what should canada do with their ( illegal alliens)

[Dave n Ailsa]

I just feel that good hard-working people should benifit from a county's laws, and criminals should be punished.

I live in the UK, and I have a friend who works in Immigration. Her job is to try and remove murderers and thieves from our country, but these criminals seem to have more rights than their victims.

I am not saying that illegal aliens are anything like this, but if they want to live in Canada they should follow the rules and earn the right like everyone else.

 

[martinezja]

ummm, what's your point?

If you break the law, you are doing something illegal.

If someone is in the country illegally, they are referred to as an Illegal alien.

You can colour it how you like, but you are a criminal.

Dude, I don't live in Canada, I don't want to live in Canada. I just think you guys need to read more and pull some pages to the left before talking about this topic, which is beyond being "illegal"; you're representing a political and social constructed mentality of intolerance and ignorance.

If you pass by a red light with your car, are you a criminal? If you smoke weed, are you a criminal? Even when people refer to sexual offenders, people don't call them a "criminal". Therefore, whom and what determinate who is a Criminal or not? Does the constitution literaly describe an "illegal" as a criminal?

Are you a Native Canadian? if you are, congratulation, i think you should claim your rights and your land, and try to kick out the government and everybody else. Otherwise i think is technically illegal and moreover, a crime, that you are talking too much BS.

Have a Nice day!

J-

 

[Dave n Ailsa]

Dude, I don't live in Canada, I don't want to live in Canada. I just think you guys need to read more and pull some pages to the left before talking about this topic, which is beyond being "illegal"; you're representing a political and social constructed mentality of intolerance and ignorance.

If you pass by a red light with your car, are you a criminal? If you smoke weed, are you a criminal? Even when people refer to sexual offenders, people don't call them a "criminal". Therefore, whom and what determinate who is a Criminal or not? Does the constitution literaly describe an "illegal" as a criminal?

Are you a Native Canadian? if you are, congratulation, i think you should claim your rights and your land, and try to kick out the government and everybody else. Otherwise i think is technically illegal and moreover, a crime, that you are talking too much BS.

Have a Nice day!

J-

You obviously have a very poor understanding of the English language.

In modern society, we use laws to ensure our modern way of life. Without laws, we fall into anarchy.

If you commit a crime, you are therefore by definition a criminal. So yes, going through a red light is a crime, and smoking weed in many counties is a crime.

If you don't live, or want to live in Canada, what are you doing on CanadaVisa.com? Are you just here to show how much you hate Canada and it's modern laws?

You are exactly the sort of person they are trying to keep out, so what you say is of no importance whatsoever. Go troll somewhere else.

 

[martinezja]

You obviously have a very poor understanding of the English language.

In modern society, we use laws to ensure our modern way of life. Without laws, we fall into anarchy.

If you commit a crime, you are therefore by definition a criminal. So yes, going through a red light is a crime, and smoking weed in many counties is a crime.

If you don't live, or want to live in Canada, what are you doing on CanadaVisa.com? Are you just here to show how much you hate Canada and it's modern laws?

You are exactly the sort of person they are trying to keep out, so what you say is of no importance whatsoever. Go troll somewhere else.

Dear Dave,

I don't hate Canada or Canadians, in fact i have a few good friends from Canada and i think they are the nicest people I ever meet. The fact that i don't want to live or I am living in Canada does not mean that i don't want to visit.

My argument is that not all the "Illegal immigrants" are criminals (I don't agree with those terms neither, but certainly this is my point of view) and generalizations are biased.

According with John Morton (United States Assistant Homeland Security Secretary- let me tell you, this guy wants Illegal immigrants out - that's his job) : "Illegal immigrants are de facto criminals, but not necessarily. It all depends on the specific circumstances of any one case. The immigration laws are civil in nature. There are criminal immigration offenses but mainly they are misdemeanors in most instances, although a lot are serious felonies. For example, if you enter the country on a visa and you overstay your visa, that is a civil but not a criminal offense."

Because I have a different point of view from yours, you are telling me that I'm the kind of person the Canadian Government wants to keep out? What do you mean with this statement? Aren't you agree with Democracy?

