FSW WORLDWIDE

[imransyed]

For those who want to see how "Free Market" in Canada works and well... crashes :

Its a two part documentary. On how Nortel become a massive giant and .... blew up entire economy of Canada. Warning : 1:30 hours each. Short summary, Nortel started as an assembling partner of Bell/Lucent, became independent 60s or so and started producing independent products, became massive, Canadians put all their money and pension in it and then ... it blew up tanking Canada's economy and pensions.

Why should you watch it?

Because it shows you how fucked up "Free Market" in Canada gets..
Because it shows how Canada has a fundamental relationship with greed... It makes them really blind. I mean really.
Because it shows that when shit really hits the fan, first one to dump its vulnerable people is Canadian goverment.
Because it shows how deeply ingrained "value signalling" is in this society.
Because it shows just how great Canadian folks are at blaming things on other and finding an external cause who is unfair, uncouth and foreign... They ... never look for the real obvious systemic issues. (Frankly, I was literally shaking my head during the section when the real issue that killed Nortel was discussed. It has all the echos of the current housing crisis. Everyone tries finding the villians, except... there was none!)

Most importantly, it shows how really big business in Canada work. It is really eye opening.

If nothing, just watch the second half of the second video. Personally, it was very very interesting for me but then, I do not expect a rather dry documentry to be everyone's taste.

@iSaidGoodDay If you get time, do watch it.. Just double the speed of the video. It sounds funny but very understandable.

This is not just a documentary, its a horror movie if I can even call it that. I watched the second half of part 2 in utter disbelief.
Just horrific what the poor employees had to put up with, especially those that stuck to the end. What a royal betrayal.

What's even more horrific is that nothing really changed despite this mess. This is greed and incompetency like I have never witnessed in my whole life.

I am glad you posted about this here, really gives a deep insight into the inner workings of Canada.

 

[imransyed]

Absolutely, this is what I meant. All those landlords and big corporations want as many new people coming in as possible.

I watched a documentary about how the the general public in western countries moved from a collective identity to an individualistic one progressively from baby boomer to gen z era. And how it has cost the society at large to be divided and exploited by the greedy corps here.

I am not an expert because I watched a random youtube video, but I think its likely impossible to come back from the grave the average Canadian and the Govt. has dug itself into. This divide will get worse and worse. Middle class is too busy making ends meet to fight for themselves. The ladder has already been pulled up.
Even before watching the Nortel documentary, I knew Pierre Poilevre is not the solution. Now I know that there is no solution. We are Too busy fighting amongst each other to imagine a collective betterment of the society at large here.

 

[GandiBaat]

Thing with Canada is, a lot of its things are not as widely known as US does. Both good and bad.

Everyone who has spent time online or in consuming general news practically anywhere has heard of Enron, 2008 great recession, 2001 dot com burst, 9/11, FBI fuck ups in wake of 9/11 that persecuted innocent American Muslims. If not for facts then its references in popular media like movies.

Just how many have heard of Nortel, 1985 Kanishka bombing, CSIS and RCMP screw-ups in investigation of 1985 bombing, Canadian pipeline fiasco? Because who makes a movie referring 1985 bombing or failure of Nortel?

Canada lives in the shadow of USA.

 

[seadrag0n]

Today I learned that there is something called occupancy fees in Canada when you buy a pre-construction condo.

So, when the unit is complete and it's time to move in, supposedly you are not the owner yet and need to wait till the builder registers the whole building with the government and you officially become the owner. Until that happens, you have to pay "occupancy fees" to the builder which is like paying rent and that money doesn't even goes toward your mortgage, which means that this is free money that you are giving to the builder.

Because of the high interest rates, this occupancy fees is super high right now, around 3500 CAD when the max rent for the same unit will be around 2300 CAD.

How is this even legal?

 

[abhiram.kumar]

I watched a documentary about how the the general public in western countries moved from a collective identity to an individualistic one progressively from baby boomer to gen z era. And how it has cost the society at large to be divided and exploited by the greedy corps here.

