PRTD on humanitarian and compassionate grounds

[jakklondon]

Many people don’t have the money or the time to sue the government especially when you could sponsor someone within the same period.

It doesn't really cost much to sue, and a case so clear cut as denial of public service could be handled Pro Se: one would need paper trail, copies of letters sent, good faith attempts made to resolve the matter, and a proof that the benefit was denied, along with proof that one is PR , which entitles them to benefit sought.

I understand that most average individuals would want to avoid litigation at all costs (which is one of the reasons why they are being so often mistreated). But OP may or may not have a choice to sponsor his wife. I don't know what are the costs of treatment for someone on dialysis (presumable she will need it through the rest of her life), and I don't know if having the medical condition she has would make her inadmissible (due to costs of treatment). This is Something OP will have to figure out. And if there is no choice to sponsor her, then bringing her to Alberta and subsequently fighting for his spouses rights might be his only option to live with her in Canada.

 

[canuck78]

It doesn't really cost much to sue, and a case so clear cut as denial of public service could be handled Pro Se: one would need paper trail, copies of letters sent, good faith attempts made to resolve the matter, and a proof that the benefit was denied, along with proof that one is PR , which entitles them to benefit sought.

I understand that most average individuals would want to avoid litigation at all costs (which is one of the reasons why they are being so often mistreated). But OP may or may not have a choice to sponsor his wife. I don't know what are the costs of treatment for someone on dialysis (presumable she will need it through the rest of her life), and I don't know if having the medical condition she has would make her inadmissible (due to costs of treatment). This is Something OP will have to figure out. And if there is no choice to sponsor her, then bringing her to Alberta and subsequently fighting for his spouses rights might be his only option to live with her in Canada.

It does cost a lot of money to sue people. At the very minimum a few thousand but likely more. Most family don’t have that type of extra money lying around. Dyalis is extremely expensive which is why kidney function is one of the main medical issues physicians look for in a medicals. The cost of dialysis is between 70-100k/year and there can be issues with the port, there are limited spots available since many need to go 2-3 times be week either overnight or during the day and it takes multiple hours to complete the procedure.

 

[jakklondon]

It does cost a lot of money to sue people. At the very minimum a few thousand but likely more. Most family don’t have that type of extra money lying around.

1. Filing lawsuits don't cost thousands. You just pay the fee and submit a complaint with it, that's all it costs to sue someone. If you hire an attorney, then yes, you have to pay him what he charges for his services (and litigating a case in court could easily costs thousands of dollars in attorney's fees). But some cases are so simple and clear cut that you can actually go Pro Se and present it before the judge or jurors by yourself. If I was denied a benefit by provincial government which I know I am entitled to (as a PR with valid PR status), I would need only few documents to make a case in court (proof I applied, proof I was denied, proof I made good faith attempt to resolve the matter and reference to the statute which states that as a PR I am entitled to benefit I sought). No need to do research, write a brief, make references to common law or case precedents, hire experts, pay for depositions and etc. Just pay a filing fee, gather your papers and appear before the judge.

Dyalis is extremely expensive which is why kidney function is one of the main medical issues physicians look for in a medicals. The cost of dialysis is between 70-100k/year and there can be issues with the port, there are limited spots available since many need to go 2-3 times be week either overnight or during the day and it takes multiple hours to complete the procedure.

2. Perfect example where it's counterproductive and silly to be stingy on litigation, when not litigating (and consequently, not getting a medicare) can cost 100K/year in medical fees. For someone in such dire situation paying even astounding for a newcomer $10K for a lawyer might be a wise move, since it may save 90K in medical fees the first year, and then 100K a year, for as long as the individual lives and needs a dialysis.
But, as I have stated above, certain matters are so simple that you don't even need a lawyer in court. Why owe 100K in medical fees, when you can pay tens or hundreds of dollars in filing fees and ask court to rule on your case, which would ultimately result in getting a medicare and all your medical fees paid?

3. Certain types of cases are handled on contingency basis. If there are punitive damages that can be pursued in court (aside from forcing the government to provide the medicare), then some attorneys may take a case without charging anything upfront. They would get their fee only if they prevailed in court, and the fee would be deducted from the settlement proceeds, as a percentage of it. If this problem as widespread as some posters imply, I wonder why there hasn't been a class action lawsuit yet.

 

[canuck78]

1. Filing lawsuits don't cost thousands. You just pay the fee and submit a complaint with it, that's all it costs to sue someone. If you hire an attorney, then yes, you have to pay him what he charges for his services (and litigating a case in court could easily costs thousands of dollars in attorney's fees). But some cases are so simple and clear cut that you can actually go Pro Se and present it before the judge or jurors by yourself. If I was denied a benefit by provincial government which I know I am entitled to (as a PR with valid PR status), I would need only few documents to make a case in court (proof I applied, proof I was denied, proof I made good faith attempt to resolve the matter and reference to the statute which states that as a PR I am entitled to benefit I sought). No need to do research, write a brief, make references to common law or case precedents, hire experts, pay for depositions and etc. Just pay a filing fee, gather your papers and appear before the judge.



2. Perfect example where it's counterproductive and silly to be stingy on litigation, when not litigating (and consequently, not getting a medicare) can cost 100K/year in medical fees. For someone in such dire situation paying even astounding for a newcomer $10K for a lawyer might be a wise move, since it may save 90K in medical fees the first year, and then 100K a year, for as long as the individual lives and needs a dialysis.
But, as I have stated above, certain matters are so simple that you don't even need a lawyer in court. Why owe 100K in medical fees, when you can pay tens or hundreds of dollars in filing fees and ask court to rule on your case, which would ultimately result in getting a medicare and all your medical fees paid?

3. Certain types of cases are handled on contingency basis. If there are punitive damages that can be pursued in court (aside from forcing the government to provide the medicare), then some attorneys may take a case without charging anything upfront. They would get their fee only if they prevailed in court, and the fee would be deducted from the settlement proceeds, as a percentage of it. If this problem as widespread as some posters imply, I wonder why there hasn't been a class action lawsuit yet.

This isn’t a damages case so no lawyer is going to take this on a contigency basis. Many do not have the money to pay for lawyers in addition to possible having to cover the cost of dialysis in Canada until the lawsuit is resolved.

 

[jakklondon]

This isn’t a damages case so no lawyer is going to take this on a contigency basis.

I am not sure about that. There is certainly mental anguish and pain inflicted by gross incompetence of agent/employee who is denying life saving benefit to a patient in such distress, who is suffering from great medical ailment.

Many do not have the money to pay for lawyers in addition to possible having to cover the cost of dialysis in Canada until the lawsuit is resolved.

It's not necessary to hire a lawyer, especially when case is so clear cut. If you just want the benefits (no damages), simply file a complaint and bring all the documents with you, to prove that you are entled to benefit, and to show that your application was illegally denied.

No one has to pay cost of dialisys. The expectaiton is that medical provider/hospital will sue patient/PR, while patient's case is pending in court to get the benefit she is entitled to. You yourself say that paying even few thousands of dollars to attorney is out of reach for most immigrants. As such, even if hospital sues and wins default judgment it will collect nothing. They can't collect what you don't have. And once you prevail in court and get medicare, medicare will have to pick the tab. Also, if one is serious about suing provence for the benefit sought, chances are hospital would delay suing the client and wait for the outcome of her case against province first (provided that PR contacts hospital and explains her situation). But none of it may even be necessary, if she moves to Alberta, instead of Ontario. Alberta provides coverage from day one (we already discussed this) , and doesn't require current PR card to process medicare app.