Landed!

[Raindrop73]

The message is heared and the lesson is learnt. your opinion reflects the 'actual' sitiuation in Canada where so many professionals stuck for the rest of their lives in blue collar jobs.

I decided to withdraw my PR application and save my whole academic and social life.

All the best my friend.

 

[rupeshhari]

Raindrop,

well done. All the power to you for deciding based on your situation and what you like and don't like with regard to your career, life, etc.
A lot of people don't want blue collar job (not that it is bad but we all have preferences) and end up going to canada and then get stuck in a job they don't want/like and they would have been more happier in their old country. I wish more people will make more clear decisions on reality and their values.

Good luck.

 

[cchabert]

Good Luck Raindrop73 !

 

[Flori]

Nobody want's to go back in life, either is work related, housing, economyc situation, or even you car. But white collar, blue collar, all that is overrated, you have to be happy with you job, or at least know what you are doing is to meet an end. The US has been for me and for so many people here, merely a step to meet our ends, wich for everyone here could be so different, since earning more money, acquiring more job experience, or more. Everyone thinking about moving to Canada, UK, Australia, or everywhere in the world, think about your current situation and analize if it worth risking what you have in order to obtain what you want. Obviously if you are planning to move, it means you are not completly happy with your lifestyle. I'm sure finding a job in Canada would not be easy for many of us, but if it helps to meet my ends, I'm again willing to try it, knowingly well the risk involved. Canada IS NO HEAVEN people please understand that. But it does offer some advantages like a better health system, a lower crime statistic than USA and Mexico, maybe my husband and I would have to take a paycut, but I could finally pursue my Ph.D. and he could keep studying too since Canadian programs are a lot more cheaper than in USA, especially if you are a resident. What Im trying to say is there's so many things to measure up before making than decision even if that means we would have to flip burgers sometimes. My pride is too strong to get smashed for a thing like that. I'd not feel less nor cry about it but rather work harder to keep on going. If you get "stuck" in a blue collar job that you don't like for the rest of your life, its because you are letting it happen.
Good luck with your decision Raindrop. I'd encourage more ppl who feels the same to take the same path. 'Cause it ain't gonna be easy.

 

[Raindrop73]

Rupeshhari,cchabert

Thanks my friends. The problem for me is not the blue collar jobs itself but the system there in general. there is no shame in work. After graduating from my MSc here in the UK, and while awaiting the funding for my PhD project, I had to do a very hard work to support my family. I did it and I am ready to do it again if I have to.

I came up with this decision after doing a deep reserach. The research I made just confirmed what I was trying to forget. I was trying to forget the many PhD holders I met, in person, in Canada when I was studying there, who had to work as cab drivers or doing similar jobs. They were stuck in such jobs for many years regardless the hard efforts to work their ways up.

That was at the booming economy times, now I am sure the situation is worse. Time now, in my humble opinion, is no good for moving there with the raising unemployment rate

I will concentrate in my PhD here in the UK where talent is much appreciated.

Flori,

My friend.

(If you get "stuck" in a blue collar job that you don't like for the rest of your life, its because you are letting it happen.)

I do NOT agree. How on earth could you come up with such conclusion. When many talented professionals moved there and been denied the opportunity to get the job they deserve and forced to work, for 12 hours a day, just to keep the food in the table, do you call this ' letting it happen !!

I call it ' locked out'.

(Canada IS NO HEAVEN people please understand that. But it does offer some advantages like a better health system,)

I totally agree with the first bit. Regarding the last sentence, I strongly recommend you to read the following link:

http://www.ctv.ca/servlet/ArticleNews/story/CTVNews/20080618/health_canadians_080618/20080618/?hub=Canada

All the best my friends.

 

[Flori]

Rupeshhari,cchabert

Thanks my friends. The problem for me is not the blue collar jobs itself but the system there in general. there is no shame in work. After graduating from my MSc here in the UK, and while awaiting the funding for my PhD project, I had to do a very hard work to support my family. I did it and I am ready to do it again if  I have to.

I came up with this decision after doing a deep reserach. The research I made just confirmed what I was trying to forget. I was trying to forget the many PhD holders I met, in person, in Canada when I was studying there, who had to work as cab drivers or doing similar jobs. They were stuck in such jobs for many years regardless the hard efforts to work their ways up.

That was at the booming economy times, now I am sure the situation is worse. Time now, in my humble opinion, is no good for moving there with the raising unemployment rate

I will concentrate in my PhD here in the UK where talent is much appreciated.

Flori,

My friend.

(If you get "stuck" in a blue collar job that you don't like for the rest of your life, its because you are letting it happen.)