I truly respect your opinion and hence, your witlessness.

J

 

[Syed2011]

Not only Canada but none of the countries allow the outsiders to stay in there house without the permit ! So i guess we can do nothing :'(

 

[Dave n Ailsa]

Dear Dave,

I don't hate Canada or Canadians, in fact i have a few good friends from Canada and i think they are the nicest people I ever meet. The fact that i don't want to live or I am living in Canada does not mean that i don't want to visit.

My argument is that not all the "Illegal immigrants" are criminals (I don't agree with those terms neither, but certainly this is my point of view) and generalizations are biased.

According with John Morton (United States Assistant Homeland Security Secretary- let me tell you, this guy wants Illegal immigrants out - that's his job) : "Illegal immigrants are de facto criminals, but not necessarily. It all depends on the specific circumstances of any one case. The immigration laws are civil in nature. There are criminal immigration offenses but mainly they are misdemeanors in most instances, although a lot are serious felonies. For example, if you enter the country on a visa and you overstay your visa, that is a civil but not a criminal offense."

Because I have a different point of view from yours, you are telling me that I'm the kind of person the Canadian Government wants to keep out? What do you mean with this statement? Aren't you agree with Democracy?

I truly respect your opinion and hence, your witlessness.

J

So are we talking about over-stayers then?

If so, then why did they over-stay their visa term?

They presumably knew that they had a time limit to either stay in the country legally, or go back to their own country.

To condone such behaviour would be same as allowing your neighbouring country to invade, set up camp and then say, we are not leaving, we like it here.

So you expect the host country to say, ok then, have some food and shelter, and jobs and education.

Of course not, you would want them out as soon as possible.

Why do you have such a problem with people following the rules of a country?

 

[Trevor and Jo]

So are we talking about over-stayers then?

If so, then why did they over-stay their visa term?

They presumably knew that they had a time limit to either stay in the country legally, or go back to their own country.

To condone such behaviour would be same as allowing your neighbouring country to invade, set up camp and then say, we are not leaving, we like it here.

So you expect the host country to say, ok then, have some food and shelter, and jobs and education.

Of course not, you would want them out as soon as possible.

Why do you have such a problem with people following the rules of a country?

Because he's a lefty liberal. Laws, they are there to be broken.

 

[mcmaman]

guys please can we steak to to second topic above please and not a debate on who should be called illegal allien and what not please that denied refugee claimant needs advise thankx

 

[scylla]

guys please can we steak to to second topic above please and not a debate on who should be called illegal allien and what not please that denied refugee claimant needs advise thankx

He should consult a qualified immigration lawyer to find out what his options are. That's the best advice any of us here can give. His situation is beyond the scope of assistance anyone on this forum can offer.

 

[newtone]

I think they should do what they have done with the 500 illegal aliens that came on a ship from Sri-lanka, make them legal. Canada needs immigrants whether its legal or illegal, it cannot sustain without them. Since we unfortunately don't have a Canadian Nationalist Party being Canadian is a very complicated and open ended question.

What does it mean to be Canadian? How do we define Canadian?
The answers vary depending on whether you are naturalized citizen or citizen by birth.

I can't speak for all but this is what I've observed from most people

For naturalized citizens, for some, its about following your own religion, culture, values (because they've been persecuted in their own countries because of their beliefs), waving the Indian, Pakistani, British, German, Japanese, Palestinian flags on their respective national days or if they win some sports match. Wearing their national dress, eating their national food, watching their national news on TV. Which only "they" know about. So its all about "them" and celebrating the "other" culture. This could also mean being Canadian to a lot of people.

For Canadian born citizens, its all about drinking beer and watching hokey and maybe celebrating and adopting the heritage their parents or grandparents take very seriously because they were immigrants themselves. Then you get the "I am 1/4th Chinese, 1/9th Spanish, 1/8th German, 1/16th Afghan, 1/12th Namibian etc". There is nothing called Canadian culture cause to the best of my knowledge we don't have one. Please correct me if I am wrong.

Therefore whether you come here legally or illegally nobody is Canadian cause if we were to define what being Canadian is you'll get millions of answers. Its left at your discretion. Half the people come here fleeing and the other half come here as economic immigrants.

