Urgent : A way to re-enter Canada by air with expired PR card

[Eugene1985]

Hello,

I will be travelling to the U.S in 2 weeks and I've just realized that my PR card is expired.

I don't meet the criteria for urgent PR application processing and its obviously too late to submit a regular PR renewal application.

In addition, due to the nature of my travel, it will be practically impossible for me to apply for a PR Travel Document (PRTD) in time, and I won't be able to cross the U.S border by land because I don't have a driver's license.

I have the following questions:

1) I've traveled to the US about 3 months ago and the only place I was asked to present my PR card was when I was already back in Canada airport talking with the officer.

Has it changed ? It seems that I'd be asked for a PR card in the U.S airport before boarding my flight to Canada...

If so, can you tell me exactly at which point will I be asked for a PR card ?


2) I hold a passport from a country that is visa-exempt. Can I just get an Electronic Travel Authorization (eTA) and show it with my passport as though I am coming as a visitor without telling that I am a Permanent Resident ?

How risky is this ? Will the airport personnel directly ask me if I am a permanent resident ? If not, is there any way for them to find out my PR status ?
I assume there is a way for them to check if they want to, but how likely is it to happen ?

3) If everything goes ok and I am allowed to board the flight back to Canada, when I am already in Canada airport, I can show the officer my expired PR card ?
I'll probably get a "lecture" about having an expired card, but I assume nothing major will happen, as I am already in Canada, and I don't think the officer will prevent me from entering.

Am I correct ?


Now thinking about it, the officer may start asking how was I allowed to board the flight in the first place... :

Anyway, please address (1) - (3).

Any tips / insights would be greatly appreciated.

Thanks

 

[zardoz]

Hello,

I will be travelling to the U.S in 2 weeks and I've just realized that my PR card is expired.

I don't meet the criteria for urgent PR application processing and its obviously too late to submit a regular PR renewal application.

In addition, due to the nature of my travel, it will be practically impossible for me to apply for a PR Travel Document (PRTD) in time, and I won't be able to cross the U.S border by land because I don't have a driver's license.

I have the following questions:

1) I've traveled to the US about 3 months ago and the only place I was asked to present my PR card was when I was already back in Canada airport talking with the officer.

Has it changed ? It seems that I'd be asked for a PR card in the U.S airport before boarding my flight to Canada...

If so, can you tell me exactly at which point will I be asked for a PR card ?


2) I hold a passport from a country that is visa-exempt. Can I just get an Electronic Travel Authorization (eTA) and show it with my passport as though I am coming as a visitor without telling that I am a Permanent Resident ?

How risky is this ? Will the airport personnel directly ask me if I am a permanent resident ? If not, is there any way for them to find out my PR status ?
I assume there is a way for them to check if they want to, but how likely is it to happen ?

3) If everything goes ok and I am allowed to board the flight back to Canada, when I am already in Canada airport, I can show the officer my expired PR card ?
I'll probably get a "lecture" about having an expired card, but I assume nothing major will happen, as I am already in Canada, and I don't think the officer will prevent me from entering.

Am I correct ?


Now thinking about it, the officer may start asking how was I allowed to board the flight in the first place... :

Anyway, please address (1) - (3).

Any tips / insights would be greatly appreciated.

Thanks

1. At check in. You will not be boarded without a valid PR card or PRTD.

2. This loophole is now CLOSED. A PR cannot obtain an eTA.

3. You will have the right to enter Canada but may be reported if you are not in compliance with the residency obligation requirements but not just for having an expired card.

 

[canuck_in_uk]

1) I've traveled to the US about 3 months ago and the only place I was asked to present my PR card was when I was already back in Canada airport talking with the officer.

Has it changed ? It seems that I'd be asked for a PR card in the U.S airport before boarding my flight to Canada...

If so, can you tell me exactly at which point will I be asked for a PR card ?


2) I hold a passport from a country that is visa-exempt. Can I just get an Electronic Travel Authorization (eTA) and show it with my passport as though I am coming as a visitor without telling that I am a Permanent Resident ?

3) If everything goes ok and I am allowed to board the flight back to Canada, when I am already in Canada airport, I can show the officer my expired PR card ?

Hi

1. Yes, it changed in November when the eTA became mandatory. The airline in the US will now require you to show a PR card or PRTD to board the plane to Canada.

2. You don't qualify for an eTA. If you apply, the system will refuse you because you are a PR.

3. CBSA won't care how you got to Canada and you would be allowed entry as a PR. However, you won't be able to board the plane without a valid PR card or PRTD.


