in Toronto in 2010

Vacancy rateRent

Studio2.3%$778

1-bedroom2.4%$952

2-bedroom1.9%$1,118

3-bedroom or more1.6%$1,305

Dwelling (unit) starts in Toronto by type:

200820092010

Detached11,3088,1309,936

Semi2,3622,0321,654

Townhouse4,6122,9184,365

Apartments23,93012,86913,240
 
Re: New immigrants are the ‘hidden homeless'

scylla said:
A depressing article from today's Toronto Star. Note that the rents shown at the end of the article are average rents for the entire city of Toronto (including suburbs). Downtown Toronto rents are far more expensive (e.g. 2 bedroom $2K+ per month).


New immigrants are the ‘hidden homeless'

It also needs to be mentioned that most immigrants are also underemployed, forming the largest population of "hidden unemployment". They live in the ghetto-like areas of Toronto or other big cities. Canada is indeed very depressing for many immigrants who don't have a lot of money.
 
Re: New immigrants are the ‘hidden homeless'

This may be so for new immigrants. But I heard the news that more and more international students are buying houses and condos in the Greater Vancouver region.
 
  • Like
Reactions: hamgha
Re: New immigrants are the ‘hidden homeless'

What a Tragic and true story.
if people spend half of their income after the rents, what will remain for them to do anything in a city where everything has a Tax of 15%. Government must make cheap housing for the new immigrants.
 
Re: New immigrants are the ‘hidden homeless'

Can't comment anything on this article, but rents in big cities in India like Mumbai-Delhi matches that of Toronto or are more than that, which can only be affordable if you are a high earner. Otherwise its impossible to live there.

Best option for immigrants if stuck with low wage jobs, will be to live in smaller cities
1. Housing is much more affordable there(2/3 or 1/2 of Toronto or Vancouver rent)
2. As you are earning min wages income will be more or less the same whether in Toronto or any other cities.
3. Safer for women & children & men too.
 
Re: New immigrants are the ‘hidden homeless'

But why do so many immigrants choose Toronto? If you go to AB, rent is lower, there are more jobs, you have 1st day health care and there is no PST.
 
Re: New immigrants are the ‘hidden homeless'

It's all within me

Besides, that article reflects a situation which is global... occurring in most metros around the world, not specific to Toronto, or Canada as a whole.

As someone opined earlier, Rents here r pretty similar to the ones found in many cities. New Delhi, Bombay, Tokyo, London, Dubai, Abu Dhabi, Oslo etc. fare much worse. So, if one can't make-out here... sure s/he can't make-it-out in similar other parts of the world too. Not in Toronto for sure.

And then, I've observed, over the time, that this picture that was painted reg. New Immigrants is typical of "No-Go" cases... there'd always be such ppl who would not make it, whatever the Govt. does (why should the Govt. do anything for them is another discussion altogether), they'd remain future-starved no matter where they r... they were so in their homeland as well. Coming here didn't change anything. They were bound to fail - no matter where they lived.

I also see new immigrants making it out damn well in 2-3 yrs. And going gaga in 5-6 yrs... well placed, living well, enjoying their life out loud!

So, where did the difference emerge? It's our +ve attitude, determination, perseverance, disposition & smart planning/outlook that matters. These guys landed well prepared, knew what they were unto, took the right steps, were financially stable (I don't say, 'strong') from the day they took off from wherever they were, and proceeded to do well here as well.

A pointer about being financially stable: immigration is no bed of roses, for anyone. Moving to a foreign land will always have it's challenges, especially in the financial front. What with the thought that "oh, I've received my PR now, let Stephen Harper do it for me hereon, once I enter canada"? How dumb that thought could be. And it's potent to also note that most despicable situations r with those guys who land from the third world; and w/out the preparations. It's common knowledge that their homeland was much less expensive to live by, while North America is a "dog eats dog" territory. So, if u thought that with sparse means u could live well here - ur head needs to be examined.

CIC gave a certain table for settlement funds... r we aware that many, I repeat "many", land here with half of that, if at all they had any? And then there r guys who come here with borrowed sums! Which they either send back imdt upon landing, or need to pay a high monthly interest to the 'loan shark' back home. How did they ever think that they could do w/out the legitimate funds in this part of the world. Std of Living aside, things ought be over-the-top expensive (especially) for them, don't u think?