So unlike other countries there is really no hard and fast rules about definition of identity or what it is to be Canadian, people just continue to follow what they deem is right and how they have interpreted themselves to be Canadian. So if there are 33 million Canadian living in Canada today there are 33 million ways to identify and define what is Canadian.

The Germans are good with technology
Americans are good with media and corporations
Chinese are best for production/industry and exports
Japanese make great cars
Canada is good for immigrants (legal and illegal)

There is nothing wrong with that its just what course the government and the judicial system decide to take.
If I've offended anyone then I do apologize cause it really wasn't my intention. So hope we can all move along with this topic and hope all the illegal aliens become legal at time point in the future. Canada has lots of talent at their disposal the government just needs to harness this talent in a positive way.

 

[sorna]

I just landed here an year ago. I am not even a citizen of Canada yet. But honestly I am a bit offended by your post that is subtly negative about Canada. So I just thought of sharing my thoughts about your post.

I think they should do what they have done with the 500 illegal aliens that came on a ship from Sri-lanka, make them legal. Canada needs immigrants whether its legal or illegal, it cannot sustain without them. Since we unfortunately don't have a Canadian Nationalist Party being Canadian is a very complicated and open ended question.

Canada has a very comprehensive system to handle immigration. It is regularly fine tuned according to the needs of the country. There are millions out there who would jump on the opportunity to come here. Yes, Canada needs legal immigrants, and it can get them accurately tailored to its needs.

But does it needs illegal immigrants. No. However, they are often accepted. This is not based on any commercial benefits. It is based on humanitarian grounds. It is based on Canada's obligations as per international law. Canada walks the talk, upholds human rights and follows the rule of law. Be proud about it.

For naturalized citizens, for some, its about following your own religion, culture, values (because they've been persecuted in their own countries because of their beliefs), waving the Indian, Pakistani, British, German, Japanese, Palestinian flags on their respective national days or if they win some sports match. Wearing their national dress, eating their national food, watching their national news on TV. Which only "they" know about. So its all about "them" and celebrating the "other" culture. This could also mean being Canadian to a lot of people.

For Canadian born citizens, its all about drinking beer and watching hokey and maybe celebrating and adopting the heritage their parents or grandparents take very seriously because they were immigrants themselves. Then you get the "I am 1/4th Chinese, 1/9th Spanish, 1/8th German, 1/16th Afghan, 1/12th Namibian etc". There is nothing called Canadian culture cause to the best of my knowledge we don't have one. Please correct me if I am wrong.

Yes Canada is a very matured. (It even let you keep your previous nationality with no issues). Canadian society is extremely matured to accept and tolerate alien cultures and practices with ease. On the other hand if you could only think about dirking bear and watching hockey as Canadian culture, you seriously need to break out of your shell.

Honestly, mingle with the people; visit the public venues, art galleries, theatres, museums and concerts. If you are already in Canada, it does not take a long to understand that Canadian culture is rich and diverse. Additionally Cultural activities are strongly supported by the government.

Therefore whether you come here legally or illegally nobody is Canadian cause if we were to define what being Canadian is you'll get millions of answers. Its left at your discretion. Half the people come here fleeing and the other half come here as economic immigrants.

Just look through these forums. You can see how many highly skilled successful professionals, doing very well in their respective countries are wanting to come here? Are they fleeing or are they economic immigrants?

Immigration is not an easy decision. Whether you like it or not, you are going to live and adapt to an alien culture; Your children are going to follow the culture of the host country. If you believe a country has no culture and just migrate there for economic reasons, you are being very short-sighted.

Personally, I was not fleeing my country and I was doing economically very well back in my former country. I migrated to Canada because it has a very stable and matured political/economical/administrative structure that treats every citizen equally. I migrate to Canada because it is a matured society with strong values; It is the least racist in the world; and it is very tolerant and welcoming about different cultures and practices. I want to live in this society and up bring my children in this society. I like my generations to live in this country. This is the reason I migrated here and I am sure that I am not the only one.

