Complicated - Sponsoring an American

[Ponga]

*sigh* you CAN `move in together', you just can't bring your existing personal items to Vancouver...yet. Just buy whatever you need with your powerful USD in Vancouver and avoid the hassles of trying to bring it into Canada.

 

[Decoy24601]

*sigh* you CAN `move in together', you just can't bring your existing personal items to Vancouver...yet. Just buy whatever you need with your powerful USD in Vancouver and avoid the hassles of trying to bring it into Canada.

I agree. I was using the word "moving" to mean bringing most of your belongings, but yeah they can "live" together technically while the OP is on visitor status. Sorry, if I was confusing.

 

[AMBillings]

Thank you for the very concise summary. I really do appreciate your time. We'll consider our options and go from there.

 

[CDNPR2014]

Visitor Records are for visitors, not permanent residents. So, you technically don't even have to have a PR application in process to get VR, but in my opinion at the Peach Arch crossing your chances of getting one are low if you are not married and don't have a PR application in process yet. CBSA officers are more lenient on visa-exempt people (particularly Americans) who have a PR applications in process.

actually, this has not been my experience at all. CBSA absolutely gives out visitor records to those in relationships with canadians that are not married or have pr applications, and I would argue the risk is substantially higher. Those are the visitors they are most concerned about, not the married/commonlaw couples applying for permanent status, since they are MORE likely to not know the rules and break them. This is how they "track" and control the length of your stay to ensure you are not overstaying or doing something you shouldn't (ie: working or studying). I would imagine it's more common to get one as someone who is dating as opposed to married. In my experience, it's not a good thing to "request" a visitor's record. from my experience, that's essentially asking CBSA to put you in their system, track your stay, and require you to regularly get sent to secondary before entering - this is not something to volunteer for IMO. CBSA has the ability to give a short term visitor record if they suspect you plan to stay long term and require you to "check in" at the border before leaving.

Now perhaps the Peach Arch is different, and they are more lienent than the norm (I've never entered through there). Trust me though, in general, CBSA is HIGHLY more suspicious of those just dating than those married/commonlaw.

The most ideal situation is to convince them you are visiting, show proof of ties to the us if it comes up, and not get a stamp in your passport. OR let THEM bring up the visitor record(don't ask for it).

 

[nmclean]

actually, this has not been my experience at all. CBSA absolutely gives out visitor records to those in relationships with canadians that are not married or have pr applications, and I would argue the risk is substantially higher. Those are the visitors they are most concerned about, not the married/commonlaw couples applying for permanent status, since they are MORE likely to not know the rules and break them. This is how they "track" and control the length of your stay to ensure you are not overstaying or doing something you shouldn't (ie: working or studying). I would imagine it's more common to get one as someone who is dating as opposed to married. In my experience, it's not a good thing to "request" a visitor's record. from my experience, that's essentially asking CBSA to put you in their system, track your stay, and require you to regularly get sent to secondary before entering - this is not something to volunteer for IMO. CBSA has the ability to give a short term visitor record if they suspect you plan to stay long term and require you to "check in" at the border before leaving.

Now perhaps the Peach Arch is different, and they are more lienent than the norm (I've never entered through there). Trust me though, in general, CBSA is HIGHLY more suspicious of those just dating than those married/commonlaw.

The most ideal situation is to convince them you are visiting, show proof of ties to the us if it comes up, and not get a stamp in your passport. OR let THEM bring up the visitor record(don't ask for it).

I don't agree that not being issued a visitor record is the most ideal situation. For one thing, not all of them are shorter - it's common for someone with an application in process to receive a year-long VR, which is certainly preferable to the default 6 months. While receiving one does indicate you are considered a higher risk, consider how it will look if you're re-entering several months later and it's discovered that you have already been living in Canada all this time without a record. That could look like you purposely slipped your intentions under their nose the first time, and raise even greater suspicion.

Another consideration is that a visitor record serves as a form of Canadian identification where you wouldn't have any otherwise. In my experience, it has been very handy to have this for government and bank services.