So, where do they go? Scar(e)borough, or Thorncliffe, if its Toronto that we r talking about. A life to start with from these places itself is deplorable from the word go. They didn't have the means, their friends-circle, here, were of similar backgrounds, who r still slogging here, they landed & 'shared' with them, it's by design that they'd 'share their misfortunes' as well. For a long long time.

Not to mention that this CIC table of funds is meant to be just a guideline; and at best meant to be for surviving for a couple of months w/out job. While, most of us could take more than 3-5 months to actually get something of a starter occupation, notwithstanding worthwhile. It's the same in any country. Once u move to another city, within ur country, do u think jobs were waiting for the grabs? So, why Canada would be any different? Uhh, newcomers r discriminated! Don't u discriminate the 'southerners' when they come to the 'north', in ur country? And vice-versa? So, where's the difference?

Moreover, this isn't an 'inter-city' migration... we r here talking about migrating to another part of the world altogether. The culture is different, the weather is different, the color (most of the time) is different, the upbringing is different, the religion (most of the time) is different, the individual thought process is different, the money-matters r different (oh, the currency equivalence is different too), the hiring process is different, the resume format is different, the work-culture is different, oh yeah - the smell of the land is different! And the works! So, why don't we prepare well in advance? We ought to 'change' ourselves if we have to survive here. The problem is: most would like others to 'change'.

I regret sounding tad rude here, but that's the irony - I would rather like Canada to roll out the red carpet for new immigrants, straight from Pearson International - but change or upgrade myself - I'd definitely not.

I see here all the time ppl/forumers asking where in Toronto do most Indians live, or the Chinese reside, or where the Muslims/Hindus/Sikh/Buddinst stay, some have gone further down to asking about typical third-world ethnic bifurcations within the city. Why don't we ever ask where the good-going Canadians live?

If I do not integrate, I'm afraid, I'd always remain an Indian-in-Canada, or a Chinese-in-Canada, or a Filipino-in-Canada, or a Muslim/Hindu/Buddhist/Sikh-in-Canada (no sectarianism involved in my quotes for the record), but I might never be a Canadian-from-Canada! It's an irony/shame that we tend to pass-on the same to our children as well... for whom we actually treaded this path (of immigrating to the west)... and they'd continue to be similarly called/imbibed/indoctrinated for generations, w/out becoming a Canadian. Did we actually plan it that way? Think about it.

Qorax
 
  • Like
Reactions: hamgha
Re: New immigrants are the ‘hidden homeless'

qorax said:
It's all within me

Besides, that article reflects a situation which is global... occurring in most metros around the world, not specific to Toronto, or Canada as a whole.

As someone opined earlier, Rents here r pretty similar to the ones found in many cities. New Delhi, Bombay, Tokyo, London, Dubai, Abu Dhabi, Oslo etc. fare much worse. So, if one can't make-out here... sure s/he can't make-it-out in similar other parts of the world too. Not in Toronto for sure.

And then, I've observed, over the time, that this picture that was painted reg. New Immigrants is typical of "No-Go" cases... there'd always be such ppl who would not make it, whatever the Govt. does (why should the Govt. do anything for them is another discussion altogether), they'd remain future-starved no matter where they r... they were so in their homeland as well. Coming here didn't change anything. They were bound to fail - no matter where they lived.

I also see new immigrants making it out damn well in 2-3 yrs. And going gaga in 5-6 yrs... well placed, living well, enjoying their life out loud!

So, where did the difference emerge? It's our +ve attitude, determination, perseverance, disposition & smart planning/outlook that matters. These guys landed well prepared, knew what they were unto, took the right steps, were financially stable (I don't say, 'strong') from the day they took off from wherever they were, and proceeded to do well here as well.