So unlike other countries there is really no hard and fast rules about definition of identity or what it is to be Canadian, people just continue to follow what they deem is right and how they have interpreted themselves to be Canadian. So if there are 33 million Canadian living in Canada today there are 33 million ways to identify and define what is Canadian.

Exactly. Yes that is the identity of Canadian. They come in many colors, they come from many backgrounds, but they all have something on common; they all accept that everyone can live the life the way they want (well.. as far as it does not contradict with core values of Canadian society).

The Germans are good with technology
Americans are good with media and corporations
Chinese are best for production/industry and exports
Japanese make great cars
Canada is good for immigrants (legal and illegal)

What is this??
Anyway, if you like over simplification perhaps you should say (in my perspective)
Canada is good for a great happy life.

Canada has lots of talent at their disposal the government just needs to harness this talent in a positive way.

I totally agree with you in the first part of the sentence. Having lived in about half a dozen countries before moving to Canada, I can confidently say that related to many other countries, Canadian government is very successful in harnessing the talent in a positive way. C'mon, this is one of a very happy, successful and powerful nation in the world. How can you even complain?

There is nothing wrong with that its just what course the government and the judicial system decide to take.
If I've offended anyone then I do apologize cause it really wasn't my intention.

I think, you kind of made everyone (In your words: Canadian born citizens, naturalized citizens, immigrants and also yourself) look a bit cheap and shallow. But if you really sit back and give a second thought, I am sure you would realise that is not true...

Cheers ,
Sorna

 

[newtone]

I just landed here an year ago. I am not even a citizen of Canada yet. But honestly I am a bit offended by your post that is subtly negative about Canada. So I just thought of sharing my thoughts about your post.

I am sorry that you are offended by my post, you've been here just for a year, please give it some time and you'll understand what I mean. If you have a better experience please feel free to share.

Canada has a very comprehensive system to handle immigration. It is regularly fine tuned according to the needs of the country. There are millions out there who would jump on the opportunity to come here. Yes, Canada needs legal immigrants, and it can get them accurately tailored to its needs.

If Canada is fine tuning its immigration system and accurately tailoring to the needs of the country why are foreign trained professionals still working at McDonalds and security guards.

But does it needs illegal immigrants. No. However, they are often accepted. This is not based on any commercial benefits. It is based on humanitarian grounds. It is based on Canada's obligations as per international law. Canada walks the talk, upholds human rights and follows the rule of law. Be proud about it.

By saying this you are undermining the contribution of thousands of refugees or people who don't have legal papers who have positively contributed to the development of this country.

Yes Canada is a very matured. (It even let you keep your previous nationality with no issues). Canadian society is extremely matured to accept and tolerate alien cultures and practices with ease. On the other hand if you could only think about dirking bear and watching hockey as Canadian culture, you seriously need to break out of your shell.

I don't see where you are going with this, whats the connection between maturity and dual nationality? Canada is not the only country in the world that accepts dual nationality, there are other countries that encourage them too such as Australia, Brazil, Belize, Macau, Ireland just to name a few. Are you telling me these countries are less mature?

Honestly, mingle with the people; visit the public venues, art galleries, theatres, museums and concerts. If you are already in Canada, it does not take a long to understand that Canadian culture is rich and diverse. Additionally Cultural activities are strongly supported by the government.

I have already done that. I know about the first nations and my heart truly goes out to them, I wish I could do more to help and promote the aboriginal culture. Other then the first nations and the war of 1812 if you could kindly explain to me what is Canadian culture, I am all ears.

Just look through these forums. You can see how many highly skilled successful professionals, doing very well in their respective countries are wanting to come here? Are they fleeing or are they economic immigrants?

Yes I have gone through this forum there are lots of highly skilled successful immigrants doing very well in "THEIR respective countries" until they get here. I have yet to see one doctor or an engineer in this forum able to directly carry over or transfer their skills (skills that they originally got points for through the Canadian immigration system saying that we have a need for Engineers and Doctors in the first place) and work here as a doctor or an engineer.