I am not an expert because I watched a random youtube video, but I think its likely impossible to come back from the grave the average Canadian and the Govt. has dug itself into. This divide will get worse and worse. Middle class is too busy making ends meet to fight for themselves. The ladder has already been pulled up.
Even before watching the Nortel documentary, I knew Pierre Poilevre is not the solution. Now I know that there is no solution. We are Too busy fighting amongst each other to imagine a collective betterment of the society at large here.

You’ve basically explained the end result of capitalism. There’s nothing anyone wants to do about it as no other alternative form of economic system actually works. Communist and Socialist countries have been extreme failures and let’s face it, everyone likes to virtue signal about collective well being but no one actually likes to contribute towards that. Once an individual reaches the upper middle class, they hate the fact that their income tax contributions have gone up by a significant margin. A lot of third world immigrants who move to the west, especially the ones who move to European countries, hate high rates of income taxation. Similarly, Europeans who are in the upper middle class, hate paying high levels of income tax and move to tax free regimes in order to save their money. The reality is that most people, wouldn’t think twice about jumping ship and settling in a place permanently if they were ever presented with the opportunity of paying zero taxes. They don’t actually give a rats ass about collective good. Individuals who actually care about contributing towards a collective well being are few and far between. They are an endangered species.

 

[navinball]

Today I learned that there is something called occupancy fees in Canada when you buy a pre-construction condo.

So, when the unit is complete and it's time to move in, supposedly you are not the owner yet and need to wait till the builder registers the whole building with the government and you officially become the owner. Until that happens, you have to pay "occupancy fees" to the builder which is like paying rent and that money doesn't even goes toward your mortgage, which means that this is free money that you are giving to the builder.

Because of the high interest rates, this occupancy fees is super high right now, around 3500 CAD when the max rent for the same unit will be around 2300 CAD.

How is this even legal?

It gets worse. Before your loan gets approved the house gets devalued because of housing market crash you still owe the original price to the builder and the bank will only approve the actual value lol. So if you signed up for 1 million home and it's now 800k. You better come up with the 200k cash or its trouble.

 

[GandiBaat]

Today I learned that there is something called occupancy fees in Canada when you buy a pre-construction condo.

So, when the unit is complete and it's time to move in, supposedly you are not the owner yet and need to wait till the builder registers the whole building with the government and you officially become the owner. Until that happens, you have to pay "occupancy fees" to the builder which is like paying rent and that money doesn't even goes toward your mortgage, which means that this is free money that you are giving to the builder.

Because of the high interest rates, this occupancy fees is super high right now, around 3500 CAD when the max rent for the same unit will be around 2300 CAD.

How is this even legal?

Its legal because you sign a contract and allowed in Condominium Act with a calculation on occupancy fee. It is allowed because during this time Builders own the building and when you sign the purchase contract, you agree to occupy on that date. That said most builders allow you to rent that property. That way you can save some money if your property is in a location that is under rental demand.

Interim fee is the still the least bothersome part of the purchasing a pre-built property. The more bothersome part is typical purchase agreements allow builders to make massive changes to the layout of the condo and location of common amenities like pool, gym, parking location, locker location etc. The legal argument used there is called "material to the contract" and that is not well defined and differs from case to case. So, yes, if you thought you will have a balcony facing the sea, you may be suprised to find that builder is allowed to change that to face a construction site by moving it to another facing of the building... possibly to save construction cost.

The only reason why people go for presales contract is FOMO and the constant absurd rise in the condo prices and rentals. If that is not there, builders will be forced to negotiate and behave and actually provide services. They will have massive sunk cost in the project.

