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WEIRD behavior from Passport Canada agent, is this normal?

kmoser

Full Member
Mar 22, 2022
32
85
So I had an in-person passport application appointment yesterday and I don't have a guarantor. I submitted the required statutory declaration in lieu of a guarantor form signed by a commissioner of oath and had to provide 4 references in total, 2 of whom have Canadian passports and with whom I've worked for about 5 years in two different places - they are not really friends, more like formal colleagues that I'm not close to (while they agreed to be my references I'm not 100% sure they would be willing to provide their passport info in order to be my guarantor).

When the agent looked at my application he asked if any of the 4 references are Canadian - those two former colleagues are and like I've explained I've 'known' them for about 5 years but not close or or on 'friendly' terms with them, at which point the agent asked, "Did you try asking them?". I answered no to which he replied that my application will be refused because I've known at least two Canadians for 5 years but don't have a guarantor. I told him I didn't know that I was automatically disqualified for a passport just for that reason (that I know at least one Canadian for 5 years yet that person couldn't or wasn't willing to be my guarantor), he said he was informing me of that reason now as my agent. I replied that I do not think I can be refused for that reason and if I were refused I would be taking legal action because I've followed the procedure for people who don't have a guarantor to the letter. He then made copies of my airline ticket then said to give him a minute, he came back after about 30 seconds and said he just explained my 'situation' to his 'supervisor' (like wft? is it even a 'situation' if I don't have a guarantor but did everything according to the rules, i.e, commissioner of oath and 4 references) and they told him my application will be refused if I submit it. I said I would go ahead and take my chances, when he gave me a pick-up date and my payment receipt I asked him if I will be contacted should my application be denied, he said 'oh yeah they'll call you'.

I dunno but I found my whole interaction with him really odd. Has anyone who applied without a guarantor experienced anything like this? He did say it's a different department that handles these no-guarantor applications. I wonder if they get some sort of bonus for every regular application (with guarantor) that they process which would explain why he kept pushing me to apply with a guarantor (at one point he even said he would give me another in-person appointment this week itself if I can convince one of my former Canadian colleagues to act as my guarantor). Any input or feedback will be appreciated.
 
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trumprefugee

Champion Member
Jun 6, 2017
1,616
3,186
Ottawa, ON
Category........
PNP
Visa Office......
Ottawa
NOC Code......
2172
App. Filed.......
06-01-2018
Nomination.....
19-12-2017
AOR Received.
07-01-2018
IELTS Request
24-06-2017
Med's Done....
05-01-2018
Passport Req..
09-03-2018
VISA ISSUED...
02-04-2018
LANDED..........
28-05-2018
Unfortunately I don't have feedback for you as I am still in the process of applying for citizenship, but following this thread as I am not sure if I will be able to find a guarantor when it comes time for me to apply for a passport. Thanks for sharing your experience. This is a good warning for those of us who have yet to apply for a passport!
 
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bellaluna

VIP Member
May 23, 2014
7,405
1,781
IDK, but a while back, someone here reported they mailed in their passport application got it returned with an agent's note that references must only be in the US or Canada (when there is actually no such requirement), so yes, getting a wayward agent can be possible....
 

kmoser

Full Member
Mar 22, 2022
32
85
IDK, but a while back, someone here reported they mailed in their passport application got it returned with an agent's note that references must only be in the US or Canada (when there is actually no such requirement), so yes, getting a wayward agent can be possible....
I guess we are at the mercy of the Passport officer assigned to us. I'm hoping that since he accepted my application after all he won't be the one processing and approving it, he did say he had to send it to another department that handles applications without a guarantor.
 

trumprefugee

Champion Member
Jun 6, 2017
1,616
3,186
Ottawa, ON
Category........
PNP
Visa Office......
Ottawa
NOC Code......
2172
App. Filed.......
06-01-2018
Nomination.....
19-12-2017
AOR Received.
07-01-2018
IELTS Request
24-06-2017
Med's Done....
05-01-2018
Passport Req..
09-03-2018
VISA ISSUED...
02-04-2018
LANDED..........
28-05-2018
I guess we are at the mercy of the Passport officer assigned to us. I'm hoping that since he accepted my application after all he won't be the one processing and approving it, he did say he had to send it to another department that handles applications without a guarantor.
Hope that department gets you your passport soon. Please share any updates as you get them. I am also concerned about how to get a guarantor, as I don't know any local Canadian citizens well enough and for at least 2 years.
 