I do NOT agree. How on earth could you come up with such conclusion. When many talented professionals moved there and been denied the opportunity to get the job they deserve and forced to work, for 12 hours a day, just to keep the food in the table, do you call this ' letting it happen !!

I call it ' locked out'.

(Canada IS NO HEAVEN people please understand that. But it does offer some advantages like a better health system,)

I totally agree with the first bit. Regarding the last sentence, I strongly recommend you to read the following link:

http://www.ctv.ca/servlet/ArticleNews/story/CTVNews/20080618/health_canadians_080618/20080618/?hub=Canada

All the best my friends.

I understand your point Raindrop, I really do, I know what it is to fight to get to some level in your life and how do you feel on not to want to go back. But believe me I and many of us know about real survival, about getting ahead on our lifes, on how to defeat adverse circunstances to advance. And I think the main obstacle to be sucessful its ourselves. I don't know your life, but let me tell you I've lived and see things you'd never imagine (or maybe you have seen them too). But remember most of us came from third world countries where from some ppl staying alive after highschool its a miracle (not that is my case). When you have to have two jobs and pay for you education, when you have nothing but less than $10 in your pocket and you still make it tru the month. When you make the minimum salary working 12 hrs a day (and no overtime) and still make to graduate from college somehow. And then you are telling me that one could have a Ph.D. already and that that person won't be able to make it tru. I believe then that its because you don't have what its necessary, if ppl with lesser advantage can pull it, why couldn't you. That's how I get to that conclusion.
Anyway, I'm not trying to change your mind, your reasons for moving (or in this case not moving) and my reasons are tottaly different, I don't know them and you don't know mine, so it would be stupid and arrogant of my part to try to change your mind. I really think you are right in taking the decision, and I totally understand ppl who wouldn't wanna move if their lifestyle doesn't make you take the risk IT'D BE STUPID TO MOVE TO A COUNTRY YOU DON'T KNOW, or that in your case, you know already.

And as for your link, I tought you were a phsysician. according to the note, you might re-consider, it looks like they are in real need of doctors. Also look at the comments, they are proposing to change to the US health care system (THEY GOT TO BE KIDDING ME).
There is one comment to pay attention to:
"
Go beyond the headline, people!
Does anybody read more than just the headline before posting a comment?

A few brief quotes: "four million Canadians are without a doctor, either because they have not found a family physician to take them on, or because they have not looked for one". Hmm....so I wonder how many people CANNOT find a doctor, versus how many DID NOT TRY to find a doctor?

Read on: "3.3 million individuals reported having somewhere to go when they fall ill" So, the headline could equally well have read "1 in 28 Canadians report not having anywhere to go when they fall ill". But that wouldn't have been nearly as attention-grabbing now, would it?

Read on: "most of them [men over age 12] admitted they have not looked for one". Hmmm. And "five per cent of seniors aged 65 or older reported not having a doctor. Only two per cent had not looked for one.". So, the headline could also have read "1 in 10 Canadians do not have a doctor because they haven't looked for one". That headline probably wouldn't have attracted 35 comments.....

You can lead people to information, but you can't make them read...."

The truth is ppl will always complaint no matter how good they have it, but have no worries, I'd look more into the subject as is my style.

 

[Flori]

Read this article in wkipedia:

http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Canadian_and_American_health_care_systems_compared

In both Canada and the United States , access to health care can be a problem. Studies suggest that 40% of US citizens and 5% of Canadian citizens lack adequate access to health care.

For example, according to a 2007 Consumer Reports study on the U.S. health care system, the underinsured account for 24% of the U.S. population and live with skeletal health insurance that barely covers their medical needs and leaves them unprepared to pay for major medical expenses. When added to the population of uninsured (approximately 16% of the U.S. population), a total of 40% of Americans ages 18-64 have inadequate access to health care, according to the Consumer Reports study.[36]

Also, based on 2003 data from the Canadian Community Health Survey,[36] an estimated 1.2 million (5%) of Canadians report that they do not have a regular doctor because they "cannot find" one, and just over twice that number report they do not have one because they "haven't looked". Those Canadians without a regular doctor are 3.5 times more likely to visit an emergency room for treatment.[36]

I've never said the Canada Health care system was perfect I just think its better than the one in the USA. Even tho I might be wrong, thats probably a chance I'd have to take.

 

[Raindrop73]

My friend, Flori

Thank you for your reply. Like you, I have seen alot in my life, good and bad, and very very bad. I had to walk for about 7km to my school just because I have no money at all in my pocket..I really mean NOTHING at all. Yet, I graduated the 1st in my whole college and been awarded a scholarship to do my postgraduate study. In short, I really do know what fighting and survive means.