Personally, I was not fleeing my country and I was doing economically very well back in my former country. I migrated to Canada because it has a very stable and matured political/economical/administrative structure that treats every citizen equally. I migrate to Canada because it is a matured society with strong values; It is the least racist in the world; and it is very tolerant and welcoming about different cultures and practices. I want to live in this society and up bring my children in this society. I like my generations to live in this country. This is the reason I migrated here and I am sure that I am not the only one.

You've mentioned "I migrated to Canada because it has a very stable and matured political/economical/administrative structure that treats every citizen equally" this translates into economic immigrant.
You've also mentioned "It is the least racist in the world; and it is very tolerant and welcoming about different cultures and practices" this translates to me that race and intolerance to different cultures is very important to you therefore you have come here.
These two points prove my earlier points about fleeing (either due to intolerance/racism/discrimination) or economic reasons (political/social/environmental). My apologies if I was too direct with my words.

I think, you kind of made everyone (In your words: Canadian born citizens, naturalized citizens, immigrants and also yourself) look a bit cheap and shallow. But if you really sit back and give a second thought, I am sure you would realise that is not true...

I am sure you cannot speak for everyone and neither can I. Having said that its not appropriate for you to jump to the conclusion about people looking cheap and shallow, these are your words. That was obviously not my intention but pointing it out like that and calling people shallow and cheap was obviously not very intelligent on your part.

 

[Leon]

People who overstay their visas know perfectly well what they are doing. If they get caught, they get deported and they know that. When they happen to bring their children with them, it is sad for the children but still, why should Canada accept these children? If people knew that their children would automatically get PR just because they were minors when they were brought illegally, it would only result in more people trying to bring their children illegally. As for the children, once they reach the age of majority, it is up to them to either try to immigrate legally to Canada, immigrate legally to some other country or go back to their country of citizenship and build a life for themselves there. I don't see how Canada owes them anything.

 

[sorna]

Hi Newtone,

I am not sure where you live. If you live in Toronto and interested in participating/experiencing cultural events around the town, see wx.toronto.ca/festevents.nsf/ for upcoming events.

You might also be interested in this page toronto.ca/culture/index.htm

Cheers,
Sorna

 

[ADUFE]

I am sorry that you are offended by my post, you've been here just for a year, please give it some time and you'll understand what I mean. If you have a better experience please feel free to share.

If Canada is fine tuning its immigration system and accurately tailoring to the needs of the country why are foreign trained professionals still working at McDonalds and security guards.

By saying this you are undermining the contribution of thousands of refugees or people who don't have legal papers who have positively contributed to the development of this country.

I don't see where you are going with this, whats the connection between maturity and dual nationality? Canada is not the only country in the world that accepts dual nationality, there are other countries that encourage them too such as Australia, Brazil, Belize, Macau, Ireland just to name a few. Are you telling me these countries are less mature?

I have already done that. I know about the first nations and my heart truly goes out to them, I wish I could do more to help and promote the aboriginal culture. Other then the first nations and the war of 1812 if you could kindly explain to me what is Canadian culture, I am all ears.

Yes I have gone through this forum there are lots of highly skilled successful immigrants doing very well in "THEIR respective countries" until they get here. I have yet to see one doctor or an engineer in this forum able to directly carry over or transfer their skills (skills that they originally got points for through the Canadian immigration system saying that we have a need for Engineers and Doctors in the first place) and work here as a doctor or an engineer.

You've mentioned "I migrated to Canada because it has a very stable and matured political/economical/administrative structure that treats every citizen equally" this translates into economic immigrant.
You've also mentioned "It is the least racist in the world; and it is very tolerant and welcoming about different cultures and practices" this translates to me that race and intolerance to different cultures is very important to you therefore you have come here.
These two points prove my earlier points about fleeing (either due to intolerance/racism/discrimination) or economic reasons (political/social/environmental). My apologies if I was too direct with my words.



I am sure you cannot speak for everyone and neither can I. Having said that its not appropriate for you to jump to the conclusion about people looking cheap and shallow, these are your words. That was obviously not my intention but pointing it out like that and calling people shallow and cheap was obviously not very intelligent on your part.

Hi Newtone,

I couldn't agree with you more! There are lots of good, wonderful things about Canada but it is by no means some kind of Utopia.IMO, there are lots of things that need to be changed, improved or stopped .