PR Expired Returning through US - Section 44 Report

[asaeed100]

Hello

i intend to return to Canada either alone or with family via Vancouver with expired PR Cards
i would like to know

1) should we show CoPR or PRC. Will we be let in?
2) any particular recommended Port of Entry ?
2) what sort of questions are generally asked at the PoE/secondary
3) is it good to have ( H & C ) reasons that kept us from fulfilling our RO
4) if they do write a section 44 report, what happens next. Do they still let us in ?
5) does the Section 44 report lead directly to a removal order that you can appeal later within 30 days ?
6) we have a child who was born after expiry of our PRC. do we apply for a visitor visa for them while inside or outside the Canada?. will such a move trigger any flag on our own statuses (ie if we manage to get in)


Thank You

 

[canuck78]

Hello

i intend to return to Canada either alone or with family via Vancouver with expired PR Cards
i would like to know

1) should we show CoPR or PRC. Will we be let in?
2) any particular recommended Port of Entry ?
2) what sort of questions are generally asked at the PoE/secondary
3) is it good to have ( H & C ) reasons that kept us from fulfilling our RO
4) if they do write a section 44 report, what happens next. Do they still let us in ?
5) does the Section 44 report lead directly to a removal order that you can appeal later within 30 days ?
6) we have a child who was born after expiry of our PRC. do we apply for a visitor visa for them while inside or outside the Canada?. will such a move trigger any flag on our own statuses (ie if we manage to get in)


Thank You

I’d the child from a visa exempt country?

Yes you will be let in. You can)5 just have an H&C reason you would need documentation. How long has your PR card been expired. How many days have you spent in Canada in the past 5 years and when was the last time you left Canada? Why are you not meeting your RO?

 

[asaeed100]

I’d the child from a visa exempt country?

Yes you will be let in. You can)5 just have an H&C reason you would need documentation. How long has your PR card been expired. How many days have you spent in Canada in the past 5 years and when was the last time you left Canada? Why are you not meeting your RO?

thank you for your reply. No. she does not hold a passport from a visa exempt country. she is only 6.

had to stay out as my mother was diagnosed with cancer . went through a long battle before she passed away

i will have H&C evidence ready such as medical reports, treatment etc. for both parents. until few months ago I had thought that we had completely lost the status until i applied for one of my children (18yrs) for a PRTD which got approved on H&C grounds. last time we were in canada was in 2009 planning to have some real estate assets before i move.

 

[canuck78]

thank you for your reply. No. she does not hold a passport from a visa exempt country. she is only 6.

had to stay out as my mother was diagnosed with cancer . went through a long battle before she passed away

i will have H&C evidence ready such as medical reports, treatment etc. for both parents. until few months ago I had thought that we had completely lost the status until i applied for one of my children (18yrs) for a PRTD which got approved on H&C grounds. last time we were in canada was in 2009 planning to have some real estate assets before i move.

Yes sometimes 18 year olds are able to retain their PR on H&C grounds 10 years is an extremely long time to be out of Canada. You would need to show that no other family member was nearby to care for your mother and your father was unable to do the caregiving during that time. It is hard to believe that she needed that level of care from you for 10 years but you can certainly try. Did you work during that time period? Do you have other siblings or family members in your home country? You would need to show that they needed a high level of care and that you had no other family who could have helped. Your 6 year old may struggle to get a TRV given that you are PRs out of compliance with your ROs. You also could not sponsor the child until you were compliant with your RO so it would likely take around 3 years to get PR. The child would not qualify for healthcare and may be asked to pay international fees for schooling as a visitor.

How long did you spend in Canada before 2009? That will also influence your H&C case.

 

[asaeed100]

Yes sometimes 18 year olds are able to retain their PR on H&C grounds 10 years is an extremely long time to be out of Canada. You would need to show that no other family member was nearby to care for your mother and your father was unable to do the caregiving during that time. It is hard to believe that she needed that level of care from you for 10 years but you can certainly try. Did you work during that time period? Do you have other siblings or family members in your home country? You would need to show that they needed a high level of care and that you had no other family who could have helped. Your 6 year old may struggle to get a TRV given that you are PRs out of compliance with your ROs. You also could not sponsor the child until you were compliant with your RO so it would likely take around 3 years to get PR. The child would not qualify for healthcare and may be asked to pay international fees for schooling as a visitor.