I personally, will NEVER buy an under construction condo. All new condos in Canada are stupidly sized (like 3 bedroom condo in 700-800 Sqft??? WTF???), not meant for living and have stupid construction with shoddy practices. Actually no condo built after 2003-05 in canada is worth living. They are simply shoeboxes in the sky. Or townhouses that are too stupid with 4 floor layout to save land space (typically a basement, main floot, first floor and "loft floor"). These narrow deep and tall abominations are sold at a premium to buyers. If you want a newly built place, buy the land and construct yourself. Otherwise what you will get a unit will be absolute shit. Best Condos/Townhouses in Canada are those built in 70s 80s and 90s (if you are not on western shore.. 90s condos of western shore have an additional issue of failing envelope due to building code stupidity of that time.). At best look for early 2000s condos. Anything post 2008 is SHIT. Just avoid it. If it is past 2015 or 16, just do not even look at it. It will small, overpriced and stupidly laid out.

 

[GandiBaat]

It gets worse. Before your loan gets approved the house gets devalued because of housing market crash you still owe the original price to the builder and the bank will only approve the actual value lol. So if you signed up for 1 million home and it's now 800k. You better come up with the 200k cash or its trouble.

Thats a little far fetched. Depending upon who the lender is, they typically use tax assessment value to decide the value of your property. Assessment values have yet to fall in major markets in Canada. It will be fun when they will fall.

For one thing, in a market like present, never offer more 80% of the assessed value. And yes, never bloody buy a presales offer. Do not buy unless you can get an independent inspector to look at the place and you can check the layout. Its always easier to skip on a deal than to chase a bloody builder for warranty.

My place still shows an assessment above 1.3M from July 2022. When I made an offer, I made it 80% of 2019 assessment value. Realtor told me that it is likely that seller wont agree. I said, good for the seller then. Seller agreed.

 

[navinball]

Thats a little far fetched. Depending upon who the lender is, they typically use tax assessment value to decide the value of your property. Assessment values have yet to fall in major markets in Canada. It will be fun when they will fall.

For one thing, in a market like present, never offer more 80% of the assessed value. And yes, never bloody buy a presales offer. Do not buy unless you can get an independent inspector to look at the place and you can check the layout. Its always easier to skip on a deal than to chase a bloody builder for warranty.

My place still shows an assessment above 1.3M from July 2022. When I made an offer, I made it 80% of 2019 assessment value. Realtor told me that it is likely that seller wont agree. I said, good for the seller then. Seller agreed.

Not far fetched at all. This couple walked away from 150k. Imagine that a 150k loss and they are relieved it's not worse.

 

[seadrag0n]

Condos are the scammiest scams in Canada.

 

[iSaidGoodDay]

Not far fetched at all. This couple walked away from 150k. Imagine that a 150k loss and they are relieved it's not worse.

Your video is about hair cutting for dads.

 

[navinball]

Your video is about hair cutting for dads.

edited

 

[Impatient Dankaroo]

Your video is about hair cutting for dads.

Despite being a slumlord and working tech in US, he still wants to save money on haircuts, a true Gujew

 

[GandiBaat]

Not far fetched at all. This couple walked away from 150k. Imagine that a 150k loss and they are relieved it's not worse.

The complete story is here : https://kitchener.ctvnews.ca/ontario-couple-walks-away-from-140k-after-dispute-with-developer-1.6656706

The issue was not of devaluation per say, it was interim occupancy fee and interim occupancy period that broke their back. Actually there was no devaluation but there were incentives that builder was offering to other customers. This couple did not get those incentives because they had signed on dotted lines much much earlier.

Typically interim occupancy period is 3-6 months, however here it was ..... indefinite. And to add to it, builder DOUBLED the interim occupancy fee and condo maintenance fee. WEIRD! I think these guys never read the purchase agreement nor got it vetted by a lawyer. They ...did not understand the risk in pre-con purchase. LOL! Plus something else is going on here. There are regulations regarding how interim occupancy fee is calculated. Something here is fishy.

And then these folks blame International students for abusing their food banks. LOL! Very Canadian.

And to make the matter ... worse, I am sure as hell they would have not added condition to the offer too.... People in Ontario in 2022 were really going full naked back then just to grab the deal.

 

[GandiBaat]

Condos are the scammiest scams in Canada.

There is nothing scammy about condos, its just that builders are people everywhere which are more slimy than used cars salespeople. There is a special place in hell for builders and telecom operators.