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Effective date of Bill C24

MUFC

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Jul 14, 2014
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According to that official message http://www.cic.gc.ca/english/citizenship/cit-changes.asp

"Changes with respect to a new revocation decision-making process and new grounds for revocation of citizenship may come into force earlier..."

So far it seems that these changes are also not enforced yet and according to that official message they may come into force earlier then the 4/6 rule.

There is also pending changes which have to be done before the 4/6 rule for example...

Giving the authority CIC to take SIN numbers.
Establishing business channels between CIC, CRA, The border agency and so on.

All of the above are still pending.

When they are enforced then this might be a big heads up that from the legal point of view everything is ready.
 

dpenabill

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Apr 2, 2010
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As I and others have been noting: this subject will very soon reach its climax.

We will fairly soon know for certain the coming-into-force date.

We can soon cease all speculation.


I am quite confident that within the next ten or twelve weeks all the speculation, informed or otherwise, will be totally irrelevant. We will know. The date will be fixed by an order made by the Governor in Council and that order will be public information. Indeed, I quite fully expect that within ten or twelve weeks the revised residency provisions as prescribed in the SCCA will be in force. Maybe not, but even if not, not much beyond that.

What will we have to masticate then?

In following this process, I for one have learned a great deal about my government (I have been a citizen for over a year now). A year ago I had no idea what "Governor in Council" meant, my reading of the Gazette was sporadic, my understanding of the legislative process in Canada was superficial and rudimentary. For me, following Bill C-24 since it was first tabled on the sixth of February last year (which, by the way, was the 8th year anniversary of the very day Harper first became PM) has been an education in Canadian government and legislation, a vehicle for learning more about the country I love and consider to be my true home.

Oh Canada! one might say with emphasis.



Clarification: to be clear, I am NO expert.

But sure, I do a lot of homework, and I make a concerted effort to carefully analyze and verify. And I do have a background in analyzing and writing about legal matters (having more than three decades of experience as a professional jurist).

It should be noted, in particular, that in contrast to an immigration lawyer, the scope of what I know has to do with a very narrow range of information and jurisprudence. I can afford to focus a great deal of attention on just a few issues because this is a hobby, not a profession (my professional efforts, my day job, while those of a writing-jurist, they have nothing to do with any aspect of Canadian law let alone Canadian immigration or citizenship).

Even in regards to the SCCA, there is a lot in the SCCA (Bill C-24 until it received Royal Assent) with which I am not much familiar at all, such as its further refinements of who is a citizen by birth . . . even relative to the grant citizenship provisions, I am not much acquainted with those which relate to the grant of citizenship for minors or adopted children. My focus has been very narrow.


Following this, though, has been fun, a bit like watching the bookies work the horse races, figuring out the odds, following the favourites, sorting through the rumours. The horses are coming around the final turn now, headed into the stretch. The odds are set, no new bets being taken. The office pool is closed. My bet has been on June 1st but there are signs that horse might fade in the stretch.


However, however, however: it is not all fun. This is about real life with real consequences for many.

As much as I love my country, it does bother me that there is so much disregard for its people. The lack of transparency in the current governing is not just disappointing, not merely disconcerting, but to my view cause for much concern. This is happening south of the border as well. As much to the Left as the U.S. President Obama leans, in many respects his Administration has continued the trend for government to move more of its functions behind the curtains. While Harper's pace in this trend is far more severe, the overall trend in modern governments foretells a powerful and converging current, a growing divide between the governing and the governed.

To my view it is as important as ever for a populace to pursue knowledge and understanding about its government, how it functions, what influences it, how to encourage the government to be a better government for all its people. This particular legislation has been an incentive, a vehicle, for at least me to pursue this.




By the way, the famous line from Groucho Marx is "Who are you going to believe, me or your lying eyes?"

Reminds me of Harper's insistence he knew nothing about Mike Duffy and Nigel Wright and others conspiring to deceive the public about the bribery payoff in regards to gross abuses in Senate expenses.
 

MUFC

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Jul 14, 2014
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I would give advice to the people who believe and trust the call centre information to arrange their travel plans from now.

If I was still waiting for the official announcement right now I would have to pay almost 2 000$ more to my airplane tickets for my travels.

But on the other hand unfortunately there is nothing official to support any definite and precise cut off date.


