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Entering Canada using PRTD

Wave1rose

Full Member
Jul 7, 2021
27
5
Hello All
I am planning to enter Canada next month using my PRTD which is valid until July 2022, can you please guide me about things I should be aware of any possible questions from visa officer? If I have a return ticket while entring Canada for return within 1 week, is that an issue?
Thanks for advice.
 

armoured

VIP Member
Feb 1, 2015
17,246
8,861
Hello All
I am planning to enter Canada next month using my PRTD which is valid until July 2022, can you please guide me about things I should be aware of any possible questions from visa officer? If I have a return ticket while entring Canada for return within 1 week, is that an issue?
Thanks for advice.
Entering Canada shouldn't be much of an issue, the PRTD is made for entry to Canada. Why you have the PRTD and then leaving shortly after arrival - well, not clear what's going on there but the concern should be about future entries and your residency obligation, etc.
 
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jakklondon

Hero Member
Oct 17, 2021
582
139
As long as you posses a document and valid PR status that entitles you to admission into Canada, there is nothing that CBSA agent can do about it. They will let you in, one way or another. And if you are not in breach of RO, you are as good as anyone else.

As to questions at the border/POE, I personally was harassed, intimidated and sent to secondary inspection any time I entered Canada by land (this did not happen when I flew to international airports in Canada). It's worth noting that at the time when CBSA agents bullied and harassed me, I was in full compliance of RO. Despite that, they would send me to secondary and grill me about my residence, about my plans to move into Canada and why I was still living in the USA. Again, please note: they did this when I was a brand new PR, very far from breach of RO. They just felt like it was Ok to bully and harass new PR at the border. It's hard to say if you will be subjected to the same level of scrutiny as I was, but it's possible. Especially if you don't belong to a class of visible minorities and are male (fearful of accusation of discriminations , they usually give preferential treatment to visible minorities in protected class and females).

Your return ticket will be indicative of your intention to leave Canada after your admission, and may trigger more questions. You don't have to volunteer the fact that you have it and intend to leave Canada in future (they are NOT entitled to you volunteering extra information to them that has nothing to do with your admission into Canada as PR). But, as I stated above, if you have valid PR status and are within RO, you will be admitted as any other PR.
 
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dpenabill

VIP Member
Apr 2, 2010
6,435
3,182
Hello All
I am planning to enter Canada next month using my PRTD which is valid until July 2022, can you please guide me about things I should be aware of any possible questions from visa officer? If I have a return ticket while entring Canada for return within 1 week, is that an issue?
Thanks for advice.
I cannot offer advice. I can offer some observations, mostly a caution.

In regards to coming to Canada, there appears to be no reason to worry about coming and entering Canada.

But if you in fact leave a week later, that is a very different story. Will not have much, if any impact, on how it goes when you arrive this time.

But . . . well, your situation is not clear.

Here's one post by you somewhat recently:

Hello All
I have EE profile with crs of 471 and noc 4163 and overseas applicant. I havent recieved any invite yet. I wanted to get your guidance on what recent changes/announcement means for anyone with my score and sitiation. If someone can please explain briefly. That would be very helpful. Thanks
Apart from wondering where that fits into your query about coming on a PR TD and previous queries about maintaining PR status, assuming you have been a PR since 2016 (will post below quote from previous post referencing this) the BOTTOM-LINE is you are OK to come to Canada using the PR TD that you have. BUT IF YOU LEAVE Canada without first staying here for an extended period of time, you will be putting your PR status at risk.

Even if your current PR TD was issued based on a positive H&C determination, if you leave and need to apply for another PR TD, the outcome might not be the same. The less you have been in Canada, in the meantime, and the longer you are abroad again, the greater the risk a new PR TD will be denied, terminating your PR status (subject to appeal).


Just for reference, illustrating your situation relative to the PR Residency Obligation, a post from last summer:

The issue is I receieved Canadian PR in July 2016, moved to Canada, lived there until July 2018(2yrs, met 730 days criteria) and then moved to living overseas until now(3 yrs outside Canada). So I have met the 730 days criteria for 5 yr period btw july 2016 and 2021. Due to Covid, I cant move back immediately, I am looking to move to Canada in December 2021, but my pr card has expired and i will need to apply for travel document at that time. Do you think it could become an issue that in Dec 2021, when i apply for travel document, visa officers may say I havent met 730 days criteria(by counting them from Dec 2016 to Dec 2021 as last 5 yrs or would they assume my new 5 yr window from July 2021 to July 2026 and within this window i need to meet 2 yr living in Canada criteria)? I be very thankful for your guidance.
 