A pointer about being financially stable: immigration is no bed of roses, for anyone. Moving to a foreign land will always have it's challenges, especially in the financial front. What with the thought that "oh, I've received my PR now, let Stephen Harper do it for me hereon, once I enter canada"? How dumb that thought could be. And it's potent to also note that most despicable situations r with those guys who land from the third world; and w/out the preparations. It's common knowledge that their homeland was much less expensive to live by, while North America is a "dog eats dog" territory. So, if u thought that with sparse means u could live well here - ur head needs to be examined.

CIC gave a certain table for settlement funds... r we aware that many, I repeat "many", land here with half of that, if at all they had any? And then there r guys who come here with borrowed sums! Which they either send back imdt upon landing, or need to pay a high monthly interest to the 'loan shark' back home. How did they ever think that they could do w/out the legitimate funds in this part of the world. Std of Living aside, things ought be over-the-top expensive (especially) for them, don't u think?

So, where do they go? Scar(e)borough, or Thorncliffe, if its Toronto that we r talking about. A life to start with from these places itself is deplorable from the word go. They didn't have the means, their friends-circle, here, were of similar backgrounds, who r still slogging here, they landed & 'shared' with them, it's by design that they'd 'share their misfortunes' as well. For a long long time.

Not to mention that this CIC table of funds is meant to be just a guideline; and at best meant to be for surviving for a couple of months w/out job. While, most of us could take more than 3-5 months to actually get something of a starter occupation, notwithstanding worthwhile. It's the same in any country. Once u move to another city, within ur country, do u think jobs were waiting for the grabs? So, why Canada would be any different? Uhh, newcomers r discriminated! Don't u discriminate the 'southerners' when they come to the 'north', in ur country? And vice-versa? So, where's the difference?

Moreover, this isn't an 'inter-city' migration... we r here talking about migrating to another part of the world altogether. The culture is different, the weather is different, the color (most of the time) is different, the upbringing is different, the religion (most of the time) is different, the individual thought process is different, the money-matters r different (oh, the currency equivalence is different too), the hiring process is different, the resume format is different, the work-culture is different, oh yeah - the smell of the land is different! And the works! So, why don't we prepare well in advance? We ought to 'change' ourselves if we have to survive here. The problem is: most would like others to 'change'.

I regret sounding tad rude here, but that's the irony - I would rather like Canada to roll out the red carpet for new immigrants, straight from Pearson International - but change or upgrade myself - I'd definitely not.

I see here all the time ppl/forumers asking where in Toronto do most Indians live, or the Chinese reside, or where the Muslims/Hindus/Sikh/Buddinst stay, some have gone further down to asking about typical third-world ethnic bifurcations within the city. Why don't we ever ask where the good-going Canadians live?

If I do not integrate, I'm afraid, I'd always remain an Indian-in-Canada, or a Chinese-in-Canada, or a Filipino-in-Canada, or a Muslim/Hindu/Buddhist/Sikh-in-Canada (no sectarianism involved in my quotes for the record), but I might never be a Canadian-from-Canada! It's an irony/shame that we tend to pass-on the same to our children as well... for whom we actually treaded this path (of immigrating to the west)... and they'd continue to be similarly called/imbibed/indoctrinated for generations, w/out becoming a Canadian. Did we actually plan it that way? Think about it.

Qorax

very well said...i think the main point is BEING PREPARED..MONEYWISE AND WELL PLANNED MOVES. GOODLUCK TO US ALL.
 
Re: New immigrants are the ‘hidden homeless'

Leon said:
But why do so many immigrants choose Toronto? If you go to AB, rent is lower, there are more jobs, you have 1st day health care and there is no PST.

I don't know Alberta--I don't think I can live up there. So friggin cold! I live in a city considered as a decent place to live and raise your kids. If you go to a grocery store like Zehrs or Sobey's here, you can't find a single colored man or woman working there. It's the same everywhere here. I guess that's what makes immigrants stick together after having the doors shut in front of their noses. On the other hand, when I visit Toronto, some parts of the city are completely filled with colored immigrants. I am often confused if I'm in India. What I am saying is it's so segregated like a city in Alabama in the US. But I guess most immigrants should all say to themselves, "IT"S ALL WITHIN ME!" just like Qorax said, with tears streaming down their faces. When your kids ask, "Why are you crying, Daddy?" You say, "IT"S ALL WITHIN ME!" "Swallowed something bad?" your daughter say. "Yes, something bad called 'Canadian immigration.' IT"S ALL WITHIN ME!."
 
