Travel Restrictions - Outland - just got approved and CoPR, when can I come?

[canuck78]

One MP, let alone one staffer in an MP's constituency office, is not "the government." (Let alone whether that MP is even a liberal MP, given the other dumb things some MPs have said...)

But you are absolutely right that neither an MP nor an MP's staffer of any party should be providing such bad advice.

MP office is the representative of the government. You don't have to be a liberal MP to represent the government. Just proves again how dysfunctional the response is. Would add that the number of actual cases (although approximate since many provinces have done a poor job of contact tracing) isn't the huge problem minus the times where our ICUs are above capacity. It is the fact that a true quarantine isn't imposed. If people went to a home where there are no non-travelers and remained isolated for 14 days the system wouldn't be a huge problem but unfortunately not what is happening and not what the government is allowing to happen. The actual numbers related to travel are higher than 1-2% because people go home and don't remain isolated for 11 days.

 

[canuck78]

i really dont get why i should spend extra money on 3 days quarantine if i will be quarantining at home for other 14 days. like i could just come straight home and sit there for 14 days.
i will also be travelling with my cat, so very inconvenient and stressful for me and her lol
they anyways won't let me into the plane with a positive covid test which i do prior to boarding.... stupid

p.s. won't be travelling till November (the earliest) so hope it will be over then

Impossible to say what will happen so far in advance. The issue is that many don't go home to an empty home and stay there for 14 days and only have contact with people who they travelled with.

 

[armoured]

MP office is the representative of the government. You don't have to be a liberal MP to represent the government.

No. Off-topic, but parliament and the members thereof are separate from the government. It's a basic constitutional concept. You can make an argument about MPs from the party that forms the government, but they are distinct. There is no requirement or even expectation that eg an MP from an opposition party takes the government line. (It's a separate point that it may generally be a Bad Idea for an MP's constituency office to provide bad advice, in apparently complete ignorance of, government laws and regs.)

Yes, many people might think that their MPs are part of 'government.' They are wrong.

 

[Western Mountain Man]

i really dont get why i should spend extra money on 3 days quarantine if i will be quarantining at home for other 14 days. like i could just come straight home and sit there for 14 days.
i will also be travelling with my cat, so very inconvenient and stressful for me and her lol
they anyways won't let me into the plane with a positive covid test which i do prior to boarding.... stupid

p.s. won't be travelling till November (the earliest) so hope it will be over then

Truth is the government doesn't trust you will follow all the rules after arrival even though it's probably much safer to quarantine at home if you
have the proper environment. Also, border services doesn't trust your pre-flight covid test due to all the fake results arriving here and most likely
won't even ask to see it.

I'm really curious if they will give your cat a covid test ?
Just to be safe

 

[Western Mountain Man]

For reference, my partner just returned to Canada and is currently in her hotel quarantine. She paid $1089, so nearly half of the ‘up to $2000’ and, at least in her experience, the room is fairly decent even if she’d prefer to have avoided it all together!

Got lucky.

Make sure you do lots of research before choosing the quarantine hotel.
You don't want to catch covid there and have to be transferred to one of the 'Stalag-13' government contract hotels.

 

[armoured]

Truth is the government doesn't trust you will follow all the rules after arrival even though it's probably much safer to quarantine at home if you
have the proper environment. Also, border services doesn't trust your pre-flight covid test due to all the fake results arriving here and most likely
won't even ask to see it.

Well put. Although I'd rephrase to say the government knows 80% of people are probably trustworthy, but it has no easy, cheap, fair and reliable way to tell who is trustworthy. It's not that we don't trust 'you' - you seem reasonable - but so does that other guy.

 

[Western Mountain Man]

This is yet another example of Really Bad Journalism - in my view. (Why is it always the post and its brethren? Politics?)

They completely miss the point and never ask the question (or ignore it) one of the very first things one learns in public policy/statistics and related: what is the denominator? (Are we comparing like to like?)

One-third sounds like a big number (as does the number in the article, 88,000). But the comparison really has to be made against something else - in this case, for example, how many travellers were arriving before these measures were brought in, and over what period of time. (This is not a perfect comparison either, it's actually much more complex)

The figure I remember for Pearson Airport alone pre-covid was 100,000 arrivals per day. If that 88k arrivals not going into hotel quarantine is over three months ... well you can see the point. (Proper comparison would be during covid but before the hotel policy, I'm just trying to give a sense of scale).

I don't mind them questioning and raising the point - and it is a serious gap that PHAC doesn't give some breakdown or info. But the one-third itself doesn't mean much of anything.

If you wanted to guess at how many infectious people being let in, okay, let's take 1-2% infection rate - 2% probably at high end - that would be ~1500 infectious cases. Over two-three months, it's not nothing, but it's actually quite a small number compared to eg Ontario with 2-3000 cases a day.

(There are a whole lot of other questions that PHAC could clarify that are REALLY relevant - for example, if a lot of this is air crews, government, military, and a few other categories - are they ALREADY doing some kind of quarantine regime i.e. outside of the hotel policy? Do those other categories also have some enhanced testing regime? Contact tracing? etc. 1500 more infectious cases might seem like a lot, but if they are already and were before doing more serious isolaiton than the hotel requirement, it might mean a much lower prob of transmission to the community, which is what we should be worried about.

Unfortunately PHAC's lack of actual figures leaves it to the Post to write more fear-mongering articles that fail to even ask the question "what's the denominator, Kenneth?*")

*Apologies for the obscure REM reference.

Seems to be a lot of bad journalism these days.

" What's the denominator Kenneth? "
I prefer the original version....... What's The Frequency, Kenneth?

 

[valvlad]

I'm really curious if they will give your cat a covid test ?

lololol i hope no ) cat's been quaranining for her whole life

government doesn't trust you will follow all the rules after arrival

and that's why they featured this app for travellers and they check on people while they're on quarantine. why extra hotel costs, idk.
my hub will go furious if it's still going to be required lol cause we're saving hard rn

 

[armoured]

and that's why they featured this app for travellers and they check on people while they're on quarantine. why extra hotel costs, idk.

The simple answer to this point is that the federal government can do the app, but absolutely cannot do the enforcement without the provinces' active cooperation.

That's not to say the Feds have been competent or are even trying that hard - don't know - but for the most part, actual enforcement of quarantine/isolation is not something the federal government can snap their fingers and do.

Who should we blame? I don't know, it's not so simple. Cooperation requires both sides to participate. But some provinces/leaders don't seem to even be trying. Personal opinion only.