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canuck78

VIP Member
Jun 18, 2017
55,587
13,518
Hello All
I am planning to enter Canada next month using my PRTD which is valid until July 2022, can you please guide me about things I should be aware of any possible questions from visa officer? If I have a return ticket while entring Canada for return within 1 week, is that an issue?
Thanks for advice.
Is your PRTD single entry or multi-entry?
 
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Wave1rose

Full Member
Jul 7, 2021
27
5
Hello Everyone
Many Thanks for your replies. Really appreciate. This is very valuable advice for me. My PRTD is multiple entry and I am planning to visit Canada for 1 week to apply for a PR Card renewal. Due to personal reasons, I will need to return from Canada within 1 week but I am planning to permanently move back to Canada in 1-2 years. Please let me know your thoughts and any further suggestions from your end. Thanks again
 

jakklondon

Hero Member
Oct 17, 2021
582
139
Hello Everyone
Many Thanks for your replies. Really appreciate. This is very valuable advice for me. My PRTD is multiple entry and I am planning to visit Canada for 1 week to apply for a PR Card renewal. Due to personal reasons, I will need to return from Canada within 1 week but I am planning to permanently move back to Canada in 1-2 years. Please let me know your thoughts and any further suggestions from your end. Thanks again
What exactly you want to know our thoughts about? If you are within RO and have travel documents, you get admitted into Canada as a matter of right. They may grill/bully/harass you , but they can't stop you and prevent you from being admitted into Canada. What happens when you next time attempt entry depends on what your RO will be. If you will still be in compliance with RO (and have ability to get to POE), then again, you will be admitted as before. If you are ever in breach, then all depends on your luck and who the border officer will be. Some will certainly report you, others may let you in without much trouble. There is nothing beyond that which you can expect to happen when you enter Canada. In compliance with RO -> admitted without being reported. In breach of RO -> admitted with possibility of report and future removal from Canada.
 

armoured

VIP Member
Feb 1, 2015
17,246
8,861
Please let me know your thoughts and any further suggestions from your end. Thanks again
you have left out one of the key needed bits: are you compliant or not with residency obligation or not? On what basis, residing in Canada? When did you last live in Canada?

How long is your multi-entry valid for?

(The answer will be very different if you are not compliant compared to eg compliant on basis of accompanying a Canadian citizen...just as examples)
 

Wave1rose

Full Member
Jul 7, 2021
27
5
Thanks everyone for your further suggestions. Currently, my RO is not met but I have a valid PRTD which will allow me entry into Canada in next month. Once am in Canada, am planning to apply for renewal of my PR Card and return back from Canada within a week due to personal reasons. Then i am hoping to receive my PR card in next few months. Within next 1-2 years, I will move to Canada permanently. At that stage, I wont be meeting RO but I will have a PR card valid for next 4-3 years which means I will have enough time to meet my RO within that future period.
Do you think entering Canada second time ie after 1-2 years from now, during my permanent move to Canada could be an issue and could i be denied entry due to not meeting RO but having a valid PR Card which will be valid for next 3-4 yrs?
 

armoured

VIP Member
Feb 1, 2015
17,246
8,861
Thanks everyone for your further suggestions. Currently, my RO is not met but I have a valid PRTD which will allow me entry into Canada in next month. Once am in Canada, am planning to apply for renewal of my PR Card and return back from Canada within a week due to personal reasons. Then i am hoping to receive my PR card in next few months. Within next 1-2 years, I will move to Canada permanently. At that stage, I wont be meeting RO but I will have a PR card valid for next 4-3 years which means I will have enough time to meet my RO within that future period.
Is your PRTD a multi-entry, and with what validity?

You also didn't clarify on what basis you got the PRTD - some H&C reasons? What's the code written on the visa?

Here's the basic issue: most of the time the PRTD is issued for the PR to re-enter Canada to remain. For those who are in compliance with the RO - no problem, they continue on as before (replacing or renewing PR card per usual).

It's mostly NOT meant to come back for a bit, get the PR card, and 'try again later.' So it's a rather large hole in your plan.

As just two simple points where it could all fall apart:
1) It's not a given that you'll get re-issued a PR card - especially given non-compliance with RO and not even being physically in the country while it's being processed. They might not issue it for a long time, or ask you to pick it up in Canada (where you might not be able to return without a new PRTD).
2) The valid PR card does NOT magically absolve you of the residency obligation. It applies at any time you're examined (eg crossing a border). So even if you get the card (or enter through USA if that's possible for you), you can be examined for non-compliance and reported (i.e. starting the process of revoking PR status, subject to appeal).

