Advice needed - US->CAN Out/In/etc

[ayrazar]

Hi there! My name is Ayra. I am a Canadian Citizen, born in Canada, living in Ontario, etc. My fiance is an American citizen, born in the US, living in New York state.

A few months ago, we made the decision to live together however we could. I have always wanted to remain in Canada, so we began attempting ways for him to be able to move to Canada. At first we tried to see if there were any work visas he applied for, but it appeared that is not the case. So then, we spent a few months not really sure what we would do, until I decided to propose and he agreed. So then we were merrily on our way to plan spousal sponsorship applications and such. We met with an Immigration Consultant, who convinced us to apply inland, and began to plan. Our wedding date is set for Dec 19 (although we havent paid the officiant yet, haha.)

Then I came on here to ask a few simple questions and all my planning kind of went to heck. According to you fine, brilliant folk, outland is the way to go. We chose inland because we'd rather this not cripple us financially, and the IC told us when we applied he would get a work visa in 4 months. However, as we will be submitting in early January 2016, that project may no longer even be running. It would be financially irresponsible for us to sit in Canada with only me working for 2-3 years while the inland is processed. My fiance is rather work-happy, in fact, and he would be very unhappy doing this. However, we are getting rather sick of living apart, and Outland means not living together until at least October 2016 (approx, if we applied early January after the wedding).

My degree is part of NAFTA, and I could theoretically live in the states if I found a job offer, but I would rather remain in Canada. Also, not sure if we could do an Outland application for PR for him while I was living in the states, or something.

Basically, I am looking for advice on what would make sense that would most efficiently have us being able to live together, without being financially, well, dumb.

 

[Ponga]

However, we are getting rather sick of living apart, and Outland means not living together until at least October 2016 (approx, if we applied early January after the wedding).

There's no reason why he can't come to Canada to visit you () while the Outland application is being processed. He would not have authorization to work in Canada, but it would cure the `sickness' of living apart.

MANY people do not realize that a person can be IN Canada and submit and Outland application.



Good luck!

 

[ayrazar]

There's no reason why he can't come to Canada to visit you () while the Outland application is being processed. He would not have authorization to work in Canada, but it would cure the `sickness' of living apart.

MANY people do not realize that a person can be IN Canada and submit and Outland application.



Good luck!

Mmhmm, thx for that info, I assumed as such but it's good to have that confirmed! Unfortunately the long drive and occasional weekend visits are just.. getting old fast. I'd rather have an option that wasn't another year and a half of that, hah.

 

[Sheps]

Also, as a Canadian Citizen, you can sponsor him from any country as long as you intend to live in Canada once you husband receives confirmation he can land.

 

[KelseyTVS]

I think Ponga means "visit" as in have your husband move to Canada on visitor status, rather than have weekend visits. He could stay with you for 6 months, and you could extend the visitor status for longer if you need to, but as Ponga said, he will not be able to work.

 

[ayrazar]

Also, as a Canadian Citizen, you can sponsor him from any country as long as you intend to live in Canada once you husband receives confirmation he can land.

Awesome, thanks. So that's technically a possibility.

I think Ponga means "visit" as have your husband move to Canada on visitor status, rather than have weekend visits. He could stay with you for 6 months, and you could extend the visitor status for longer if you need to, but as Ponga said, he will not be able to work.

Mmhmm, I understand. But as I graduated a few months ago and good old OSAP, Im not yet making enough or us to both live on responsibly. Damned money

 

[Majromax]

Mmhmm, I understand. But as I graduated a few months ago and good old OSAP, Im not yet making enough or us to both live on responsibly. Damned money

An inland process may be difficult then, as well. Even with a work permit in 4 months' time, you and your husband would need to support yourselves on one income in the interim.

Another possibility is to have a small wedding now, with firm plans for a bigger ceremony and reception as planned in December. This may or may not be acceptable to you depending on how you and your respective families/friends value the symbolism of the wedding. If you do go this route you would probably want to include extra evidence that the relationship is genuine and not simply for the purposes of immigration, but generally speaking CIC does not consider marriage fraud a problem for US/Canadian relationships since there is little to no advantage to be gained from immigration.

 

[ayrazar]

An inland process may be difficult then, as well. Even with a work permit in 4 months' time, you and your husband would need to support yourselves on one income in the interim.

Another possibility is to have a small wedding now, with firm plans for a bigger ceremony and reception as planned in December. This may or may not be acceptable to you depending on how you and your respective families/friends value the symbolism of the wedding. If you do go this route you would probably want to include extra evidence that the relationship is genuine and not simply for the purposes of immigration, but generally speaking CIC does not consider marriage fraud a problem for US/Canadian relationships since there is little to no advantage to be gained from immigration.

4 months is easily doable, 10 months is pushing it a bit. His current work is seasonal and he will probably be off Jan/Feb regardless so we thought the timing would work out quite well.

Yeah. I would worry about it seeming rushed/for the purpose of immigration etc. As it stands the Dec one is gonna be pretty small, we intended to have a bigger party next summer.

 

[ayrazar]

Also, as a Canadian Citizen, you can sponsor him from any country as long as you intend to live in Canada once you husband receives confirmation he can land.

Was just looking at the NAFTA stuff again, and wondering about your wording. "once... receives confirmation he can land" Does that mean that if I was in another country, and submitted an outland, that once approved we would have X days to get back into Canada?

 

[Sheps]

It is more of a....

You can't land with the intent to immediately leave and not come back for 3 years.


It doesn't mean you have to move ASAP, but it does have to be reasonable I believe. Don't quote me on this as my wife is living in Canada with me (I am supporting her while she can't work).

If you are planning on submitting in January 2016, you may want to do outland. Many US citizens who applied in January and some in February have already landed. My wife (Japanese) is expected to get her COPR this week or next and she will land pretty much right after.