I am curious what the call clerks are saying about when it will be published officially if the date is really that one.
 
Mar 13, 2015
17
1
dpenabill said:
As I and others have been noting: this subject will very soon reach its climax.

We will fairly soon know for certain the coming-into-force date.

We can soon cease all speculation.


I am quite confident that within the next ten or twelve weeks all the speculation, informed or otherwise, will be totally irrelevant. We will know. The date will be fixed by an order made by the Governor in Council and that order will be public information. Indeed, I quite fully expect that within ten or twelve weeks the revised residency provisions as prescribed in the SCCA will be in force. Maybe not, but even if not, not much beyond that.

What will we have to masticate then?

In following this process, I for one have learned a great deal about my government (I have been a citizen for over a year now). A year ago I had no idea what "Governor in Council" meant, my reading of the Gazette was sporadic, my understanding of the legislative process in Canada was superficial and rudimentary. For me, following Bill C-24 since it was first tabled on the sixth of February last year (which, by the way, was the 8th year anniversary of the very day Harper first became PM) has been an education in Canadian government and legislation, a vehicle for learning more about the country I love and consider to be my true home.

Oh Canada! one might say with emphasis.



Clarification: to be clear, I am NO expert.

But sure, I do a lot of homework, and I make a concerted effort to carefully analyze and verify. And I do have a background in analyzing and writing about legal matters (having more than three decades of experience as a professional jurist).

It should be noted, in particular, that in contrast to an immigration lawyer, the scope of what I know has to do with a very narrow range of information and jurisprudence. I can afford to focus a great deal of attention on just a few issues because this is a hobby, not a profession (my professional efforts, my day job, while those of a writing-jurist, they have nothing to do with any aspect of Canadian law let alone Canadian immigration or citizenship).

Even in regards to the SCCA, there is a lot in the SCCA (Bill C-24 until it received Royal Assent) with which I am not much familiar at all, such as its further refinements of who is a citizen by birth . . . even relative to the grant citizenship provisions, I am not much acquainted with those which relate to the grant of citizenship for minors or adopted children. My focus has been very narrow.


Following this, though, has been fun, a bit like watching the bookies work the horse races, figuring out the odds, following the favourites, sorting through the rumours. The horses are coming around the final turn now, headed into the stretch. The odds are set, no new bets being taken. The office pool is closed. My bet has been on June 1st but there are signs that horse might fade in the stretch.


However, however, however: it is not all fun. This is about real life with real consequences for many.

As much as I love my country, it does bother me that there is so much disregard for its people. The lack of transparency in the current governing is not just disappointing, not merely disconcerting, but to my view cause for much concern. This is happening south of the border as well. As much to the Left as the U.S. President Obama leans, in many respects his Administration has continued the trend for government to move more of its functions behind the curtains. While Harper's pace in this trend is far more severe, the overall trend in modern governments foretells a powerful and converging current, a growing divide between the governing and the governed.

To my view it is as important as ever for a populace to pursue knowledge and understanding about its government, how it functions, what influences it, how to encourage the government to be a better government for all its people. This particular legislation has been an incentive, a vehicle, for at least me to pursue this.




By the way, the famous line from Groucho Marx is "Who are you going to believe, me or your lying eyes?"

Reminds me of Harper's insistence he knew nothing about Mike Duffy and Nigel Wright and others conspiring to deceive the public about the bribery payoff in regards to gross abuses in Senate expenses.
What will we have to masticate then?

If any of our chatmates should desire to masticate, then I suggest that he/she do so elsewhere, behind closed doors!

Groucho, or even Chico may have used the word "lying" on an occasion or two, I don't know, but my quotation is one which I know, as a matter of fact, he (and Chico) used. However, "Certs is a breath mint", as well as a "candy mint", so we needn't deliberate this matter.

Your modesty aside, I have learnt much from your posts, and wish unto you many more years of research and instruction.

One question. How can I manage to add another chatroom star to my credentials? I have grown weary of being just a rear admiral!
 