 

[CDNPR2014]

I don't agree that not being issued a visitor record is the most ideal situation. For one thing, not all of them are shorter - it's common for someone with an application in process to receive a year-long VR, which is certainly preferable to the default 6 months. While receiving one does indicate you are considered a higher risk, consider how it will look if you're re-entering several months later and it's discovered that you have already been living in Canada all this time without a record. That could look like you purposely slipped your intentions under their nose the first time, and raise even greater suspicion.

Another consideration is that a visitor record serves as a form of Canadian identification where you wouldn't have any otherwise. In my experience, it has been very handy to have this for government and bank services.

it is my understanding the OP does not have an application in, and is not commonlaw or married yet, so this is why asking for a visitor record is not ideal in my opinion.

also, every entry is unique, so every time a person enters canada, they will be asked when the last time you were in canada was (at least from what I remember). it will be very unusual if CBSA doesn't ping someone who says they were there only a few months prior. at some point, they will be stopped and questioned (and if not - good for them - keep going and don't ask questions).

I didn't say it's not handy for those when applying for pr, i'm saying i don't recommend ASKING for one. Let CBSA decide if one is necessary. Try to get in without a stamp, and apply to extend your stay through CIC so you don't have to worry about dealing with CBSA and border crossings. (this is certainly the most ideal situation in my opinion). The more you show up at a border as someone not married/commonlaw and without a PR application in, the higher chance they will question your intent and will do something worse than limit your stay (ie: deny entry/issue exclusion order or worse).

 

[Ponga]

it is my understanding the OP does not have an application in, and is not commonlaw or married yet, so this is why asking for a visitor record is not ideal in my opinion.

also, every entry is unique, so every time a person enters canada, they will be asked when the last time you were in canada was (at least from what I remember). it will be very unusual if CBSA doesn't ping someone who says they were there only a few months prior. at some point, they will be stopped and questioned (and if not - good for them - keep going and don't ask questions).

I didn't say it's not handy for those when applying for pr, i'm saying i don't recommend ASKING for one. Let CBSA decide if one is necessary. Try to get in without a stamp, and apply to extend your stay through CIC so you don't have to worry about dealing with CBSA and border crossings. (this is certainly the most ideal situation in my opinion). The more you show up at a border as someone not married/commonlaw and without a PR application in, the higher chance they will question your intent.

I agree. Without a pending PR Sponsorship application in the queue, this is going to be a very difficult dance for the OP after CBSA determines what's really happening.

 

[AMBillings]

it is my understanding the OP does not have an application in, and is not commonlaw or married yet, so this is why asking for a visitor record is not ideal in my opinion.

also, every entry is unique, so every time a person enters canada, they will be asked when the last time you were in canada was (at least from what I remember). it will be very unusual if CBSA doesn't ping someone who says they were there only a few months prior. at some point, they will be stopped and questioned (and if not - good for them - keep going and don't ask questions).

I didn't say it's not handy for those when applying for pr, i'm saying i don't recommend ASKING for one. Let CBSA decide if one is necessary. Try to get in without a stamp, and apply to extend your stay through CIC so you don't have to worry about dealing with CBSA and border crossings. (this is certainly the most ideal situation in my opinion). The more you show up at a border as someone not married/commonlaw and without a PR application in, the higher chance they will question your intent and will do something worse than limit your stay (ie: deny entry/issue exclusion order or worse).

Correct, I have not submitted an application, and I've already stated that I'm trying to move in with my boyfriend of two years, so this shouldn't come as a surprise to anyone who read my opening post.

That said, we have been dating for about two years, with each of us traveling at least one weekend per month to visit the other (sometimes two). I have been working a 4/10 shift to allow me to spend more time at his place, which means a "weekend" is typically Thursday night through Monday morning. We both have NEXUS passes, so CBSA doesn't even look at my passport when I cross over. No one at Peace Arch has ever hassled me or asked me to go to secondary for any reason, nor have I given them any reason to. I'd like to ensure that whatever I do is all above-board...I don't want to risk being accused of doing anything improperly because I don't want to risk ruining my chances of getting PR.

 

[Ponga]

Correct, I have not submitted an application, and I've already stated that I'm trying to move in with my boyfriend of two years, so this shouldn't come as a surprise to anyone who read my opening post.

