Applicant from PhD program after 5 Nov, 2011 connect here to get status

[Reno]

Here is the gist of the letter. Let me know if you have any questions.

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The Minister of Citizenship, Immigration and Multiculturalism issued instructions which were published in the Canada Gazette on November 5, 2011. These instructions specify that applications from international students who are currently enrolled in a PhD program, or foreign nationals who have completed a PhD program, in a recognized educational institution located in Canada and that are accompanied by the results of the principal applicant’s English or French language proficiency assessment are eligible to be processed in the Federal Skilled Worker class.

I have now completed the assessment of your application for a permanent resident visa as a skilled worker. I have determined that you do not meet the requirements for immigration to Canada.

While the Phd program meets one of the requirements of the Ministerial Instructions now in effect, to be eligible for processing, your work experience must still meet the minimal requirements as defined in subsection 75(2) of the Immigration and Refugee Protection Regulations that states that a foreign national is a skilled worker if:

a) within the ten years preceding the date of their application for a permanent resident visa, they, have at least one year of continuous full-time (37.5 hours/week) employment experience as described in subsection 80(7), or the equivalent in continuous part-time employment in one or more occupations, other than a restricted occupation, that are listed in Skill Type 0 Management Occupations or Skill Levels A or B of the National Occupational Classification matrix;

b) during that period of employment they performed the actions described in the lead statement for the occupation as set out in the occupational descriptions of the National Occupational Classification; and

c) during that period of employment they performed a substantial number of the main duties of the occupation as set out in the occupational descriptions of the National Occupational Classification, including all of the essential duties.

I am not satisfied that you meet part A of these requirements for the following reasons:

All supporting documentation on file regarding your work experience history was taken into consideration. Work experience with XXX University for a period less than one year continuous at time of application. Therefore, evidence of part A above cannot be established.

Subsection 75(3) states that if a foreign national fails to meet these requirements, the application shall be refused and no further assessment is required. I am not satisfied that you meet these requirements.

Subsection 11(1) of the Act states that a foreign national must, before entering Canada, apply to an officer for a visa or for any other document required by the regulations. The visa or document may be issued if, following an examination, the officer is satisfied that the foreign national is not inadmissible and meets the requirements of this Act. Subsection 2(2) specifies that unless otherwise indicated, references in the Act include regulations made under it.

Following an examination of your application, I am not satisfied that you meet the requirements of the Act and the regulations for the reasons explained above. I am therefore refusing your application.
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[MapleDream]

Hi, I just got an email from CIC today. I didn't get PER. Apparently, the visa officer didn't think that I have enough hours to count as one-year work experience. I only submitted my TA/RA as work experience. I have had TA jobs for almost 6 years now, and there should be enough hours (37.5 hours x 54 weeks), so I don't really know what happened. Anyways, I don't think I am gonna resubmitted my application for this particular stream. Good luck guys!! Wish you the best for the rest of the journey!

This is very sad news. However, after you defend your thesis, you could apply in PNP. That's much faster.

 

[s.guo82]

Sorry to hear that. Do you mind letting us know what document you sent to prove your working experience?

 

[supergoldenfish]

Congrats snow_walker... hopefully, I will get PER as soon as you did...

It says the same thing in my email also. May be CIC just send PER on the basis of PhD enrollment/completion criteria.

It doesn't mention anything about work experience.

 

[supergoldenfish]

Sorry to hear that. Do you mind letting us know what document you sent to prove your working experience?

good question!!

 

[Reno]

Hi, I sent all the TA contracts along with letters from the professors that I had worked with. As for T4 form, I can't remember whether I submitted or not, but I think I did.

Sorry to hear that. Do you mind letting us know what document you sent to prove your working experience?

 

[s.guo82]

Hi, I sent all the TA contracts along with letters from the professor that I had worked with. As for T4 form, I can't remember whether I submitted or not, but I think I did.

That is weird, cos in your TA contracts you should have clearly stated working hours and hourly rate. The accumulative working hours should be a legit and valid proof for your working experience. Did not you claim any RA experience? TA working experience alone may be discontinuous in our university and it should not be more than 10hrs a week. However, RA could be up to 8hrs/day.

 

[Reno]

Hi, I did include a letter from my supervisor stating that i have had some hours as a research assistant, but it is not as formal as the TA job. Yes, the TA contracts had all the hours listed for each term or year. The only thing that I could think of might be that I didn't include the most recent TA contract, which is the one I am doing right now.

That is weird, cos in your TA contracts you should have clearly stated working hours and hourly rate. The accumulative working hours should be a legit and valid proof for your working experience. Did not you claim any RA experience? TA working experience alone may be discontinuous in our university and it should not be more than 10hrs a week. However, RA could be up to 8hrs/day.

 

[asbereth]

Hi, I did include a letter from my supervisor stating that i have had some hours as a research assistant, but it is not as formal as the TA job. Yes, the TA contracts had all the hours listed for each term or year. The only thing that I could think of might be that I didn't include the most recent TA contract, which is the one I am doing right now.