Ojeola

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Jul 27, 2012
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Hello Everyone,

To put at rest to all the speculations about the implementation date for Bill c24, I just got a concrete reply from the Minister's office. Kindly visit the link below to read more.

http://www.canadavisa.com/canada-immigration-discussion-board/tracking-june-2015-citizenship-application-please-share-your-timeline-t278115.0.html
 

MUFC

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Ojeola said:
Hello Everyone,

To put at rest to all the speculations about the implementation date for Bill c24, I just got a concrete reply from the Minister's office. Kindly visit the link below to read more.

http://www.canadavisa.com/canada-immigration-discussion-board/tracking-june-2015-citizenship-application-please-share-your-timeline-t278115.0.html
This are also my impressions from the call centre and that's why I don't trust them until the final official confirmation.
Basically everyone there is making assumption that the date will be this one without any confirmation yet.

They just have the same official message from last year like everyone.

Let's see the final note from the Governor what he will decide as the final cut off date.
 

na123

Star Member
Dec 28, 2014
106
2
So it seems whoever bet on June 1st lost :p :p, now the favorite date seem to be July 1st CANADA DAY ! this is just my own bet, although my previous bet which I still believe is also likely is June 1st.
 

dpenabill

VIP Member
Apr 2, 2010
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Ojeola said:
To finally put to rest all the speculations about when the implementation DATE on bill c24. Today, I finally receive a reply from the Minister's office. Although a definite date was not provided, I was given more than enough information about when some of the bill will be implemented.



Dear Mr. ****:

This is in reply to your correspondence of March 10, 2015, addressed to Mr. Chris Alexander, Canada's Minister of Citizenship and Immigration, concerning the implementation of Bill C-24. I regret the delay in responding.

As you are aware, Bill C-24 received royal assent and the Strengthening Canadian Citizenship Act became law on June 19, 2014.

The date of Royal Assent is when Parliament passes a bill and the date of Coming into Force is when the proposed changes in the bill are actually in effect. Coming into Force can occur either on the same day as Royal Assent or at a date to be determined by the Governor in Council. Various elements of the new Citizenship Act will come into force at different times over the next two years.

While Bill C-24 received Royal Assent on June 19, 2014, and some provisions came into force immediately, others were expected to come into force in approximately one month. Certain other provisions were expected to come into force in approximately a year's time. The later dates for coming into force will allow the Department enough time to prepare for implementation of these changes.

Provisions coming into force on a date to be determined by the Governor in Council, anticipated to be in approximately a year, include: provisions to give citizenship to more “Lost Canadians”; new residence requirements; the new intent to reside requirement; expanded age requirements for language and knowledge testing; and a requirement to demonstrate knowledge of Canada in an official language. Other provisions in this category include: strengthened offences and penalties for fraud; prohibitions for foreign criminality and activities against national interests; a new revocation model and new grounds for revocation of citizenship; a new authority to designate a regulatory body for citizenship consultants; and improved information-sharing authorities.

These will come into force on a date to be determined by the Governor in Council, which is expected to be in approximately mid-year 2015, to enable sufficient time to prepare the changes needed to implement these and other provisions of C-24.

For more information on the changes contained in the Strengthening Canadian Citizenship Act, and for further announcements concerning the coming into force dates, please visit the CIC Website at www.cic.gc.ca.

Thank you for writing. I trust that this information is of assistance.


Ministerial Enquiries Division

Even though I have suggested making queries to MPs regarding the coming-into-force date for the revised residency requirements, sure, this response is the expected response, which is a restatement of last June's announcement, as in "approximately a year" (referenced from June 19, 2014).

Many times it can be worth asking the question even if no substantive answer is anticipated. Sometimes just asking the question is what matters.

I would suggest a reply question specifically stating that given the fact you will meet the requirements for citizenship this summer you were hoping for more precise information than a restatement of last June's vague announcement, so that you could better make personal plans for the summer.

Not that this will generate a more precise answer. Probably will not. Sometimes politicians need to be reminded that real people have real lives, and these things make a difference, that the people being governed deserve more information about their governing.

This may very well be to no avail, but if those affected do not speak for themselves, no one else is going to do it for them. No voices is silence. One or few voices are easily brushed aside. If only a few are interested enough to press for more information, then everyone waits until the Governor in Council issues the order.


Famous quotes versus actual quotes: probably more often not the same than the same. It is almost always easier to misquote than to quote, and many misquotes tend to be the ones remembered and repeated.

