HELLP!:Application to Change Conditions / Extend Your Stay in Canada as a Worker

[screech339]

While I would wholly support anyone that anyone can work beyond PGWP expiry date so long as CIC can actually get this in writing. Where is this "that PGWP is "sort of like an OWP". I want definitve proof of writing/regulation that say otherwise. I won't not take an agent's word over a written policy on "implied status" for PGWP. If someone can provide this link and supportive document, please provide it here.

I don't mean any disrespect to anyone, I don't trust CiC agent caller's word when one can get 3 different agents with 3 different answers. If they can't be consistent in each and every time then I can't take their word at face value until they provide documentation that specifically say that those on PGWP can work past the expiry date under "implied status". It doesn't affect me at all but would hate to see someone get in a world of trouble when they get caught working past their PGWP over the word on an agent caller.

Screech339

 

[truesmile]

Granted, but in the case of 'bankerguy's case they HAVE been consistent. On the basis of two agents' corroborating responses (and the well-trained kind also), he is FAR from being in a "world of trouble". If it could so easily be found and posted here, heck we would have no need for this forum, for that or the many other lingering questions that forum members have.

 

[screech339]

FW-1

5.22. Work without a work permit R186(u)—Implied status
R186(u) allows for persons to continue working under the conditions of an expired work permit, as
long as they applied for a new work permit before the original work permit expired and have
remained in Canada. Once the decision has been made, the client will either have to leave
Canada or will continue as a worker who holds a valid work permit.
See also OP 11, section 24.

OP11, section 24,

24. Implied status
(Replaces OB 092 – January 15, 2009)
A temporary resident must apply to extend their period of authorized stay before it ends. If they
have done so, their period of authorized stay as a temporary resident is extended by law until a
decision is made [R183(5)]. Such a person is considered to have implied status as a temporary
resident during that period.
If a temporary resident applies for renewal of their work or study permit and their permit expires
before a decision is made, R186(u) and R189 (the right to continue working or studying under the
same conditions pending a determination of their application for renewal) apply only as long as
the person remains in Canada.
A temporary resident with implied status who has left Canada may:
• be allowed to re-enter Canada as a temporary resident, pending a decision on the renewal of
their application to study or work in Canada, provided they are TRV exempt as per R190 or on
a multiple-entry visa. They may not resume work or study in Canada until their application for
renewal has been granted. For those not able to resume work, they must satisfy the BSO that
they have sufficient means of support. (Note that this applies to foreign nationals who are
TRV exempt as per R190(3)(f) and to those on multiple-entry visas.)
• be allowed to apply for a new work or study permit at the port of entry provided they have a
right to do so under the Regulations.

The first part is listed in FW-1 manual and the second is OP11 manual.

The OP11 specified that those one study or work permit can be on implied status. I highlighted the work/study portion of OP11.
It does not specify Post Graduate Work Permit. This is the only "in writing" I can find that says only those on study and work permit gets implied status.
I believe that the omittal of Post Graduate Work Permit along with IEC work permit is due to the fact that they are not extendable/renewable within Canada.

On this basis do I believe that you cannot work beyond your PGWP under "implied status".

Screech339

 

[truesmile]

And yet on the basis of your quote of section 5.22 I read it that he/she is allowed to work beyond it. Hence, the phone calls, hence the two corroborating responses (from CIC no less), hence the decision not to worry about it.

 

[screech339]

And yet on the basis of your quote of section 5.22 I read it that he/she is allowed to work beyond it. Hence, the phone calls, hence the two corroborating responses (from CIC no less), hence the decision not to worry about it.

But you are ignoring OP11 or cherry picking the one that suits your thoughts. Section 5.22 is too vague. So it lists OP11 24 for specifics. It says "also see OP11 section 24" to section 5.22. It is like you don't want to go look at OP11.

Screech339

 

[hockeyfan]

But you are ignoring OP11 or cherry picking the one that suits your thoughts. Section 5.22 is too vague. So it lists OP11 24 for specifics. It says "also see OP11 section 24" to section 5.22. It is like you don't want to go look at OP11.

Screech339

Interesting debate that you both are making!

Just to clarify, Screech, a post graduate work permit is a type of work permit. I am not too sure what you mean by omitting IEC and post graduate work permits. And OP11 24 only talks about study / work permits...

 

[screech339]

R186(u) and R189 (the right to continue working or studying under the
same conditions pending a determination of their application for renewal) apply only as long as the person remains in Canada.

Notice that it says "pending a deterination of their application for renewal". Note the word RENEWAL.

IEC and PGPW are not renewable according to FW-1 Section 11.2

Categories of work with validity periods which may not be exceeded.

International Experience Canada Programs
R205(b), exemption C21. Most programs are six months or one year

Post-graduate employment
R205(c)(ii), exemption C43 – Can be used only once;
total employment up to a maximum of three years. (See OP 12 for details)

OP12 Section 7.3
7.3. Temporary Resident Work Permit
If a temporary resident applies for renewal of their work or study permit and their permit expires
before a decision is made, R186(u) and R189 (the right to continue working or studying under the
same conditions pending a determination of their application for renewal) apply only as long as
the person remains in Canada.

So far there are no mention of PGWP and IEC getting ability to work under "implied status" Only those on study and work permit get implied status on the premise that they are renewable.
This under this premise do I believe that PGWP and IEC work permits don't get the "implied status".

Screech339

 

[hockeyfan]

Cool, thanks for clarifying!