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armoured

VIP Member
Feb 1, 2015
17,019
8,715
They really do not like the no guarantor cases.

Even if it makes you uncomfortable, it is pretty normal to ask in many cases, professional and otherwise. The guarantor is not guaratneeing anything more than that they know you. (I wish they'd change the name really)

The bar is so low that it's basically considered impossible for someone to reside in Canada and not be able to find one. (But yes, some exceptions). It's not meant to be for cases where it's awkward but impossible.

If you want to risk it or deal with legal expense to challenge, that's your right.
 

kmoser

Full Member
Mar 22, 2022
32
85
Hope that department gets you your passport soon. Please share any updates as you get them. I am also concerned about how to get a guarantor, as I don't know any local Canadian citizens well enough and for at least 2 years.
I will be updating here - I'm supposed to be picking up the passport in about 2 weeks, that is, if I don't get a call that it's been refused. I've already informed all 4 references that chances are almost 100% they will all be contacted as I now expect the Passport department will go over my application with a fine-tooth comb, probably cross-checking all my listed places of employment, residence, tax records, etc.
 

Tackica

Star Member
Feb 24, 2015
108
50
As someone mentioned above, guarantor only guarantees that s/he has known you for this or that many years and that you are the person from the photo. That is all. The guarantor does NOT guarantee for your behaviour, your past or anything like that.
Good luck with your application. I hope the rest of your passport process will be smooth and fast.
Take care!
 

armoured

VIP Member
Feb 1, 2015
17,019
8,715
As someone mentioned above, guarantor only guarantees that s/he has known you for this or that many years and that you are the person from the photo. That is all. The guarantor does NOT guarantee for your behaviour, your past or anything like that.
Yes - really important if you ask anyone about this, the 'guarantor' is not taking any significant risk or liability, they're not putting any financial guarantee.

The ONLY risk as far as I can tell is if they lie - like if you lie under any formal sworn statement.
 

Hopeful007

Hero Member
Feb 16, 2019
468
344
They really do not like the no guarantor cases.

Even if it makes you uncomfortable, it is pretty normal to ask in many cases, professional and otherwise. The guarantor is not guaratneeing anything more than that they know you. (I wish they'd change the name really)

The bar is so low that it's basically considered impossible for someone to reside in Canada and not be able to find one. (But yes, some exceptions). It's not meant to be for cases where it's awkward but impossible.

If you want to risk it or deal with legal expense to challenge, that's your right.
Hmm, it's not that low. I reside here for 12 years, I know people. Recently, I asked a couple of people I talk frequently to be a reference. Apparently, they didn't even pick up their phones. Now, I don't really trust anyone. Plus, immigrants like me usually are friends with other immigrants, they don't have Canadian citizenship. If there is depression or introversion involved, forget it. This requirement really is inconvenient. They should give an option of fingerprints or something, which they already have by the way.
 

kmoser

Full Member
Mar 22, 2022
32
85
Hmm, it's not that low. I reside here for 12 years, I know people. Recently, I asked a couple of people I talk frequently to be a reference. Apparently, they didn't even pick up their phones. Now, I don't really trust anyone. Plus, immigrants like me usually are friends with other immigrants, they don't have Canadian citizenship. If there is depression or introversion involved, forget it. This requirement really is inconvenient. They should give an option of fingerprints or something, which they already have by the way.
This. It's like they expect everyone to fit some kind of mold, not very different from a social credit system, if you don't then too bad you don't deserve a passport. Citizenship I can understand is a privilege but a passport isn't, it's a fundamental right. After clearing all the hurdles for citizenship I now have to jump through more hoops for a passport. For most people this may not seem like such a big deal but for someone with Asperger's syndrome (me) it's an absolute nightmare. I don't make friends easily, I've found every workplace to date to be toxic to the point where I have now quit to become self-employed so I don't have to deal with people. This is why I refuse to conform and I'm prepared to fight this legally if necessary.
 

armoured

VIP Member
Feb 1, 2015
17,019
8,715
Recently, I asked a couple of people I talk frequently to be a reference. Apparently, they didn't even pick up their phones.
Sorry, I don't understand what you mean happened here. You asked people and they agreed, but then they did not pick up their phone when the government called? If that's it, what happened next?