Do you think entering Canada second time ie after 1-2 years from now, during my permanent move to Canada could be an issue and could i be denied entry due to not meeting RO but having a valid PR Card which will be valid for next 3-4 yrs?
Yes, it could be an issue. As a PR, you cannot be denied entry - but you could be formally reported and admitted to Canada while you appeal (during which you'd reside in Canada but could very well lose your PR status).


So overall: it's definitely not a plan that's free of risk.

(Note though my questions at the beginning are substantive and may change somewhat the circumstances and potential consequences.)
 

Tubsmagee

Hero Member
Jul 2, 2016
438
131
Thanks everyone for your further suggestions. Currently, my RO is not met but I have a valid PRTD which will allow me entry into Canada in next month. Once am in Canada, am planning to apply for renewal of my PR Card and return back from Canada within a week due to personal reasons. Then i am hoping to receive my PR card in next few months. Within next 1-2 years, I will move to Canada permanently. At that stage, I wont be meeting RO but I will have a PR card valid for next 4-3 years which means I will have enough time to meet my RO within that future period.
Do you think entering Canada second time ie after 1-2 years from now, during my permanent move to Canada could be an issue and could i be denied entry due to not meeting RO but having a valid PR Card which will be valid for next 3-4 yrs?
@armoured has what is probably a more articulate response, but your plan sounds like a train wreck waiting to happen.

1. Getting the PRTD was probably out of luck, good fortune, or the approver not wanting to take time to report you.
2. Applying for PR card when not compliant sets you up for another RO determination.
3. If approved for PR to be issued, given history, there is higher probability of your PR card not being sent to you and having to go into pick it up, and have counter interview which could address your RO.
4. No way to know how lenient they will be in a couple years. While people out of complained may be waived in, you will be seriously out of compliance at that point, and even with valid PR card could be reported.
 

dpenabill

VIP Member
Apr 2, 2010
6,435
3,182
Thanks everyone for your further suggestions. Currently, my RO is not met but I have a valid PRTD which will allow me entry into Canada in next month. Once am in Canada, am planning to apply for renewal of my PR Card and return back from Canada within a week due to personal reasons. Then i am hoping to receive my PR card in next few months. Within next 1-2 years, I will move to Canada permanently. At that stage, I wont be meeting RO but I will have a PR card valid for next 4-3 years which means I will have enough time to meet my RO within that future period.
Do you think entering Canada second time ie after 1-2 years from now, during my permanent move to Canada could be an issue and could i be denied entry due to not meeting RO but having a valid PR Card which will be valid for next 3-4 yrs?
In general I concur in the observations by @armoured and @Tubsmagee . . . EXCEPT in terms of emphasis . . . my impression is you will be very much RISKING your PR status if you leave Canada after a short stay here, and particularly so if you are abroad for an extended period of time.

Perhaps I am overlooking or missing something (a multiple entry PR TD does not fit what I see, but then neither did your reference to being an "overseas applicant" and an "EE profile with crs of 471 and noc 4163" in another recent post).

But there is no hint in what you have shared that would indicate reason to be confident a new PR card will be issued if you leave Canada after a short stay. Even if to date you have a strong H&C case.
 

canuck78

VIP Member
Jun 18, 2017
55,587
13,518
Thanks everyone for your further suggestions. Currently, my RO is not met but I have a valid PRTD which will allow me entry into Canada in next month. Once am in Canada, am planning to apply for renewal of my PR Card and return back from Canada within a week due to personal reasons. Then i am hoping to receive my PR card in next few months. Within next 1-2 years, I will move to Canada permanently. At that stage, I wont be meeting RO but I will have a PR card valid for next 4-3 years which means I will have enough time to meet my RO within that future period.
Do you think entering Canada second time ie after 1-2 years from now, during my permanent move to Canada could be an issue and could i be denied entry due to not meeting RO but having a valid PR Card which will be valid for next 3-4 yrs?
As soon as you leave Canada you will be out of compliance with your RO again. Most PRs living abroad are required to pick up their new PR card in person to make sure they remain in compliance with their RO. If your PRTD was granted with code RC-1 you will be granted a PR card but when you go to pick it up you could be reported for not meeting your RO. If you don't pick up your PR card and return after 1-2 years you can be reported as well. You'd also need to apply for a new PRTD or enter via the US land border. PRTDs are granted primarily for PRs to return to Canada permanently. IRCC was likely quite lenient giving out PRTDs based on H&C due to covid but that is likely a one time thing. The next time you don't meet RO you can't count on the same understanding. Would add that you can't sponsor anyone until you are compliant with your RO so if you got married or had a child it will take 2+ years before you can start the sponsorship process.
 