 

[bankerguy]

R186(u) and R189 (the right to continue working or studying under the
same conditions pending a determination of their application for renewal) apply only as long as the person remains in Canada.

Notice that it says "pending a deterination of their application for renewal". Note the word RENEWAL.

IEC and PGPW are not renewable according to FW-1 Section 11.2

Categories of work with validity periods which may not be exceeded.

International Experience Canada Programs
R205(b), exemption C21. Most programs are six months or one year

Post-graduate employment
R205(c)(ii), exemption C43 – Can be used only once;
total employment up to a maximum of three years. (See OP 12 for details)

OP12 Section 7.3
7.3. Temporary Resident Work Permit
If a temporary resident applies for renewal of their work or study permit and their permit expires
before a decision is made, R186(u) and R189 (the right to continue working or studying under the
same conditions pending a determination of their application for renewal) apply only as long as
the person remains in Canada.

So far there are no mention of PGWP and IEC getting ability to work under "implied status" Only those on study and work permit get implied status on the premise that they are renewable.
This under this premise do I believe that PGWP and IEC work permits don't get the "implied status".

Screech339

when i spoke with the CIC agent, he said PGWP is a TYPE of open work permit..and therefore it does qualify for 'implied status'.

english/department/media/releases/2008/2008-04-21.asp

this CIC link..check it out....

for the first time, these international students would be able to obtain an open work permit under the Post-Graduation Work Permit Program, with no restrictions on the type of employment and no requirement for a job offer. In addition, the duration of the work permit has been extended to three years across the country. Previously, the program only allowed international students to work for one or two years, depending on location.

 

[screech339]

when i spoke with the CIC agent, he said PGWP is a TYPE of open work permit..and therefore it does qualify for 'implied status'.

english/department/media/releases/2008/2008-04-21.asp

this CIC link..check it out....

for the first time, these international students would be able to obtain an open work permit under the Post-Graduation Work Permit Program, with no restrictions on the type of employment and no requirement for a job offer. In addition, the duration of the work permit has been extended to three years across the country. Previously, the program only allowed international students to work for one or two years, depending on location.

Now I admit I don't know the full history of PGWP. From what I am reading what you post sounds like prior to this new change, it is similar to LMO work permit in that you are stuck with one employer for 1 or 2 years max, one time use. Now the changed it to similar to an open work permit in that you don't require an LMO and you can work for any employer for a max 3 year, still ONE TIME USE. It still doesn't change the fact that it is not renewable.

CIC probably revised it because they thought it was too restrictive subjecting graduates to only one employer. And employers probably took advantage of this. Allowing it to be similar to OWP in that graduates can switch employers if they choose. This help prevents employers from taking advantage of them.

Screech339

 

[truesmile]

So I was wrong! They ARE prepared to put it in writing . . . see excerpt from another forum members post (member's PGWP will also expire soon):

"As a Foreign National in Canada you are not eligible to apply for an open work permit until such time as you receive confirmation that your application for Permanent Residence will be processed from within Canada. Your application for an open work permit will be considered at the same time as your application for permanent residence and if the latter is accepted, the open work permit will be issued to you. Meanwhile, you are considered to have implied status and you may continue to work for any employer under the same conditions imposed on your most recent work permit."

 

[screech339]

So I was wrong! They ARE prepared to put it in writing . . . see excerpt from another forum members post (member's PGWP will also expire soon):

"As a Foreign National in Canada you are not eligible to apply for an open work permit until such time as you receive confirmation that your application for Permanent Residence will be processed from within Canada. Your application for an open work permit will be considered at the same time as your application for permanent residence and if the latter is accepted, the open work permit will be issued to you. Meanwhile, you are considered to have implied status and you may continue to work for any employer under the same conditions imposed on your most recent work permit."

Thanks truesmile on posting this information. Based on what you posted, PGWP do not get "implied status" perk. They can only work until the visa expires, no further. Just hope bankguy's girlfriend will get her OWP before it expires.

Screech339

 

[bankerguy]

Thanks truesmile on posting this information. Based on what you posted, PGWP do not get "implied status" perk. They can only work until the visa expires, no further. Just hope bankguy's girlfriend will get her OWP before it expires.

Screech339

I dont follow....

"Meanwhile, you are considered to have implied status and you may continue to work for any employer under the same conditions imposed on your most recent work permit."

Meanwhile means that while we wait for AIP and the OWP to be processed.... she IS considered to have implied status...

am i reading this wrong.? to me, based on the wording of the above quote...she can continue to work under implied status when her PGWP expires.

 

[screech339]

I dont follow....

"Meanwhile, you are considered to have implied status and you may continue to work for any employer under the same conditions imposed on your most recent work permit."

Meanwhile means that while we wait for AIP and the OWP to be processed.... she IS considered to have implied status...

am i reading this wrong.? to me, based on the wording of the above quote...she can continue to work under implied status when her PGWP expires.

Which part do you not understand. It said "must follow same conditions imposed on current work conditions". The current PGWP conditions is that it is not extendable. So you must end employment on day of expire date. But you would still have "implied status" as a visitor after that date as you can continue to stay after PGWP. Expires.

Screech339

 

[bankerguy]

Which part do you not understand. It said "must follow same conditions imposed on current work conditions". The current PGWP conditions is that it is not extendable. So you must end employment on day of expire date. But you would still have "implied status" as a visitor after that date as you can continue to stay after PGWP. Expires.

Screech339

check out that other thread..

the 'conditions' are not the same as what you're thinking.