Hi Reno, I'm really sorry to hear about your NER. This is too depressing As s.guo82 said, the letter from your supervisor(s) should be enough to prove that you work a certain number of hours for a certain period of time. I really can't think of any reason why they wouldn't consider your TA/RA experience. If you go back these 6 years, was there ever any gap in funding. Can you at least locate a continuous period of 1,950 hours (a combination of any periods of time within the last 6 years)? If you are (positively) sure that there was never a gap in funding such that you can't locate a continuous period of 1,950 hours, then there was probably a mistake on their part, and can probably try this tactic (courtesy of shaon31):

http://www.canadavisa.com/canada-immigration-discussion-board/how-to-deal-with-an-unfair-ner-a-negative-eligibility-review-t67741.0.html

Explain to them why, based on (ONLY) the documents you submitted, it should be possible to locate a one year of continuous full-time employment experience (each work week is 37.5 hours). Remember, even if you have, say, 9,750 legit hours within the last 6 years (which means 5 years of work experience within the last 6 years), if it is broken down into 6 1,625 hour pieces (say you don't work during summer, and are not funded), then you would still not be eligible, so one would have to be careful in deciding what to put on their letters of reference. For TA/RA, since you're probably only claiming like 20 - 25 hours, you would need a two-year of continuous enrollment in the program with funding. If you continuously with funding for 23 months, then take a month off without funding, then you would not be eligible since your number of continuous hours would never reach 1,950.

Good luck, and hopefully things can actually work out on your favor. Please do not give up just yet, and I really appreciate you sharing this with us (I don't think I could stomach sharing bad news with the rest of the forum if, God forbids, I get NER as well).

One thing we know for sure though, the CIO did check more than the period of PhD enrollment for eligibility review. It also seems to check whether you have a one-year continuous full-time work experience.

Anyway, I am from Indonesia (for the spreadsheet)

 

[s.guo82]

Hi Reno, I'm really sorry to hear about your NER. As s.guo82 said, the letter from your supervisor(s) should be enough to prove that you work a certain number of hours for a certain period of time. I really can't think of any reason why they wouldn't consider your TA/RA experience.

If you go back these 6 years, was there ever any gap in funding. Can you at least locate a continuous period of 1,950 hours (a combination of any periods of time within the last 6 years)? If you are (positively) sure that there was never a gap in funding such that you can't locate a continuous period of 1,950 hours, then there was probably a mistake on their part, and can probably try this tactic:

http://www.canadavisa.com/canada-immigration-discussion-board/how-to-deal-with-an-unfair-ner-a-negative-eligibility-review-t67741.0.html

Explain to them why, based on (ONLY) the documents you submitted, it should be possible to locate a one year of continuous full-time employment experience (each work week is 37.5 hours). Remember, even if you have, say, 9,750 legit hours within the last 6 years (which means 5 years of work experience within the last 6 years), if it is broken down into 6 1,625 hour pieces, then you would still not be eligible, so one would have to be careful in deciding what to put on their letters of reference.

Good luck, and hopefully things can actually work out on your favor.

One thing we know for sure though, the CIO did check more than the period of PhD enrollment for eligibility review. It also seems to check whether you have a one-year continuous full-time work experience.

One thing I am thinking about my case is that I have 5 months' gap in my first year RA. However, during that 5 months, I was working as a TA. According the letter sent to Reno "or the equivalent in continuous part-time employment in one or more occupations", does it indicate that my working experience is still continuous?

asbereth has pointed out a very important fact that both RA and TA working experience probably need to be listed in details with hourly rate according to work contracts and they should be continuous. I yet got any reply from CIO. I only have a letter from HR as the proof of my working experience without any other documents. Feeling anxious right now.

 

[asbereth]

One thing I am thinking about my case is that I have 5 months' gap in my first year RA. However, during that 5 months, I was working as a TA. According the letter sent to Reno "or the equivalent in continuous part-time employment in one or more occupations", does it indicate that my working experience is still continuous?

asbereth has pointed out a very important fact that both RA and TA working experience probably need to be listed in details with hourly rate according to work contracts and they should be continuous. I yet got any reply from CIO. I only have a letter from HR without any other documents. Feeling anxious right now.

Can you locate a continuous funding for a period of at least 1,950 hours in any combinations of any periods within the last 10 years? I think what you described sounds fine (if you can show that during those 5 months, you were funded by TA).

In my letter of reference, I did not even have single day gap (since the funding on my contract actually goes from 1 of the first month of the term to 31 of the last month of the term). Obviously my TA funding would have gap (since there were periods where I did not do any TA), but never was there a period where I did not receive any funding for a single day from September 1 09 (and this was evident from my letter of reference).

