BREAKING NEWS Bill C-6 finally passed in HoC, Now reading in Senate

[daisy2]

I am close to 4 yrs and that will end up in April,2017 . If the 3 yrs bill pass and again need to wait for 2 yrs this would not be fair for everyone like my situation . Because one needs to wait for only 1 yr under 4 years of law, whereas we have to wait again 2 yrs that means total 6 yrs ...!!!

 

[deerestlovelybear]

Hi bro,

Are you kidding most of the immigrant can afford 10,000 as processing fee? I landed in Canada as PR with 90k job in my hand and all expense paid by employer. I can't afford. Can you tell me your secret? I may benifit from this.
Thx

That is because you count only yourself, is your wife working as well? Most immigrants family earn much more than that if you count the family and 10k is nothing not to be affordable for matter such important as citizenship

 

[admontreal]

Not sure why you are speechless...the first tweet related to the restoration of citizenship to terrorists which many Canadians (if not the majority) are against. So I fail to see the controversy in the Senator's position.

The way the senator expressed this was really unprofessionnal. Honestly, most of the 'old stock' Canadians are too ignorant to have an unbiased and objective view of this issue. They often mix up citizenship and permanent residency, and keep finding it normal that any person who is not white should be deported upon any kind of misbehavior (even theft). That's why we have a Supreme Court and a Senate, those institutions are supposed to have the knowledge and the expertise to look at very important issues like this one according to the Canadian Constitution (i.e., the Charter) with 'sober second thought' and sound judgement. That's why the behaviour of this senator in this tweet is unacceptable (and honestly disgusting). If you were asking Canadians every time what they think of each issue through polls, we would end up like a third world country.

 

[torontosm]

The way the senator expressed this was really unprofessionnal. Honestly, most of the 'old stock' Canadians are too ignorant to have an unbiased and objective view of this issue. They often mix up citizenship and permanent residency, and keep finding it normal that any person who is not white should be deported upon any kind of misbehavior (even theft). That's why we have a Supreme Court and a Senate, those institutions are supposed to have the knowledge and the expertise to look at very important issues like this one according to the Canadian Constitution (i.e., the Charter) with 'sober second thought' and sound judgement. That's why the behaviour of this senator in this tweet is unacceptable (and honestly disgusting). If you were asking Canadians every time what they think of each issue through polls, we would end up like a third world country.

Again, I fail to see what the issue is. The Senator tweeted: "Cdn Senate currently debating Bill C6 which will restore citizenship to convicted terrorists such as ringleader of Toronto 18. Good policy?" What exactly is unprofessional in that tweet? And, despite what you have conjectured in your own mind, there is absolutely NO reference to white Canadians vs. other Canadians. And finally, are you upset that the Senator is asking the public for their thoughts? I thought that is exactly what a democracy was all about.

 

[Natan]

Again, I fail to see what the issue is. The Senator tweeted: "Cdn Senate currently debating Bill C6 which will restore citizenship to convicted terrorists such as ringleader of Toronto 18. Good policy?" What exactly is unprofessional in that tweet? And, despite what you have conjectured in your own mind, there is absolutely NO reference to white Canadians vs. other Canadians. And finally, are you upset that the Senator is asking the public for their thoughts? I thought that is exactly what a democracy was all about.

Legislators should have the courage to do the jobs they were elected/apponted to do. That means sometimes taking unpopular decisions because they're good for Canada, or because they're just the right thing to do. While public opinion is an important component of a truly representative democracy -- that's what elections are for, legislators are not elected/appointed to take opinion polls before each difficult decision (not even the ultra scientific polls a tweet can provide). One look south of the border should tell us all we need to know about too much populism in our politics.

 

[torontosm]

Legislators should have the courage to do the jobs they were elected/apponted to do. That means sometimes taking unpopular decisions because they're good for Canada, or because they're just the right thing to do. While public opinion is an important component of a truly representative democracy -- that's what elections are for, legislators are not elected/appointed to take opinion polls before each difficult decision (not even the ultra scientific polls a tweet can provide). One look south of the border should tell us all we need to know about too much populism in our politics.

Wow, the poor Senators can't win. if they make a decision on their own, they get blasted for being unelected officials that are violating democratic principles and opposing the opinions of the people. And if they ask the public for input, people like you are unhappy becuase you view that as lacking courage.

It seems like the Senators are doing exactly what you want them to...blocking C-6 becuase they don't think it's in Canada's best interest. And I for one support them on this.

 

[admontreal]

Again, I fail to see what the issue is. The Senator tweeted: "Cdn Senate currently debating Bill C6 which will restore citizenship to convicted terrorists such as ringleader of Toronto 18. Good policy?" What exactly is unprofessional in that tweet? And, despite what you have conjectured in your own mind, there is absolutely NO reference to white Canadians vs. other Canadians. And finally, are you upset that the Senator is asking the public for their thoughts? I thought that is exactly what a democracy was all about.

