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citizenship by convenience

Politren

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Jan 16, 2015
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screech339 said:
If Canada turns into Afghanistan in 10 years, who's fault is that? Look no further than Greece to see what will happen when spending is not checked.
The direction of Canada by bringing more and more burden here while the good meaningful jobs are extremely difficult to get is not so bright. If I had a good job I would be so angry to pay from my taxes the bills to people working at the low end. Look at already the huge debt of Canada, guess who will pay that debt. ;) we already see the direction toward the Greece destination.
 

pie_vancouver

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torontosm said:
You don't seem to understand what I'm saying, so I'll try one last time. I am NOT saying that citizens shouldn't have the right to move elsewhere for better opportunities. I AM saying that if they choose to do so, they and their children shouldn't expect to be afforded the same rights and privileges as Canadians who live here.

I brought up the example of long-term overseas Canadians not being allowed to vote in elections. Why aren't you up in arms about that? Using your logic, as those citizens or their parents or their parents' parents may have contributed to Canada, why shouldn't they have the right to vote? The fact is that as they don't live here, they aren't as affected by what happens in Canada, so the Courts ruled that they shouldn't have the right to determine the country's future. Similarly, I believe that as these overseas Canadians don't live in Canada, they shouldn't have the right to show up to get medical treatment for free, or to send their kids for subsidized education without first re-establishing their residency.
And how would the government know that this family spent x number of years abroad, came back and because of that no 100% benefits to you yet, what is the difference if this time a natural born Canadian left and worked abroad for 30 years and came back here same no 100% benefits to you too or no you are good because you were not immigrant.
again, this creation of 2 classes of citizens is BS
 

Politren

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Jee786 said:
You didn't receive any benefits from pakistan? Stand in front of a mirror and ask yourself this question. You born there. You grew up there. You got education there. If any reason Canada revoke your citizenship then you have to go back there or you will end up in a sea like syrian refugee.

Well, that means anyone who born and raised in Canada. Get education and everything, they can simply say good bye Canada, I am going to Pakistan to serve them. We will still salute them and say, good man, keep it up.
You can use the his mindset too when you leave Canada by saying I didn't get any benefits from Canada and therefore I am not CoC of Canada. This is I guess his logic.

I guess he is the only one who didn't use the roads, medical care, public services ... and so on in Pakistan. What a mysterious Paki citizen he is ;D
 

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Politren said:
So a Canadian of convenience are only those Canadians who are born abroad and for some reason they are abroad.

If a Canadian is born here and do the very same thing, he is NOT Canadian of convenience.

Am I the only one who treat this as an double standard?
Yes and No. CoC's seek to acquire citizenship for the purposes of a safety net in the first place. A Canadian born in Canada would not fall into that category since they acquired citizenship because they were born in Canada. However, you can say that their parents immigrated to Canada to get their child a citizenship. Then that child can be an "anchor baby"
 

torontosm

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Politren said:
You can use the his mindset too when you leave Canada by saying I didn't get any benefits from Canada and therefore I am not CoC of Canada. This is I guess his logic.

I guess he is the only one who didn't use the roads, medical care, public services ... and so on in Pakistan. What a mysterious Paki citizen he is ;D
My medical care and education was all private in Pakistan. And, for the short period of time I lived in Pakistan, I and my family all paid taxes so we were entitled to use the public services. Satisfied?

You guys need to go back and read the first post on this thread to understand what a CoC is. A CoC is NOT someone who uses the benefits while they are living in, and contributing to, a country.
 

torontosm

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pie_vancouver said:
And how would the government know that this family spent x number of years abroad, came back and because of that no 100% benefits to you yet,
The same way that they know this very information for health benefits, for taxes, etc.. The system is already in place.
 

Politren

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torontosm said:
I was born there and left when I was one. So, I guess i didn't use the roads. As for medical care, it's private in Pakistan so it was all paid for. Satisfied?
Perfect so if a person like you have spend little time in a country (like yourself one year) then it is impossible that person to be considered CoC.
 

torontosm

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Politren said:
Perfect so if a person like you have spend little time in a country (like yourself one year) then it is impossible that person to be considered CoC.

Do you even understand what a CoC is? You seem to be arguing for no real reason other than because you have some racist grudge against all Asians.

