Expired PR card in 2012 but need to join University in 2018

[canuck78]

As these cases have become more common I will be curious whether there will be a change of ruling especially as many of these families spent less than a couple of months in Canada. It seems to be a new technique to get your children into a Canadian university and pay domestic fees. As someone pointed out from canlii recently a young adult was denied H&C because she had no real links to Canada. The original intent was to allow children who had spent a large portion of their schooling in Canada to return to do further studies although their family had moved for work/family reasons to another country.

 

[rish888]

As these cases have become more common I will be curious whether there will be a change of ruling especially as many of these families spent less than a couple of months in Canada. It seems to be a new technique to get your children into a Canadian university and pay domestic fees. As someone pointed out from canlii recently a young adult was denied H&C because she had no real links to Canada. The original intent was to allow children who had spent a large portion of their schooling in Canada to return to do further studies although their family had moved for work/family reasons to another country.

I doubt the primary intent in most cases is that the kids get domestic tuition. If it were, most would be applying for EE when their kids are ~15 so they could go to Canada and still be in compliance with their RO. (People have kids relatively early in most Eastern cultures so most wouldn't loose a lot of points because of age.)

For example. my parents decided to immigrate to Canada because they woke up one morning and said "why not?"

Funnily enough my initial PR card was rejected due to a photo issue and because my parents didn't understand the difference between PR status and the PR card they were always under the assumption that I never became a Permanent Resident.

It was only a while back while completing a travel history questionnaire for a British visa that I realized that I held an immigrant visa which lead me to discovering that I had in fact became a PR and am still one. Despite the reduced tuition in Canadian schools my parents still want to me to go to the U.S./UK uni. (they believe the education system is better and leads to better employment prospects etc.)

I do believe that intent is the correct way to determine abandonment of status. (Used to be what Canada used, and is still used by the U.S.) It's unfair to place a requirement on people that are incapable of fulfilling them. If principle is not enough, it's been statistically proven that the greatest benefit Canada gets from immigrants doesn't come from the first-generation, but from their Canadian born children/children who immigrated with their parents at a very young age.

People will of course always have a difference of opinion, and I can completely see the other side, but I think the right way to address the issue would be to restrict domestic tuition status to students who graduated from a Canadian high school/whose parents graduated from a Canadian high school. (Something like the American state school system where citizenship status does not automatically equate to reduced tuition.)

Canadian graduates still have a relatively easy path to PR, so with reform to the tuition/benefits policy, it wouldn't make sense, and factually speaking increases the strain on the immigration system and the tax payers, to strip them of their PR status at 18 is they're just going to regain it at 23.

 

[modibaljit]

Can someone please share a sample letter for explaining H&C ground as I am going to submit PRTD next week. They have asked for a letter

 

[Ramadanoa]

Hi Riah, many thanks for such information and advise. I have similar case, and I have Few questions:
A) any idea if Nova Scotia going to issue driving license and health card under same circumstances?
B) do u recommend certain proviance than other, where I can send my daughter to it for university?
C) is it better for me to enter Canada with my daughter as a family (me and my spouse have the same case) or ask her to cross the boarder alone in the way u explained above, and I may enter with my wife the next day?

 

[Ramadanoa]

Also read this if you're considering land border entry: (Dpenbill explains the POE processes in greater detail in his post, this is a condensed version.)

Practical stuff surrounding a land border entry:

How it Works:

Fly to JFK/NYC.

Rent a car from a company that will let you drop it off in Toronto. (Most major companies should allow this.)

Drive to Toronto. (There are a couple of border crossings you could use but from what I've read most tend to use Rainbow Bridge/Niagara.)

Drop off the car in Toronto. Take a train/fly to your final destination.

If you don't drive, fly to Buffalo airport via JFK. Take a taxi to the border. Cross as a pedestrian. From the Canadian side take a taxi to the nearest train station/airport. Fly/taken a train to your final destination.

What Happens at the Border?

1 of 4 things:

1) The first officer you encounter at the booth lets you in without asking any questions.

2) The first officer directs you to Secondary Inspection. The officer at secondary inspection hears your H&C reasons and lets you into Canada.

3) The officer at Secondary doesn't agree with your H&C reasons, so he prepares a report. The report gets forwarded to a senior officer (Minister's delegate) who reads the report, asks you to explain your H&C reasons, finds in your favor, and lets you enter Canada.

4) The Minister's Delegate doesn't agree with the validity of your H&C reasons. He agrees with the report and issues you a Departure Order. (An order terminating your PR status.) You will still be allowed to enter Canada, but you will need file a notification of appeal within 30 days.

Note that in all the scenarios you can enter Canada. A Permanent Resident CANNOT be denied entry into Canada.

Which Scenarios are Good? Which are Bad?