Your only option would be to re-route your flight to somewhere near the border in the US and make your way over the border via non-commercial means.

 

[keesio]

I won't be able to cross the U.S border by land because I don't have a driver's license.

You can always taxi it to the border and walk across (for those border crossings that allow pedestrian crossing) and then take another taxi on the other side.

 

[Eugene1985]

1) When did the loophole for PRs being able to get an eTA close ??
I was reading past recent posts, where people wrote that it is possible.

2) What borders are there ?
Most probably my flight back to Canada will be from Miami. What would the best border option or me ?

 

[canuck_in_uk]

1) When did the loophole for PRs being able to get an eTA close ??
I was reading past recent posts, where people wrote that it is possible.

2) What borders are there ?
Most probably my flight back to Canada will be from Miami. What would the best border option or me ?

1. There was never a loophole allowing PRs to get eTAa. There was a loophole BEFORE the eTA was implemented allowing visa-exempt PRs to board a plane using just their passport.

2. There are dozens of borders. You need to take the time to research that yourself.

 

[scylla]

1) When did the loophole for PRs being able to get an eTA close ??
I was reading past recent posts, where people wrote that it is possible.

There was never a loophole. It's always been impossible for PRs to obtain an ETA. If a PR wants to obtain an ETA, they would need to officially give up their PR status first. Three months ago the ETA process was in place but not mandatory. That's probably what you're thinking of. It's mandatory now.

What citizenship do you hold?

 

[Eugene1985]

Hi,

The loophole I am referring to is being able to clear an eTA application ( despite being a PR) and travelling with a visa-exempt passport ( not revealing you are a PR).
It seems that now the eTA application tool rejects eTA submissions coming from PRs.

I will look into the borders, but I am totally clueless to how it works.

If I want to return via a border from US to Canada should I be looking for US borders here www_cbp_gov OR Canadian borders here: www_cbsa-asfc_gc_ca/ ?

How do I identify the border that I need ?

After crossing the border, where do I end up ( in an airport ??).

Like I've said, totally clueless :-[ Any information would be greatly appreciated.

 

[keesio]

Hi,

The loophole I am referring to is being able to clear an eTA application ( despite being a PR) and travelling with a visa-exempt passport ( not revealing you are a PR).
It seems that now the eTA application tool rejects eTA submissions coming from PRs.

I will look into the borders, but I am totally clueless to how it works.

If I want to return via a border from US to Canada should I be looking for US borders here www_cbp_gov OR Canadian borders here: www_cbsa-asfc_gc_ca/ ?

How do I identify the border that I need ?

After crossing the border, where do I end up ( in an airport ??).

Like I've said, totally clueless :-[ Any information would be greatly appreciated.

Try:
https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/List_of_Canada%E2%80%93United_States_border_crossings

The border that you should use is up to you. You likely want to use one of the bigger border crossings because they will have better infrastructure. If you are going to walk across, pick one with pedestrian access.

For a land border, you will most certainly not end up in an airport. You just end up in the part of Canada after the border crossing (which is usually a road or something).

 

[Eugene1985]

Thank you for the information.

Can you please direct me to where it says on the CIC website that COPR is enough if entering Canada by land through a U.S border ?

I could not find it anywhere on the CIC official website

Thanks

 

[Rob_TO]

Thank you for the information.

Can you please direct me to where it says on the CIC website that COPR is enough if entering Canada by land through a U.S border ?

I could not find it anywhere on the CIC official website

You do not even need a COPR. Just your passport is all you need, and with that CBSA should be able to confirm your PR status at secondary inspection.

Having COPR will just make the process much quicker and easier and perhaps skip the need to go to secondary.

The loophole I am referring to is being able to clear an eTA application ( despite being a PR) and travelling with a visa-exempt passport ( not revealing you are a PR).
It seems that now the eTA application tool rejects eTA submissions coming from PRs.

eTA system NEVER accepted submissions from PRs. The loophole was that before eTA was made absolutely mandatory (in November), a PR could still fly on their visa-exempt passport without need for eTA.

 

[Eugene1985]

You do not even need a COPR. Just your passport is all you need, and with that CBSA should be able to confirm your PR status at secondary inspection.

Having COPR will just make the process much quicker and easier and perhaps skip the need to go to secondary.

