Bill C-24 Second Reading on February 27th:

[us2yow]

Remember, it'll be 2 years for some of us with no pre-PR time counted!

Or more in some cases. Correct me if I am wrong, so if someone were an undergraduate, then did their masters (so lets say 4+2 years) and say
just became a TFW - they could actually apply under current rules based on just the 50% of 6 years they put in as a student

YES ?

The change is extremely harsh on students and TFWs !

 

[torontosm]

Like most conservative people who try to accuse other people of racism, you can't seem to get things straight. Several mistakes that you made:

1) I wrote 'guys who are trying to come over and pick vegetables and support their families', not 'Mexicans'. Most people who try to cross into America illegally from Latin America are poor -- that's why they're coming. Many of them work in agriculture -- I don't look down on that in the least, it's a valuable service.. Nothing in my post indicated disapproval of them.

2) I wrote 'you', referring to DoctorKB, whose attitudes towards immigrants are very, very similar to the 'gun-loving, trigger happy, immigrant hating racists' who hand out on the Rio Grande threatening people. Secondly, even if I did say that Americans are all those things, I completely deny that would be 'racist'.

So in other words, Mexicans were never mentioned, I didn't have anything negative to write about undocumented immigrants, and Americans weren't even mentioned -- or do you have a definition of 'racism' that includes gun-toting vigilantes as a race?

On-hold, it's pointless arguing with you because you will never admit you are wrong, but you said:

"Since when did an American get to decide what 'legitimate' immigration is in Canada? Shouldn't you be hanging out on the Rio Grande with a gun, threatening guys who are trying to come over to pick your vegetables and support their families?"

So, contrary to your last sentence, you obviously did mention Americans. And, when you said "guys that come over", I assumed you meant guys that cross the border, so that would either imply Mexicans or Candians, since the US has no other land borders. And, you claim you meant legal agricultural workers, but then why would Americans be threatening such workers with guns?

So in effect, either you are clueless or a liar. either way, I'm done with this argument.

 

[on-hold]

On-hold, it's pointless arguing with you because you will never admit you are wrong, but you said:

"Since when did an American get to decide what 'legitimate' immigration is in Canada? Shouldn't you be hanging out on the Rio Grande with a gun, threatening guys who are trying to come over to pick your vegetables and support their families?"

So, contrary to your last sentence, you obviously did mention Americans. And, when you said "guys that come over", I assumed you meant guys that cross the border, so that would either imply Mexicans or Candians, since the US has no other land borders. And, you claim you meant legal agricultural workers, but then why would Americans be threatening such workers with guns?

So in effect, either you are clueless or a liar. either way, I'm done with this argument.

I know you like to leave arguments when you lose, but this is pretty silly -- I wrote 'American' but according to you, I meant 'Americans'? And you claim that I meant Canada when I wrote 'Rio Grande'? Seriously? If I were you, I'd stop arguing too.

And your final question, claiming total naivete as to why Americans might be threatening such workers with guns, is a real piece of work. So you're totally unfamiliar with the southern border of America and how it factors into the violent, nativist politics of the USA? Well, I am familiar with it. Actually, I'm an American . . .

 

[taleodor]

If Conservatives stay at power after the elections, it will be much longer than 2 years.

This corrupted government cannot add 2 and 2, not speaking about the Immigration. All they know how to do is shutting the mouths of the invited experts.

 

[torontosm]

I know you like to leave arguments when you lose, but this is pretty silly -- I wrote 'American' but according to you, I meant 'Americans'? And you claim that I meant Canada when I wrote 'Rio Grande'? Seriously? If I were you, I'd stop arguing too.

And your final question, claiming total naivete as to why Americans might be threatening such workers with guns, is a real piece of work. So you're totally unfamiliar with the southern border of America and how it factors into the violent, nativist politics of the USA? Well, I am familiar with it. Actually, I'm an American . . .

It's clear you didn't understand a word of my post, and I don't feel like repeating myself. But, since you are an American, I'll ask you the same question you posed to doktorkb: Since when did an American get to decide what immigration policies to Canada should be?

 

[Hasher]

Usually when Canadians are arrested in any un-developed countries they are labelled as terrorist, the police of that country can easily charge them as on any resourceful advise or even police by themselves (to justify their failure of getting bribe from them) as terrorist, in such situation usually Canadians contact any nearest Canadian Embassy or consulate to get rid of such false charges and get back safely to Canada. It is very common if some naturalized citizen is from Iraq, Iran Pakistan, Egypt, North Korea, Cuba, China, India, Middle east, Bahrain, Philippine, Mexico, Colombia, Venezuela etc. travelled back to their native country. This even happened to some Canadian who travelled to other countries like Mexico, Cuba, Colombia etc for leisure trip.