" . . . lying eyes" is the famous quote from Marx, not necessarily an actual quote, and is particularly a favourite in a variety of humorous quips skewering lawyers and their manipulation of juries (as I recall, in contrast, the Marx quote itself purportedly derives from an instance of insistent denial despite obvious evidence of marital infidelity).

The U.S. Postal Service recently stepped into it in this regards: its recently issued stamp honoring Maya Angelou features a quote which, it turns out, is actually a line from a poem book by a children's author, Joan Walsh Anglund. Apparently this quote has been famously attributed to Maya Angelou on more than a few auspicious occasions, once attributed to her by President Barack Obama.

That quote: "A bird doesn't sing because it has an answer, it sings because it has a song."

But Parliament is no choir. There is a real question posed. The same old song is not music to our ears. Time for an answer.



As for the June 1st bet: yeah, signs are that horse will fade in the stretch, but it is not time to throw away the ticket yet, the old nag may have more legs still.
 

surgi

Star Member
Feb 20, 2014
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if you think that the effective date would be a part of politics and not just a legal action, so the gov should study the background before taking the final decision. If the aim of this bill to attract some voters to vote for a certain party,the job is done by passing all levels to the governor. Now after the performance of the party in power in provincial elections in Ontario and Quebec,the situation is very difficult for them. The application of this bill before the elections in October would make it more difficult . So many people knows about it and very unsatisfied and have fears from its impact on next emerged bills. Those who have the right to vote are not away from its impact. I realize that decision makers know that very well. They may take a decision to postpone the effective date till after elections. If they win,then they apply it as they promised. If they do not win they threw a bomb to the next government. At least this law should not be an issue of discussion before elections which encourages so many PRs to participate in the propaganda of election anti the party in power, which may lead multiple communities of different ethnicity to vote against them.
 

MUFC

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"These will come into force on a date to be determined by the Governor in Council, which is expected to be in approximately mid-year 2015, to enable sufficient time to prepare the changes needed to implement these and other provisions of C-24. "

When I saw this segment, I also expect the real cut off date to be 1st of July.
Unfortunately it seems that the confirmation for that will come in the last moment.

To all those applicants who will be eligible to apply with minimum 1095 days of physical presence before Canada day, ALL of you have a really good chance to apply under the old rules so the best you can do is to stay here until then.
 

DND

Star Member
Oct 20, 2014
62
6
Various elements of the new Citizenship Act will come into force at different times over the next two years.
Next two years (from june 2014 I assume), is not the same as mid-2015
 

MUFC

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"While Bill C-24 received Royal Assent on June 19, 2014, and some provisions came into force immediately, others were expected to come into force in approximately one month. Certain other provisions were expected to come into force in approximately a year's time. The later dates for coming into force will allow the Department enough time to prepare for implementation of these changes."

Finally some real clue what do they understand as a time range when they use the word "Approx." The first bold segment is referring to the changes which were done on the 1st of August. So the time range is +- 3 weeks on the plus side.
 

MUFC

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surgi said:
if you think that the effective date would be a part of politics and not just a legal action, so the gov should study the background before taking the final decision. If the aim of this bill to attract some voters to vote for a certain party,the job is done by passing all levels to the governor. Now after the performance of the party in power in provincial elections in Ontario and Quebec,the situation is very difficult for them. The application of this bill before the elections in October would make it more difficult . So many people knows about it and very unsatisfied and have fears from its impact on next emerged bills. Those who have the right to vote are not away from its impact. I realize that decision makers know that very well. They may take a decision to postpone the effective date till after elections. If they win,then they apply it as they promised. If they do not win they threw a bomb to the next government. At least this law should not be an issue of discussion before elections which encourages so many PRs to participate in the propaganda of election anti the party in power, which may lead multiple communities of different ethnicity to vote against them.
Your point of you can loom very large if that Law is still not enforced after Mid-August, for now it's a possibility, because as you know nothing is confirmed yet.
Don't get me wrong, I'm just an observer here and nothing can really surprise me, so your scenario seems another possible one.

In general I also believe that this law was intentionally held from them to be almost ready for the federal elections year. If this law was a real priority for them, then it should have been implemented long time ago, not at the end of the cabinets cycle.
 

MUFC

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I thing the best thing we can do from now on, is to wait for the real cut off date which will be issued from the Governor in Council.

Lets wait for the Official Confirmation.

Without Official confirmation the real cut off date is still Unknown.