Re: New immigrants are the ‘hidden homeless'

steaky said:
If you go to Pacific Place mall in Calgary, you definitely would find authentic Chinese cuisine and other Asian services.

steaky, I'm not Chinese and not looking for any "Asian" services. You go eat lots of authentic Chinese food there. No thanks for me. Can't stand any Chinese sauce!
 
Re: New immigrants are the ‘hidden homeless'

cocosyr said:
steaky, I'm not Chinese and not looking for any "Asian" services. You go eat lots of authentic Chinese food there. No thanks for me. Can't stand any Chinese sauce!

but at least you can find asians working there! I heard that NW and SW Calgary are some of the decent places to live. Where do you live?
 
Re: New immigrants are the ‘hidden homeless'

steaky said:
but at least you can find asians working there! I heard that NW and SW Calgary are some of the decent places to live. Where do you live?

You see what I'm talking about? Total segregation! Canada is like Alabama in the 50's.
 
Re: New immigrants are the ‘hidden homeless'

cocosyr said:
I don't know Alberta--I don't think I can live up there. So friggin cold!

Were you ever in AB during winter? It doesn't actually feel that cold because it is a dry cold. Still, if it gets to -30 or colder, you do not want to spend a lot of time outside but that is only a few days a year that happens.

There is a higher percentage of colored people in Ontario than in AB for sure but from what I have seen in AB, I have worked with all kinds of people and everybody seems to have the same possibilities to move up if they work at it.
 
Re: New immigrants are the ‘hidden homeless'



1. Anthony Rosario, his wife and three adult children shared a two-bedroom apartment in Scarborough when they first came from Bangladesh in 1998.At times, they also shared their already crowded dwelling with other families, converting available space into bedrooms.Space was tight but so was their budget, with their $900-a-month rent eating up half the family's monthly income.
>>>> Today a 2 bedroom apartment in Scarbrough is rented in $1000-1100, no question arises that in 1998 rent was $900 and that too on shairing basis. This reporter cooks nice stories.

2. Up until February, Rosario and his wife, Mary, were still sharing their two-bedroom apartment with his son, daughter-in-law and two grandchildren.“It's tough to live with so many people in so little space, but you are bound to live like this when you don't have money,” said Rosario, 61, a bakery chef, who two months ago finally moved into a subsidized seniors' apartment after four years on the waiting list.
>>> So they were 4 adults to earn bread and 2 kids must be getting CCTB. Even with the survival jobs this family could have made $ 5-6000 and add $732 for the CCBT. When the desire is to relax and look at the government for benifits then one can not blame others for the miseries. I must congratulate this family of finally getting subsidized apartment, where all 4 adults can have more relaxation at tax payers cost.

3. But a new study on immigrant housing warns that thousands of newcomers continue to live in “hidden homelessness” — in shared, overcrowded housing — an issue that has grown more acute, especially in Toronto, where affordable rental units are in short supply.
>>> Where ever you go you would see in Toronto that the apartment management advertising for vacancy, i dont think rental units are in short supply. I dont see newcomers sleeping in shacks.

4. The national study by Metropolis, an international network of researchers in immigration policy, found most newcomers reported spending more than 50 per cent of income on housing, with 15 per cent spending 75 per cent or more.
>>> 50 % income going towards rent is for most of people in North America, so nothing unusual for newcomers.

Not everything published in news papers are correct. This report is not having more value than a trash. I just dumped it in my trash can.
 
Re: New immigrants are the ‘hidden homeless'

qorax said:
It's all within me

Besides, that article reflects a situation which is global... occurring in most metros around the world, not specific to Toronto, or Canada as a whole.

As someone opined earlier, Rents here r pretty similar to the ones found in many cities. New Delhi, Bombay, Tokyo, London, Dubai, Abu Dhabi, Oslo etc. fare much worse. So, if one can't make-out here... sure s/he can't make-it-out in similar other parts of the world too. Not in Toronto for sure.