And then you are telling me that one could have a Ph.D. already and that that person won't be able to make it tru. I believe then that its because you don't have what its necessary, if ppl with lesser advantage can pull it, why couldn't you. That's how I get to that conclusion.

You missed my point here.

What I ment has nothing to do with the ability. It has so much to do with the SYSTEM. When the system locked you out' then the change will come or has to come from the political willing to improve the whole situation. From what I heared and see, this willing is not there for many reasons.

There is a purpose behind it. The shortage of doctors there is very obvious, but the willing to change the situation is NOT there. I have heared about so many doctors who even though they spent many years trying to fulfil the requirments in order to give them the permission to practise their job, but they kept them out.

When you find yourself in similar situation, trust me, your attention will be focused in one thing only, keeping the food on the table. This will mean working most of the day, in a subhuman circumestances, which will destroy your energy, in a country well knowen by its very high tax rate, and you will be very lucky if you could keep up with your daily needs, the bills and the live expenses.

I am not trying to change your mind, and I am sure you are not doing the same thing. My point is not about survival. It is about choosing the right time to go to the right place. With the global financial crisis, I think taking the risk could be equal to DESTROY your life.

Please note that we both agree that Canada is no heaven, but I wanna say that it is really a heaven ONLY for someone who has nothing to loose.

I will keep the door open to move there, but when I see a sign for change in the system. This sign will be the light which will help me to put my steps in the right place, which is better than steping inside in a complete darkness.

By the way, I am not a phsysician, but a Health and Safety professional.

All the best my friend.

 

[Leon]

When you find yourself in similar situation, trust me, your attention will be focused in one thing only, keeping the food in the table. This will mean working most of the day, in a subhuman circumestances, which will destroy your energy, in a country will knowen by its very high tax rate, and you will be very lucky if you could keep up with your daily needs, the bills and the live expenses.

Subhuman circumstances? Are you kidding? I have a university degree, still decided to take a blue collar job in Canada and apprentice. I never hurt for money, I had a lot of fun and circumstances were far from subhuman. I don't know what you think blue collar people do but I am sure it's not like you imagine. As for the tax rate, it's a lot higher in Europe.

 

[Raindrop73]

Leon,

I am not kidding and I am not in the mode to do so. YES, subhuman circumestances!. I dont mean the subhuman situation one may find in some areas of Asia of Africa, but I mean racism, disrespect.

I am sure you enjoy the place there, maybe because you are from Iceland, not from India, or 3rd world countries.

I suggest you ask as many 3rd world immigrants as possible about this issue, and Iam sure you will be surprised !

 

[Flori]

Raindrop, I've had heard too about the lack on the system, keeping good profesionals from another part of the world out of the picture. And don't get me wrong, I think its real, I know I'd be very hard for me too, but I know I can do it, and if I see the system is completly messed up, then I'll leave, thats what I meant when I said "its because you are letting it happen" if things go so bad and in a catastrophic escenario, where you can barely make it tru, you can always try a different place, if one could make it out of a 3rd world country with a paycheck thats is less than nothing, Im sure you could make it out of Canada. Even if that means to start over. Now Raindrop, you live in the UK, why would you wanna move to Canada in the first place?
I live in the USA, and I know I could make tru here, but there are so many things I dont like here, and one of them is that I don't have a GC, and I don't like the uncertainty of the H1B1 visa (and believe me there are things worse than that). I can't change jobs when I want to (and I want to NOW) And applying for a residency here in the USA is too stressfull, expensive and takes a long of time, a lot of people here would agree for me on that.

 

[Raindrop73]

Raindrop, I've had heard too about the lack on the system, keeping good profesionals from another part of the world out of the picture. And don't get me wrong, I think its real, I know I'd be very hard for me too, but I know I can do it, and if I see the system is completly messed up, then I'll leave, thats what I meant when I said "its because you are letting it happen" if things go so bad and in a catastrophic escenario, where you can barely make it tru, you can always try a different place, if one could make it out of a 3rd world country with a paycheck thats is less than nothing, Im sure you could make it out of Canada. Even if that means to start over. Now Raindrop, you live in the UK, why would you wanna move to Canada in the first place?
I live in the USA, and I know I could make tru here, but there are so many things I dont like here, and one of them is that I don't have a GC, and I don't like the uncertainty of the H1B1 visa (and believe me there are things worse than that). I can't change jobs when I want to (and I want to NOW) And applying for a residency here in the USA is too stressfull, expensive and takes a long of time, a lot of people here would agree for me on that.