That said, we have been dating for about two years, with each of us traveling at least one weekend per month to visit the other (sometimes two). I have been working a 4/10 shift to allow me to spend more time at his place, which means a "weekend" is typically Thursday night through Monday morning. We both have NEXUS passes, so CBSA doesn't even look at my passport when I cross over. No one at Peace Arch has ever hassled me or asked me to go to secondary for any reason, nor have I given them any reason to. I'd like to ensure that whatever I do is all above-board...I don't want to risk being accused of doing anything improperly because I don't want to risk ruining my chances of getting PR.

Yes, but you will undoubtedly agree that unless, and until, you can spend more time together in the same home, you can't even start the Common-Law eligibility clock. It's great that you seem to be able to travel freely now, because you're spending the majority of your time outside of Canada. It might not be so easy when you're in Vancouver more than Seattle.

 

[nmclean]

it is my understanding the OP does not have an application in, and is not commonlaw or married yet, so this is why asking for a visitor record is not ideal in my opinion.

also, every entry is unique, so every time a person enters canada, they will be asked when the last time you were in canada was (at least from what I remember). it will be very unusual if CBSA doesn't ping someone who says they were there only a few months prior. at some point, they will be stopped and questioned (and if not - good for them - keep going and don't ask questions).

I didn't say it's not handy for those when applying for pr, i'm saying i don't recommend ASKING for one. Let CBSA decide if one is necessary. Try to get in without a stamp, and apply to extend your stay through CIC so you don't have to worry about dealing with CBSA and border crossings. (this is certainly the most ideal situation in my opinion). The more you show up at a border as someone not married/commonlaw and without a PR application in, the higher chance they will question your intent and will do something worse than limit your stay (ie: deny entry/issue exclusion order or worse).

Aside from the sentence you highlighted, at least everything else I said applies whether there is an application in process or not, or whether you are married/common-law or not. It is helpful to have a VR.

I've noticed the prevailing advice on this forum seems to be hide as much information as possible because what they don't know can't hurt you, but I've never agreed with this. While it may work for people who are willing to wait out the entire process without exit/re-entry, this simply isn't practical for everyone. As you say, you inevitably will be questioned, and when that happens, you don't want to come off as someone who has been evasive previously. If they see that you had a VR and have adhered to it, that tells them at least two things right away: you have already been truthful and satisfied another officer in the past, and you have subsequently followed the rules they gave you.

In my case, we actually received a 12-month VR before our application was in process, and were even able to bring in personal effects duty-free and receive health insurance before landing. I am not saying this will happen for everyone, of course. The take-away is that we should not be looking at CBSA as an enemy to the immigration process who are just looking for any opportunity to sabotage it. My experience would not have been possible without their cooperation, and was a result of full disclosure from day one, letting them have a copy of all the documentation we intended to submit to CIC, and sharing our exact intentions. Being in their system is not automatically an invitation to regularly get sent to secondary. It can be just the opposite.

Maybe you shouldn't just "ask" for a VR, but I don't think anyone was advising that per se. You should tell them enough to make an informed decision to issue one, not because they are suspicious, but because they understand the situation and know that it will help you in the future. You should not be trying to avoid getting a stamp, and you shouldn't claim to be "just visiting" if that's not what you're doing.

 

[carr1]

Aside from the sentence you highlighted, at least everything else I said applies whether there is an application in process or not, or whether you are married/common-law or not. It is helpful to have a VR.

I've noticed the prevailing advice on this forum seems to be hide as much information as possible because what they don't know can't hurt you, but I've never agreed with this. While it may work for people who are willing to wait out the entire process without exit/re-entry, this simply isn't practical for everyone. As you say, you inevitably will be questioned, and when that happens, you don't want to come off as someone who has been evasive previously. If they see that you had a VR and have adhered to it, that tells them at least two things right away: you have already been truthful and satisfied another officer in the past, and you have subsequently followed the rules they gave you.

In my case, we actually received a 12-month VR before our application was in process, and were even able to bring in personal effects duty-free and receive health insurance before landing. I am not saying this will happen for everyone, of course. The take-away is that we should not be looking at CBSA as an enemy to the immigration process who are just looking for any opportunity to sabotage it. My experience would not have been possible without their cooperation, and was a result of full disclosure from day one, letting them have a copy of all the documentation we intended to submit to CIC, and sharing our exact intentions. Being in their system is not automatically an invitation to regularly get sent to secondary. It can be just the opposite.