How long did you spend in Canada before 2009? That will also influence your H&C case.

i understand your chain of thoughts. however when you are the only son and going away for a long time ( while abandoning your sick and old parents) to get own life settled far away is way down on your to do list. As Mandalorian would say "this is the way" in our culture.


i had to work considering somebody had to work to pay the bills. my siblings had moved to Canada already. they would come for a short visit.

i dont regret my decision one bit. like i said after 2009 i was totally under the impression that we were done with the PR, otherwise i would have at least tried to move my spouse with kids a lot earlier. i was actually thinking about reapplying only a few months ago and even went for IELTS. . it was only a few months back i came to know about the difference between a PR Card and the residency status - also border crossing via usa and PRTD for kids.

my plan is to move and not leave until status is restored. if i get reported while crossing, i will have to appeal and hopefully by the time i get a hearing i would have stronger case. my only concern is for my daughter. Cant leave her behind. only risky option is to apply for a TRV while in USA rather than my home country.

Thanks

 

[canuck78]

i understand your chain of thoughts. however when you are the only son and going away for a long time ( while abandoning your sick and old parents) to get own life settled far away is way down on your to do list. As Mandalorian would say "this is the way" in our culture.


i had to work considering somebody had to work to pay the bills. my siblings had moved to Canada already. they would come for a short visit.

i dont regret my decision one bit. like i said after 2009 i was totally under the impression that we were done with the PR, otherwise i would have at least tried to move my spouse with kids a lot earlier. i was actually thinking about reapplying only a few months ago and even went for IELTS. . it was only a few months back i came to know about the difference between a PR Card and the residency status - also border crossing via usa and PRTD for kids.

my plan is to move and not leave until status is restored. if i get reported while crossing, i will have to appeal and hopefully by the time i get a hearing i would have stronger case. my only concern is for my daughter. Cant leave her behind. only risky option is to apply for a TRV while in USA rather than my home country.

Thanks

Applying for a TRV while in the US will be not different than applying from Canada. What if she gets denied? Chances of her getting a TRV are not very good. If your parents got better or passed away more than 6 months before your attempt to enter Canada your chances of H&C are even lower since you would need to show you tried to relocate as soon as possible. It may be cultural for the only son to be responsible for caring for their parents but that isn’t taken account when it comes to RO. It seems like you haven’t spent much time in Canada. If you get reported and appeal your level of establishment in Canada now will not have a huge influence on your case it is about the past. Would certainly not sell your home in India if you have one, in India when attempt to relocate given the odds are not in your favour.

 

[asaeed100]

Applying for a TRV while in the US will be not different than applying from Canada. What if she gets denied? Chances of her getting a TRV are not very good. If your parents got better or passed away more than 6 months before your attempt to enter Canada your chances of H&C are even lower since you would need to show you tried to relocate as soon as possible. It may be cultural for the only son to be responsible for caring for their parents but that isn’t taken account when it comes to RO. It seems like you haven’t spent much time in Canada. If you get reported and appeal your level of establishment in Canada now will not have a huge influence on your case it is about the past. Would certainly not sell your home in India if you have one, in India when attempt to relocate given the odds are not in your favour.

i am not indian.

you have a logical points. however when it comes to H&C cases it is not about you mostly but more about your children, dependents and factors that had kept you away from relocating. also by proving that you are not coming back to leech off of the system but rather as positive contributors while having assets and savings, will surely support our case. worst case scenario, if the case gets denied, we will pack up and leave. but at least i would have given one last shot at it for rest of the family. Considering two of the three have PR (thru PRTD) and will stay on and continue their education. i will not burn any ships back home.

my older children being in canada will be one of the reasons for me to do whatever i can to unite the family.

if i do not take any steps as you are suggesting with chances of appeal getting denied, then as a father I dont want to look like that i failed the entire family. i have nothing to loose here (only lawyers fees, plane tickets etc, a year and a half of stay in Canada) ., considering only few months ago i had thought otherwise and had given hope. now there is a slight glimmer of hope.

there are other scenarios that i can consider. such as traveling alone or sending my wife alone, while one of us stay back until our status gets resolved. hey i could even renounce my PR when my children are ready to sponsor me or go for a super visa.. but i guess i will be too old by that time.

btw many people i know have gone on a TRV with family, gotten a work permit and later appealed to get a PR status. my case seems to be little on the easier side thatn theirs.

