Application withdrawal and reapplying

[Midcityjohn]

I applied for PR through my wife in 2011 but the relationship broke down and she withdrew the application. This was an inland application in which a decision was not yet made, although they gave me an open work permit. I returned to my home country after I got the letter saying the application was withdrawn.

I have now found myself getting married to another Canadian and possibly applying again. How does my previous application affect any new application?

When we ended our relationship, she was very angry and I'm fairly certain she said some god awful things about me in her withdrawal letter. I have heard that a withdrawn application is like the application never happened. Anyone know anything about this or can offer any advice on how to proceed?

 

[Alurra71]

You will still need to note that you did apply previously under sponsorship but that application was withdrawn. They may or may not look at information you provided on that application to compare it to information you present on a new application. It shouldn't have any effect on you regarding what your previous wife stated, CIC is used to poison letters and such and take them with a grain of salt, I'm sure.

You will want to be very clear with CIC about why you divorced in the first instance and just happened to meet yet another Canadian and are trying for PR again. It MIGHT look a bit odd to them.

 

[scylla]

No - a withdraw application is certainly not like it never happened. It's in CIC's systems permanently.

You should expect your application to be reviewed more closely and overall processing to take more time. CIC will be looking to ensure your second marriage is genuine rather than a means of obtaining PR status. It's quite possible you should expect an interview for this reason.

I would ensure you include as much evidence as possible to support your current relationship.

I would also include an additional letter explaining the circumstances of your previous sponsorship application and why it was terminated. There's absolutely no doubt that CIC will see the withdraw application in their system when they are reviewing your new application. So I would address this issue up front.

 

[Midcityjohn]

I have heard both ways on a withdrawn application being "visible" to CIC. You have any citation? I'm not trying to hide anything but would hate to mention an application in which they can not find to slow down the process. I'm not sure that it asks on the application that the person being sponsored has applied before either.

 

[Alurra71]

By not disclosing it, whether it asks you on the new application or not, they will find the information and you would be charged with misrepresentation and likely barred for 5 years. Giving them information won't slow them down, it will only help them. If they have to ask for it later when they do find it, and they will find it, that is what will slow you down.

 

[Midcityjohn]

But how do you know this to be true? Before I left Canada the last time I tried to look up my application online, the system said no record exists. I submitted a mail in request for copy of my open work permit and I got a letter back stating that no record could be found.

 

[kangamoose]

But how do you know this to be true? Before I left Canada the last time I tried to look up my application online, the system said no record exists. I submitted a mail in request for copy of my open work permit and I got a letter back stating that no record could be found.

It doesn't matter that ECAS said it didn't exist, this simply means the file is closed. CIC have access to your entire immigration file, I know this because I had a working holiday permit application that I had started and didn't go through with in 2013. I was questioned about it when I last entered Canada in Jan 2015 to be granted my current working holiday permit. By not disclosing the previous sponsorship it could appear that you are just trying anything to get to Canada and the visa officer would look more into your current marriage as a marriage of convenience. It is a big red flag, you need to address it and explain what happened whether there is a direct question about it or not.

 

[scylla]

I have heard both ways on a withdrawn application being "visible" to CIC. You have any citation? I'm not trying to hide anything but would hate to mention an application in which they can not find to slow down the process. I'm not sure that it asks on the application that the person being sponsored has applied before either.

You mentioned that an OWP was issued to you - your old applicaiton will definitely be in the system since it went through quite a bit of processing before being withdrawn.

If an application is withdrawn without any processing taking place - that's a different story. Assume yours will be in the system along with full details.

As mentioned above, failure to disclose in your new application is misrepresentation and will result in a 5 year ban from Canada. You sure you want to risk that???

Your ECAS argument holds no water. My husband no longer has an ECAS record (hasn't for year). His application was successfully processed and he landed and became a PR. Whether something is still in ECAS tells you nothing.

 

[canadianwoman]

You can order your GCMS and FOSS notes to see what the government has on file about you.