But now situation would be all naturalized citizen will have to bribe the corrupt authorise so not to get stripped from Canadian Citizenship, just to tell you those corrupt Authorities will know about this Law very well pretty soon, so on even a traffic violation as soon as they know you are Canadian Citizen they arrest or threat to arrest people on Criminal charges or terrorist charges. No body, like now will able to stand on ground to fight those corrupt people or society because of fear of losing the Citizenship or hassle and pain one would have to go through to justify themselves that it was a traffic violation not a Terrorist act.

 

[on-hold]

It's clear you didn't understand a word of my post, and I don't feel like repeating myself. But, since you are an American, I'll ask you the same question you posed to doktorkb: Since when did an American get to decide what immigration policies to Canada should be?

Since I arrived here to live beneath the principals of the Charter of Rights and Freedoms.

 

[daktrader]

Im not sure what your point was...
Confusing text ???

Usually when Canadians are arrested in any un-developed countries they are labelled as terrorist, the police of that country can easily charge them as on any resourceful advise or even police by themselves (to justify their failure of getting bribe from them) as terrorist, in such situation usually Canadians contact any nearest Canadian Embassy or consulate to get rid of such false charges and get back safely to Canada. It is very common if some naturalized citizen is from Iraq, Iran Pakistan, Egypt, North Korea, Cuba, China, India, Middle east, Bahrain, Philippine, Mexico, Colombia, Venezuela etc. travelled back to their native country. This even happened to some Canadian who travelled to other countries like Mexico, Cuba, Colombia etc for leisure trip.

But now situation would be all naturalized citizen will have to bribe the corrupt authorise so not to get stripped from Canadian Citizenship, just to tell you those corrupt Authorities will know about this Law very well pretty soon, so on even a traffic violation as soon as they know you are Canadian Citizen they arrest or threat to arrest people on Criminal charges or terrorist charges. No body, like now will able to stand on ground to fight those corrupt people or society because of fear of losing the Citizenship or hassle and pain one would have to go through to justify themselves that it was a traffic violation not a Terrorist act.

 

[torontosm]

Since I arrived here to live beneath the principals of the Charter of Rights and Freedoms.

So, the same as him then? See the irony?

 

[taleodor]

Looks like all Conservatives' staff rushed into this thread

Scared of next elections? Well, u should be.

 

[on-hold]

So, the same as him then? See the irony?

Well, two points.

1) He's not American, he's Canadian. Read more carefully.

2) Canadians who advocate removing Charter rights from immigrants don't get a free pass, simply because they're Canadian.

 

[torontosm]

Well, two points.

1) He's not American, he's Canadian. Read more carefully.

2) Canadians who advocate removing Charter rights from immigrants don't get a free pass, simply because they're Canadian.

Did you know he was Canadian when you wrote "Since when did an American get to decide what 'legitimate' immigration is in Canada?" My point is that it is awfully hypocritical of you to ask a question like that when you yourself are an American doing the very same thing.

 

[O_Ca]

Looks like all Conservatives' staff rushed into this thread

Scared of next elections? Well, u should be.

They should be re-named to the Propaganda Party of Racism.

 

[chakrab]

Looks like all Conservatives' staff rushed into this thread

Scared of next elections? Well, u should be.

trust me, conservatives are not scared in federal elections at this point. the oppositions need much better leaders to make any difference. also most immigrants vote conservative. check the racial diversity in the HOC and you will realize that.

 

[on-hold]

Did you know he was Canadian when you wrote "Since when did an American get to decide what 'legitimate' immigration is in Canada?" My point is that it is awfully hypocritical of you to ask a question like that when you yourself are an American doing the very same thing.

Obviously not -- but his immigration situation was quite thoroughly discussed after that, and if you weren't diving into this thread to cherry pick little points, and then threatening to leave when this fails to win arguments, you would have noticed that.

If you read the thread, you'll notice that there are two dominant positions: Doctorkb's, which is that immigrants lack rights, many immigrants are illegitimate, etc. etc., and the other, which is that immigrants are people protected by the same Charter rights that other Canadians have, including mobility and other fundamental aspects of human dignity. This latter view is the Canadian legal standard -- I'm defending it, but not deciding it. In fact, if you review my posts on this subject, you'll see that nowhere do I dispute the idea that Canada has the right to set its citizenship standards; I think they're remaking them in a stupid and counterproductive manner, but that's the country's business.

Doctorkb, contra this, is proposing a radical, and to my mind unCanadian, set of policies in which immigrants don't have the right to send money home, travel, or live like Canadians. Personally, I found it revolting when I thought he was an American and called him out on that; I was wrong, he's not American. Now I find it revolting that a Canadian would propose it. If this is hypocritical, then I'm a hypocrite.