 

[canuck78]

i am not indian.

you have a logical points. however when it comes to H&C cases it is not about you mostly but more about your children, dependents and factors that had kept you away from relocating. also by proving that you are not coming back to leech off of the system but rather as positive contributors while having assets and savings, will surely support our case. worst case scenario, if the case gets denied, we will pack up and leave. but at least i would have given one last shot at it for rest of the family. Considering two of the three have PR (thru PRTD) and will stay on and continue their education. i will not burn any ships back home.

my older children being in canada will be one of the reasons for me to do whatever i can to unite the family.

if i do not take any steps as you are suggesting with chances of appeal getting denied, then as a father I dont want to look like that i failed the entire family. i have nothing to loose here (only lawyers fees, plane tickets etc, a year and a half of stay in Canada) ., considering only few months ago i had thought otherwise and had given hope. now there is a slight glimmer of hope.

there are other scenarios that i can consider. such as traveling alone or sending my wife alone, while one of us stay back until our status gets resolved. hey i could even renounce my PR when my children are ready to sponsor me or go for a super visa.. but i guess i will be too old by that time.

btw many people i know have gone on a TRV with family, gotten a work permit and later appealed to get a PR status. my case seems to be little on the easier side thatn theirs.

Sorry thought your wrote that you were a mumbaikarian,

When it comes to not meeting your residency requirement for so long it has nothing to do with your children. You are applying for an H&C based on not meeting your RO. What will be considered is whether you had a legitimate reason for not meeting your residency requirement. It is unclear how much time you ever spent in Canada but your children have been living in your home country for 10 years so returning will not negatively effect them. You have an 18 year old who is considered able to live independently. It sounds like you have an older child who was extremely lucky to get a PRTD if they were 20+ years old. They are also considered adults so being in Canada to support them would not be a great argument. You are also likely to encounter problems getting a TRV for your youngest child. You got extremely lucky with both children getting PRTDs. Retaining PR for you and your spouse and getting a TRV for your daughter is much harder.
.

 

[asaeed100]

i am not indian.

you have a logical points. however when it comes to H&C cases it is not about you mostly but more about your children, dependents and factors that had kept you away from relocating. also by proving that you are not coming back to leech off of the system but rather as positive contributors while having assets and savings, will surely support our case. worst case scenario, if the case gets denied, we will pack up and leave. but at least i would have given one last shot at it for rest of the family. Considering two of the three have PR (thru PRTD) and will stay on and continue their education. i will not burn any ships back home.

my older children being in canada will be one of the reasons for me to do whatever i can to unite the family.

if i do not take any steps as you are suggesting with chances of appeal getting denied, then as a father I dont want to look like that i failed the entire family. i have nothing to loose here (only lawyers fees, plane tickets etc, a year and a half of stay in Canada) ., considering only few months ago i had thought otherwise and had given hope. now there is a slight glimmer of hope.

there are other scenarios that i can consider. such as traveling alone or sending my wife alone, while one of us stay back until our status gets resolved. hey i could even renounce my PR when my children are ready to sponsor me or go for a super visa.. but i guess i will be too old by that time.

btw many people i know have gone on a TRV with family, gotten a work permit and later appealed to get a PR status. my case seems to be little on the easier side thatn theirs.