Timelines for US citizens with a non-complicated application are less then 8 months I believe.

 

[Majromax]

If you are planning on submitting in January 2016, you may want to do outland. Many US citizens who applied in January and some in February have already landed. My wife (Japanese) is expected to get her COPR this week or next and she will land pretty much right after.

Timelines for US citizens with a non-complicated application are less then 8 months I believe.

This is pretty variable. From the Ottawa spreadsheet, many of those who applied this time last year didn't get their landing papers until April, but the January 2014 applicants landed in June-August.

Ottawa is one of the busier visa centers, and it handles not just family files but also much of the express entry stream. That seems to mess about with the waiting periods, as other programs get priority at different times. For example, as far as we can tell from the Ottawa spreadsheet the office did not finalize any family cases from the beginning of January until the last part of March.

Fortunately, the inland/outland decision does not have to be made right now; the forms are nearly identical. I do, however, advise ayrazar and others in similar situations to get their FBI checks sooner than would seem reasonable, perhaps around September. The FBI processing times are still quite long, and it would help to have the criminality check in-hand to submit with the rest of the application.

 

[ayrazar]

This is pretty variable. From the Ottawa spreadsheet, many of those who applied this time last year didn't get their landing papers until April, but the January 2014 applicants landed in June-August.

Ottawa is one of the busier visa centers, and it handles not just family files but also much of the express entry stream. That seems to mess about with the waiting periods, as other programs get priority at different times. For example, as far as we can tell from the Ottawa spreadsheet the office did not finalize any family cases from the beginning of January until the last part of March.

Fortunately, the inland/outland decision does not have to be made right now; the forms are nearly identical. I do, however, advise ayrazar and others in similar situations to get their FBI checks sooner than would seem reasonable, perhaps around September. The FBI processing times are still quite long, and it would help to have the criminality check in-hand to submit with the rest of the application.

Yeah, I get the impression Ottawa is kind of a come-what-may processor. Doesn't seem to have a linear sense to processing.
My fiance and I were trying to decide when exactly to do the FBI check. It cannot be any older than 3 months, correct? We were thinking of submitting for it early October, but you are saying September?
And yeah. Im guessing once we get our marriage licence in our hot little hands in December, we'll have a look at current times/probably bother you fine folk again to decide at that moment which is the better option. If we did outland he could still live in Canada Jan-Mar while the season is still down and on unemployment and all that jazz, which would be nice, I suppose.

 

[Majromax]

Yeah, I get the impression Ottawa is kind of a come-what-may processor. Doesn't seem to have a linear sense to processing.
My fiance and I were trying to decide when exactly to do the FBI check. It cannot be any older than 3 months, correct? We were thinking of submitting for it early October, but you are saying September?
And yeah. Im guessing once we get our marriage licence in our hot little hands in December, we'll have a look at current times/probably bother you fine folk again to decide at that moment which is the better option. If we did outland he could still live in Canada Jan-Mar while the season is still down and on unemployment and all that jazz, which would be nice, I suppose.

CIC's guides are actually contradictory here. The police certificate page says the report must be from within the past six weeks, whereas the immigration guide says three months. As I understand it, six months is a new-ish policy and not all the documentation is updated.

If the FBI maintains its current processing times, submitting in September will get the police certificate issued and in your hands in December, just in time to apply. That's why I recommend an overabundance of caution. However, the FBI might get its act together and return to relatively rapid turnarounds -- there is another thread here on FBI certificate processing timelines, so check in there around August-ish.

Be very careful with any "and on unemployment." Unemployment often requires an active job search, so state officials might cancel benefits for someone who is actually in Canada.

 

[keesio]

Yeah, I get the impression Ottawa is kind of a come-what-may processor. Doesn't seem to have a linear sense to processing.

I think Ottawa outland works with this multiple stream system. Applicants from the US who are citizens go into one stream. This is the fastest stream and timelines can jump around a lot but for the standard case, it usually maxes out at 10 months (but usually sooner). Sometimes this stream really moves along and can be as fast as the 3-5 month length we have seen recently with some. Based on the past two years, it seems like it is the summer months where they really get rolling. Non-citizens from the US go into another stream that is slower. Green card holders get priority here while work permit holders and student visa holders have longer timelines. It can be over a year for some. Applications from the US with major issues (criminal record, history of deportation, etc) go into another stream where they are sent to the LA office and those can take a long time (2+ years). of course Ottawa also handles applications from other parts of the world and they go into other separate streams.

 

[ayrazar]

Be very careful with any "and on unemployment." Unemployment often requires an active job search, so state officials might cancel benefits for someone who is actually in Canada.

Because he is union and the work is known to be seasonal, he just has to be able to be called into work at all times. As we are (albeit a fairly long) drive from each other, we /should/ be fine. Thanks though! We definitely agreed that if we do this we will have to be certain on this.

I think Ottawa outland works with this multiple stream system. Applicants from the US who are citizens go into one stream. This is the fastest stream and timelines can jump around a lot but for the standard case, it usually maxes out at 10 months (but usually sooner). Sometimes this stream really moves along and can be as fast as the 3-5 month length we have seen recently with some. Based on the past two years, it seems like it is the summer months where they really get rolling. Non-citizens from the US go into another stream that is slower. Green card holders get priority here while work permit holders and student visa holders have longer timelines. It can be over a year for some. Applications from the US with major issues (criminal record, history of deportation, etc) go into another stream where they are sent to the LA office and those can take a long time (2+ years). of course Ottawa also handles applications from other parts of the world and they go into other separate streams.

Ah, that makes sense. And Seems to agree with me theory that if we apply in Jan 2016, outland, should be expecting a response around Oct 2016.