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Wave1rose

Full Member
Jul 7, 2021
27
5
Hi All
Thanks for your replies. My PRTD is multi entry, valid until 25/7/22, in RC-1 Category. Yes, it is a risky plan and I want to clarify am not doing this for fun, I have some serious personal issues. I am discussing it as I am trying to find the best solution as I cant stay long term in Canada on my next visit. I appreciate the honest suggestions from all of you.

Considering above suggestions and current processing timeline for Renewal of PR cards being 114 days:

1. I think I should give atleast 4 months of timeline between submitting application of pr card renewal and expiry of my prtd. So, in case am called back for interview or to pick up pr card (assuming it doesn't take longer than 4 months which it could) I can fly back on the same PRTD , if its not mailed. Do you agree?

2. I had heard that people who hold PRTD in RC-1 category can immediately apply for PR card renewal after landing in Canada and even if they dont meet RO, they would still receive a new PR card. Is that correct?

3.In above posts, it was indicated that I could be reported for not meeting RO at my next visit to Canada (when i travel on my PRTD), during PR card renewal process or at my second entry to Canadian airport when i enter with valid pr card to live in Canada permanently which will lead to revoking of PR status. When a visa officer reports me in any of the above situations and IRCC starts process of revoking my pr status, would i be informed immediately at the airport etc?

Thanks for your guidance
 

armoured

VIP Member
Feb 1, 2015
17,246
8,861
My PRTD is multi entry, valid until 25/7/22, in RC-1 Category. Yes, it is a risky plan and I want to clarify am not doing this for fun, I have some serious personal issues. I am discussing it as I am trying to find the best solution as I cant stay long term in Canada on my next visit.

Considering above suggestions and current processing timeline for Renewal of PR cards being 114 days:

1. I think I should give atleast 4 months of timeline between submitting application of pr card renewal and expiry of my prtd. So, in case am called back for interview or to pick up pr card (assuming it doesn't take longer than 4 months which it could) I can fly back on the same PRTD , if its not mailed. Do you agree?

2. I had heard that people who hold PRTD in RC-1 category can immediately apply for PR card renewal after landing in Canada and even if they dont meet RO, they would still receive a new PR card. Is that correct?
Two main issues here:
1) You cannot count on the 114 days working in any case, and particularly in a case where there may be other issues - your case is not at all 'average' and to rely on such time periods is a huge risk.

2) In particular: it is quite likely that IRCC will look at and scrutinize whether the applicant is compliant with residency obligation AND of course whether the applicant is present in Canada. Both would be reasons to send for more in-depth review and/or for pick-up in Canada. (It's worth noting that there are many, many applications still waiting the 'pick up in office' PR card arrangements - because there have beenn very few and possibly none of these done since the start of the pandemic).

3. Yes, although those with PRTD with RC-1 (H&C reasons for issuance) can apply for PR card on arrival, the vast majority of such cases are those who remain in Canada while the PR card is being processed. (And then even after they get it, they need to be cautious with travel, because the PR card does NOT mean the RO compliance issues have been resolved or forgiven.

Again, the point of the PRTD is to let PRs return to Canada to reside.

3.In above posts, it was indicated that I could be reported for not meeting RO at my next visit to Canada (when i travel on my PRTD), during PR card renewal process or at my second entry to Canadian airport when i enter with valid pr card to live in Canada permanently which will lead to revoking of PR status. When a visa officer reports me in any of the above situations and IRCC starts process of revoking my pr status, would i be informed immediately at the airport etc?
If reported ,you would almost certainly be informed at the airport (either of report or of need to confirm when officer available). But I think that kind of misses the point.

Again, with the PRTD on your first entry back, it is quite unlikely you would be reported (basically the border agent would usually defer to the formal decision made by IRCC when you applied for the PRTD). Possibly that would apply to subsequent entries during the validity of the PRTD (given that it was issued as a multi-entry).

But after that validity expires, no guarantees at all, and a much higher risk that eg if you needed to apply for another PRTD, that it would simply be refused (and now you would have no alternative but to appeal from abroad).

The bottom line is that right now, whatever your reasons, the only truly 'safe' way to retain your PR is to return to Canada during validity of your PRTD and remain. (Whether you could return now and depart for a period before the July expiry date of your PRTD - probably significantly less risky, the key factor being entering Canada remaining afte rthat july date.)

Again, not much in the way of 'advice' here - just warnings that what you believe your plan is seems quite risky (if you wish to remain a PR). Your reasons are your reasons and no-one here can comment; but neither can anyone responsibly sugar-coat it and say that future H&C requests will be treated the same way.
 
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