Sorry thought your wrote that you were a mumbaikarian,

When it comes to not meeting your residency requirement for so long it has nothing to do with your children. You are applying for an H&C based on not meeting your RO. What will be considered is whether you had a legitimate reason for not meeting your residency requirement. It is unclear how much time you ever spent in Canada but your children have been living in your home country for 10 years so returning will not negatively effect them. You have an 18 year old who is considered able to live independently. It sounds like you have an older child who was extremely lucky to get a PRTD if they were 20+ years old. They are also considered adults so being in Canada to support them would not be a great argument. You are also likely to encounter problems getting a TRV for your youngest child. You got extremely lucky with both children getting PRTDs. Retaining PR for you and your spouse and getting a TRV for your daughter is much harder.
.

all children are under 18. Yes, i do understand my chances in the long run. taking care of elderly parents and child born after expiry and not being fully aware of the regulations were mainly the reasons for such a long absence. H&C and establishing myself while awaiting the appeal will be my play. i forgot to mention that i worked for a Canadian company affiliate before 2009, that could come in handy as well. the company went bankrupt in 2013. will have the bags ready as well. i will still apply for a TRV. if we get lucky we will be all set to take up this adventure. wish us luck and thats for the feedback. some of the points you raised will be helpful.

 

[canuck78]

all children are under 18. Yes, i do understand my chances in the long run. taking care of elderly parents and child born after expiry and not being fully aware of the regulations were mainly the reasons for such a long absence. H&C and establishing myself while awaiting the appeal will be my play. i forgot to mention that i worked for a Canadian company affiliate before 2009, that could come in handy as well. the company went bankrupt in 2013. will have the bags ready as well. i will still apply for a TRV. if we get lucky we will be all set to take up this adventure. wish us luck and thats for the feedback. some of the points you raised will be helpful.

Your lack of knowledge and a new child are not excuses. The fact that you work for a Canadian affiliated company has no benefit only work and time living in Canada counts.

 

[asaeed100]

Your lack of knowledge and a new child are not excuses. The fact that you work for a Canadian affiliated company has no benefit only work and time living in Canada counts.

i dont agree. please read up on this regulation.

 

[canuck78]

i dont agree. please read up on this regulation.

I know about appealing to retain your PR based on H&C as well. General H&C applications for PR and attempting to retain your PR after not meeting your RO are different things. Saying I didn’t know and I had a child who is now 6 does not represent H&C reasons for not meeting RO. Work at a Canadian affiliated organization also has no effect. Proving that you have a family member who needed to be cared for due to their serious medical issue while there was no other family members is the main reason for approval for H&C. For children around 18 it is being removed against their will as a minor. If you get reported your chances aren’t good. You have to hope you don’t get reported. How did your child under 18 get a PRTD without involving you and your spouse? Canada wold not allow a minor to return on their own.

 

[asaeed100]

I know about appealing to retain your PR based on H&C as well. General H&C applications for PR and attempting to retain your PR after not meeting your RO are different things. Saying I didn’t know and I had a child who is now 6 does not represent H&C reasons for not meeting RO. Work at a Canadian affiliated organization also has no effect. Proving that you have a family member who needed to be cared for due to their serious medical issue while there was no other family members is the main reason for approval for H&C. For children around 18 it is being removed against their will as a minor. If you get reported your chances aren’t good. You have to hope you don’t get reported. How did your child under 18 get a PRTD without involving you and your spouse? Canada wold not allow a minor to return on their own.

the residency obligation has a clause about working for a Canadian company - i am not totally relying on it
i dint say any one under 18 got PRTD
for me its like rolling the dice and taking our chances
few months back i didnt have this option
if it works , well and good. i will be taking this step for my children
if not, i dont loose much more than i thought i already had.

 

[canuck_in_uk]

the residency obligation has a clause about working for a Canadian company - i am not totally relying on it
i dint say any one under 18 got PRTD
for me its like rolling the dice and taking our chances
few months back i didnt have this option
if it works , well and good. i will be taking this step for my children
if not, i dont loose much more than i thought i already had.

The clause about working for a Canadian company does not apply at all in your situation.

 

[keesio]

The clause about working for a Canadian company does not apply at all in your situation.

Agreed. There is a pretty narrow criteria to claim this credit. Doesn't sound like the OP meets it