 

[mikeymyke]

They'll definitely know that you attempted to be sponsored before and had it withdrawn. If you look at all the cases on Canlii.org, you will see that they usually make reference to red flags that include the applicant attempting to be sponsored a 2nd time.

 

[WeeHippieElf]

i don't see any reason to not include it, just to be safe. i am currently sponsoring my second Scottish husband. with my first husband, we applied inland, withdrew it, then applied outland and it was processed with no hitch. with this application, i was concerned CIC would refuse me as a sponsor based on my first marriage and the fact that it seems fishy both men have been from the same country, but i was approved on the exact timeline CIC was showing - so being upfront on the application about previous undertakings didn't slow things down at all.

address it. explain it. you'll be fine.

 

[Midcityjohn]

I think it may be a good idea to order the notes on my file, if it exists. Anyone know of good service to order this information from?

 

[kangamoose]

I don't think you're understanding just how serious what you're thinking of doing is. They will know you have applied before, there is no question about that. You got far enough into the process that you got an OWP so you have a UCI number, they would also be able to see any visitor visa's you have held in the past (if you're from a visa requiring country). Also I'm sure you are aware that the background declaration requires you to list every address, every activity you were doing and the locations of these for the past 10 years. How else are you going to explain why you were in Canada if not on an OWP for inland sponsorship?

As said above a second spousal sponsorship is a big red flag if the first one failed/was withdrawn and your application will get scrutinized more. You need to be honest, you don't even need to go into much detail just a simple statement that you have previously been married to a Canadian citizen/PR but the relationship broke down due to .... and the application was withdrawn. Put this in the section on the background declaration that asks for any additional information. A red flag that has been addressed becomes a lot less of an issue when you explain the situation in your application because the officer examining the file will be a lot less suspicious than if you try and hide it.

 

[Midcityjohn]

Knagamoose,

I realize that you feel this previous application exists in the system but I have yet see any evidence that this is true. I have heard from more than one source that a withdrawal prior to a final decision removes the application. Furthermore, I had an open work permit which I tried to get another copy of by submitting a paper CIC form and snail mail, not E-case, only to be told they are unable to locate my work permit. This was in writing from CIC. Additionally, I have crossed the border via land crossing a dozen times since and not one mention of any of this.

I'm not saying that I'm not going to mention my previous attempt, as I agree to error on the side of caution, rather than trying to get an idea of how this system works, so I can make the best personal choice for myself. On the flip side, if what I suspect is true about this, I stand a decent chance of causing myself a lot of trouble if, in fact, my previous case was removed and CIC ends up looking for a missing file. If I order my entire case file, I should be able to get a better idea of how this works. If I see my information in my case file, I obviously know it is there and how to proceed. If not, then I have to make a judgement call on it.

Additionally, if I attempt another sponsorship application and it fails, I have no issue staying in USA. Therefore, I think I'm in position to gamble a bit. I never received a removal order or anything from CIC previously stating that I need to leave Canada, as one would suspect after having a sponsorship withdrawn, and I have visited with zero issues since. I take all of this into consideration towards thinking that my application was indeed removed.

 

[mikeymyke]

Midcityjohn, read my previous post, and familiarize yourself with the cases on Canlii.org.

Make no mistake about it, they WILL know about your previous sponsorship attempt. Also what kangamoose says is correct, the background declaration will require you to declare your activity for the last 10 years, and you will either have to tell the truth as to what you were doing in Canada, or lie about it, then get caught with misrepresentation later on, because they will be able to put two and two together (applied inland, but makes no mention of residing in Canada, hmm...).

Also, you're an American, and Americans probably have the easiest path to PR and the least amount of scrutiny, by coming clean and explaining your 1st sponsorship attempt in detail, you will come along just fine. It's way better than lying about it and being caught with misrepresentation.

By far, the best course of action for yourself is to just simply explain in detail, the circumstances surrounding the breakdown of the 1st relationship, and how you came about to be with the 2nd partner.