And then, I've observed, over the time, that this picture that was painted reg. New Immigrants is typical of "No-Go" cases... there'd always be such ppl who would not make it, whatever the Govt. does (why should the Govt. do anything for them is another discussion altogether), they'd remain future-starved no matter where they r... they were so in their homeland as well. Coming here didn't change anything. They were bound to fail - no matter where they lived.

I also see new immigrants making it out damn well in 2-3 yrs. And going gaga in 5-6 yrs... well placed, living well, enjoying their life out loud!

So, where did the difference emerge? It's our +ve attitude, determination, perseverance, disposition & smart planning/outlook that matters. These guys landed well prepared, knew what they were unto, took the right steps, were financially stable (I don't say, 'strong') from the day they took off from wherever they were, and proceeded to do well here as well.

A pointer about being financially stable: immigration is no bed of roses, for anyone. Moving to a foreign land will always have it's challenges, especially in the financial front. What with the thought that "oh, I've received my PR now, let Stephen Harper do it for me hereon, once I enter canada"? How dumb that thought could be. And it's potent to also note that most despicable situations r with those guys who land from the third world; and w/out the preparations. It's common knowledge that their homeland was much less expensive to live by, while North America is a "dog eats dog" territory. So, if u thought that with sparse means u could live well here - ur head needs to be examined.

CIC gave a certain table for settlement funds... r we aware that many, I repeat "many", land here with half of that, if at all they had any? And then there r guys who come here with borrowed sums! Which they either send back imdt upon landing, or need to pay a high monthly interest to the 'loan shark' back home. How did they ever think that they could do w/out the legitimate funds in this part of the world. Std of Living aside, things ought be over-the-top expensive (especially) for them, don't u think?

So, where do they go? Scar(e)borough, or Thorncliffe, if its Toronto that we r talking about. A life to start with from these places itself is deplorable from the word go. They didn't have the means, their friends-circle, here, were of similar backgrounds, who r still slogging here, they landed & 'shared' with them, it's by design that they'd 'share their misfortunes' as well. For a long long time.

Not to mention that this CIC table of funds is meant to be just a guideline; and at best meant to be for surviving for a couple of months w/out job. While, most of us could take more than 3-5 months to actually get something of a starter occupation, notwithstanding worthwhile. It's the same in any country. Once u move to another city, within ur country, do u think jobs were waiting for the grabs? So, why Canada would be any different? Uhh, newcomers r discriminated! Don't u discriminate the 'southerners' when they come to the 'north', in ur country? And vice-versa? So, where's the difference?

Moreover, this isn't an 'inter-city' migration... we r here talking about migrating to another part of the world altogether. The culture is different, the weather is different, the color (most of the time) is different, the upbringing is different, the religion (most of the time) is different, the individual thought process is different, the money-matters r different (oh, the currency equivalence is different too), the hiring process is different, the resume format is different, the work-culture is different, oh yeah - the smell of the land is different! And the works! So, why don't we prepare well in advance? We ought to 'change' ourselves if we have to survive here. The problem is: most would like others to 'change'.

I regret sounding tad rude here, but that's the irony - I would rather like Canada to roll out the red carpet for new immigrants, straight from Pearson International - but change or upgrade myself - I'd definitely not.

I see here all the time ppl/forumers asking where in Toronto do most Indians live, or the Chinese reside, or where the Muslims/Hindus/Sikh/Buddinst stay, some have gone further down to asking about typical third-world ethnic bifurcations within the city. Why don't we ever ask where the good-going Canadians live?

If I do not integrate, I'm afraid, I'd always remain an Indian-in-Canada, or a Chinese-in-Canada, or a Filipino-in-Canada, or a Muslim/Hindu/Buddhist/Sikh-in-Canada (no sectarianism involved in my quotes for the record), but I might never be a Canadian-from-Canada! It's an irony/shame that we tend to pass-on the same to our children as well... for whom we actually treaded this path (of immigrating to the west)... and they'd continue to be similarly called/imbibed/indoctrinated for generations, w/out becoming a Canadian. Did we actually plan it that way? Think about it.

Qorax

Plus 1 for you for mate .