Thank you for the info but my question is where can I find the document requirements for entry to Canada through a U.S border on the CIC website?

eTA system NEVER accepted submissions from PRs. The loophole was that before eTA was made absolutely mandatory (in November), a PR could still fly on their visa-exempt passport without need for eTA

I can post links to past posts from VIP member (s) suggesting otherwise

 

[dpenabill]

Thank you for the info but my question is where can I find the document requirements for entry to Canada through a U.S border on the CIC website?

There is no specific IRCC information stating what documents a PR can present at a PoE, such as at a land crossing with the U.S., which will establish the PR's identity and PR status, other than passport plus PR card or PR Travel Document. The IRCC online information, however, explicitly states that a PR needs a PR card or PR TD to board commercial transportation headed to Canada, and does NOT suggest, let alone state, that such documents are necessary to obtain actual entry at a PoE.

There is a good reason for this: PRs are entitled (by statute) to enter Canada, so all a PR needs to do is to establish identity and status. As others have noted, proof of identity usually suffices to establish status but the actual, practical examination process will typically go faster and more smoothly if the traveler has some documentation showing PR status. CoPR works. An expired PR card works. Any correspondence from IRCC showing the individual's name and client number will help. But, ultimately, the PR's passport should suffice, particularly if that passport has been used in any previous CBSA or IRCC transactions.

I can post links to past posts from VIP member (s) suggesting otherwise

(In response to statement that "eTA system NEVER accepted submissions from PRs. The loophole was that before eTA was made absolutely mandatory (in November), a PR could still fly on their visa-exempt passport without need for eTA"

Perhaps you could, but if so they were wrong.

Moreover, it turns out the system for screening eTA did not come into use until November 10, 2016 (six weeks ago), even though travelers with visa-exempt passports were able to obtain eTA for a long while prior to that (it had no effect, before November 10, since eTA is not like a visa or travel document, but rather is an authorization recorded in the CBSA IAPI system, such that when the airport enters the traveler's API into the system, the system recognizes the traveler and traveler's passport, and gives a "board" response, allowing the airlines to issue the traveler a boarding pass . . . and that procedure was not in use until November 10th).

It is almost certain that either you, or those whose posts you are referring to, have confused prior practices pursuant to which PRs carrying a visa-exempt passport were often (probably usually if not nearly always) allowed to board flights to Canada by presenting their visa-exempt passports, with the electronic Travel Authorization process, which again has really only been applied since November 10th.


Regarding border crossings:

Look at a map (digital or paper). Look where major highways go from the U.S. to Canada. There is a PoE at those points. Fly to the nearest airport in the U.S., relative to your destination in Canada, and make arrangements to either take transportation to the border, and walk across, then obtain transportation on the Canadian side to your Canadian destination, or arrange to have a vehicle (friends in Canada, rental, or such) to carry you from the nearest U.S. airport to and across the border.

Example: for Toronto or GTA, Buffalo, N.Y. is a typical place to fly to, and from there most who would walk will go to Niagara Falls and walk across the Rainbow Bridge. Lots of ground transportation available from Buffalo airport to Niagara Falls; lots of ground transportation available on Canadian side of Niagara Falls, buses and shuttles and taxis.

For Montreal, fly to Plattsburgh, N.Y., or Burlington, Vermont, or even just to New York City, and again take ground transportation to the border. Or rent a car. Or get friends from Canada to pick you up.

For Vancouver area, Seattle, Washington is the place to fly to.

For SW Ontario (Windsor, London), fly to Detroit, Michigan or Toledo, Ohio.

Not that complicated.

Main issue at the border, as long as you present a valid passport positively establishing who you are, is whether or not you are in compliance with the PR Residency Obligation (if not, you are still entitled to enter Canada but you may be reported and then have to appeal). Have some proof of compliance with PR RO in hand, or documents showing reason why you did not return to Canada sooner.

 

[Eugene1985]

There is no specific IRCC information stating what documents a PR can present at a PoE, such as at a land crossing with the U.S., which will establish the PR's identity and PR status, other than passport plus PR card or PR Travel Document. The IRCC online information, however, explicitly states that a PR needs a PR card or PR TD to board commercial transportation headed to Canada, and does NOT suggest, let alone state, that such documents are necessary to obtain actual entry at a PoE.

There is a good reason for this: PRs are entitled (by statute) to enter Canada, so all a PR needs to do is to establish identity and status. As others have noted, proof of identity usually suffices to establish status but the actual, practical examination process will typically go faster and more smoothly if the traveler has some documentation showing PR status. CoPR works. An expired PR card works. Any correspondence from IRCC showing the individual's name and client number will help. But, ultimately, the PR's passport should suffice, particularly if that passport has been used in any previous CBSA or IRCC transactions.