Flori,

I know I'd be very hard for me too, but I know I can do it, and if I see the system is completly messed up, then I'll leave

My friend,

I wish things are as easy as you think. Please note that most immigrants left their own jobs back home, sold their own homes, and they might spend their hard earning saved money once they are in Canada, so they are really stuck there. It is not that easy to leave Canada if things go so wrong, keep that in mind.

Now Raindrop, you live in the UK, why would you wanna move to Canada in the first place?

I have my reasons too. I was misled by the CIC lies that Canada is the land of opportunities, with an advanced health care system and wide job opportunities,( the ones that Canadian do not like to do).

After doing my research, I knew that things are not that bright there, so I decided to stay here. The UK is a nice place to live in, what makes me think to move to Canada is the same thing you mention about the US,the uncertainty. I am staying here as an international student, and getting the British PR takes a very long time with many restrictions. I would be more than happy if I got it because I like the country here and it seems better than Canada in many ways, the health care system is just one example.

All the best my friend

 

[Leon]

Leon,

I am not kidding and I am not in the mode to do so. YES, subhuman circumestances!. I dont mean the subhuman situation one may find in some areas of Asia of Africa, but I mean racism, disrespect.

I am sure you enjoy the place there, maybe because you are from Iceland, not from India, or 3rd world countries.

I suggest you ask as many 3rd world immigrants as possible about this issue, and Iam sure you will be surprised !

I have had some coworkers from all over the place, a couple from the Philippines and a couple from Ethiopia, also met people from Afghanistan, Iran and Kenya at my citizenship ceremony and they were all very happy to be in Canada. Not one of them mentioned subhuman circumstances. I don't know where you get that from. Maybe you feel you need to paint a bad picture of Canada to justify your decicision not to go. Canada isn't perfect but you don't have to paint it worse than it really is.

 

[Flori]

Yeah, I visited Canada, and for what I've seen its not that bad, I mean its not as good as some other ppl say it is, but neither the US or Canada are places where you can get stuck for life, I should know.

 

[Raindrop73]

(I have had some coworkers from all over the place, a couple from the Philippines and a couple from Ethiopia, also met people from Afghanistan, Iran and Kenya at my citizenship ceremony and they were all very happy to be in Canada. Not one of them mentioned subhuman circumstances. I don't know where you get that from. Maybe you feel you need to paint a bad picture of Canada to justify your decicision not to go. Canada isn't perfect but you don't have to paint it worse than it really is.)


Leon,

Thank you for your accusation!

First of all, I am not using a ‘Mental Defence mechanisms' which makes me turn over the Internal perception' of something to make acceptance of any contrary decision easier. That is regarding accusing me of trying to make a bad image of Canada just to justify my new decision not to go there NOW.

Secondly, about where I got this picture from, I would like to tell you that I spent 1 ½ year in Canada and I know , in person, many PhD holders who used to work as University professors back home, and I saw how bad they were suffering. I do NOT mean that EVERY blue collar worker is suffering, but most of them.

Thirdly,

‘I have had some coworkers from all over the place, a couple from the Philippines and a couple from Ethiopia, also met people from Afghanistan, Iran and Kenya at my citizenship ceremony and they were all very happy to be in Canada'

You just makes my laugh now !

One can not analyse an issue WITH A STRANGER during a citizenship ceremony ! this is not the right time/ place to discuss such matters, it is a time for celebration, for the only valuable AWARD for being a PR.

Ohhh...Could you please have a second look at the countries you mentioned in your post.

Philippines, Ethiopia, Afghanistan, Iran, Kenya!!

Could you please elaborate on what all these countries have in common ?

If you don not know about them, then it is better to do some research. These countries have very wonderful people live in a very hard and subhuman condition, either ruled by dictatorship/ corrupted systems or suffering from famine. I think this may explain why they COULD be happy in Canada!

All in all, I am a mature person who knows exactly what he wants. I am not trying to convince other people not to go there. Everyone has his own reasons, and everyone has his own story.

Please keep in mind that I am a Health and Safety professional, the specialist in conducting Risk Assessment and Analysis, and the result of my analysis could be concluded in the following:

‘ Due to the uncertainty and the raising unemployment rate in Canada, which is confirmed by the tendency to reduce the number of immigrants for this year, and with a poor ‘ networking skills' added to the lack of the valuable ‘Canadian expereince', I came up with a conclusion that CANADA IS NO GOOD PLACE TO BE IN, NOW.

(By the way, I very much like Canada, I spent a very wounderful time when I was an international student there, and I have nothing whatsoever against Canada as a LANDor PEOPLE, but being a single student there is totally different than moving there with a family, with the given circumestances)

I hope this helps.