Sorry, I was referring to another tweet where she said that 'A Canadian is not a Canadian, ....'. Starting a tweet with such a stupid and non-sensical statement is everything but professional.
Technically, Zakaria Amara should never have lost his citizenship, he is a Canadian terrorist that should be dealt with by Canada. You can't pick and choose who is Canadian enough and who is not and I am not really in the mood of arguing again about this terrorist citizenship revocation thing. You will always camp in your position because of your beliefs and it will be the same for me. And that's the way it is.
I agree with you, there's (on paper), no reference to White versus non-White Canadians in this law but in the facts that's absolutely the case. When the Harper government tried to enforce this clause they did that on people with arab-origin (Amara) or pakistani-origin (Gaya- who was born in Canada by the way). I never heard any reference to revoking the citizenship of a white canadian-born terrorist fighting for ISIS (after all they could be eligible for Irish or British citizenship as well if you dig enough). So please don't give me that argument that all Canadians were treated the same way by C-24. It's simply not true.

I don't think the main function of the Senate and the Supreme Court involves listening to the public.Regarding the Senate, these Senators were appointed (and not elected) to use their experience and their knowledge to assess Canadian laws. You want to listen to the People ? You go to the House of commons, to townhalls, to the city hall, to the media. Democracy is about listening to the People, you are right, but again, protecting our rights and values is about looking at the facts against the core foundations of our country.So no, a Supreme Court judge doesn't care about the will of the Canadians, he cares about the Law and its interpretation.
That's called Balance of Power, and that's how we can differentiate ourselves from totalitarian regimes elsewhere in the world.

 

[foodie69]

That is because you count only yourself, is your wife working as well? Most immigrants family earn much more than that if you count the family and 10k is nothing not to be affordable for matter such important as citizenship

Clearly discriminating against those who cannot pay 10 grand. One should not be able to purchase citizenship or any paper in that matter.

 

[admontreal]

Wow, the poor Senators can't win. if they make a decision on their own, they get blasted for being unelected officials that are violating democratic principles and opposing the opinions of the people. And if they ask the public for input, people like you are unhappy becuase you view that as lacking courage.

It seems like the Senators are doing exactly what you want them to...blocking C-6 becuase they don't think it's in Canada's best interest. And I for one support them on this.

Senate shouldn't make decisions against the House of Commons ones. All they can do is 'strongly advise' like they did for the Assisted-dying Bill. That's what we mean by 'sober second thought'. Moreover, they shouldn't be motivated by partisanship. All I see in the Second reading debates from the Conservative senators is the same old and repetitive arguments, the same ones their House of Commons counterparts told them to say. There's no added value, no constructive debate, the same and lame :' we are giving citizenship to the toronto 18 ringleader'... I expect more than that from the Senate Opposition.

 

[deadbird]

Hi bro,

Are you kidding most of the immigrant can afford 10,000 as processing fee? I landed in Canada as PR with 90k job in my hand and all expense paid by employer. I can't afford. Can you tell me your secret? I may benifit from this.
Thx

Hi Asif

I'm really curious, how are you not able to afford 10K with a 90K salary? What are your main expenses? I used to be able to save 10K annually on 25K as a grad student.

 

[Natan]

Wow, the poor Senators can't win. if they make a decision on their own, they get blasted for being unelected officials that are violating democratic principles and opposing the opinions of the people. And if they ask the public for input, people like you are unhappy becuase you view that as lacking courage.

It seems like the Senators are doing exactly what you want them to...blocking C-6 becuase they don't think it's in Canada's best interest. And I for one support them on this.

If a legislator wants to poll the "opinions of the people" in a representative democracy, the proper course of action is to hold an election/plebiscite. Tweets are not considered a legitimate expression of the will of "the people".

 

[hangincanada]

Senate shouldn't make decisions against the House of Commons ones. All they can do is 'strongly advise' like they did for the Assisted-dying Bill. That's what we mean by 'sober second thought'. Moreover, they shouldn't be motivated by partisanship. All I see in the Second reading debates from the Conservative senators is the same old and repetitive arguments, the same ones their House of Commons counterparts told them to say. There's no added value, no constructive debate, the same and lame :' we are giving citizenship to the toronto 18 ringleader'... I expect more than that from the Senate Opposition.

totally agree. her statement is misleading as bill c6 is all about equality of all citizens. and you are also right that she has been motivated by partisanship based on her other statements so her sober second thought as a senator is really concerned.

 

[daisy2]

Again, I fail to see what the issue is. The Senator tweeted: "Cdn Senate currently debating Bill C6 which will restore citizenship to convicted terrorists such as ringleader of Toronto 18. Good policy?" What exactly is unprofessional in that tweet? And, despite what you have conjectured in your own mind, there is absolutely NO reference to white Canadians vs. other Canadians. And finally, are you upset that the Senator is asking the public for their thoughts? I thought that is exactly what a democracy was all about.

I am in between the two changes and I could not make it out and now close to 4 yrs .But ironically nothing is coming good for me if they pass 2 yr processing time...

 

[asifmehmood]

Hi Asif

I'm really curious, how are you not able to afford 10K with a 90K salary? What are your main expenses? I used to be able to save 10K annually on 25K as a grad student.

You must be single, we are family of 5 and my spouse is studying. ITS HARD....

 

[torontosm]

If a legislator wants to poll the "opinions of the people" in a representative democracy, the proper course of action is to hold an election/plebiscite. Tweets are not considered a legitimate expression of the will of "the people".

So do you feel that it is equally irresponsible or illegitimate for citizens to contact their MP's? What exactly is the difference between a MP listening to their constituents and a Senator (who has no official constituents) asking for public input? Do you think democracy would be better served is Senators did whatever they wanted (or even worse, what their party demanded) without even trying to gauge where public opinion was? I don't.