Yes, I did see IRCC listing the documentation requirements to board commercial transportation back to Canada (i.e., PR card or PRTD), but nothing about documents necessary to obtain actual entry at a PoE, so I thought I just missed it. Thanks for confirming it's simply not there on IRCC website.

PRs are entitled (by statute) to enter Canada, so all a PR needs to do is to establish identity and status.

If that's the case, so why is there such a difference between commercial vs non-commercial transportation docs requirements (non-expired PR card or PRTD vs.
any proof of identity and status, respectively) ?

Both fall under " PRs are entitled (by statute) to enter Canada "...

(In response to statement that "eTA system NEVER accepted submissions from PRs. The loophole was that before eTA was made absolutely mandatory (in November), a PR could still fly on their visa-exempt passport without need for eTA"

Perhaps you could, but if so they were wrong.

Moreover, it turns out the system for screening eTA did not come into use until November 10, 2016 (six weeks ago), even though travelers with visa-exempt passports were able to obtain eTA for a long while prior to that (it had no effect, before November 10, since eTA is not like a visa or travel document, but rather is an authorization recorded in the CBSA IAPI system, such that when the airport enters the traveler's API into the system, the system recognizes the traveler and traveler's passport, and gives a "board" response, allowing the airlines to issue the traveler a boarding pass . . . and that procedure was not in use until November 10th).

It is almost certain that either you, or those whose posts you are referring to, have confused prior practices pursuant to which PRs carrying a visa-exempt passport were often (probably usually if not nearly always) allowed to board flights to Canada by presenting their visa-exempt passports, with the electronic Travel Authorization process, which again has really only been applied since November 10th.

I think I understand now where the confusion comes from.

I did not mean to say that PRs were entitled to get an eTA at any point of time.

What I was referring to is that up until recently PRs who wanted to get an eTA were able to do it TECHNICALLY by submitting an online application via IRCC website which was approved ( and then head back to Canada based on their visa-exempt eTA linked passport, simply not disclosing that they are actually PRs to the airline personnel).

See past links supporting that:

canadavisa.com/canada-immigration-discussion-board/entering-canada-with-an-expired-pr-card-urgent-please-help-t89524.0.html

page 3, last post:

Rob_TO
VIP Member
*******
With a visa and eTA exempt US passport, most likely you can just fly back to Canada with that alone. Just don't mention to the airline upon checkin that you're a PR, or it could cause them to demand a valid PR card. Just fly by posing as a visa-exempt foreign national.



Rob_TO
VIP Member


page 4:

No, nobody will care one little bit about if you boarded the plane as a foreign national and not using your PR card. Thousands of PRs have traveled on visa-exempt passports alone, and I've never seen a case in history of anyone getting in trouble after the fact (assuming you meet the RO, which you do).

page 4:

Rob_TO
VIP Member

When it comes to entering Canada, the new eTA rules don't change anything. CBSA will not care about HOW you got to Canada. Once you present yourself to them at immigration, all they will care about is confirming your PR status and that you meet the residency obligation. It will be completely irrelevant to them that you boarded a plane with just your passport.


Now, however, PRs are TECHNICALLY no longer able to receive an eTA, because they get a rejection email from IRCC ( due to them being PRs) a few hours after they've submitted the online application. That's the technical loophole that had been closed just recently, which I've been referring to all along.

I hope its more clear now.

Regarding border crossings:

Thank you for the helpful information. I will fly to Buffalo NY and cross the border there.

 

[scylla]

You've misunderstood the context of the thread you quoted. What was being said is that someone who holds an American passport is visa exempt and ETA exempt. No where in what you've quoted does it state that it's possible for a PR to obtain an ETA. Speaking of which, did you ever respond to the question about your nationality? (Maybe I missed it?) Any chance you're American? That would change things.

Again to reiterate, we've never seen someone successfully apply for an ETA who is a PR. This has never been possible. On the contrary, we've seen several of people denied ETAs (both before and after they became mandatory) for being PRs - including a few who haven't been to Canada for over a decade but "technically" still have PR. Anyway - whether or not this was ever possible is not material to your situation.

If you're not American, then it sounds like flying to a US city close to the Canadian border and re-entering using your landing document sounds like the only viable solution.

Good luck.