 

[cdhbamboo]

Explain to them why, based on (ONLY) the documents you submitted, it should be possible to locate a one year of continuous full-time employment experience (each work week is 37.5 hours). Remember, even if you have, say, 9,750 legit hours within the last 6 years (which means 5 years of work experience within the last 6 years), if it is broken down into 6 1,625 hour pieces (say you don't work during summer, and are not funded), then you would still not be eligible, so one would have to be careful in deciding what to put on their letters of reference. For TA/RA, since you're probably only claiming like 20 - 25 hours, you would need a two-year of continuous enrollment in the program with funding. If you continuously with funding for 23 months, then take a month off without funding, then you would not be eligible since your number of continuous hours would never reach 1,950.

Anyway, I am from Indonesia (for the spreadsheet)

But in my work experience, I have one summer break and even a break between my master's degree and my PhD study. I do not think summer break matters, especially for PhD stream.

Section 7.2 Assessing applications against the Ministerial Instructions issued June 26, 2010
“Anticipated short breaks between jobs are acceptable. For example, if an applicant is employed in one occupation for a 4 month contract and before the end of that contract, has secured other employment that will begin shortly after the end of first contract, this break in continuity would be acceptable.”

 

[Reno]

Hi, Asbereth. Thanks very much for the information! It is okay. Comes to think about it. it isn't a really big deal. I think eventually I will get PR, maybe not through this stream, but others might work. The same is probably true for everyone here as well. I am sure it will work out for everyone, and I am sure everyone knows it! It is only a matter of time, and how long it takes. If you have an ability to do a PhD, this immigration thing seems nothing really. hehe. Just be patient! Life is a like running a marathon. Either a good news or a bad news, excitement, disappointment, or being anxious, it is all worth experiencing and makes us appreciate more what we already have.

Hi Reno, I'm really sorry to hear about your NER. This is too depressing As s.guo82 said, the letter from your supervisor(s) should be enough to prove that you work a certain number of hours for a certain period of time. I really can't think of any reason why they wouldn't consider your TA/RA experience. If you go back these 6 years, was there ever any gap in funding. Can you at least locate a continuous period of 1,950 hours (a combination of any periods of time within the last 6 years)? If you are (positively) sure that there was never a gap in funding such that you can't locate a continuous period of 1,950 hours, then there was probably a mistake on their part, and can probably try this tactic (courtesy of shaon31):

http://www.canadavisa.com/canada-immigration-discussion-board/how-to-deal-with-an-unfair-ner-a-negative-eligibility-review-t67741.0.html

Explain to them why, based on (ONLY) the documents you submitted, it should be possible to locate a one year of continuous full-time employment experience (each work week is 37.5 hours). Remember, even if you have, say, 9,750 legit hours within the last 6 years (which means 5 years of work experience within the last 6 years), if it is broken down into 6 1,625 hour pieces (say you don't work during summer, and are not funded), then you would still not be eligible, so one would have to be careful in deciding what to put on their letters of reference. For TA/RA, since you're probably only claiming like 20 - 25 hours, you would need a two-year of continuous enrollment in the program with funding. If you continuously with funding for 23 months, then take a month off without funding, then you would not be eligible since your number of continuous hours would never reach 1,950.

Good luck, and hopefully things can actually work out on your favor. Please do not give up just yet, and I really appreciate you sharing this with us (I don't think I could stomach sharing bad news with the rest of the forum if, God forbids, I get NER as well).

One thing we know for sure though, the CIO did check more than the period of PhD enrollment for eligibility review. It also seems to check whether you have a one-year continuous full-time work experience.

Anyway, I am from Indonesia (for the spreadsheet)

 

[asbereth]

Section 7.2 Assessing applications against the Ministerial Instructions issued June 26, 2010
“Anticipated short breaks between jobs are acceptable. For example, if an applicant is employed in one occupation for a 4 month contract and before the end of that contract, has secured other employment that will begin shortly after the end of first contract, this break in continuity would be acceptable.”

I see. I suppose what 'begin shortly' means will be crucial here. So you really claimed no other work experience than TA/RA? I'm assuming that you only claimed the T4 portion of your income? Be that as it may, with at least 5 adaptability points from your wife, then you have at the very least 71 points (or 76 if you get the 2 years of PhD adaptability points, which are still ambiguous), so that could probably help expedite the whole process.

I really have no idea then why Reno's application was rejected, and hope he will actually try to contest the results (since there doesn't seem to be any reason why they would consider him not having work experieince).

 

[asbereth]

Hi, Asbereth. Thanks very much for the information! It is okay. Comes to think about it. it isn't a really big deal. I think eventually I will get PR, maybe not through this stream, but others might work. The same is probably true for everyone here as well. I am sure it will work out for everyone, and I am sure everyone knows it! It is only a matter of time, and how long it takes. If you have an ability to do a PhD, this immigration thing seems nothing really. hehe. Just be patient! Life is a like running a marathon. Either a good news or a bad news, excitement, disappointment, or being anxious, it is all worth experiencing and makes us appreciate more what we already have.

Reno, thanks for being so positive But would you at least consider contesting the decision, since I really do think that you have a good enough reason to do so (unless there were indeed some prolonged breaks within the past 6 years that would prevent you from getting the required 1,950 hours)?