Scenarios 1 to 3 are positive. Your PR status will remain safe as long as you don't leave Canada for 2 years. (At which point you'll be back in compliance with your residency obligation.)

Scenario 4 is not good. You can still enter Canada but you need to appeal to retain your PR status. It takes a year or two to get a hearing date. At the hearing you will either retain your PR status or loose it. If you loose the appeal you'll need to leave Canada.

Can I/Should I Travel Abroad or Renew My PR Card?

If your encounter scenarios 1-3 you must not renew your PR card for 2 years. You must not travel for 2 years. I cannot stress this enough.

Note that your PR status is not the same as your PR card. PR status is like citizenship, it's permanent and you keep it for life.

The PR card is like a passport, it's just a travel document.

A PR does not need to have a PR card. Your landing papers indicate that you have PR status. (Like a birth certificate indicating your citizenship.)

Your PR status DOES NOT expire with your PR card. You still are, and will continue to remain, a Permanent Resident of Canada, unless you are reported and loose an appeal. (If you choose to appeal.)

If you encounter scenario 4 your PR card will be renewed automatically while you wait for an appeal, but you still shouldn't travel abroad if you'd like to win the appeal. You remain a PR while waiting for your appeal and as such can live, work, and study in Canada.

What Happens Once I'm Inside Canada?

You'll be inside Canada as a Permanent Resident, and therefore are entitled to all the rights associated with your status, including the right to live, study, and work without restriction.

Do you have a SIN card? You cannot work without this.

To get essential documentation. (Driver's license and health card) your CoPR (landing papers) and foreign passport will suffice in the Province of Ontario.

 

[Ramadanoa]

Hi Rish, many thanks for such information and advise. I have similar case, and I have Few questions:
A) any idea if Nova Scotia going to issue driving license and health card under same circumstances?
B) do u recommend certain proviance than other, where I can send my daughter to it for university?
C) is it better for me to enter Canada with my daughter as a family (me and my spouse have the same case) or ask her to cross the boarder alone in the way u explained above, then and I may enter with my wife the next day? This is in order to creat for her a separate file and case.

 

[mpsqra]

Hello All,
I received PR status for my family in Dec 2012 but then couldn't go back to Canada due to some unforeseen reasons. This means that the PR card expired in Dec 2017 as I couldn't meet RO.

At that time my both daughters were minor.

But Now my elder daughter intends to join Toronto University in Aug 2018. I request anyone who can help me with the options I have.

I am ready to spend again for reapplying but am not sure whether this would be acceptable or not.

Thanks
Baljit

you have to apply for a student visa and pay in full the university

 

[steaky]

Hi Rish, many thanks for such information and advise. I have similar case, and I have Few questions:
A) any idea if Nova Scotia going to issue driving license and health card under same circumstances?
B) do u recommend certain proviance than other, where I can send my daughter to it for university?
C) is it better for me to enter Canada with my daughter as a family (me and my spouse have the same case) or ask her to cross the boarder alone in the way u explained above, then and I may enter with my wife the next day? This is in order to creat for her a separate file and case.

Perhaps, you should just send a pm to NetMecca who lives in Nova Scotia.

 

[rish888]

Hi Rish, many thanks for such information and advise. I have similar case, and I have Few questions:
A) any idea if Nova Scotia going to issue driving license and health card under same circumstances?
B) do u recommend certain proviance than other, where I can send my daughter to it for university?
C) is it better for me to enter Canada with my daughter as a family (me and my spouse have the same case) or ask her to cross the boarder alone in the way u explained above, then and I may enter with my wife the next day? This is in order to creat for her a separate file and case.

A) Calling up Nova Scotia DMV and health authority is your best bet. You an also check their website, or as others have said PM a member who lives in NS.

B) The school should matter the most. Just make sure that it's a province where she can live with just her CoPR. (This basically rules out BC for sure.)

C) Your daughter should cross alone. Period.

 

[abbu]

@rish888

Hi

I am in the same situation. My PR card expired in 2011. Now i applied for PR again under express entry. Today i received an email from Visa office regarding renouncing old PR. Can we do that ? Will they give new PR immediately. We got nominated by onip. our file is in IP2 stage. Thanks

 

[modibaljit]

@rish888

Hi

I am in the same situation. My PR card expired in 2011. Now i applied for PR again under express entry. Today i received an email from Visa office regarding renouncing old PR. Can we do that ? Will they give new PR immediately. We got nominated by onip. our file is in IP2 stage. Thanks

Hi Abbu
How did you apply for PR Renounce process? How much long this process takes? What are the formalities?

 

[Bs65]

Hi Abbu
How did you apply for PR Renounce process? How much long this process takes? What are the formalities?

A quick Google will take you here

http://www.cic.gc.ca/english/information/applications/guides/5781ETOC.asp

There is no stated processing time that am aware of but expect is in weeks not months.