Maybe you shouldn't just "ask" for a VR, but I don't think anyone was advising that per se. You should tell them enough to make an informed decision to issue one, not because they are suspicious, but because they understand the situation and know that it will help you in the future. You should not be trying to avoid getting a stamp, and you shouldn't claim to be "just visiting" if that's not what you're doing.

Agreed!!!
A VR gets a bad rap on this forum IMHO but in my case it was great to have! I don't have nexus and when crossing back and forth on my VR I was allowed to say I live in Canada when asked, I was never hassled or brought into secondary once on my VR. When I was given my VR they even asked if I wanted to import and belongings but I didn't have anything.

I never asked for VR but was going to, I didn't need to because once we moved to this area and started crossing a lot more CBSA suggested it, stating it will make it much easier.
Sounds like you have all your ducks in a row! We were like u and living together to gain common law but half way through we decided we would get married.
Good luck

 

[nmclean]

Agreed!!!
A VR gets a bad rap on this forum IMHO but in my case it was great to have! I don't have nexus and when crossing back and forth on my VR I was allowed to say I live in Canada when asked, I was never hassled or brought into secondary once on my VR. When I was given my VR they even asked if I wanted to import and belongings but I didn't have anything.

I never asked for VR but was going to, I didn't need to because once we moved to this area and started crossing a lot more CBSA suggested it, stating it will make it much easier.
Sounds like you have all your ducks in a row! We were like u and living together to gain common law but half way through we decided we would get married.
Good luck

We also learned like you that it's not the same experience at the Toronto airport. But I guess you can't blame someone for having a terrible attitude when they have to get up every morning and work at the Toronto airport.

 

[Ponga]

I can't help but wonder if this is really a moot point.

The OP states that s/he will be [hopefully] residing in Canada, while commuting to the office in Seattle, 2x per week, during the one year period to establish Common-Law. Will s/he be staying overnight in Seattle, thus only spending 5 days (and nights) out of 7 in Vancouver, or traveling back to Vancouver each night?

If it's the former, I wonder what happens when the PR application is being processed. Would CIC not see this as a full one year period of cohabiting?

I know that once Common-Law has been established, it's usually not an issue, but...before it has been established, CIC couldn't deny the application?

 

[Kayaker]

I also wonder, even if the OP commutes to her job in the US two days a week and spends, say, 9 hours each day there, will CIC see it as 18 hours a week spent in the US, or 2 days? If they see it as 2 days every week, won't that add up to like a 100 days per year spent in the US, which means 100 days a year NOT spent with the sponsor?

I wonder if anyone has ever done this - without a precedent showing that it has been done successfully, I would not be confident. Of course the OP can try and see if CIC accepts it as common law. That would be interesting to find out, but if I were the OP I wouldn't want to spend 1+ year of my life doing an experiment.

If getting married is something you two want to do anyway, you might as well get married now, and stay with your spouse in Canada most of the time and commute to the US twice a week. With Nexus the chances of being sent to secondary are smaller, I believe, and even if, worst case scenario, the OP gets turned away at the border, the PR application will go forward and the OP can get PR in a few months - it's been quite quick for US applicants I've heard.

Good luck!

 

[carr1]

I can't help but wonder if this is really a moot point.

The OP states that s/he will be [hopefully] residing in Canada, while commuting to the office in Seattle, 2x per week, during the one year period to establish Common-Law. Will s/he be staying overnight in Seattle, thus only spending 5 days (and nights) out of 7 in Vancouver, or traveling back to Vancouver each night?

If it's the former, I wonder what happens when the PR application is being processed. Would CIC not see this as a full one year period of cohabiting?

I know that once Common-Law has been established, it's usually not an issue, but...before it has been established, CIC couldn't deny the application?

So hard to say what CIC will say, that would concern me too. I know of one other couple that did this and was approved but this was a few years ago.
I would say if you guys ever thought about getting married since common law is "basically" that it may be better to actually get married and then apply, keeping in mind applying itself takes time, from getting paperwork together and the FBI check can take months.
Lots of things to think about in this situation!!