Let me try to explain it to you again: If I was drawing benefits from Pakistan (e.g., if my kids were going to public schools there for free) without actually living in Pakistan, and without paying taxes or contributing to Pakistan in some way, I would certain consider myself a CoC. However, this is far from the case. See the difference?
 

screech339

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pie_vancouver said:
And how would the government know that this family spent x number of years abroad, came back and because of that no 100% benefits to you yet, what is the difference if this time a natural born Canadian left and worked abroad for 30 years and came back here same no 100% benefits to you too or no you are good because you were not immigrant.
again, this creation of 2 classes of citizens is BS
Actually CoC can be applied to Canadian born who left Canada for 30-40 years and return to retire in Canada accessing free medical care they have not paid into all their lives.

It is not the same as a Canadian working all their lives in Canada paying into the system and then retire outside Canada. They can then return to Canada for medical needs. As far as im concerned, they have a right to it since they contributed to the system all their lives.
 

Politren

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torontosm said:
Do you even understand what a CoC is? You seem to be arguing for no real reason other than because you have some racist grudge against all Asians.

Let me try to explain it to you again: If I was drawing benefits from Pakistan (e.g., if my kids were going to public schools there for free) without actually living in Pakistan, and without paying taxes or contributing to Pakistan in some way, I would certain consider myself a CoC. However, this is far from the case. See the difference?
What is the reason to call me rasist, I guess the facts which I showed that the dominant part is from South Asia made me under your understanding such??? I don't see anything wrong to show some official data about the recent newcomers and their source countries. What is the problem with that?

CoC simply doesn't exist as legal term, you are trying to prove here something which is full with subjectivity. If it was a problem it would be a long time in the criminal code. Do you realize how funny your whole pushing here is regarding this imaginary CoC spooky thing ;D

Do you see that everyone here has different understanding about CoC. This is because is Subjective. Now according to screech339 even a Canadian born here can be CoC. At the beginning of the topic was clear that it could apply only to those Canadians born abroad :p
 

Politren

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screech339 said:
Actually CoC can be applied to Canadian born who left Canada for 30-40 years and return to retire in Canada accessing free medical care they have not paid into all their lives.

It is not the same as a Canadian working all their lives in Canada paying into the system and then retire outside Canada. They can then return to Canada for medical needs. As far as im concerned, they have a right to it since they contributed to the system all their lives.
The fact that Canadian born were contributed all their lives here is not an excuse if they are out of Canada. Why Canadian should pay their medical care when they might not be residents in Canada at that time. They are typical CoC and should be banned from using Canadian benefits.
 

screech339

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Politren said:
What is the reason to call me rasist, I guess the facts which I showed that the dominant part is from South Asia made me under your understanding such??? I don't see anything wrong to show some official data about the recent newcomers and their source countries. What is the problem with that?

CoC simply doesn't exist as legal term, you are trying to prove here something which is full with subjectivity. If it was a problem it would be a long time in the criminal code. Do you realize how funny your whole pushing here is regarding this imaginary CoC spooky thing ;D

Do you see that everyone here has different understanding about CoC. This is because is Subjective. Now according to screech339 even a Canadian born here can be CoC. At the beginning of the topic was clear that it could apply only to those Canadians born abroad :p
So by the same logic, marriage of convenience doesn't exist as a legal definition?

When the terminology get used often enough, it can become a legal word. Take "selfie" for example. It didnt get added to the legal lingo until everyone was using it.
 

Politren

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screech339 said:
So by the same logic, marriage of convenience doesn't exist as a legal definition?

When the terminology get used often enough, it can become a legal word. Take "selfie" for example. It didnt get added to the legal lingo until everyone was using it.
I really want to see some day a legal definition of CoC. That "issue" is in the lingo for a long time and still nothing official. I really want to see the first case of someone stripped from citizenship by being accused and proven guilty as being CoC. Good luck meanwhile by creating proper definition ;D

I bet that such legal definition and prosecution will never show up.
 

Politren

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johnr said:
Why don't you all blame the government for placing everyone in this quagmire?

Afterall, it is the captain of the ship.

Why, can't you sue the government here because it's taboo?

What kind of "civilized" nation is that?
They don't blame the government because they prefer to continue paying from their pockets by keeping these people here. ;)
 

pie_vancouver

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Well healthcare in BC is not free it is $1,800 per year for a family of 3 or more
unless you have $22k or below annual gross income then it is free.